Cuts, Waiver Claims & 90 man roster depth: A study

[The Tomcat]

Very nice.

 

I'd like to add we've done a decent job of trading players for picks as well.

[boater]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

1. The Bills have been one of the most picked over rosters at cut down day, which speaks to their roster depth even through the summer in recent years;

That supports the argument that Beane is good at his job.

 

But I have been told in these pages that Beane is not very good.

[hondo in seattle]

1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

The only way Gore gets claimed is if his dad convinces one of his buddies on another team's coaching staff to give him a roster spot.  Highly unlikely but that would be the way.

 

It's funny because that's pretty much how I felt about us signing him as a UDFA.  Looking at his measurables, Gore Jr. doesn't belong in the NFL and I thought Beane signed him as a favor to his dad.  But watching him play, this kid legit deserved a tryout.  

[hondo in seattle]

7 minutes ago, boater said:

That supports the argument that Beane is good at his job.

 

But I have been told in these pages that Beane is not very good.

 

Beane is fantastic at building depth.  But to quote @GunnerBill, "we need more difference makers" in the starting lineup.

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

Beane is fantastic at building depth.  But to quote @GunnerBill, "we need more difference makers" in the starting lineup.

 

Yep that is absolutely my view. When it comes to finding players who can legit play in the NFL I put Beane up against anybody. He is one of the better day 3 drafters and he has a goid history finding UDFAs and the lower value FA pickups that contribute. The knock, and it is a fair one, is on the lack of elite talent difference makers both in terms of draft and his higher end FA signings.

[The Jokeman]

I guess people forget that we got Isaiah McKenzie off waivers but I guess he doesn't count because it was inseason?

[dpberr]

I think one of the positives in the players the Bills bring to camp is that the majority of them are legitimate football players who understand the game of football, and who can understand and absorb a football playbook.  You don't see a lot of track stars or phenomenal athletes "moonlighting" as football players on this team annually.  Those are the guys who run the wrong routes, blow the coverages, miss assignments and have no instinct for the game because in college, they didn't learn football.

 

Some wonder why a guy like Denzel Mims can't stick on a roster.  Sure he's fast.  Gifted athlete.  However, he's always been a sloppy route runner, with poor concentration, has never improved his route running, and he's rarely where he's supposed to be on the field.  

 

[MJS]

The Jets have been able to acquire decent talent, especially on defense. The problem is they never seem to keep them around. They let then walk in free agency, or they trade them, or they pick the wrong players to keep, etc. They always find a way to shoot themselves in the foot.

 

They've had high draft picks for forever, so they always bring in talent.

[hondo in seattle]

58 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep that is absolutely my view. When it comes to finding players who can legit play in the NFL I put Beane up against anybody. He is one of the better day 3 drafters and he has a goid history finding UDFAs and the lower value FA pickups that contribute. The knock, and it is a fair one, is on the lack of elite talent difference makers both in terms of draft and his higher end FA signings.

 

I agree with you 100%.

 

But I'll add this to be fair to Beane.  A GM can't afford stars everywhere. 

 

On offense, he drafted Josh - a huge win - and rented Stef for a while.  That's it - though maybe Kincaid emerges this year.

But Beane's been snake-bitten on defense.  He seemed to want (and is willing to pay for) a difference maker on each level of the defense: Von, Milano, Tre.   With injuries, that plan hasn't worked out, and we ended up with - for example - Klein on Kelce in the playoffs.    

 

But the point stands, we haven't had enough elite difference makers to compete for a Lombardi.  

[jwhit34]

Thanks for the info that's a lot of work (and writing).

 

None of the 10 (9 if you only count McCloud once) have played meaningful snaps. The two most noteworthy are Kingsley Jonathan and Alex Austin (who had an INT vs. Allen). Everyone has bounced around mostly on practice squads.

 

It's noteworthy that 9 (or 10) have been picked up but none have really "made it." 

 

As for Beane's success at finding NFL caliber players but not elite talent in the early rounds, I don't agree with that. If elite is All Pro, then sure but how many in each draft are on that level, 5-8? If you're not drafting in the top 10 you're probably not getting All Pros very often. Pro Bowl caliber to very good players, he has done pretty well. First rounders have all been good to excellent except Elam and there has been 2nd-3rd round successes like Dawkins, Cook, Spencer Brown, Bernard, Torrence.

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, jwhit34 said:

Thanks for the info that's a lot of work (and writing).

 

None of the 10 (9 if you only count McCloud once) have played meaningful snaps. The two most noteworthy are Kingsley Jonathan and Alex Austin (who had an INT vs. Allen). Everyone has bounced around mostly on practice squads.

 

It's noteworthy that 9 (or 10) have been picked up but none have really "made it." 

 

As for Beane's success at finding NFL caliber players but not elite talent in the early rounds, I don't agree with that. If elite is All Pro, then sure but how many in each draft are on that level, 5-8? If you're not drafting in the top 10 you're probably not getting All Pros very often. Pro Bowl caliber to very good players, he has done pretty well. First rounders have all been good to excellent except Elam and there has been 2nd-3rd round successes like Dawkins, Cook, Spencer Brown, Bernard, Torrence.

 

Dawkins wasn't him. And yea, all pros. He has zero first team all pros out of the six drafts before this one. He has two second team all pros - Josh Allen (2020) and Taron Johnson (2023). I get the Bills are drafting late but actually there are multiple all pros that have come later in those classes. In six drafts I think I'd hope for more than two to put him in top end GM territory. And even pro bowlers... drafted by Beane.... it's Allen twice and then Edmunds once as original selections with Edmunds once more and Knox once as alternates. Those numvers have to tick up for me to say he is great. He is clearly good. He gets guys that can play, he doesn't have a ton of busts for 6 years of doing it and he creates depth right down the roster to the extent our cuts often make other squads. But it is the high end where Josh covers for some warts IMO.

 

 

[GunnerBill]

22 hours ago, The Jokeman said:

I guess people forget that we got Isaiah McKenzie off waivers but I guess he doesn't count because it was inseason?

 

Correct. He was also before 2020 when this analysis starts.