AlBUNDY4TDS Posted September 11 Posted September 11 12 minutes ago, Starr-Bills said: Deal with these networks moving forward. How not free speech and authoritarian of you. Did ABC settle for $768,000,000.00 for propagating election lies? But cnn had to for spreading lies about a high school kid. What's you point? It all stinks. 2
Starr-Bills Posted September 11 Posted September 11 2 minutes ago, AlBUNDY4TDS said: But cnn had to for spreading lies about a high school kid. What's you point? It all stinks. This again, do a search, I’ve covered this “what about ism”
SCBills Posted September 11 Posted September 11 6 minutes ago, Starr-Bills said: Okay Mr. “Free speech”. So what you are saying is Harris is smart not going on Fox? Politically, yea. I think they’d be fairer to her than you think .. similar to the CNN debate. Also, I don’t think you know what free speech means.. not sure why you keep bringing that up in this context. 1
Avisan Posted September 11 Posted September 11 3 minutes ago, dgrochester55 said: I am independent and was going to likely vote Kennedy before he dropped out. Trump had a bad night and the mods showed bias. Both happened, One did not cause the other and it is not an either/or. The mods on ABC news were problematic. Why was Harris not asked the same type of tough questions or corrected when she said something inaccurate? This is not just a few MAGAs whining, the bias of ABC news seemed to be noticed across the board. Harris shows a history that is far to the left but suddenly seems to be running on a more moderate platform. People have a right to naturally question why there was a sudden change in her views and the mods did a disservice by not pressing this. We already know what Trump is like for better or worse. A lot of Americans do not know much about Harris and had questions about her that were not answered. A good debate moderator gives equal and consistent treatment to each participant and that did not happen last night. To answer your question: Neither candidate was fact-checked with respect to their attacks on one another as candidates. Trump was fact-checked with respect to objective realities involving late-term pregnancy terminations or palliative care for non-viable infants, incendiary claims about (legal) migrants eating family pets, whether or not he won the 2020 election, and whether or not he recently made comments about Harris' racial background. Asserting something incorrect about your opponent is different from asserting incorrect things about reality outside of your opponent. Moderators were fact-checking the latter, but not the former. One of the candidates has a more complicated relationship with truth than the other, and was thus fact-checked more. 3 1
AlBUNDY4TDS Posted September 11 Posted September 11 2 minutes ago, Starr-Bills said: This again, do a search, I’ve covered this “what about ism” Again, what was your point?
Starr-Bills Posted September 11 Posted September 11 Just now, AlBUNDY4TDS said: Again, what was your point? What about do a search was unclear?
SCBills Posted September 11 Posted September 11 1 minute ago, Avisan said: To answer your question: Neither candidate was fact-checked with respect to their attacks on one another as candidates. Trump was fact-checked with respect to objective realities involving late-term pregnancy terminations or palliative care for non-viable infants, incendiary claims about (legal) migrants eating family pets, whether or not he won the 2020 election, and whether or not he recently made comments about Harris' racial background. Asserting something incorrect about your opponent is different from asserting incorrect things about reality outside of your opponent. Moderators were fact-checking the latter, but not the former. One of the candidates has a more complicated relationship with truth than the other, and was thus fact-checked more. Linsey Davis fact check on abortion was wrong. Trump referenced letting the baby die after they’re born. This has happened 8 times in Minnesota since Tim Walz changed language in their legislation to require only comfort care to be provided to a baby that survives an abortion, instead of life-saving care. 1
phypon Posted September 11 Posted September 11 2 minutes ago, SCBills said: Linsey Davis fact check on abortion was wrong. Trump referenced letting the baby die after they’re born. This has happened 8 times in Minnesota since Tim Walz changed language in their legislation to require only comfort care to be provided to a baby that survives an abortion, instead of life-saving care. I have to say, that is so F'ed up. Anyone that supports "comfort care" in that situation is absolutely pure evil. Pure evil. 2
dgrochester55 Posted September 11 Posted September 11 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Avisan said: To answer your question: Neither candidate was fact-checked with respect to their attacks on one another as candidates. Trump was fact-checked with respect to objective realities involving late-term pregnancy terminations or palliative care for non-viable infants, incendiary claims about (legal) migrants eating family pets, whether or not he won the 2020 election, and whether or not he recently made comments about Harris' racial background. Asserting something incorrect about your opponent is different from asserting incorrect things about reality outside of your opponent. Moderators were fact-checking the latter, but not the former. One of the candidates has a more complicated relationship with truth than the other, and was thus fact-checked more. Harris also said things that were not accurate. I am not saying that they should not have corrected Trump, but that they should have also fact checked her and asked her tough questions. If you do not like Trump like many don't, fine. I do not care for him either. What I do not get is why people would not want to see equal treatment and an even playing field on the debate. Regardless of how it is spun or justified, that did not happen. Edited September 11 by dgrochester55 3
Avisan Posted September 11 Posted September 11 1 minute ago, SCBills said: Linsey Davis fact check on abortion was wrong. Trump referenced letting the baby die after they’re born. This has happened 8 times in Minnesota since Tim Walz changed language in their legislation to require only comfort care to be provided to a baby that survives an abortion, instead of life-saving care. Were those elective abortions or medical abortions due to a combination of risk to the mother and conditions incompatible with life for the baby? All of the alleged cases I have seen so far outside of Minnesota have involved parents making decisions about how long to sustain the life of a doomed and suffering (wanted) infant. 1 minute ago, dgrochester55 said: Harris also said things that were not accurate. I am not saying that they should not have corrected Trump, but that they should have also fact checked her and asked her tough questions. If you do not like Trump like many don't, fine. What I do not get is why people would not want to see equal treatment and an even playing field on the debate. Regardless of how it is spun or justified, that did not happen. Harris did not make strong inaccurate claims outside of her opponent about matters of fact. You could reasonably say that she was misleading on how she answered questions about herself or attacks on Trump's positions, but again, moderators were not fact-checking attacks against opponents. 2 1
BillsFanNC Posted September 11 Posted September 11 1 minute ago, dgrochester55 said: Harris also said things that were not accurate. I am not saying that they should not have corrected Trump, but that they should have also fact checked her and asked her tough questions. If you do not like Trump like many don't, fine. What I do not get is why people would not want to see equal treatment and an even playing field on the debate. Regardless of how it is spun or justified, that did not happen. All politicians lie. It's part of the job description. The moderators should not be live "fact checking" either one. The moderators are supposed to moderate. Down the middle. If they choose to step out of their lane as moderators and "fact check" then if they want to be considered anything close to fair then they need to "fact check" both of them That did not happen on ABC last night. 3 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted September 11 Posted September 11 Betting odds often cited here. How do you like them apples? https://www.realclearpolling.com/betting-odds/2024/president
Big Blitz Posted September 11 Posted September 11 I said 11 last night. It was 10 to ZERO 10 “fact checks” and rebuttals to ZERO Not complaining bc I knew this was going to be rigged. Just pointing out so did everyone else. And the media (Democrat party) forgot what happens when Trump is attacked and persecuted. 1
SCBills Posted September 11 Posted September 11 10 minutes ago, Avisan said: Were those elective abortions or medical abortions due to a combination of risk to the mother and conditions incompatible with life for the baby? All of the alleged cases I have seen so far outside of Minnesota have involved parents making decisions about how long to sustain the life of a doomed and suffering (wanted) infant. Here’s some context on the topic. Linked below. And regardless, it was an incorrect fact check. We can discuss the nuance, but Trump wasn’t wrong & her fact check was quite literally incorrect. https://www.dailysignal.com/2024/08/06/under-gov-tim-walz-babies-born-alive-in-botched-abortions-were-left-to-die-then-he-removed-reporting-requirements/amp/ 1
All_Pro_Bills Posted September 11 Posted September 11 4 minutes ago, dgrochester55 said: Harris also said things that were not accurate. I am not saying that they should not have corrected Trump, but that they should have also fact checked her and asked her tough questions. If you do not like Trump like many don't, fine. I do not care for him either. What I do not get is why people would not want to see equal treatment and an even playing field on the debate. Regardless of how it is spun or justified, that did not happen. The media bias is clear. Its one major takeaway from the event. They covered for Biden's mental condition when it was obvious something was erong nd now they're covering for Harris. Many objective people are asking the same question that you ask. If the press can't be neutral with these debates then they should be limited to setting topics. Just let the two candidates fight it out like we do in real life. I think Harris did well but I have to deduct points for degree of difficulty because she was babies by the mods. Just as expected 2 1
Avisan Posted September 11 Posted September 11 Just now, SCBills said: Here’s some context on the topic. Linked below. And regardless, it was an incorrect fact check. We can discuss the nuance, but Trump wasn’t wrong & her fact check was quite literally incorrect. https://www.dailysignal.com/2024/08/06/under-gov-tim-walz-babies-born-alive-in-botched-abortions-were-left-to-die-then-he-removed-reporting-requirements/amp/ Yeah, I've been looking into this-- there is nothing, even on extremely right-leaning or otherwise pro-life spaces, that indicates that any of these cases are elective abortions of viable fetuses/babies, which is what Trump's claims were about. Trump was also making unnuanced claims involving "executions" of full-term babies, which is what prompted the fact-check. 2 1 1
phypon Posted September 11 Posted September 11 15 minutes ago, Avisan said: Were those elective abortions or medical abortions due to a combination of risk to the mother and conditions incompatible with life for the baby? All of the alleged cases I have seen so far outside of Minnesota have involved parents making decisions about how long to sustain the life of a doomed and suffering (wanted) infant. Here are a couple of articles that are worth a read on the topic: https://www.yahoo.com/news/claims-children-born-alive-abortion-195553629.html https://patch.com/minnesota/across-mn/tim-walz-repealed-mn-law-protecting-babies-born-after-failed-abortions
BillsFanNC Posted September 11 Posted September 11 (edited) Muir: well when I listened to your comment I didn't detect the sarcasm. Reliable. Pravda. Edited September 11 by BillsFanNC 1
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