9/29/2024 Bills @ Ravens post game thread

[BillsFan130]

12 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

 

"The Ravens ran out of heavy sets 82% of the time. The Bills gave light box counts on rushing downs (6 or less in the box) on 41.2% of rushing snaps. Heavy box counts only 8.8% of the time."

 

Just smh.

McDermott/Babich... So infuriating 

[Johnnycage46]

3 hours ago, Trekking said:

It’s how they lost not that they lost. They got bullied and had no answer

 

That's exactly it. The Bills have never had an undefeated season, so we all know they will lose games. But to come out and just look so flat and get steamrolled and embarrassed is what makes this so frustrating. But ultimately, it is just one game...BUT, I think this type of loss really puts on tape what to do to shut a team down, so unless we have additional answers, I would expect other teams to play us the same way (obviously some will be more successful than others based on their personnel, coaching, etc.).

[Low Positive]

6 minutes ago, Johnnycage46 said:

 

That's exactly it. The Bills have never had an undefeated season, so we all know they will lose games. But to come out and just look so flat and get steamrolled and embarrassed is what makes this so frustrating. But ultimately, it is just one game...BUT, I think this type of loss really puts on tape what to do to shut a team down, so unless we have additional answers, I would expect other teams to play us the same way (obviously some will be more successful than others based on their personnel, coaching, etc.).

Then lucky for us, there is a tape on what to do against houston because they got an even worse beat down in Minnesota. 

[Johnnycage46]

47 minutes ago, Low Positive said:

Then lucky for us, there is a tape on what to do against houston because they got an even worse beat down in Minnesota. 

 

True, if we have the personnel and coaching to do it

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

It’s crazy if you listen to Sal or anyone talking about the Bills, they constantly justify the staying in nickel like a trade off for the pass defense. The stubbornness is maddening but then we aren’t even good at stopping the pass. Every decent QB has all day and whatever they want on every big 3rd down. Stop doing what we are doing 

[Blank Stare]

14 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

It’s crazy if you listen to Sal or anyone talking about the Bills, they constantly justify the staying in nickel like a trade off for the pass defense. The stubbornness is maddening but then we aren’t even good at stopping the pass. Every decent QB has all day and whatever they want on every big 3rd down. Stop doing what we are doing 

This is one of the more frustrating things about McD and his defense. Yes, it’s designed to stop the pass and has been effective against many teams that prioritize the pass. BUT he refuses to adapt it to the opponent when the occasion calls for it (i.e., when playing a run heavy team). Instead of adjusting and playing a third linebacker, he just sticks to his scheme. Maybe that works with a healthy Bernard and Taron Johnson, but sometimes you’ve gotta read the room and adjust when you’re playing backups dude. The answer isn’t a 180 and 190 lb Cam Lewis and Ja’Marcus Ingram, respectively, against 300lb Ricard and 250lb Henry. 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

5 minutes ago, Blank Stare said:

This is one of the more frustrating things about McD and his defense. Yes, it’s designed to stop the pass and has been effective against many teams that prioritize the pass. BUT he refuses to adapt it to the opponent when the occasion calls for it (i.e., when playing a run heavy team). Instead of adjusting and playing a third linebacker, he just sticks to his scheme. Maybe that works with a healthy Bernard and Taron Johnson, but sometimes you’ve gotta read the room and adjust when you’re playing backups dude. The answer isn’t a 180 and 190 lb Cam Lewis and Ja’Marcus Ingram, respectively, against 300lb Ricard and 250lb Henry. 

It looked like they tried to go heavier early which led to a few extremely easy short throws leading to big gains 

 

really felt like a damned if you do damned if you don’t situation in this one specifically but overall that criticism seems pretty valid 

[Blank Stare]

1 minute ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

It looked like they tried to go heavier early which led to a few extremely easy short throws leading to big gains 

 

really felt like a damned if you do damned if you don’t situation in this one specifically but overall that criticism seems pretty valid 

Fair. This game certainly had that feel to it. 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

1 hour ago, Johnnycage46 said:

 

That's exactly it. The Bills have never had an undefeated season, so we all know they will lose games. But to come out and just look so flat and get steamrolled and embarrassed is what makes this so frustrating. But ultimately, it is just one game...BUT, I think this type of loss really puts on tape what to do to shut a team down, so unless we have additional answers, I would expect other teams to play us the same way (obviously some will be more successful than others based on their personnel, coaching, etc.).

Not every team has Lamar Jackson, Derrick Henry, likely, and Andrews lol. ‘Oh no there’s tape out there now’ has to be the most overblown thing in football. 
 

just because you can watch how another team beat an opponent doesn’t mean you can replicate it with the talent you have.  Every opposing coach knows we have huge weaknesses at LB and safety right now and our nickel corner isn’t as good as the starter.  It isn’t like Baltimore discovered it 🤣

 

biggest issue I’ve seen is we have way

overcompensated for keeping mobile qbs in the pocket since halftime in Arizona and we’ve already faced the two most notable examples of that.  

Edited October 1 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

38 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

It’s crazy if you listen to Sal or anyone talking about the Bills, they constantly justify the staying in nickel like a trade off for the pass defense. The stubbornness is maddening but then we aren’t even good at stopping the pass. Every decent QB has all day and whatever they want on every big 3rd down. Stop doing what we are doing 

i actually think it really works because Taron is just as good if not better in run support than any other LB we have. 
 

but given how critical Taron is to our D, I was really hoping we would invest in a high quality backup behind him. Cam is serviceable, but obviously can’t support the run nearly as well.

[Johnnycage46]

11 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Not every team has Lamar Jackson, Derrick Henry, likely, and Andrews lol. ‘Oh no there’s tape out there now’ has to be the most overblown thing in football. 
 

just because you can watch how another team beat an opponent doesn’t mean you can replicate it with the talent you have.  Every opposing coach knows we have huge weaknesses at LB and safety right now and our nickel corner isn’t as good as the starter.  It isn’t like Baltimore discovered it 🤣

 

biggest issue I’ve seen is we have way

overcompensated for keeping mobile qbs in the pocket since halftime in Arizona and we’ve already faced the two most notable examples of that.  

 

I was talking about OUR offense being shut down. Some of it was scheme on our end and some of it is the make-up of the skill position players. If we can't get separation on the outside and teams clog the middle of the field it creates some big problems. If our WRs can't get separation on the outside, it doesn't take elite CB play from opposing defenses to make it difficult.

[Kenosha2Buffalo]

1 hour ago, Blank Stare said:

This is one of the more frustrating things about McD and his defense. Yes, it’s designed to stop the pass and has been effective against many teams that prioritize the pass. BUT he refuses to adapt it to the opponent when the occasion calls for it (i.e., when playing a run heavy team). Instead of adjusting and playing a third linebacker, he just sticks to his scheme. Maybe that works with a healthy Bernard and Taron Johnson, but sometimes you’ve gotta read the room and adjust when you’re playing backups dude. The answer isn’t a 180 and 190 lb Cam Lewis and Ja’Marcus Ingram, respectively, against 300lb Ricard and 250lb Henry. 

 

Didn't we have three linebackers on the first play where Henry ran wild ? I remember seeing 3 

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

9 minutes ago, Kenosha2Buffalo said:

 

Didn't we have three linebackers on the first play where Henry ran wild ? I remember seeing 3 

I did as well seen three lbs on field I think more in second half 

[Mango]

3 hours ago, BillsFan130 said:

McDermott/Babich... So infuriating 

 

I honestly thought McD was going to take over play calling even before the half. I am surprised he didn't.

 

McD has stopped Lamar a bunch and he never did it by doubling down on the pass but giving up the run. He did it by taking away Lamar's legs and making him beat him down field. My takeaway is that he doesn't trust his current back 7 as much as he has trusted them in past years. 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

1 hour ago, Johnnycage46 said:

 

I was talking about OUR offense being shut down. Some of it was scheme on our end and some of it is the make-up of the skill position players. If we can't get separation on the outside and teams clog the middle of the field it creates some big problems. If our WRs can't get separation on the outside, it doesn't take elite CB play from opposing defenses to make it difficult.

Same sort of deal on the offensive side too…Baltimore didn’t really do anything complicated up front but they won a high percentage of 1v1 pass rushing matchups. Limiting separation is easy when you’re getting to the qb because your guys don’t have to cover long.  Prime diggs got shut down all the time in that scenario.  There wasn’t much of a ‘secret formula’ that Baltimore employed that other teams now can replicate.  
 

we also got a big panicky with the playcalling seeing the defense not able to slow them down too and abandoned the run a bit early imo.  When we were actually running the ball we ran it as well as anyone has against that Baltimore defense. 

[Blank Stare]

1 hour ago, Kenosha2Buffalo said:

 

Didn't we have three linebackers on the first play where Henry ran wild ? I remember seeing 3 

Not according to this (Cam Lewis was in):

 

58 minutes ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

I did as well seen three lbs on field I think more in second half 

They did put a third LB on the field at times, but not part of the initial game plan. More so because they were out of answers. 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

21 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

I honestly thought McD was going to take over play calling even before the half. I am surprised he didn't.

 

McD has stopped Lamar a bunch and he never did it by doubling down on the pass but giving up the run. He did it by taking away Lamar's legs and making him beat him down field. My takeaway is that he doesn't trust his current back 7 as much as he has trusted them in past years. 

Maybe this is more saying the same thing a different way and not disagreeing but I think mcd tried to do what he always does with much worse players in a few very important positions. From a pretty limited sample size of running with a heavier defensive formation it seemed like things could’ve gone even worse if we went that route 😂. Morrow was godawful 

Edited October 1 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Johnnycage46]

31 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Same sort of deal on the offensive side too…Baltimore didn’t really do anything complicated up front but they won a high percentage of 1v1 pass rushing matchups. Limiting separation is easy when you’re getting to the qb because your guys don’t have to cover long.  Prime diggs got shut down all the time in that scenario.  There wasn’t much of a ‘secret formula’ that Baltimore employed that other teams now can replicate.  
 

we also got a big panicky with the playcalling seeing the defense not able to slow them down too and abandoned the run a bit early imo.  When we were actually running the ball we ran it as well as anyone has against that Baltimore defense. 

 

Agree on running the ball. Playcalling general seemed all over the place. On the now-infamous trick play drive, we were picking up 5, 7 yards a play. Just hope they have a good plan this week as we saw weeks 1-3

[Scott7975]

1 hour ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Same sort of deal on the offensive side too…Baltimore didn’t really do anything complicated up front but they won a high percentage of 1v1 pass rushing matchups. Limiting separation is easy when you’re getting to the qb because your guys don’t have to cover long.  Prime diggs got shut down all the time in that scenario.  There wasn’t much of a ‘secret formula’ that Baltimore employed that other teams now can replicate.  
 

we also got a big panicky with the playcalling seeing the defense not able to slow them down too and abandoned the run a bit early imo.  When we were actually running the ball we ran it as well as anyone has against that Baltimore defense. 

 

Because our line was so crap, they kept extra blockers in and only sent 3 out in pass patterns against 5/6. They arent winning that matchup when the rush still gets there.  Nobody could block. Ravens simulated pressure fooled em all and they couldnt figure out what to do about it. They dumped the whole gameplan, no motions or nothing.

1 hour ago, Blank Stare said:

Not according to this (Cam Lewis was in):

 

They did put a third LB on the field at times, but not part of the initial game plan. More so because they were out of answers. 

 

For reference on how good that speed was, Nick Wright said it was only 0.1 sec slower than Worthy's TD.  Thats just insane to keep that speed all the way down the sideline at his age and wear and tear.

Edited October 1 by Scott7975

[2003Contenders]

3 hours ago, Kenosha2Buffalo said:

 

Didn't we have three linebackers on the first play where Henry ran wild ? I remember seeing 3 

Yes. I was at the game and noted that there was a 3rd LB -- and the safeties were playing up close rather than in their usual cover-2 formation. So those pointing out that their scheme of not crowding the line of scrimmage, may see this first play as the reason that the coaches backed off from it. The drawback is that if the ball carrier manages to break through the initial line of defense, there is no second level to contain him. And Henry is a special case (as we have seen) where he is like a freight train once he gets up to his top level of speed. After that they backed off (some would say "played scared"), willing to let Henry pop off 4-5 yards per carry in exchange for avoiding another back-breaking run.

Edited October 1 by 2003Contenders