Mini rebuild. Why is anyone that surprised?

[All_Pro_Bills]

21 minutes ago, ProcessTruster said:

yeah, it seems many on this board either

 

(1) really have no idea how the league actually works in practice re: the salary cap and injury impacts on it (see T White, V Miller, etc.) or

 

(2) fail to appreciate the impact of changing the entire coaching staff and then stinking for 2-3 years while changing the roster to fit the coaches, or 

 

(3) just want to "buy" a single SB in FA, get the T - shirt and then stink for the next 10 years (see LA Rams, Saints, etc. ) 

 

Some (Most?) of the posts on this board after a loss reflect one of the above 3 .  IMHO, Better to wait until about Thursday to look at this board.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

#2. They didn't change the entire coaching staff. They failed to replace the single most important person. The one responsible for a series of in-game gaffes and mistakes that have cost this team in critical situations against the better teams in the league where there is no margin of error for tolerating such blunders. This team looked totally unprepared for the Ravens game and played like it. Against the Texans the defense did their best but the offense looked like garbage most of the game. And when listening to post game excuses I keep hearing about communication and execution problems. 

 

Is there anyone here confident that Sean will have this team prepared for what we all know the Jets will do on offense and defense and ready to play their best on Monday night? Playing their best win or lose. That's really the expectation and I think that what most fans are looking for out of their team. I'm not expecting miracles such as the WR group is going to light it up or all the new players on defense playing because of injuries and departures are going to make the Pro Bowl. And there's nothing wrong with losing to a superior foe but when you constantly shoot yourself in the foot and blow a game in the most inconceivable way and look like a fool while doing it, its a different story. At this point either you know what you're doing or you don't And stop making stupid coaching mistakes or find another job someplace else. The longer they delay reaching the inevitable conclusion that we need to make a change at HQ, the longer they will fail to get a sniff at the Super Bowl.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[balln]

For all the - our WR room is trash ppl.

 

its not.

 

Look at kc last night. Juju. Who was hot garbage w/ teams outside of kc. But somehow.  Was 7 catches for 130 at 18 yards per catch. Long of 50. On 8 targets. Also look at how efficient they. Are it’s like 8 for 9, 4 for 4 to other receivers. 
 

ITS not the WRs. It’s the QB and the OC. Always was. Always is. always will be. They have a system. They have the qb. They have the qb in total command of that system. We do not. 
 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/boxscore/_/gameId/401671687#home

 

this is why I circle back to firing McD. Hes not gonna hire an OC that will click here. We need a Ben Johnson or slovik

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

17 hours ago, Blackbeard said:

I get that, but you also cannot afford to bring in the best every year to surround him.  The league is cap prohibited in this respect.  Something HAS to give.

Never said that.

I think I could find a way to live without Ed “the invisible man” Oliver’s salary and spending that coin on a bonafide WR1

[Kirby Jackson]

8 minutes ago, balln said:

For all the - our WR room is trash ppl.

 

its not.

 

Look at kc last night. Juju. Who was hot garbage w/ teams outside of kc. But somehow.  Was 7 catches for 130 at 18 yards per catch. Long of 50. On 8 targets. Also look at how efficient they. Are it’s like 8 for 9, 4 for 4 to other receivers. 
 

ITS not the WRs. It’s the QB and the OC. Always was. Always is. always will be. They have a system. They have the qb. They have the qb in total command of that system. We do not. 
 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/boxscore/_/gameId/401671687#home

 

this is why I circle back to firing McD. Hes not gonna hire an OC that will click here. We need a Ben Johnson or slovik

You sure that you want to do this without at least googling JuJu? He has 4 seasons (of his 7 full seasons) better than every season, of every Bills WR combined….

Edited October 8 by Kirby Jackson

[GunnerBill]

12 minutes ago, balln said:

For all the - our WR room is trash ppl.

 

its not.

 

Look at kc last night. Juju. Who was hot garbage w/ teams outside of kc. But somehow.  Was 7 catches for 130 at 18 yards per catch. Long of 50. On 8 targets. Also look at how efficient they. Are it’s like 8 for 9, 4 for 4 to other receivers. 
 

ITS not the WRs. It’s the QB and the OC. Always was. Always is. always will be. They have a system. They have the qb. They have the qb in total command of that system. We do not. 
 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/boxscore/_/gameId/401671687#home

 

this is why I circle back to firing McD. Hes not gonna hire an OC that will click here. We need a Ben Johnson or slovik

 

Nah. Our receivers ARE trash. 

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

13 minutes ago, balln said:

For all the - our WR room is trash ppl.

 

its not.

 

Look at kc last night. Juju. Who was hot garbage w/ teams outside of kc. But somehow.  Was 7 catches for 130 at 18 yards per catch. Long of 50. On 8 targets. Also look at how efficient they. Are it’s like 8 for 9, 4 for 4 to other receivers. 
 

ITS not the WRs. It’s the QB and the OC. Always was. Always is. always will be. They have a system. They have the qb. They have the qb in total command of that system. We do not. 
 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/boxscore/_/gameId/401671687#home

 

this is why I circle back to firing McD. Hes not gonna hire an OC that will click here. We need a Ben Johnson or slovik

You might want to do some research on JJSS’s stats over his career before labeling him “hot garbage”

[colin]

The front office has a bit of an over bias toward balance and depth and risk aversion that leads to explosive failure the same way risky planning can sometimes.

 

We play deep 2 high and take away the deep pass, but that sometimes fails as we saw bishop blow a coverage.  That's fine, but we allow some big gainers on underneath stuff to fast players almost predictably.

 

The fo loves depth and we drafted a 3rd RB (again).  We also tend to get all around rbs, not pure speed or power guys (cook is the only RB this team has had with actual talent since MCD got here), clearly they want to avoid risk of not being able to do something in their scheme based on who is at RB.

 

And we pay a te and then trade up to draft one.

 

The issue with the above is we need to have some killer match ups and advantages.  Drafting another wr this season would make sense, so we didn't.  We got some more back up linemen for o and another day in Carter (he might be sick tho).

 

Having to play 7 dl extended snaps every game but having Hamlin as a starting safety is just crazy.  Our vet dt was out, Oliver was out, and miller was out vs Houston, but the garbage play at nickel and the raw safety playing along side #3 is what cost us on our two td drives on d.

 

 

If you look at KC, they will not field a team that doesn't have high talent at OT, and it seems like they feel the same way about interior blocking.  They draft depth guys too, but they dont overload and can just go out and sign a vet for 3rd when someone goes down.  They also scheme and use what they have to give them the best chance to win.  I saw some what looked like 22 and 13 formations vs KC, and they were able to run well (and stick with it, unlike us) and make short high % passes to move the sticks.

 

The bills just have this insane gap between who they draft and sign and what they want to do as coaches.  Hines, Samuel, Hollis, and us putting on Anderson regularly when we have Knox and kinkaid is mind numbing.  We end up being super predictable based on personal and formation and then play our goofy schemes with guys who just can't get it done.

 

Obv some killer talent at wr or safety or ol would help the team a ton, but the biggest ***** is the preventable issues of having your biggest fa wr signing being a limited use and obvious screen gadget guy while you trot a slow jag out to catch bombs on the outside.  3 deep at RB and zero deep at safety is also mind numbing.

 

I really hope these goons figure out how to run this team with a quickness, but they seem to forget about motion and misdirection and tendencies way too fast.

[balln]

13 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

You sure that you want to do this without at least googling JuJu? He has 4 seasons (of his 7 full seasons) better than every season, of every Bills WR combined….

Did you read what I said? Look at with KC and then without. Hes past his prime.

10 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Nah. Our receivers ARE trash. 

They are. My point is kc can still roll. And we go 9/30 and look inept. It’s more qb / oc execution , discipline and command of the offense 

[SoCal Deek]

I had very low expectations going into this year and they remain low now. What I cannot figure out is how the Offense can look like an efficient machine against Jacksonville two weeks ago in a first half that had them scoring at will, and then be utterly inept the next 10 quarters. But for one play in which Coleman breaks a tackle and tip toes down the sideline it would be even worse! 

[balln]

12 minutes ago, AlCowlingsTaxiService said:

You might want to do some research on JJSS’s stats over his career before labeling him “hot garbage”

https://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/3120348/juju-smith-schuster
 

Two good years at pit. Then tailspin . Oh wow production w kc. Then disaster in NE. Oh look back in kc. No rashee rice. Juju forced into WR 1 and he gets 8 for 9. 130 . 18 per. And 50 long. WHAT. Also Kareem hunt goes OfF. He was out of the league 

 

if this ever proves that WR doesn’t matter (that much - I know bills have no one) - and supports. It’s all qb and oc / command of the system. The “weapons” are plug and play 

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, balln said:

They are. My point is kc can still roll. And we go 9/30 and look inept. It’s more qb / oc execution , discipline and command of the offense 

 

True to an extent, sure. But while I've never been the biggest JuJu guy he is not Mack Hollins level of inept. 

[mannc]

26 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

You sure that you want to do this without at least googling JuJu? He has 4 seasons (of his 7 full seasons) better than every season, of every Bills WR combined….

And a couple weeks ago, he was released by the offensive powerhouse known as the New England Patriots.

[balln]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

True to an extent, sure. But while I've never been the biggest JuJu guy he is not Mack Hollins level of inept. 

For sure. We’ll never get to see Reid and Pat w a complete wr swap. But. Come on. To an extent- Kareem hunt and juju - who nobody wanted. Hunt is out of the league. They know the system. And so chiefs O doesn’t skip a beat when they plug these after thoughts and get insane production. 
 

The analogy would be bring back John brown and latavius and they get stats like that? (Again can’t completely get a good 1:1 comparison. Bc they are older in age)

[Kirby Jackson]

19 minutes ago, balln said:

Did you read what I said? Look at with KC and then without. Hes past his prime.

They are. My point is kc can still roll. And we go 9/30 and look inept. It’s more qb / oc execution , discipline and command of the offense 

Not sure what point your making? He played a year with the worst offense ever in New England. The year before he had 933 yards with KC. 2 years before that he had 97 catches and 7 TDs. 2 years before that he had 111/1426/7. He’s proven that he can play. We don’t have ANYONE that has touched those seasons. I’m not a Juju guy but he’s been way more productive than anyone that we have. 
 

Also, can we stop with “our WRs are no worse than KCs.” Rice, Juju, Hollywood and obviously Kelce, have all had better seasons than anyone we have. While their pass catchers aren’t great, they are way more productive than ours. They also have Reid and Mahomes. We need to stop pretending that we are the same to justify our trash receivers. 

Edited October 8 by Kirby Jackson

[balln]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Not sure what point your making? He played a year with the worst offense ever in New England. The year before he had 933 yards with KC. 2 years before that he had 97 catches and 7 TDs. 2 years before that he had 111/1426/7. He’s proven that he can play. We don’t have ANYONE that has touched those seasons. I’m not a Juju guy but he’s been way more productive than anyone that we have. 

You’re missing the point. You’re in WR land . Juju NOW. Is different than JUJU breakout wr in his first two seasons w pit

 

its about the qb/ oc and command of the offense

[dave mcbride]

8 minutes ago, mannc said:

And a couple weeks ago, he was released by the offensive powerhouse known as the New England Patriots.

Pretty sure he forced his way off that team, which is currently in disarray and with a historically bad offense (the o line is probably the worst in the league).

[mannc]

9 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Pretty sure he forced his way off that team, which is currently in disarray and with a historically bad offense (the o line is probably the worst in the league).

Great, so why didn’t we sign him?

[Savage]

18 hours ago, Blackbeard said:

We ALL knew what this season was likely going to be.  

 

We gutted a bunch of defensive players.  We traded stallworths Diggs and Davis.  We didn't trade up for a WR or trade for a #1.

 

You cannot think that we will have a stacked roster year in, year out.  There HAS to be some rebuilding..  and this is it.  There is something called "the cap".

 

We are retooling.  Hoarding draft pics etc.

 

I am not surprised the talent level has dropped off.  Does it suck, sure.  But we are regrouping to enter into Allen's second window imo.

 

Everyone needs to calm down.  

Second window?

 

JA17 got his bell rung last game.

 

he was out cold, but guess that doesn’t matter for star players, if it extremely obvious to the casual viewer.

 

his second window could potentially much shorter than the first window.

 

carpe diem!!

 

 

48 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Nah. Our receivers ARE trash. 

F-ing Hollins!!!

 

wow!!

 

not much else to say.

2 minutes ago, Savage said:

Second window?

 

JA17 got his bell rung last game.

 

he was out cold, but guess that doesn’t matter for star players, if it extremely obvious to the casual viewer.

 

his second window could potentially much shorter than the first window.

 

carpe diem!!

 

 

F-ing Hollins!!!

 

wow!!

 

not much else to say.

And the dumb rookie that gets hit in the back of the head by the ball, and has no idea what hit him!!!

 

tough to watch.

 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

I’m not throwing the season away. We play in the weakest division in football. Playoffs are almost a guarantee and anything can happen once you’re in. The front office and coaching staff just need to start showing some desperation because their jobs are definitely on the line. If Buffalo comes up short again, I think McDermott has one more season left. There are no time for “rebuilds” when u have a franchise QB. McDermott & Brady better be banging down the door of Beane’s office to get a WR. The season can still be salvaged. The Giants started out 0-4 then ended up winning a championship. Coughlin was on the hot seat up until that point and Eli was approaching bust status, but the fans and media lit a fire underneath them. Will this happen w/ the Bills ? Who knows, but I liked the grit they showed at the end up last season rattling off all those wins and barely losing by a FG to the eventual champs. 

[stlbills13]

No season is a mini rebuild with Josh Allen as your quarterback. You have to surround him with the best possible team. Now I know that given our cap situation and the Diggs situation that this season was going to be harder. But adding Samuel, Hollins, MVS was not the answer in April and it's not the answer in October.