HS team executes brilliant underhand thrown fake punt

[Cash]

I mean, it was cool and all, but it took one heck of a contested catch on the jump ball to work.  I'm not sure it's "brilliant" so much as, "our high school has a tall dude who can jump high... let's run a fake punt with an underhand throw so that he can outjump everyone for the catch."

[hondo in seattle]

I guess the punter threw it underhanded so the defenders downfield would think it was a punt and not fight for the ball.

And it worked because they could have made a play but didn't.

 

This wouldn't work in the NFL unless maybe you had a punter who could throw the ball 45 yards downfield underhanded with a great hang time to make it look like an actual punt.  

[Buffalo716]

6 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

I guess the punter threw it underhanded so the defenders downfield would think it was a punt and not fight for the ball.

And it worked because they could have made a play but didn't.

 

This wouldn't work in the NFL unless maybe you had a punter who could throw the ball 45 yards downfield underhanded with a great hang time to make it look like an actual punt.  

People who could throw a beautiful football underhand do exist but it's rare 

 

My buddy was a UB lineman and backup quarterback.. like 5th String quarterback 

 

And man.. I've never been able to see somebody sling a football underhand like him 

 

Tight spiral, 35 40 miles an hour.. hit you right in the hands lol

Edited September 4 by Buffalo716

[QB Bills]

23 minutes ago, Charles Romes said:

They would outlaw this immediately just like they outlawed Kenny Pickett’s fake slide, though Allen got away with the fake slide in the playoffs.  

Pours out the gasoline.

Lights match. 

Runs.

 

[Don Otreply]

1 hour ago, Big Turk said:

How long before someone in the NFL adopts this play and runs it in a game? Absolutely brilliant...and would be very hard to stop if they didn't know it was coming...

 

Essentially the punter acts like he is punting, but instead underhand throws the ball down field in a high arc that actually looks like a punt.

 

His player then catches it like 30-40 yard down field for a first down.

 

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/high-school-punter-really-threw-165610695.html

Can we get Damar in on this play? 😬

[Buffalo716]

I don't even want to interject cuz this is just going to bring up painful memories for people 

 

But fake punts inside 4 yards have the highest conversion rate of any play in the NFL..  over 60% 

 

Now how the hell did we come up with that JV fake punt snap to Hamlin when 60% of the league gets it right!

[BigAl2526]

I suppose it would be something of a give away if the Bills had Joah Allen line up as the punter.

[Simon]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

People who could throw a beautiful football underhand do exist but it's rare 

 

Believe it or not, it's actually not as hard as you think.

Try it a few times and you'll figure out how to produce a tight spiral pretty quickly.

[BigAl2526]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

People who could throw a beautiful football underhand do exist but it's rare 

 

My buddy was a UB lineman and backup quarterback.. like 5th String quarterback 

 

And man.. I've never been able to see somebody sling a football underhand like him 

 

Tight spiral, 35 40 miles an hour.. hit you right in the hands lol

I could throw a beautiful football if you could find me one.  Unfortunately, most footballs look the same.  Also, the throw would look ugly

[Buffalo716]

7 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

Believe it or not, it's actually not as hard as you think.

Try it a few times and you'll figure out how to produce a tight spiral pretty quickly.

But how far could you sling it? 

 

Like I said my buddy is was a lineman at the University at Buffalo... And also the fifth string quarterback 

 

He obviously would throw overhand in a practice if he ever got the reps... 

 

But just tossing it around with friends, he had this underhand sling that could go 30 yards on a rope! I honestly thought that was super impressive and only guys like Fran tarkenton could do that

Edited September 4 by Buffalo716

[Simon]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

But how far could you sling it?

 

When I was younger I could be accurate at 20-30 yards like that.

The key is the windup, sort of like fastpitch softball; a couple practice throws and you'll find the angle to make it come off your hand tight.

[Thurman#1]

8 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

This would never work at the NFL level.. there are built-in man to man principles and punt plays

 

So the second that ball is snapped and an eligible receiver ran down the field he would have a man on him.. and as soon as the punter never punted it and just lofted it into the air 

 

The entire team and sidelines would be screaming fake and pass.. and there would be a guy on the eligible receiver to break it up 

 

This is a perfect high school trick play

There are sidelines that can see it and scream pass.. the guys coming off the edge would clearly be able to see it in the NFL too

 

The entire punt return team would be alerted and I can't ever see a pop fly of an underhand toss being completed.. 

 

Punt return teams have built in man-to-man principles to stop fakes and any player from the punting team who looks like he's tracking a football to catch would also be suspicious... Gunners don't track a football to catch it unless it's a sky kick inside the 10 yard line

 

 

 

 

It would absolutely stand a chance and arguably a pretty good one.

 

You're right that there are systems in place to guard against it. 

 

There were systems in place to guard against onside kicks back when it was a thing, and while they produced very low success rates when everyone knew they were coming, they succeeded at high rates in non-obvious situations when only used once in a great great while. Same with fake punts of other types. When expected, not much success. When unexpected, they stood and stand a great chance. 

 

This only increases the chance of a brain fart from the receiving team because it's a method that hasn't been seen before.

 

The problem is that SNS means now every STs coach in the league will have heard of it. But in 2025, maybe even late 2024, we'll see someone try it, and if they handle it right they'll have a great shot at totally surprising and outwitting the receiving team. The problem is that even if the runback guy has no idea what's happening - very likely - he'll still be trying to catch it. The kicking team has to actually make the catch rather than just knock it down and recover it. That'll be tough.

 

My guess is that when they do it they'll use film study to find an area that the receiving team habitually doesn't cover well, perhaps five to ten yards off to the side and fifteen yards beyond the LOS for instance. Try it too close to the LOS for the returner to get there and expect most of the return team to overrun it.

 

It's thoughtful and interesting. Me likey. I bet we see a success or three over the next few years, with some failures too, of course. 

 

 

6 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

I don't even want to interject cuz this is just going to bring up painful memories for people 

 

But fake punts inside 4 yards have the highest conversion rate of any play in the NFL..  over 60% 

 

Now how the hell did we come up with that JV fake punt snap to Hamlin when 60% of the league gets it right!

 

 

If I remember correctly it would have worked but one guy blew his block.

 

You're right, that's a painful memory. Jeez.

 

 

Edited September 5 by Thurman#1

[Buffalo716]

Just now, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

It would absolutely stand a chance and arguably a pretty good one.

 

You're right that there are systems in place to guard against it. 

 

There were systems in place to guard against onside kicks back when it was a thing, and while they produced very low success rates when everyone knew they were coming, they succeeded at high rates in non-obvious situations when only used once in a great great while. Same with fake punts of other types. When expected, not much success. When unexpected, they stood and stand a great chance. 

 

This only increases the chance of a brain fart from the receiving team because it's a method that hasn't been seen before.

 

The problem is that SNS means now every STs coach in the league will have heard of it. But in 2025, maybe even late 2024, we'll see someone try it, and if they handle it right they'll have a great shot at totally surprising and outwitting the receiving team. The problem is that even if the runback guy has no idea what's happening - very likely - he'll still be trying to catch it. The kicking team has to actually make the catch rather than just knock it down and recover it. That'll be tough.

 

My guess is that when they do it they'll use film study to find an area that the receiving team habitually doesn't cover well, perhaps five to ten yards off to the side and fifteen yards beyond the LOS for instance. Try it too close to the LOS for the returner to get there and expect most of the return team to overrun it.

 

It's thoughtful and interesting. Me likey. I bet we see a success or three over the next few years, with some failures too, of course. 

Fake punt passes under seven yards already have a good success rate ... Because coaches already time them usually and only run them when they know they have advantage 

 

So there's no need to do a weird underhand pass... You could do a traditional fake punt pass at 4th and 7th and convert at a 50% clip if timed right which is better than third down conversion rates

[Thurman#1]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

Fake punt passes under seven yards already have a good success rate ... Because coaches already time them usually and only run them when they know they have advantage 

 

So there's no need to do a weird underhand pass... You could do a traditional fake punt pass at 4th and 7th and convert at a 50% clip if timed right which is better than third down conversion rates

 

 

Yeah, they do have a good success rate. That's exactly the point I was making.

 

But you don't stop trying a play that gives you a further advantage because the other play is already pretty good.

 

Fakes are essentially an attempt to cause a brain fart. This would be an even better way to do that. It would work far better at an unexpected time, but that's half the game with fakes.

[Thurman#1]

7 hours ago, Cash said:

I mean, it was cool and all, but it took one heck of a contested catch on the jump ball to work.  I'm not sure it's "brilliant" so much as, "our high school has a tall dude who can jump high... let's run a fake punt with an underhand throw so that he can outjump everyone for the catch."

 

 

This is a good thought too.

 

We've got a lot of tall WRs this year. Put one of them out there on the coverage units some measure of the time, 20% - 40%? Teams would have to get used to seeing him out there, so he'd have to be good at part of the ordinary job of covering kicks. Then when they're used to seeing him, you run it to his side.

 

I always remember onside kick in the comeback game against Houston. Marv didn't just snag an extra possession there, he told the whole team, we're still in it and we'll do anything to make it happen.

[The Cincinnati Kid]

Nope. This doesn’t work in the NFL. Why? Same reason NFL teams don’t use the spread punt or the rugby punt. NFL players are ALL playing in the NFL. 

[BillsShredder83]

16 hours ago, pi2000 said:

 

2:50 mark

legit sounds like a CFL rule

16 hours ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Yes it is easy to defend IF you can see it or know it is coming.  I think  it would be very difficult to see especially if you are deep as a return man, both lines would be visual obstacles with as low as the underhand pass is.

would bet my life savings teams will get together and come up with a call for it,  instead of "POISON" or "FIRE" it'll have a similar yell-able name, after ST's coach shows the  team that play

[JP51]

LOL, this was the perfect spot on the field to do it... even if it gets picked its still like a punt... it hits the ground the start from the 40 ... you get it you have them shaking their heads for the rest of the series... I wonder if they scored? 

[Captain Hindsight]

16 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

People who could throw a beautiful football underhand do exist but it's rare 

 

My buddy was a UB lineman and backup quarterback.. like 5th String quarterback 

 

And man.. I've never been able to see somebody sling a football underhand like him 

 

Tight spiral, 35 40 miles an hour.. hit you right in the hands lol

I bet some softball pitchers could probably do a decent job

[TheFunPolice]

If you had a QB who could also punt sometimes that would make for some interesting options/fakeouts. 

 

It's been done before! 

 

There's a lot of psychology to going for it on 4th down or faking it. 

 

3rd down stop! Everyone is excited! Defense jogging off the field, high 5's helmets on the posts, gatorade... 

 

All the fans of the team on defense are feeling relief: we stopped them! We're getting the ball. 

 

What does the team who just made the 3rd down stop want more than anything? A simple punt that isn't muffed or fumbled. 

Edited September 5 by TheFunPolice