Xavier Worthy: So far, not much more than a gadget guy

[Alphadawg7]

7 minutes ago, FireChans said:

The playoff game vs the Chiefs was the second highest offensive EP of their season. Second only to the Panthers.

stop me if you heard this before. The defense sucks in the biggest moments against the Chiefs…. every season.

 

2024 teams that held the Chiefs to a lower offensive EP than the Bills in the AFCCG:

 

Texans x 2

Bucs

Saints

Steelers

Raiders x 2

Falcons

Niners

Broncos x2 

Chargers x2 

Bengals

Browns

 

Guess where the 2023 Bills were?

 

Bottom 5. Again.

 

Guess where the 2021 Bills were?

 

Bottom 3. Again.

 

Guess where the 2020 Bills were?

 

Worst defensive performance against the Chiefs the ENTIRE SEASON. 

So really, what the heck are we talking about? Invest more in defense so we can be more like the 2020-2021 Bills and be terrible like always?

 

So let me get this straight...your argument against improving the defense is to point out how the defense isn't good enough?  Lol 

[FireChans]

9 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

So let me get this straight...your argument against improving the defense is to point out how the defense isn't good enough?  Lol 

My argument is that we have been there and done that lmao.

 

How many All-Pros and future All-Pros on defense did we have in 2021? 
 

How much did it matter? Obviously, NOT AT ALL.

[Alphadawg7]

10 minutes ago, FireChans said:

My argument is that we have been there and done that lmao.

 

How many All-Pros and future All-Pros on defense did we have in 2021? 
 

How much did it matter? Obviously, NOT AT ALL.

 

Why not compare the 1990 Bills while you are at it?  I mean this isn't the same roster, DC, or OC of those teams...its as irrelevant of a comparison as it gets.  And we NEVER had any kind of a difference maker at ANY point on our DL...never once.  Not on those teams, not on this team.  

 

Meanwhile...no one in the NFL has scored more points than the Bills the past 5 seasons.  No player has scored more TD's than Allen in the history of the NFL at this stage of their career.  No team has one more games by 20+ points than we did this year.  No QB in history had a lower percentage of plays that resulted in a sack or turnover than Allen did this season.  Allen is number 1 in all kinds of playoff QB records.

 

What has it gotten us.  Nothing.  Nothing at all.  While you sit here and complain about the D not being good enough simultaneously arguing to NOT improve the D.  

 

  

Edited January 30 by Alphadawg7

[FireChans]

6 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Why not compare the 1990 Bills while you are at it?  I mean this isn't the same roster, DC, or OC of those teams...its as irrelevant of a comparison as it gets.  And we NEVER had any kind of a difference maker at ANY point on our DL...never once.  Not on those teams, not on this team.  

 

Meanwhile...no one in the NFL has scored more points than the Bills the past 5 seasons.  No player has scored more TD's than Allen in the history of the NFL at this stage of their career.  No team has one more games by 20+ points than we did this year.  No QB in history had a lower percentage of plays that resulted in a sack or turnover than Allen did this season.  Allen is number 1 in all kinds of playoff QB records.

 

What has it gotten us.  Nothing.  Nothing at all.  While you sit here and complain about the D not being good enough simultaneously arguing to NOT improve the D.  

 

  

We have 2 first round picks, 1 second round pick and a decently priced FA on the line lol.

 

we just need 5 first or second rounders and then maybe it will happen!

 

I hope you’re right. I truly do, especially because they are probably gonna go DL heavy again. But I think you and them will be wrong. 

[Kelly to Allen]

Coleman was clearly better before the injury. And Carter was ascending before the injury too 

 

 

[folz]

Not sure if anyone did a final tally or anything for this thread, but anyone wringing their hands over "giving Worthy to KC" as the narrative goes (another Buffalo blunder), well, I think the story is far from being written still. Some people act like Worthy had one of the greatest rookie seasons ever or something. He had a very good rookie season, but let's hold off on crowning him.

 

I couldn't find a list deeper than 25 players, but of the most receiving yards by a rookie receiver, Worthy doesn't even sniff #25. Numbers 24 and 25 are Mike Evans with 1,051 and 12 TDs and Keenan Allen with 1,046 and 8 TDs.

 

Worthy had 638 receiving yards and 6 receiving TDs. If you include his rushing stats, he had 742 yards and 9 TDs. Six rookie receivers had more receiving yards than he did this year, 7 rookie receivers had more than Worthy's rookie totals in 2023. He had a good year, but let's keep it in perspective. {I understand that means you can say all of the same things about Coleman---since he is one spot right below Worthy in the rookie numbers, but that is ok, we weren't looking for him to come in and be a number one WR right away in an everyone eats offense---plus he missed time}

 

Coleman had 567 scrimmage yds and 4 TDs in 13 games, with one 100-yard game. (And Coleman wasn't quite right for at least a couple of games back from injury).

Worthy had 742 scrimmage yds and 9 TDs in 17 games, no 100-yard games.

 

I know Keon didn't do much in the playoffs. But thus far, if you take away the non-catch in the Championship game, Worthy has averaged 48 yards and 0.5 TDs in K.C.'s two playoff games. It's not like he put that team over the top or gave them something they didn't have. Obviously both players will continue to grow and learn and may both turn out to be very good players. And this is not a down on Worthy post (I hope he does well, except when playing the Bills). It is just to calm the KC got us again sentiment, if it's out there. So again, I don't think we can make any determinations after just their rookie years.

 

Game averages 2024:

Worthy 43.64 yards/game, 0.53 TDs/game

Coleman 42.77 yards/game, 0.31 TDs/game

 

Yards per Target:

Worthy: 6.51

Keon: 9.75

 

Yards per Reception:

Worthy: 10.8

Keon: 19.2

 

I still think the Bills got the right player for Buffalo and there is no need to play into the narrative of KC one-upping us again here.

[90sBills]

30 minutes ago, folz said:

Not sure if anyone did a final tally or anything for this thread, but anyone wringing their hands over "giving Worthy to KC" as the narrative goes (another Buffalo blunder), well, I think the story is far from being written still. Some people act like Worthy had one of the greatest rookie seasons ever or something. He had a very good rookie season, but let's hold off on crowning him.

 

I couldn't find a list deeper than 25 players, but of the most receiving yards by a rookie receiver, Worthy doesn't even sniff #25. Numbers 24 and 25 are Mike Evans with 1,051 and 12 TDs and Keenan Allen with 1,046 and 8 TDs.

 

Worthy had 638 receiving yards and 6 receiving TDs. If you include his rushing stats, he had 742 yards and 9 TDs. Six rookie receivers had more receiving yards than he did this year, 7 rookie receivers had more than Worthy's rookie totals in 2023. He had a good year, but let's keep it in perspective. {I understand that means you can say all of the same things about Coleman---since he is one spot right below Worthy in the rookie numbers, but that is ok, we weren't looking for him to come in and be a number one WR right away in an everyone eats offense---plus he missed time}

 

Coleman had 567 scrimmage yds and 4 TDs in 13 games, with one 100-yard game. (And Coleman wasn't quite right for at least a couple of games back from injury).

Worthy had 742 scrimmage yds and 9 TDs in 17 games, no 100-yard games.

 

I know Keon didn't do much in the playoffs. But thus far, if you take away the non-catch in the Championship game, Worthy has averaged 48 yards and 0.5 TDs in K.C.'s two playoff games. It's not like he put that team over the top or gave them something they didn't have. Obviously both players will continue to grow and learn and may both turn out to be very good players. And this is not a down on Worthy post (I hope he does well, except when playing the Bills). It is just to calm the KC got us again sentiment, if it's out there. So again, I don't think we can make any determinations after just their rookie years.

 

Game averages 2024:

Worthy 43.64 yards/game, 0.53 TDs/game

Coleman 42.77 yards/game, 0.31 TDs/game

 

Yards per Target:

Worthy: 6.51

Keon: 9.75

 

Yards per Reception:

Worthy: 10.8

Keon: 19.2

 

I still think the Bills got the right player for Buffalo and there is no need to play into the narrative of KC one-upping us again here.

No one is saying fit Worthy for his HoF jacket. People are just pissed watching him get catch after catch with a TD to send us home while the guy we took got 1 rather inconsequential catch while looking very slow and mediocre in the same game. 

[streetkings01]

2 hours ago, 90sBills said:

No one is saying fit Worthy for his HoF jacket. People are just pissed watching him get catch after catch with a TD to send us home while the guy we took got 1 rather inconsequential catch while looking very slow and mediocre in the same game. 

Hopefully going forward we won’t have our slowest player in the secondary(Hamlin) covering their fastest receiver(Worthy)!

[QCity]

7 hours ago, folz said:

there is no need to play into the narrative of KC one-upping us again here.

 

There's no narrative anymore, it's a foregone conclusion that they one-upped us here. For all the work you put into massaging those stats, I'll offer this simple counterpoint: go watch that game again. Worthy is an absolute weapon that has to be schemed for and accounted for on every snap and he was a major reason why our team is heading to Cancun, while Keon is trending towards a WR 4/5 role. I'm sorry but anyone here that would still take Coleman over Worthy at this point has their fan goggles on so tight they can't be objective.

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

Worthy just scored 2 TDs in the Superbowl. 

 

That long TD bomb was impressive!

[Lionel Hutz]

I think it was stupid for the Bills to ever trade with the Chiefs but I don't know if Worthy is better than Coleman. I think a lot of it has to do with play calling and offensive schemes. Who's to say Coleman wouldn't have had a great season if he was playing under Andy Reid and Worthy might have stunk with the Bills. 

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Worthy just scored 2 TDs in the Superbowl. 

 

That long TD bomb was impressive!

What was impressive is not a garbage time TD in blow out loss by a one trick pony who helped Mahomes have maybe his worst season as a pro…but instead it was watching the Eagles learn from their mistakes and go out and get a real defense to not just get back to the SB but smash the Chiefs once they got there.  Just like the Bucs did, and just like the Bengals did the last time teams beat KC in the post season.  
 

 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

On 1/31/2025 at 1:11 AM, QCity said:

 

There's no narrative anymore, it's a foregone conclusion that they one-upped us here. For all the work you put into massaging those stats, I'll offer this simple counterpoint: go watch that game again. Worthy is an absolute weapon that has to be schemed for and accounted for on every snap and he was a major reason why our team is heading to Cancun, while Keon is trending towards a WR 4/5 role. I'm sorry but anyone here that would still take Coleman over Worthy at this point has their fan goggles on so tight they can't be objective.

I really don’t get worthy, is he getting open and mahomes just isn’t throwing it to him?  He’s good against man with a free release but seems like he gets lost when he’s jammed.  
 

An ‘absolute weapon that you have to account for on every snap’ doesn’t completely disappear in the second half of the afc championship against that awful

bills secondary.  I’ve seen you hyping up his afc championship performance a few times and that kinda has me puzzled.  26 yards of his were absolute bollocks…that one play was def not a completion.  he had a pretty good first half in the 40 ish receiving yards area accounting for that then mostly vanished.  
 

tonight in crunch time he was completely locked up.  Pretty sure he had 1 target for  a 1 yard completion before the game got very out of hand and 2 targets for 10 total yards by the time it got completely out of hand 

the dude probably saw as many snaps as most rookie WRs ever have and had a pretty ok season?  Like I’m just not seeing it honestly.  Chiefs are probably wishing we didn’t make the trade so they could’ve grabbed mcconkey deep down 🤣

better than Coleman yea maybe I guess we’ll see.  Coleman was actually ahead of worthy’s pace pre injury. But this notion we traded them some absolutely game breaking wr I’m just not understanding 

Edited February 10 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Aussie Joe]

5 hours ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Worthy just scored 2 TDs in the Superbowl. 

 

That long TD bomb was impressive!

Did he win the MVP?

 

I had turned off the game by then …

 

Before that… I  thought they should have drafted an OL instead of Worthy considering how Mahomes was running for his life the whole game …

 

 

 

Edited February 10 by Aussie Joe

[BigDingus]

On 1/30/2025 at 1:14 PM, FireChans said:

My argument is that we have been there and done that lmao.

 

How many All-Pros and future All-Pros on defense did we have in 2021? 
 

How much did it matter? Obviously, NOT AT ALL.

 

Bingo. And I don't trust Beane & McDermott to identify potential star defensive players in the early rounds of the draft anyway. The best they do is find under-valued players they can coach up in the later rounds.

 

I'd much rather them continue to take shots to get Josh help on offense. They traded to get players like Hyde & Poyer, so if anything, look for young pieces they can get in free agency or trade.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

20 minutes ago, BigDingus said:

 

Bingo. And I don't trust Beane & McDermott to identify potential star defensive players in the early rounds of the draft anyway. The best they do is find under-valued players they can coach up in the later rounds.

 

I'd much rather them continue to take shots to get Josh help on offense. They traded to get players like Hyde & Poyer, so if anything, look for young pieces they can get in free agency or trade.

Interesting thing I keep hearing from Bills media is the Chiefs stole Trent McDuffie from the Bills. There’s people that say they were 100% set on McDuffie.

 

Always the Chiefs. 

[Thrivefourfive]

I did not want to see this happen tonight. My Coleman and Worthy comments this season are not of the flattering type 

Only Beane would undersell Worthy’s freakables and buy into whatever he thinks Coleman CAN be.

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

5 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

What was impressive is not a garbage time TD in blow out loss by a one trick pony who helped Mahomes have maybe his worst season as a pro…but instead it was watching the Eagles learn from their mistakes and go out and get a real defense to not just get back to the SB but smash the Chiefs once they got there.  Just like the Bucs did, and just like the Bengals did the last time teams beat KC in the post season.  
 

 

You'll never have a real, physical defense with McDermott. He prioritizes speed over strength.

 

Our DL is so fkn weak man, you rarely see our guys win one on one, let alone 4v5 like the eagles did yesterday.

 

I have zero faith.

[thenorthremembers]

8 hours ago, Lionel Hutz said:

I think it was stupid for the Bills to ever trade with the Chiefs but I don't know if Worthy is better than Coleman. I think a lot of it has to do with play calling and offensive schemes. Who's to say Coleman wouldn't have had a great season if he was playing under Andy Reid and Worthy might have stunk with the Bills. 

 

We really have to stop this narrative.  Reid is one of the best offensive coaches of all time but he isn't revolutionizing offense.   Part of his genius is calling the right play at the right time but part of it is drafting great players.   

 

Scheme and players are symbiotic one doesn't work without the other.   Let's just call a spade a spade with Worthy and Coleman, one guy is running by people in the Superbowl, and the other is a jump ball specialist who can't run a fade route.   

 

It's not only about scheme and it's not only about talent.  That said,  that does Coleman do that's elite?   He can't get off press.  He hasn't shown he has reliable hands.   He isn't fast.  And he can't run a full route tree.   Scheme doesn't fix that.   

[Chaos]

To my eyes, it appears the Bills like to draft guys, that they hope to be worthy of a second contract.  Some other teams seem to like guys who are going to significantly outperform their rookie contract costs.  We will be trying to develop and grow Keon Coleman.  Meanwhile guys like Zay Flowers, Tank Dell, and Xavier Worthy are likely to be used up and not worth a long term second contract. Rookies should be part of a "Win Now" strategy.