OLINE Pass Pro / Qb Unforced Error Review - week 4 9/29/24 Ravens

[Bocephuz]

in the past i used to do lengthy in depth posts with gifs.. don't have time for that nowadays. I also did not count the Mitch TurdBiscuit reps. 

 

I watched every passing snap to evaluate pass blocking performance as well as Josh Allen unforced errors committed (PASS BLOCKING ONLY EVALUATED.. did not evaluate running plays). 

 

UNFORCED ERROR  =  Allen has time to throw, wr is open and he misses throw.. or.. Allen makes poor unforced decision 

 

OLINEMAN BEATEN =  O lineman clearly loses his one on one matchup... or.. clearly misreads stunt/combo block

 

____

 

OLINEMAN BEATEN STATS

 

DAWKINS -  0

EDWARDS -  2

MCGOVERN - 1

ANDERSON - 1

TORRENCE - 3

BROWN - 2 

DAVIS - 1

 

 

-DAWKINS - The only clean performance. Had a few dominant reps. 

- EDWARDS -  Was beaten twice. Both times DE got around his left side. 

- MCGOVERN - Was injured briefly but stepped up and came back in. He was cleanly beaten on one play.. but other than that held up reasonably well. 

- ANDERSON -  Came in at C for a few reps .. had a bad shotgun snap that I am counting as a bad rep.

- TORRENCE - His PFF low grade seems justified. Torrence led the OL in bad reps with 3. He was cleanly beaten one on one several times.. and also had a few reps where he looked lost and was trying to find someone to block. He started out strong last year but his pass protect quality has slipped and he is close to becoming a liability in pass pro. 

- BROWN  - Brown has certainly improved from last  year.. .but he was beaten one on one on a couple of nifty moves by the D end. Good news is he seems to have fixed the issue he had last few years where DE's would blow right by him on the outside with speed. For both moves that beat him yesterday you have to tip your hat to the DE. 

- DAVIS - imn q4 Davis was in for pass pro in the shotgun but he lined up way too close to line of scrimmage. When ball was snapped he couldn't get out to block the LDE in time and Allen was flushed immediately. 

 

OL SUMMARY :  This was a rough game for the O Line. Baltimore did a few twist stunts.. but mostly they just beat the Bills O linemen with technique one on one. Josh' scrambling ability saved 3 or 4 sacks.  The Guards ( Edwards and particularly Torrence) really struggled in one on one on several reps .. and it seemed like there was a bit of confusion on picking up stunts.  

 

QB UNFORCED ERRORS:  Josh had 3 unforced errors by my count where he had time but made bad decisions. For example .. in q3 he had a clean pocket to step into but he bailed right too early. This seems to be a pattern for Josh ( understandably so). If the o line is shaky early.. Josh gets a little antsy later in the game and bails from the pocket occaisonally when he doesn't need to.   It seemed like even when Josh did have time .. .the receivers rarely had any separation ( Kincaid being the exception). Based on my history of doing this kind of analysis when a qb has 5 or more unforced errors the chances of his team winning decrease materially.  In this case.. Josh actually played a pretty clean game with 3 unforced errors. 

 

Edited September 30 by Bocephuz

[CSBill]

It seems like what I saw was some good, but mostly a struggle all night. Thanks, Bocephuz.

[Simon]

16 hours ago, Bocephuz said:

For example .. in q3 he had a clean pocket to step into but he bailed right too early. This seems to be a pattern for Josh ( understandably so). If the o line is shaky early.. Josh gets a little antsy later in the game and bails from the pocket occaisonally when he doesn't need to.

I thought he was doing it well before the 3rd qrtr.

It was clear he didn't trust his OLine throughout much of the game.

[paulmm3]

Guards really struggled on Sunday. I rarely notice interior OL play but I did notice OCT struggling and the team overall with a mediocre pass protection game.

[Bocephuz]

18 minutes ago, Simon said:

I thought he was doing it well before the 3rd qrtr.

It was clear he didn't trust his OLine throughout much of the game.

 

Josh rarely climbs the pocket and hangs in to deliver a throw while taking a hit. He is capable of doing it ( think Jacksonville game throw to Robert Foster). Its certainly not a toughness issue... but it would be nice if he occasionally climbed the pocket ( when its there) instead of bailing. 

[SoonerBillsFan]

17 hours ago, Bocephuz said:

in the past i used to do lengthy in depth posts with gifs.. don't have time for that nowadays. I also did not count the Mitch TurdBiscuit reps. 

 

I watched every passing snap to evaluate pass blocking performance as well as Josh Allen unforced errors committed (PASS BLOCKING ONLY EVALUATED.. did not evaluate running plays). 

 

UNFORCED ERROR  =  Allen has time to throw, wr is open and he misses throw.. or.. Allen makes poor unforced decision 

 

OLINEMAN BEATEN =  O lineman clearly loses his one on one matchup... or.. clearly misreads stunt/combo block

 

____

 

OLINEMAN BEATEN STATS

 

DAWKINS -  0

EDWARDS -  2

MCGOVERN - 1

ANDERSON - 1

TORRENCE - 3

BROWN - 2 

DAVIS - 1

 

 

-DAWKINS - The only clean performance. Had a few dominant reps. 

- EDWARDS -  Was beaten twice. Both times DE got around his left side. 

- MCGOVERN - Was injured briefly but stepped up and came back in. He was cleanly beaten on one play.. but other than that held up reasonably well. 

- ANDERSON -  Came in at C for a few reps .. had a bad shotgun snap that I am counting as a bad rep.

- TORRENCE - His PFF low grade seems justified. Torrence led the OL in bad reps with 3. He was cleanly beaten one on one several times.. and also had a few reps where he looked lost and was trying to find someone to block. He started out strong last year but his pass protect quality has slipped and he is close to becoming a liability in pass pro. 

- BROWN  - Brown has certainly improved from last  year.. .but he was beaten one on one on a couple of nifty moves by the D end. Good news is he seems to have fixed the issue he had last few years where DE's would blow right by him on the outside with speed. For both moves that beat him yesterday you have to tip your hat to the DE. 

- DAVIS - imn q4 Davis was in for pass pro in the shotgun but he lined up way too close to line of scrimmage. When ball was snapped he couldn't get out to block the LDE in time and Allen was flushed immediately. 

 

OL SUMMARY :  This was a rough game for the O Line. Baltimore did a few twist stunts.. but mostly they just beat the Bills O linemen with technique one on one. Josh' scrambling ability saved 3 or 4 sacks.  The Guards ( Edwards and particularly Torrence) really struggled in one on one on several reps .. and it seemed like there was a bit of confusion on picking up stunts.  

 

QB UNFORCED ERRORS:  Josh had 3 unforced errors by my count where he had time but made bad decisions. For example .. in q3 he had a clean pocket to step into but he bailed right too early. This seems to be a pattern for Josh ( understandably so). If the o line is shaky early.. Josh gets a little antsy later in the game and bails from the pocket occaisonally when he doesn't need to.   It seemed like even when Josh did have time .. .the receivers rarely had any separation ( Kincaid being the exception). Based on my history of doing this kind of analysis when a qb has 5 or more unforced errors the chances of his team winning decrease materially.  In this case.. Josh actually played a pretty clean game with 3 unforced errors. 

 

Browns issues are of his own making. He mouthed off to KVN in the first quarter and KVN responded with "Ok" to him. I remember seeing it. After that KVN went flat off.

Edited October 1 by SoonerBillsFan

[Bocephuz]

3 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Browns issues are of his own making. He mouthed off to KVO in the first quarter and KVO responded with "Ok" to him. I remember seeing it. After that KVO went flat off.

 

yeah.. i recall that now. KVO went ballistic on him after that. 

 

[Simon]

5 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Browns issues are of his own making. He mouthed off to KVO in the first quarter and KVO responded with "Ok" to him. I remember seeing it. After that KVO went flat off.

 

Van Noy was taking liberties with his QB and Brown told him about it, like he should have.

It didn't make anybody play or better or worse.

[SoonerBillsFan]

6 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

Van Noy was taking liberties with his QB and Brown told him about it, like he should have.

It didn't make anybody play or better or worse.

I dunno,look at how almost immediately after Van Noy had a sack against brown.  He seemed to take it up a level after the exchange.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

21 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

Van Noy was taking liberties with his QB and Brown told him about it, like he should have.

It didn't make anybody play or better or worse.

Ravens are consistently one of the dirtiest teams I’ve ever seen

[MPL]

It felt like Josh never really had a solid command of what the Ravens were doing defensively — something that became increasingly problematic as the deficit increased. And I think because Josh wasn't able to fully predict what the defense was doing, he wasn't always able to get the protection aligned how it needed to be. The Ravens delayed blitzes really caused problems. I know Torrence has had his struggles but I remember one play where he had a DT driving to his left and then a blitzing linebacker shooting the gap that had opened up to his right. Not a really a winnable situation for Torrence. 

I also feel like Josh has a tendency to bail early when he doesn't quite know what he's seeing, because he knows if he can get outside the pocket he has a chance to create through improv. It often works, but sometimes it also creates more pressure than if he would have just stayed in the pocket. And I think the latter was the case throughout much of the 2nd half of the Ravens game. 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

2 hours ago, paulmm3 said:

Guards really struggled on Sunday. I rarely notice interior OL play but I did notice OCT struggling and the team overall with a mediocre pass protection game.

I fear Torrence is turning into a mediocre guard. If Josh doesn't trust his OL, he'll bail early. 

[RyanC883]

17 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

I fear Torrence is turning into a mediocre guard. If Josh doesn't trust his OL, he'll bail early. 

 

same.  Torrence seems to have regressed, which is very uncommon for our OL.  

[Sojourner]

Dawkins really having no errors and remained unbeaten? 
 

the blocking on that trick play that ended the game and almost josh’s season makes me think otherwise. 
 

brown and torrence were rough!

[Bocephuz]

11 hours ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Ravens are consistently one of the dirtiest teams I’ve ever seen

Humphrey eyepoke exh A

[GoBills808]

Did you do this before the all22 came out lol

[DapperCam]

I would give Dawkins a -1 for his blocking on the trick play. He missed the initial block because he ran into Kincaid, and then he missed a second opportunity to get a piece of Van Noy after the play was already broken. Two whiffs on one play.

[Simon]

12 minutes ago, DapperCam said:

I would give Dawkins a -1 for his blocking on the trick play. He missed the initial block

 

There was absolutely no way that Dawkins could have got to that block.

He was *&#%ed before that ball was even snapped.

[Brand J]

15 hours ago, Bocephuz said:

 

Josh rarely climbs the pocket and hangs in to deliver a throw while taking a hit. He is capable of doing it ( think Jacksonville game throw to Robert Foster). Its certainly not a toughness issue... but it would be nice if he occasionally climbed the pocket ( when its there) instead of bailing. 

Kirk Cousins really impresses me in this area. I think the best manipulator of the pocket was Tom Brady. He always had guys reaching for him, always on the verge of a sack, but it was tough to get him. Before the season I said if Josh could improve on his pre-snap recognition his game would really elevate. Now I say if he could learn how to manipulate the pocket and bail less (thus keeping both sides of the field open), I wouldn’t know how to stop that guy as a DC.

[HIT BY SPIKES]

On 9/30/2024 at 4:27 PM, Bocephuz said:

in the past i used to do lengthy in depth posts with gifs.. don't have time for that nowadays. I also did not count the Mitch TurdBiscuit reps. 

 

I watched every passing snap to evaluate pass blocking performance as well as Josh Allen unforced errors committed (PASS BLOCKING ONLY EVALUATED.. did not evaluate running plays). 

 

UNFORCED ERROR  =  Allen has time to throw, wr is open and he misses throw.. or.. Allen makes poor unforced decision 

 

OLINEMAN BEATEN =  O lineman clearly loses his one on one matchup... or.. clearly misreads stunt/combo block

 

____

 

OLINEMAN BEATEN STATS

 

DAWKINS -  0

EDWARDS -  2

MCGOVERN - 1

ANDERSON - 1

TORRENCE - 3

BROWN - 2 

DAVIS - 1

 

 

-DAWKINS - The only clean performance. Had a few dominant reps. 

- EDWARDS -  Was beaten twice. Both times DE got around his left side. 

- MCGOVERN - Was injured briefly but stepped up and came back in. He was cleanly beaten on one play.. but other than that held up reasonably well. 

- ANDERSON -  Came in at C for a few reps .. had a bad shotgun snap that I am counting as a bad rep.

- TORRENCE - His PFF low grade seems justified. Torrence led the OL in bad reps with 3. He was cleanly beaten one on one several times.. and also had a few reps where he looked lost and was trying to find someone to block. He started out strong last year but his pass protect quality has slipped and he is close to becoming a liability in pass pro. 

- BROWN  - Brown has certainly improved from last  year.. .but he was beaten one on one on a couple of nifty moves by the D end. Good news is he seems to have fixed the issue he had last few years where DE's would blow right by him on the outside with speed. For both moves that beat him yesterday you have to tip your hat to the DE. 

- DAVIS - imn q4 Davis was in for pass pro in the shotgun but he lined up way too close to line of scrimmage. When ball was snapped he couldn't get out to block the LDE in time and Allen was flushed immediately. 

 

OL SUMMARY :  This was a rough game for the O Line. Baltimore did a few twist stunts.. but mostly they just beat the Bills O linemen with technique one on one. Josh' scrambling ability saved 3 or 4 sacks.  The Guards ( Edwards and particularly Torrence) really struggled in one on one on several reps .. and it seemed like there was a bit of confusion on picking up stunts.  

 

QB UNFORCED ERRORS:  Josh had 3 unforced errors by my count where he had time but made bad decisions. For example .. in q3 he had a clean pocket to step into but he bailed right too early. This seems to be a pattern for Josh ( understandably so). If the o line is shaky early.. Josh gets a little antsy later in the game and bails from the pocket occaisonally when he doesn't need to.   It seemed like even when Josh did have time .. .the receivers rarely had any separation ( Kincaid being the exception). Based on my history of doing this kind of analysis when a qb has 5 or more unforced errors the chances of his team winning decrease materially.  In this case.. Josh actually played a pretty clean game with 3 unforced errors. 

 

 

Any theory as to what is happening with Torrence this year?

 

I was excited when we drafted him reasonably early.

 

I was impressed with his play last year as a rookie.

 

However, he certainly has taken a step back this year when he should be improving after a year of NFL diet, weight room, video watching and coaching.