Tyreek Hill apparently arrested this morning…

[HamSandwhich]

51 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

you might be right on the window tint and safety, but there is no law that says you need to treat anyone with “respect”

So you agree the police acted appropriately then? He rolled up his window with really dark tint where anything could be happening behind that window.

41 minutes ago, Freddie's Dead said:

My immediate reaction after seeing the video is that the cops went way overboard.  They were unprofessional, dropping F-bombs on Hill and otherwise swearing at him and generally roughing him up.  The knee on the back was eerily reminiscent of Floyd.  While what they did may be legal, it's not the kind of policing I want to see.  The biggest issue I have with police is that they deal with the dregs of society every day, and unfortunately, sometimes that rubs off on their interactions with ordinary citizens.  For those of you who think the cops deserved to treat Hill like that, we're in Dave Mason territory.  While he may be a POS, he didn't deserve to be yanked out of his car forcefully just because he didn't roll down his window fast enough.  Cops need to de-escalate, not escalate that situation.

That is a clear safety concern, the windows were tinted very dark, cannot see what he's doing back there. If you don't understand that piece then I'm not sure what to tell you.

45 minutes ago, SageAgainstTheMachine said:

“Soft” in my opinion is thinking the police get to tune you up for not listening.

For putting them potentially in harms way. When the threat was no longer present, I agree, they may have went a little too far but we're Monday morning QBing. They likely were worried something was going on behind the dark tinted windows which is why the adrenaline started up and they got a little out of hand, but not to the point the police are at fault completely and should be let go. The biggest issue here is the rolling up and not listening to cops and putting their lives in danger not knowing what is going on. Simple as that, comply and you'll be fine. 

[Drew21PA]

Just because he is a dolphin, he should be suspended a game. LOL

 

I kid - not getting involved in this conversation.  Praying for the country for sure.

[Avisan]

3 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

 

Again... They didn't kill him.

This is the bar?

 

That there boy should just be sooo grateful that an armed agent of the state didn't end his life for the heinous sin of... being insufficiently respectful?

[shrader]

7 hours ago, RangerDave said:

I agree this was a pissing match between Hill and the officers.  One the officers will almost always win.

 

Some officers are badge heavy.  These appear to be this type.  Whether they acted within the "range of reasonableness" will be up to the courts and/the department, if it gets that far.  I believe officers like this damage the credibility of police everywhere, but they don't often lose in court.

The only court this will ever see is the court of public opinion. It’s already shown in here that Hill lied with his initial statements. Will the people care?

[What a Tuel]

Clearly the officer didnt know who he was and Hill was acting sketchy driving alongside the cop asking how fast he was going instead of stopping. Eventually stopped with his window up and got pissed the officer tapped on it. Then rolled his window up all the way with fairly dark tint. Some people need to go watch a few of the tragic videos of how quickly this could turn deadly for the officer. Yeah the officer could have been more patient, but Hill could have been more cooperative for both the officers safety and Hills.

Edited September 10 by What a Tuel

[ExiledInIllinois]

6 minutes ago, Avisan said:

This is the bar?

 

That there boy should just be sooo grateful that an armed agent of the state didn't end his life for the heinous sin of... being insufficiently respectful?

Yes.

 

If what they say Tyreek was doing by driving reckless... He was putting a lot of others in serious harm's way.

 

Should they go easy on him? He'll just get worse:

 

Traffic deaths are up due to the lack of enforcement. 

 

https://www.npr.org/2023/04/06/1167980495/americas-roads-are-more-dangerous-as-police-pull-over-fewer-drivers

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10 by ExiledInIllinois

[SoCal Deek]

You are to comply with the police officer unless they’re demanding that you do something illegal. Always remember that your interaction with the officer is NOT your day in court.  

[newcam2012]

9 minutes ago, SageAgainstTheMachine said:

I never said I thought Hill did the right thing.  He drove recklessly and then acted like an entitled twit.  

I disagree a little. Hill did comply and gave the officers his license and registration. He even told the officer give me the ticket because he's fixen to be late. He then rolled up his window. The cops at point  should have just went back to their vehicle and completed their checks and given him a ticket. The whole incident would have been over. Instead, the cop demanded Hill roll down his window. It clearly wasn't an officer safety issue at this point. It was a power struggle. Who is the boss, who is in control, and you are going to listen to us.  This is evidenced by what the officers tell Hill when they yank him out of the car, subdue him, and cuff him. You are not in control. You listen to what we have to say. That was the theme. 

 

Hill is a jerk. Hill was pissed about the police banging on his window. Hill probably dislikes the police. He was passive aggressive . He lacks respect for the police and his attitude feels like one of entitlement He contributed to the situation no doubt. No way to I support his ***** attitude or conduct. At the same time, he doesn't have to kiss the officers as$ either. 

 

The police are always held to a higher standard. That's a constant theme they are taught from the academy to continued training. They are trained in situations where citizens are verbally confrontational, aggressive, passive aggressive, non con compliant, etc... They have a duty to deescalate situations. In no way can any reasonable person say the police officers did this. In fact, they did the opposite. They escalated the whole situation by getting into a pissing contest over a window. I'm convinced the window incident was more about asserting power than an officer safety issue. Legally or not was it wise or prudent for the officers to forceably remove Hill from the vehicle, subdue him, and cuff him? Did they really have to go there? I think not. The officers remarks clearly showed they were pissed at Hill for not listening. Again, nothing to do with officer safety. To make things worse, the officer grabs Hill around his neck while he's cuffed and restrained by another police officer. Says something to the effect of surgery on his ears and comments about the window. This behavior is absolutely unjustified and at best unprofessional. The police really mishandled this whole situation. 

[ExiledInIllinois]

13 minutes ago, Drew21PA said:

Just because he is a dolphin, he should be suspended a game. LOL

 

I kid - not getting involved in this conversation.  Praying for the country for sure.

Yup. Then he goes on field and escalates the debate even more w/the celebration. 

 

Who really has the pulpit here?  The big bad jack boot gov't thugs or poor little Tyreek?

[Avisan]

1 minute ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

Yes.

 

If what they say Tyreek was doing by driving reckless... He was putting a lot of others in serious harms way.

 

Should they go easy on him? He'll just get worse:

 

Traffic deaths are up do to the lack of enforcement. 

 

https://www.npr.org/2023/04/06/1167980495/americas-roads-are-more-dangerous-as-police-pull-over-fewer-drivers

Cops meting out extrajudicial punishments is completely antithetical to the ideals of a free and equal society.  We have a legal process and protections under the law for a reason, and to be so cavalier about a clear violation of those principles because the person in question is an unpleasant human being is really concerning and disheartening.

[newcam2012]

5 minutes ago, shrader said:

The only court this will ever see is the court of public opinion. It’s already shown in here that Hill lied with his initial statements. Will the people care?

There is plenty of blame to go around from Hill to the police officers. IMHO, no one comes out of this situation looking good. Personally, I place more blame on the officers than I do Hill. 

[ExiledInIllinois]

Just now, Avisan said:

Cops meting out extrajudicial punishments is completely antithetical to the ideals of a free and equal society.  We have a legal process and protections under the law for a reason, and to be so cavalier about a clear violation of those principles because the person in question is an unpleasant human being is really concerning and disheartening.

And it ain't working. People still need a little fear in their lives to keep us all safe. 

 

Society can't be totally devoid of thar fear... We lose mindfulness. 

1 minute ago, newcam2012 said:

There is plenty of blame to go around from Hill to the police officers. IMHO, no one comes out of this situation looking good. Personally, I place more blame on the officers than I do Hill. 

I place it 180° opposite.  Only Hill had the ability to de-escalate the situation.  If one doesn't comply, everyone on plant knows they will be forced to comply.

Forcing someone to comply IS their job when the person won't comply.

 

How more simple can we make this?

[JP51]

This is a perfect example of how this stuff happens... Quite honestly, I think they were both out of line. Hill simply needs to comply with a reasonable request and leave his window down. He has tinted windows hard to see inside and officers get shot at traffic stops that way. I completely understand why they wanted him out of the vehicle. He was non compliant and being difficult. So to me the order to get out of the car was fine and probably appropriate. 

 

As this is going on you can see the police officer become agitated and indignant.  Which I get I suppose he is human and it is a confrontational situation. However, in todays world where this is going to end up and where the officer will be criticized is Hill was lifting his leg to comply with the command of getting out of the car.  It was apparent at least to me they didnt need to forcibly pull him out and take it to the ground. They could have let him out hands on hood spread legs and cuffed him. They saw his hands, he had no gun.

 

So to me in the end, Hill instigated this whole exchange by committing the violation as well as initially not complying with the request. The officer over reacted in pulling him out of the car and putting him on the ground probably because he was angry. In the end this will be this action that will be the one the public examines and is pointed too. "Look, he is complying and getting out of the car" "Why did you need to pull him out and throw him to the ground?" .... and they wont be wrong. Unfortunately this will be the over all narrative with a subsection of people arguing Hill should have just listened etc... and the argument will continue. In the end I dont think this was about race, or the officer was a Jags fan or anything insidious. I think it was an individual acting like an a$$ and an over authoritative officer who got pissed and was gonna teach him a lesson about listening to COPs.  

 

And I am not sure I am good with either of their actions.... So Hill is not wrong, we have to be better... including him. Much better.

 

Edited September 10 by JP51

[Avisan]

1 minute ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

And it ain't working. People still need a little fear in their lives to keep us all safe. 

 

Society can't be totally devoid of thar fear... We lose mindfulness. 

Fear induces a fight-or-flight response, which demonstrably and provably does not improve people's abilities to make safe, reasoned decisions for the benefit of others.  It does the opposite.

 

It is... interesting to hear the perspective that we need to fear armed agents of the state for our own good.

[RangerDave]

8 minutes ago, shrader said:

The only court this will ever see is the court of public opinion. It’s already shown in here that Hill lied with his initial statements. Will the people care?

From what I have heard, the department has already put the officer on administrative assignment.   That part of the investigation has already started.

 

I also read that Hill was issued two citations.  That will end up in court if not plead out.

 

Hill can also sue the police if he believes his rights were violated.

 

I don't think this is over by any means.

[ExiledInIllinois]

2 minutes ago, Avisan said:

Fear induces a fight-or-flight response, which demonstrably and provably does not improve people's abilities to make safe, reasoned decisions for the benefit of others.  It does the opposite.

 

It is... interesting to hear the perspective that we need to fear armed agents of the state for our own good.

Fear before the fact. Like: "I better not drive like an idiot or I will get my ass kicked. Worse, I might kill someone."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

According to Tyreek, his uncle taught him to listen... He wasn’t listening.  His uncle must be a bad teacher.

Edited September 10 by ExiledInIllinois

[shrader]

1 minute ago, RangerDave said:

From what I have heard, the department has already put the officer on administrative assignment.   That part of the investigation has already started.

 

I also read that Hill was issued two citations.  That will end up in court if not plead out.

 

Hill can also sue the police if he believes his rights were violated.

 

I don't think this is over by any means.

The citations will go away after a little wink-wink-nod-nod-hey I think you dropped $20,000 over there. Jill won’t be suing anyone. Neither side is going to want the negative attention it would bring. 

[Avisan]

Just now, ExiledInIllinois said:

Fear before the fact. Like: "I better not drive like an idiot or I will get my ass Kicked. Worse, I might kill someone."

Are extrajudicial ass-kickings meted out by armed agents of the state at their own personal discretion an element of a just and equal society in your view, then?

[newcam2012]

7 minutes ago, What a Tuel said:

Clearly the officer didnt know who he was and Hill was acting sketchy driving alongside the cop asking how fast he was going instead of stopping. Eventually stopped with his window up and got pissed the officer tapped on it. Then rolled his window up all the way with fairly dark tint. Some people need to go watch a few of the tragic videos of how quickly this could turn deadly for the officer. Yeah the officer could have been more patient, but Hill could have been more cooperative for both the officers safety and Hills.

I agree but do you really feel that window incident was about officer safety? Of course, that's a valid concern. However, take in the totality of the incident. What was said, how it was said, what happened, what didn't happen, and why did it happen? The overwhelming evidence suggest this was a power struggle. Police vs disrespectful citizen. The police officers here were going to teach Hill a lesson. They were going to let him know who is in charge. They are going to send a massage you listen or else. Their comments back this up 100%. At no point, do I see it hear Hill threatening the officer's safety. In fact, he did roll down the window seconds before he was forceably removed from his car. 

 

The officers will absolutely claim officer safety here. The officers will cling to the fact that they can remove non compliant individuals from their vehicles. They may have the law on their side. However, I saw police officers who acted unprofessional, abused their power, and botched the whole incident. 

[ExiledInIllinois]

Just now, Avisan said:

Are extrajudicial ass-kickings meted out by armed agents of the state at their own personal discretion an element of a just and equal society in your view, then?

No.

 

This incident was NOT authoritative and subjective.

 

This incident was handled stern and objectively. 

1 minute ago, newcam2012 said:

I agree but do you really feel that window incident was about officer safety? Of course, that's a valid concern. However, take in the totality of the incident. What was said, how it was said, what happened, what didn't happen, and why did it happen? The overwhelming evidence suggest this was a power struggle. Police vs disrespectful citizen. The police officers here were going to teach Hill a lesson. They were going to let him know who is in charge. They are going to send a massage you listen or else. Their comments back this up 100%. At no point, do I see it hear Hill threatening the officer's safety. In fact, he did roll down the window seconds before he was forceably removed from his car. 

 

The officers will absolutely claim officer safety here. The officers will cling to the fact that they can remove non compliant individuals from their vehicles. They may have the law on their side. However, I saw police officers who acted unprofessional, abused their power, and botched the whole incident. 

You just have a problem with stern and objective. That's why you see it as botched.

 

It's only botched because Hill was driving illegally.