Blame For Defensive Injuries

[TheWeatherMan]

You forgot the JA injuries, although he didn’t miss any time.  

[colin]

coach mcd claps constantly and it creates microtrauma that leads to injuries.

 

ok, seriously this is mostly bad luck.  It is true tho, that smaller more quick twitch and faster players are more prone to losing time to injury.  part of it is the size they have vs the force they generate/take from contact w bigger players.  a sort of under stated part of it tho is a bigger stronger guy can be more effective w some injuries than a smaller faster guy, not to mention position by position.

 

so, an OL can have a back that needs heavy surgery (spencer brown the other year) play on it all year, and still be a solid contributor.  big part of that is brown is a titan of a man, he's 320 lean strong and 6'8 no matter how is back is feeling.  he doesn't sprint and change direction and catch balls, or cover guys, so him being a bit more sluggish won't hurt him as much.

 

a bigger linebacker than milano is less likely to get muscle injuries simply because in order to have the physical impact that milano does he needs to have bigger stronger muscles relative to his frame and size than a larger edumds type backer (who missed very little time in spite of playing nearly all snaps).  now the upside is, when a player like milano can hit and tackle like a bigger guy, he's a human missile and wrecks shop when healthy.

 

another example to sort of support my point is josh allen.  messed up his UCL, all but just broke his left hand, but since he's such a savage truck of a human he can still go out there and ball out.  chad pennington of much slighter stature would just not be able to go with injuries like that.

 

so anyhow, size and such does play a part, and we have a smaller d, but luck is a giant part of it, and every team gets guys hurt.

[amprov56]

1 hour ago, mjt328 said:

Human nature is always looking for someone to blame when things go wrong.

I notice a lot of people trying to lay all these injuries on our training and conditioning staff, but I'm not sure that's really fair.

 

Up until the end of 2021, the Bills were actually one of the healthiest teams in the entire league.  And if you recall, our training staff and facilities were getting a lot of credit (which honestly was probably just luck and was really undeserved).  Then on Thanksgiving of that year, everything started unraveling.  And it's been a mess ever since.

 

2021 - Tre White - ACL

2022 - Micah Hyde - Neck

2022 - Von Miller - ACL

2023 - Tre White - Achilles

2023 - Matt Milano - Leg

2023 - Daquan Jones - Pec

2024 - Matt Milano - Bicep

2024 - Terrel Bernard - Pec

 

As you can see, most of these injuries are freak occurrences.  

Miller did have a previous ACL tear to the same knee, but it was 9 years prior. 

Milano gets a bad rap for being injury-prone.  But anyone would have gotten hurt getting caught in a pile like that.  His bicep injury happened hitting a bag.

Bernard is undersized, so I can sorta understand the point being made there.  But Jones is not, and he completely tore it.

 

The crazy thing is, everything is on the Defensive side of the ball. 

Our Offense has remained relatively healthy.  Josh Allen has the longest streak of starts for a QB in the NFL.  Our O-Line was the only unit to start the same five guys every game last year.

 

This is TBD, it's what happens here!

[NORWOODS FOOT]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

Yea some of it is just pure bad luck. The ACLs, neck and achillies injury are not the sort of things your conditioning staff can solve, sadly. The muscle injuries you would definitely want to look at what you are doing in that department. I don't buy that Bernard's size has anything to with it though. 

My understanding is that, via specialized nutrition and specialized exercises tendons and ligaments can indeed be strengthened, but there’s only so much time in a day. So who knows if these extra steps are happening?

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

 

1 hour ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

kc has a horseshoe jammed so far up their a** 😂. Its more them being lucky than us being unlucky though 

Switch the fryer oil that Reid has his 'chicken noogies' cooked in to vegetable based.  It will be like cutting off Sampson's hair. 😉

1 hour ago, nucci said:

it's football

We all know what Doug Whaley thinks about it.

[dpberr]

1 hour ago, Matt_In_NH said:

The blaming of the strength staff for injuries is so annoying.   Can it impact things?   Yes but if you think they have some internet doctors creating the plans and they never thought to invest in sports science you are ridiculous.   A couple years ago the bills had low injuries so the narrative is the bills have the best sports science in the history of the world.  The numbers catch up with them because the nfl is a 100 percent injury sport and now they are just clowns.  So dumb

I wouldn't give the S&C team a free pass.  An example - when the Ravens fired Steve Saunders, it was due to the ineffectiveness of his injury prevention and recovery program, not his strength program.  It wasn't working - and the Ravens were racking up serious injuries to ligaments and muscles of a significant number of players.  

 

As it pertains to Bills injuries - I suspect players are either training too hard or doing the wrong types of training in the offseason, considering their previous injuries and age.  I think Bills players like Bills S&C because they largely let the players train using their own programs, but they show up to camp physically strong, but in some respects, fragile.  

 

 

 

[Bruffalo]

McD to the Bills sports science/conditioning  staff & God: 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

2 hours ago, Matt_In_NH said:

The blaming of the strength staff for injuries is so annoying.   Can it impact things?   Yes but if you think they have some internet doctors creating the plans and they never thought to invest in sports science you are ridiculous.   A couple years ago the bills had low injuries so the narrative is the bills have the best sports science in the history of the world.  The numbers catch up with them because the nfl is a 100 percent injury sport and now they are just clowns.  So dumb

It'sa combination of everything. It's field conditions, it's player size, it's conditioning regiments, it's luck.  It's literally all of the above. The only thing I can't figure out is why the defense is dominating the injury list?

[MikePJ76]

Pretty weird, the Chiefs have what players say is the worst group of trainers/doctors in the league and their guys are never hurt.  I always wonder if that is part of Andy Reid's old school mentality where he keeps those guys away from the players and they basically tell them to tough it out more.

 

Parcells, Bellichick, Ditka etc...used to keep the players away from the doctors and basically tried to intimidate the doctors.  The old nfl was brutal.  

[Royale with Cheese]

2 hours ago, gonzo1105 said:

The Bills have had some bad luck with things but referencing Milano, Bernard, and Johnson they are all undersized for the things they are asked to do in the NFL. Johnson is one of the best slot CB's because not only can he cover but he's a really good player coming down and tackling but that involved a guy under 200 pounds constantly taking on offensive lineman, TE's and bigger running backs.

 

Milano and Bernard are 230 pounds at best and constantly taking on 300 pound lineman. Those battles take their toll over time. 

 

I can agree with you on Taron...he's a small missile.

 

But with Milano having a 300+ lbs lineman rolling on a leg when it's planted, anyone's leg is snapping.

DaQuan Jones tore his pec last year and he's huge.  I think it's just freak occurrences.  

[ColoradoBills]

These injuries are tough.  The one good thing is so far, they all are expected back.

 

The mini bye may help getting a few walking wounded back into the mix.

[starrymessenger]

If you go with a smaller, faster D you probably run a greater risk of injury. Our top shelf players who have been sidelined, Milano, Bernard and Johnson are smaller guys. That is McD's D and it's a good one so you run with the risk. 
One way to mitigate that risk is with a strong bench of backup players. They have been very good so far (except the first half v Zona) and if they hold up then the coaching staff (and the GM) deserve a lot of credit for grooming these guys and for realizing the importance of having people who can step in especially when you run the D they do. 
I look forward to the day when the D is back at full strength. It should be very solid.

[nedboy7]

11 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I can agree with you on Taron...he's a small missile.

 

But with Milano having a 300+ lbs lineman rolling on a leg when it's planted, anyone's leg is snapping.

DaQuan Jones tore his pec last year and he's huge.  I think it's just freak occurrences.  

This is accurate.  While size will have a role in injuries, we’re too quick to exaggerate it’s effect. 
 

Edited September 14 by nedboy7

[without a drought]

I blame mjt328. 

[Scott7975]

Its a violent sport.  Anybody can get injured anytime.

[gonzo1105]

When you run a system with smaller guys these things happen. 
 

Thomas Davis had 3 ACL tears, 1 of which was with McDermott, pulled his hamstring and broke his arm. Davis weighed 235

 

Shaq Thompson another McDermott guy has had hamstrings, knee sprains, shoulder issues, and recently fractured his leg. Thompson weighed 230. 
 

Luke Kuechly who everyone knows was a star retired due to concussions

also tore his labrum and had shoulder surgery. He weighed 235. 

 

Bernard is 225 pounds. He plays the Kuechly role and is 10 pounds less. 
 

Milano is 223 pounds. He plays the Thomas Davis role and is 12 pounds less. 
 

Taron Johnson plays the Shaq Thompson role. Johnson is 192 pounds while Thompson was 229. 
 

Look at how banged up the Panthers guys got in the same McDermott system and they were bigger than all 3 of the Bills guys. This will continue and is more likely to happen to the 3 as they age. Small bodies break down when colliding with bigger bodies over and over again 

[MJS]

It's part of the game. Every team has injuries. But, it doss seem the defense has been snake bitten. Hopefully we can have all our injuries to begin the year and they can be healthier heading into the playoffs. Is that too much to ask?

[Donuts and Doritos]

Linebacker position hit hard 2nd year in a row. Last year we decided to go w/ a Milano style (smaller, fast coverage LBer) at MLB. Milano has a history of injuries in the past. I wonder IF there's a correlation between smaller LBers and increased injuries? I acknowledge it's pure speculation on my part, might be just a coincidence.

[Don Otreply]

The injuries “could” be from a multitude of reasons, bad luck, over use/ off season workouts, steroids/ Peds, or those anatomies are developed to their end points, and are on the edge of capacity, it’s a Gladiator sport, odds are pretty high any one of these guys are going to get injured in the next game they play, example is Allen’s non throwing hand, etc etc, just part of the game.

[Motorin']

On 9/13/2024 at 7:11 AM, mjt328 said:

Human nature is always looking for someone to blame when things go wrong.

I notice a lot of people trying to lay all these injuries on our training and conditioning staff, but I'm not sure that's really fair.

 

Up until the end of 2021, the Bills were actually one of the healthiest teams in the entire league.  And if you recall, our training staff and facilities were getting a lot of credit (which honestly was probably just luck and was really undeserved).  Then on Thanksgiving of that year, everything started unraveling.  And it's been a mess ever since.

 

2021 - Tre White - ACL

2022 - Micah Hyde - Neck

2022 - Von Miller - ACL

2023 - Tre White - Achilles

2023 - Matt Milano - Leg

2023 - Daquan Jones - Pec

2024 - Matt Milano - Bicep

2024 - Terrel Bernard - Pec

 

As you can see, most of these injuries are freak occurrences.  

Miller did have a previous ACL tear to the same knee, but it was 9 years prior. 

Milano gets a bad rap for being injury-prone.  But anyone would have gotten hurt getting caught in a pile like that.  His bicep injury happened hitting a bag.

Bernard is undersized, so I can sorta understand the point being made there.  But Jones is not, and he completely tore it.

 

The crazy thing is, everything is on the Defensive side of the ball. 

Our Offense has remained relatively healthy.  Josh Allen has the longest streak of starts for a QB in the NFL.  Our O-Line was the only unit to start the same five guys every game last year.

 

 

Come on, everyone knows it was the dude's fault who posted the thread about the Bills never being injured right before the start of the 2021 season.