ESPN Top 100 Players

[BILLS55]

I don't put much stock in any of these lists but they only have one Bill on the list. Josh at #5. Lamar and Mahomes are the two QBs above him.  Who else do you think if any should be on it. Cook?

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/40941434/nfl-rank-2024-ranking-top-100-players-predictions-stats

Edited August 26 by BILLS55
added link

[Ben]

Hard to believe there are 100 football players better than Ed O.

[Kaenon]

Dawkins, Oliver, Milano, and Taron Johnson are the only guys who would have any consideration I think.

[BADOLBILZ]

 

Bernard and Rousseau could be on it next year if they stay healthy.   Contract time players tend to get noticed because agents tend to impact these lists.   Also, Bernard's numbers last year were pretty crazy for a MLB,  top 100 worthy for sure,  just needs to do it again before he gets recognized.

[Matt_In_NH]

Earlier in the offseason I looked at various QB power rankings and almost every single one had the same top four.  All of them had Mahomes 1 and then some combination of Allen, Jackson and Burrow for the next three.  I don't see the love affair with Lamar, understand he is really talented but he has had availability problems and has not done well in pressure situations.  I am biased but Allen is clearly above Lamar for those reasons.   Burrow has a stronger case to me as he has performed well in the playoffs but he is not a running threat and has had his own availability issues.  Allen is an enigma due to the perception he is a turnover machine.....it is true he has led the league in turnovers and INT's over the last 4 years but it is also true he has led the league in TD's.  If you look at his INT% which is how you should look at it, he is not that out of whack, his number is high but not off the charts high like is perceived.

Edited August 26 by Matt_In_NH

[dma0034]

3 minutes ago, Matt_In_NH said:

Earlier in the offseason I looked at various QB power rankings and almost every single one had the same top for.  All of them had Mahomes 1 and then some combination of Allen, Jackson and Burrow for the next three.  I don't see the love affair with Lamar, understand he is really talented but he has had availability problems and has not done well in pressure situations.  I am biased but Allen is clearly above Lamar for those reasons.   Burrow has a stronger case to me as he has performed well in the playoffs but he is not a running threat and has had his own availability issues.  Allen is an enigma due to the perception he is a turnover machine.....it is true he has led the league in turnovers and INT's over the last 4 years but it is also true he has led the league in TD's.  If you look at his INT% which is how you should look at it, he is not that out of whack, his number is high but not off the charts high like is perceived.

 

 

He has team success. Lamar has had a top 5 defense every year except one year. And people will say oh well so has Allen. I look at these two very differently. I look at the Bills Defense as benefitting from Allen's Offense ability and making teams one dimensional because of the Offensive power where I see the RAvens as the opposite. Their defense is so strong that it gives the Ravens more chances on Offense. Lamar doesn't have to force anything because the defense doesn't let them down. The one year they weren't top 5? 2021 

 

Lamar's stats: 16 TDs, 13 picks, 38 sacks, 87 rating QBR 57. Simply put his worst season (he only played 12 games but even if you average it out to 16). 

[Gunsgoodtime]

3 hours ago, BILLS55 said:

I don't put much stock in any of these lists but they only have one Bill on the list. Josh at #5. Lamar and Mahomes are the two QBs above him.  Who else do you think if any should be on it. Cook?

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/40941434/nfl-rank-2024-ranking-top-100-players-predictions-stats

No one else from the Bills.  I'm not sure why this would suprise anyone with this roster.  People on here way overrate the players we have.

[JP51]

Seems like a reasonable list, not much for lists... I would say this... if two or three of the following:  Cook, Kincaid, Spencer Brown, Terrell Bernard, Rasul Douglas Ed Oliver, Rousseau or Von crack this list next year, we will have had a pretty good season. Some guys on the cusp or with the theoretical talent to make it. Should they up their games to play like it then sounds good to me. 

[Logic]

Health woes notwithstanding -- and I realize it's "out of sight, out of mind" with these lists -- Matt Milano is absolutely one of the 100 best players in the NFL.

[Taro Nimbus]

This is ESPN after all.   All the Bills have is Josh Allen. 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Top 100 - Allen, Taron Johnson, and Cook

 

Bills have a bunch of guys that are just below that level and a few that are ascending - Oliver, Rousseau, Dawkins, Douglas, Kincaid, and Torrence.

Miller and Milano can be if they bounce back from injury

Shakir if used correctly looks like he could catch 100 balls and could crack the top 100 next year

[Ethan in Cleveland]

1 hour ago, Matt_In_NH said:

Earlier in the offseason I looked at various QB power rankings and almost every single one had the same top four.  All of them had Mahomes 1 and then some combination of Allen, Jackson and Burrow for the next three.  I don't see the love affair with Lamar, understand he is really talented but he has had availability problems and has not done well in pressure situations.  I am biased but Allen is clearly above Lamar for those reasons.   Burrow has a stronger case to me as he has performed well in the playoffs but he is not a running threat and has had his own availability issues.  Allen is an enigma due to the perception he is a turnover machine.....it is true he has led the league in turnovers and INT's over the last 4 years but it is also true he has led the league in TD's.  If you look at his INT% which is how you should look at it, he is not that out of whack, his number is high but not off the charts high like is perceived.

59 career fumbles as well which is 6 more than Lamar

 

It's not a perception. He turns the ball over too much. 

 

It's ok to realize Allen is the best QB in franchise history and still state that he has to get better in certain aspects of his game. 

[Matt_In_NH]

33 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

59 career fumbles as well which is 6 more than Lamar

 

It's not a perception. He turns the ball over too much. 

 

It's ok to realize Allen is the best QB in franchise history and still state that he has to get better in certain aspects of his game. 

I am usually the one saying that same thing.  Let me ask you a question, who fumbles more per snap, Allen or Lamar?  I don't know the answer but if Allen has 6 more fumbles than Lamar, I believe he has a lot more volume in terms of snaps.  

 

• What are Allen's turnover stats in the postseason?  Are they the same or different than the regular season?
• Josh's INT% is 2.5%.  Tom Brady is at 1.8% career as is Mahomes.  Brett Favre was at 3.3%  Lamar is at 2.1% Burrow 2.0%.  Stafford is at 2.4%   Tua 2.3%, Rodgers is the gold standard at this at 1.4%.   Is Josh higher than his peers?  Yes, is it astronomical?  No, I wish he would just correct it by 25% and be in line with his peers.   
• Josh has 78 INT's in 6 seasons, Tom Brady had the same number, 78 INT's in his first 6 seasons starting.
• OK, I did the math on fumbles, Lamar fumbles at a rate of 1.77% of passing attempts plus rushing attempts, Josh's rate is 1.55% so Lamar has a bigger "fumbling problem" than Josh.  The difference is similar if you do fumbles per snap, Lamar fumbles more, not sure what the best metric is.

My point is not that Josh should not work to clean up turnovers, it is that it is overblown......because it is.

 

Edited August 26 by Matt_In_NH

[RobbRiddick]

2 minutes ago, Matt_In_NH said:

I am usually the one saying that same thing.  Let me ask you a question, who fumbles more per snap, Allen or Lamar?  I don't know the answer but if Allen has 6 more fumbles than Lamar, I believe he has a lot more volume in terms of snaps.  

 

• What are Allen's turnover stats in the postseason?  Are they the same or different than the regular season?
• Josh's INT% is 2.5%.  Tom Brady is at 1.8% career as is Mahomes.  Brett Favre was at 3.3%  Lamar is at 2.1% Burrow 2.0%.  Stafford is at 2.4%   Tua 2.3%, Rodgers is the gold standard at this at 1.4%.   Is Josh higher than his peers?  Yes, is it astronomical?  No, I wish he would just correct it by 25% and be in line with his peers.   
• Josh has 78 INT's in 6 seasons, Tom Brady had the same number, 78 INT's in his first 6 seasons starting.

My point is not that Josh should not work to clean up turnovers, it is that it is overblown......because it is.

 

 

Exactly. This is why most of the pundits when asked will put Allen over Jackson. Jackson fans talk about the MVPs, then Allen advocates mention the playoffs. That's when football goes up a significant level, it's also when most people actually watch every game rather than just highlights or glancing at box scores.

 

Every year people sit down to watch the playoffs and see Lamar ***** the bed while Allen takes it up a notch and reduces the errors. To me it's a no brainer that he's above Jackson

[PonyBoy]

Kind of weird, if Josh is the only one, why isn't he a shoe in for MVP past few years if he's all the Bills got, we have made what 6 straight play off appearances?

[Ethan in Cleveland]

32 minutes ago, RobbRiddick said:

 

Exactly. This is why most of the pundits when asked will put Allen over Jackson. Jackson fans talk about the MVPs, then Allen advocates mention the playoffs. That's when football goes up a significant level, it's also when most people actually watch every game rather than just highlights or glancing at box scores.

 

Every year people sit down to watch the playoffs and see Lamar ***** the bed while Allen takes it up a notch and reduces the errors. To me it's a no brainer that he's above Jackson

Both things can be true.

He's better than Jackson. He's qthe second best QB in the NFL and at times he easily plays as the best QB in NFL. In my mind there is no question.  I don't care about MVPs. Unlike others I think Lamar is a good QB.

 

You just listed a bunch of playoff and HOF QBs and Allen's INT% is higher than all but Favre. 

 

I guess we can go down the semantics road and argue what is overblown. We can also bring up the fact before Bass missed the kick against the Bengals Allen fumbled on that drive and Morse(I think) had to recover it. 

 

Does anyone really think Allen doesn't need to get better protecting the football?  He's already at worst a top 3 QB, but 3 less turnovers a year will make him even better. 

 

Oh and he still needs to get better on deep ball, not that we have a WR that can get open deep this year...lol

 

[DapperCam]

Part of Allen’s fumbling problems are because he plays hero ball. And by the way, his entire career he has had to play hero ball. His supporting cast has been woeful at times, and the offense play calling seems to devolve to “Let Allen run around and figure it out” when the game is on the line.

[TBBills Fan]

1 hour ago, Logic said:

Health woes notwithstanding -- and I realize it's "out of sight, out of mind" with these lists -- Matt Milano is absolutely one of the 100 best players in the NFL.

Milano

Dawkins

Oliver

T Johnson 

And if laporta is in the 60s, Dalton should have squeaked in

 

Rasul certainly did well last year as well and should have been in consideration 

[GASabresIUFan]

Taron Johnson is the only other Bill that should be on the list.  He is the best slot corner in the NFL.  Not having the best player at his position in the NFL on the list invalidates the entire list.  

[Doc Brown]

21 minutes ago, DapperCam said:

Part of Allen’s fumbling problems are because he plays hero ball. And by the way, his entire career he has had to play hero ball. His supporting cast has been woeful at times, and the offense play calling seems to devolve to “Let Allen run around and figure it out” when the game is on the line.

He only fumbled it seven times last year (4 lost) which put him at #17 among qualified QB's in the league despite throwing the ball the third most.  He's cleaned up his fumbling problem significantly.