Tua’s Broken Dome (now being placed on IR-out at least 4 games)

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, hikerprof2 said:

It took them six minutes to "decide" Tua had a concussion, a conclusion anyone could have come to within 5 seconds. Don't care that most of us are not "medical experts" man hits his head, goes unconscious, crumbles up and initiates an automatic "fencing pose," you can't hide that. Why did it take so long for the official word?? Because that is five minutes trying to invent some excuse as to why what is obviously a concussion was not a concussion -pay some fake team Dr. Nick Riviera to say "it's only soft tissue damage to-the hip" and cart him right back out there, in a desperation attempt to win a game that they needed to win, just like two years ago.  I don't want our team to be responsible for the death of a player-Miami has to do the right thing. I live in Florida though, and I can attest "doing the right thing" and "Florida" are just not congruent in this tropic dystopia. We look pretty. Everything else is a moral abyss.

 

That may have happened in the past, but there is an independent doctor present during the evaluation nowadays.

It took only 6 minutes to officially determine a concussion.  Seems pretty fast to me.

[TheWei44]

34 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Based on the theory of the mechanism of injury for CTE, they all are---likely beginning well before the entered the NFL.  Years of repetitive impacts, large and tiny/unnoticed.   

 

Boxing and MMA are still hugely popular---all they do is punch and kick each other in the head.  Hockey still allows fighting--guy toss their gloves so they can properly punch other players in the head.  No one cares--"it's part of the game"...etc.  No one is forced to retire after getting knocked out (which is the goal of any fight).

 

Players and their agents and their organization have proven over and over that they are not concerned with this.  They refuse to adapt almost any serious efforts to mitigate injury (they won't were those helmet guards, they continue to cheap shot and head shot each other, etc). If they are not concerned, it's hard for me to be overly concerned.  There are countless workers who take on far more risk to their health/lives for a tiny fraction NFL money.  

 

My point is that there are a lot of crocodile tears being shed here for a rival team's player....

Not sure how you can call it crocodile tears when if all that mattered were beating the Fins, having Tua play is preferable to him retiring.  Many of us our family men and women, and when you take into account that he has a family, I think a lot of people genuinely feel bad for the guy (who by all accounts is a good guy).  There's a lot of blame to go around, including Tua himself, but I personally believe alot of Bills fans are sincerely concerned about his health and think that retiring should be strongly considered.

[Mr. WEO]

27 minutes ago, SageAgainstTheMachine said:

So I’m partially in agreement with you, in that these are adults who can make their own decisions.

 

But why do you mention crocodile tears and a rival team?  I think people are genuinely upset to see someone putting himself through life altering head injuries.  We’re a social and empathetic species and some things transcend which team you’re rooting for.

 

1 minute ago, TheWei44 said:

Not sure how you can call it crocodile tears when if all that mattered were beating the Fins, having Tua play is preferable to him retiring.  Many of us our family men and women, and when you take into account that he has a family, I think a lot of people genuinely feel bad for the guy (who by all accounts is a good guy).  There's a lot of blame to go around, including Tua himself, but I personally believe alot of Bills fans are sincerely concerned about his health and think that retiring should be strongly considered.

 

I've listed the reasons why these are crocodile tears.  Scroll up.

 

I'll throw in that if this was a QB in the NFC South, for instance, there would be no threads about it.  No one here believes the Dolphins would be a more difficult team to beat with a backup QB.   

 

No doubt many fans truly feel for the guy, and hope he retires (I would hope he leaves football).  But Tua gets crapped on here year round, and when he may now be eliminated as a threat on a team that has been widely picked to challenge the Bills for the division, let's say I'm not convinced of the genuine nature of the concussion prompted TBD outpouring of concern for Tua's health....when the same posters are clamoring for Hyde's return (to help the Bills in the playoff run!), for instance.

 

it's a stretch....

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Grown men. They know the risk

That said, he should have never been let back into the game two years ago. 

I think the independent doc was fired after that.

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

9 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

I've listed the reasons why these are crocodile tears.  Scroll up.

 

I'll throw in that if this was a QB in the NFC South, for instance, there would be no threads about it.  No one here believes the Dolphins would be a more difficult team to beat with a backup QB.   

 

No doubt many fans truly feel for the guy, and hope he retires (I would hope he leaves football).  But Tua gets crapped on here year round, and when he may now be eliminated as a threat on a team that has been widely picked to challenge the Bills for the division, let's say I'm not convinced of the genuine nature of the concussion prompted TBD outpouring of concern for Tua's health....when the same posters are clamoring for Hyde's return (to help the Bills in the playoff run!), for instance.

 

it's a stretch....

Yeah, I guess there’s bound to be a spectrum of authenticity.  I wonder if the Bills fan base is at least a little more genuine than average after what happened in ‘22.  I know my reaction to Thursday had more of a memento mori to it because Hamlin was involved.

 

For the record I did start a thread saying Morse should retire a few years ago, and the responses were polarized.

Edited September 14 by SageAgainstTheMachine

[ProcessImproverMan]

The Dolphins management, coaching, ownership and fanbase is simply just as braindead as their QB. Miami should have tried to push Tua in a trade during the draft while his value was higher to a desperate team and undergone a sort of salary purge by trading away Hill and others for picks as part of a reset. Miami has not been able to consistently beat good teams with this group so purging and resetting would have made sense. A team like the Giants or Falcons or Broncos may have given up enough to them so they could get a QB and reset the past draft. However management, coaching, their fanbase, etc all thought they would win this year so here they are.

 

 

Edited September 14 by ProcessImproverMan

[Doc]

2 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

I've listed the reasons why these are crocodile tears.  Scroll up.

 

I'll throw in that if this was a QB in the NFC South, for instance, there would be no threads about it.  No one here believes the Dolphins would be a more difficult team to beat with a backup QB.   

 

No doubt many fans truly feel for the guy, and hope he retires (I would hope he leaves football).  But Tua gets crapped on here year round, and when he may now be eliminated as a threat on a team that has been widely picked to challenge the Bills for the division, let's say I'm not convinced of the genuine nature of the concussion prompted TBD outpouring of concern for Tua's health....when the same posters are clamoring for Hyde's return (to help the Bills in the playoff run!), for instance.

 

it's a stretch....

 

Tua gets crapped on here year round for his play on the field.  I don't think many people have said a bad thing about him as a person. 

 

But yes, worrying about his health while at the same time hoping Hyde returns is a bit hypocritical.

[The Frankish Reich]

1 hour ago, Sweats said:

Of course they can't "force" him to retire,

No, but I believe an independent neurologist could opine that he cannot be cleared to play, and that there's no real expiration date on that. In other words, never cleared = effective medical retirement?

[Mr. WEO]

1 minute ago, SageAgainstTheMachine said:

Yeah, I guess there’s bound to be a spectrum of authenticity.  I wonder if the Bills fan base is at least a little more genuine than average after what happened in ‘22.  I know my reaction to Thursday had more of a memento mori to it because Hamlin was involved.

 

For the record I did start a thread saying Morse should retire a few years ago, and the responses were polarized.

 

 

There might have been a tiny bit more solid moral footing in the calls for his retirement after the '22 issue.  But that died quickly when he came back from a coma to win 5 straight.  Suddenly no one was distraught over his health...

[The Frankish Reich]

2 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Tua gets crapped on here year round for his play on the field.  I don't think many people have said a bad thing about him as a person. 

 

But yes, worrying about his health while at the same time hoping Hyde returns is a bit hypocritical.

Fitzy really got it perfect in the post game.

He didn't urge any particular outcome. He just said he knows Tua as a fine man with a growing family, and that obviously the decision on whether or not to come back (if cleared) will take into account his continued life outside of football.

[Mr. WEO]

Just now, The Frankish Reich said:

No, but I believe an independent neurologist could opine that he cannot be cleared to play, and that there's no real expiration date on that. In other words, never cleared = effective medical retirement?

 

If he is exhibiting no signs of concussion, what would they base their decision not to clear him on? They do not clear or deny clearance based on the possibility that the injury could happen again.  That's not their charge.

[Breakout Squad]

1 hour ago, Toledo Bill said:

I posted this the other day:

 

It makes me sick listening to McDaniel talk about his concern for Tua and how he cares about him.

Going back to 2022 when they put him back into the game after the “back injury” I still feel that if they “cared” so much about him that would not have happened.

I will always believe that he never truly recovered from that and the Dolphins and Mr, “Caring” McDaniel should share in the blame regarding Tua’s situation.

McDaniels cares… He kissed him on the head 😏

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

It’s also worth noting how tear-your-hair-out dumb it is for Tua to not just slide after he has the first down, given his post concussion issues.  
 

With the way the rules are geared to avoid QB hits and the work he put into falling the right way (which apparently worked in ‘23) Tua could have conceivably played out a nice career without exacerbating this.  But he just needed an extra meaningless yard.

Edited September 14 by SageAgainstTheMachine

[dma0034]

I'm glad the Dolphins paid him. No one really has a bad thing to say about Tua as a person. 

 

I think he'll continue to play. It's sad because that hit wasn't a devastating blow but every concussion he gets has the ability to do more damage and the likelihood of them happening increases. 

 

NFL players don't ever think about the long term effects. The more concussions he has the more his life will suck later on. Imagine having light sensitivity and constant migrates at age 35

 

Poor dude, it's his choice but I hope he lives a healthy life

[Old Coot]

Geez, you guys are very critical of McDaniel. Maybe he didn't know that Tua was concussed. A player will sometimes "man up" and cover up an injury because of competitiveness or not wanting to let the team down.

 

Mcdaniel isn't a doc & if the docs checked Tua for concussion and cleared him, then McDaniel is ignorant of the concussion.

 

Also, Mcdaniel risks losing the players if they see that he values winning more than their health.

 

I don't know what McDaniel knew when he allowed Tua to play on that Thursday night so maybe he did know. It's possible he did not; that's my point.

[Thrivefourfive]

2 hours ago, RunTheBall said:

IDK if this needs its own thread, I didn’t see one that seemed to fit, but feel free to merge it if appropriate.

 

I’m a doc, not a brain doc, but I’ve got enough experience with traumatic brain injury that I think I can opine with some credibility. I’ve always disliked Miami as a franchise but ever since 2022 I’ve had a searing hatred for them because I think they put Tua’s life in danger. 

 

The decision to allow Tua to play that Thursday night game after he got his first concussion against the Bills on a Sunday was criminal. When Tua fell/stumbled off the field and they said it was back spasms the NFL should have stepped in and said “WTF are you even thinking?!” That second concussion he suffered where he was fencing on the ground was the one that significantly scrambled his brain and has the potential to be life altering. Despite what that clown David Chao says, a fencing response is an indicator of a SEVERE concussion. You don’t get a fencing response on a minor concussion. What’s happening is near seizure like activity leading to spasticity and uncontrolled limb movements. 

 

We saw a fencing response from Tua again on Thursday night on what should have been a very minor head bonk. The reason Tua suffered another severe concussion on a minor hit was because his brain was significantly damaged back in 2022 and he’s highly vulnerable to future concussions and brain damage. There’s no question in my mind Tua should walk away from the game with his guaranteed millions and enjoy the rest of his life as healthy as he can. 

 

Miami is a disgusting franchise. The reason McDaniels looked so shell shocked on Thursday is because he knows he’s partially responsible for Tua’s marshmallow cranium. Every person who said it was ok for Tua to play that Thursday night in 2022, including the docs who signed off on it, should have been fired, and at the very least feel immense shame for what they did to Tua.

 

 

Doc, please ask your lawyer if Tua can sue the Dolphins? 2022 was criminal, as you say.

[Saxum]

1 hour ago, Buddy Hix said:

When I saw McDaniel asking people not to bring up Tua’s future, I could only laugh. I immediately thought about that “back injury” and how complicit he and the Fins franchise are Tua’s situation.

 

If I was a reporter I would ask if they could bring up Tua's history just to see the lemon tasting face of him.

[H2o]

Miami could have put more focus on building an OL to protect Tua. Instead they keep going for shiny new toys. They traded for and handed out a lot of $$$ to Chubb, Ramsey, and Tyreek Hill. They threw too much $$$ at an often injured Terron Armstead. They still have Eichenberg starting on that OL and he's been putrid for them. Grier has just been terrible. Ross is stupid for keeping him around. All that said, Tua puts himself in harm's way a lot. If he would have just slid against us, he wouldn't have gotten hurt. The concussion against the Packers could have been avoided. He chose to go back in the game against us after his "back injury" when he could have been honest with the medical staff. He should have retired after 2022. He kept playing and here we are. 

[Mike in Horseheads]

If ya want to see what a few too many hits to the head will do to you read up on Jim Mcmahon (sp)

Edited September 14 by Mike in Horseheads

[DaVinci]

Tua is done. The NFL will never let him play. Can you Imagine the Optics of one more Fencing Tua on the field.