syhuang Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?s...s=f1&id=2089850 14 out of 20 cars boycotted the United States Grand Prix on a tire dispute. Michelin claim their tires are not safe at top speed on the last turn of the speedway and requested FIA to change rules. This is crazy!! Don't ask the officials to adjust rules one day before the game because you are not good enough. How can't they just drive slower on that turn or change tires more frequently? Maybe we should ask NFL to award us 10 points per touchdown because we have a first year QB.
jayg Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 I care, and it was a complete joke. I surely didn't want Ferrari to win under those circumstances. http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?s...s=f1&id=2089850 14 out of 20 cars boycotted the United States Grand Prix on a tire dispute. Michelin claim their tires are not safe at top speed on the last turn of the speedway and requested FIA to change rules. This is crazy!! Don't ask the officials to adjust rules one day before the game because you are not good enough. How can't they just drive slower on that turn or change tires more frequently? Maybe we should ask NFL to award us 10 points per touchdown because we have a first year QB. 362036[/snapback]
Dr. Fong Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?s...s=f1&id=2089850 This is crazy!! Don't ask the officials to adjust rules one day before the game because you are not good enough. How can't they just drive slower on that turn or change tires more frequently? Maybe we should ask NFL to award us 10 points per touchdown because we have a first year QB. 362036[/snapback] I think it's a different story when someone's life is involved. Going out there with unsafe tires is insanity. The FIA should have cited the safety issue and allowed the teams to obtain safe equipment for the race. I think the more apt example than the one you offered, in my opinion, would be if the NFL were to not allow a team to procure new helmets after the manufacturer deemed theirs faulty. Certainly you wouldn't expect the team to take the field. I don't know why you expected the drivers to take to the track in this instance. Certainly the situation could have, and should have, been handled so that the fans were not the ones that ultimately were made to suffer for the problem, but I think the FIA is more to blame than the drivers. Having said all that I don't know jack about racing and nor do I care to. Don't ask me why I felt compelled to read the article and offer my opinion.
syhuang Posted June 20, 2005 Author Posted June 20, 2005 I think it's a different story when someone's life is involved. Going out there with unsafe tires is insanity. The FIA should have cited the safety issue and allowed the teams to obtain safe equipment for the race. I think the more apt example than the one you offered, in my opinion, would be if the NFL were to not allow a team to procure new helmets after the manufacturer deemed theirs faulty. Certainly you wouldn't expect the team to take the field. I don't know why you expected the drivers to take to the track in this instance. Certainly the situation could have, and should have, been handled so that the fans were not the ones that ultimately were made to suffer for the problem, but I think the FIA is more to blame than the drivers. Having said all that I don't know jack about racing and nor do I care to. Don't ask me why I felt compelled to read the article and offer my opinion. 362061[/snapback] The 'helmet' example is very different to this situation. It is not like the tire will explore immediately if the dirvers use it. It is unsafe when they keep using the Michelin tires at high speed on the last turn. As I said, there're alternative ways to make sure their safety, like drive slower on that turn or change tires more frequently. But doing so, it'll make the drivers less competitive, which they don't want to sacrifice even to keep them safe. The seven teams using Michelin tires do know drive slower on the last turn can make them safe, but they don't want to slowdown just themselves. Thus, they asked FIA to break the rule to add a chicane on the last turn so "all teams" are forced to drive slower on that turn. And of course, their request was rejected. If it was the only solution to insure safety, the rules need to be changed right away. However, it is not the case here.
wwovince Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 It was a complete joke. My dad watched and was telling me about it. Saying fans were throwing stuff on track. I be pissed to those are some expensive tickets to come by.
Max Fischer Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 On a side note: I've tried, but I don't get F1 Racing. It's nearly impossible to pass, which seems to suggest that if you don't qualify well you have no chance of winning; and if your like Schumaker -- win the poll and never lose. To the untrained eye it simply looks like a train going around a track for a few hours. Can any educate me or say I'm wrong?
stuckincincy Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 The FIA has been introducing rule changes for the past year or so, to remove some of the insanity. IIRC, the changes are meant to make it more competitive and not so expensive. It takes millions of dollars to field the cars these days. Some of the changes are - no launch control, starting the race with the amount of fuel left after qualifying, using the same motor for the race as used in qualifying, using the qualifying tire, diminishing communication between team members and the pits (to stop the "roller derby" strategy which seems the vogue in NASCAR). F1 interest has been waning in Europe - people perceived that technology has taken driver skills out of the sport in fair measure - and the changes were cooked up to get folks back in the fold. Michelin, and the teams that use their tires, knew the rules.
KD in CA Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 I care. I was there and it was a disgrace. F-1 screwed themselves in the US. It is not like the tire will explore immediately if the dirvers use it. It is unsafe when they keep using the Michelin tires at high speed on the last turn. 362103[/snapback] Really? How do you know that? How many hot laps did Rolf do before plowing into the wall at turn 13 on Friday? One? As I said, there're alternative ways to make sure their safety, like drive slower on that turn or change tires more frequently. But doing so, it'll make the drivers less competitive, which they don't want to sacrifice even to keep them safe. The seven teams using Michelin tires do know drive slower on the last turn can make them safe, but they don't want to slowdown just themselves. Thus, they asked FIA to break the rule to add a chicane on the last turn so "all teams" are forced to drive slower on that turn. And of course, their request was rejected. 362103[/snapback] Are you joking? Tell everyone except the Ferraris "just drive slower". Yeah, that'll make for a competetive race. And no, they CAN'T just change tires more frequently. They can't change tires AT ALL!! That was the whole problem, they aren't allowed to change tires during the race and FIA refused to allow them to put the safe tires on their cars before the races started. Maybe you should learn the basic rules before commenting on them. There were two solutions: Allow all teams to change tires (good solution) or add a chicane before turn 13 (bad solution but better than not having a race). The FIA ignored both options. Let me guess, you're one of those people who was happy about the whole thing because your guy "won".
KD in CA Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 The FIA has been introducing rule changes for the past year or so, to remove some of the insanity. IIRC, the changes are meant to make it more competitive and not so expensive. It takes millions of dollars to field the cars these days. Some of the changes are - no launch control, starting the race with the amount of fuel left after qualifying, using the same motor for the race as used in qualifying, using the qualifying tire, diminishing communication between team members and the pits (to stop the "roller derby" strategy which seems the vogue in NASCAR). F1 interest has been waning in Europe - people perceived that technology has taken driver skills out of the sport in fair measure - and the changes were cooked up to get folks back in the fold. Michelin, and the teams that use their tires, knew the rules. 362216[/snapback] Yeah, but the problem arose after the teams got to Indy. The sport has to have some responsibility for driver safty. I agree with a lot of the rule changes, but the single tire rule has already proven to be potentially disasterous with Raikkonen's crash on the last lap a few weeks ago. That could decide the championship, not to mention that two drivers could have been killed. Now as a result of their inflexibility, they've ruined F-1 in the US, probably for good.
drnykterstein Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 racing roxors my soxors off. yay for watching people sit and turn a wheel.
CoachChuckDickerson Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?s...s=f1&id=2089850 14 out of 20 cars boycotted the United States Grand Prix on a tire dispute. Michelin claim their tires are not safe at top speed on the last turn of the speedway and requested FIA to change rules. This is crazy!! Don't ask the officials to adjust rules one day before the game because you are not good enough. How can't they just drive slower on that turn or change tires more frequently? Maybe we should ask NFL to award us 10 points per touchdown because we have a first year QB. 362036[/snapback] You are right. I don't care.
syhuang Posted June 20, 2005 Author Posted June 20, 2005 I care. I was there and it was a disgrace. F-1 screwed themselves in the US.Really? How do you know that? How many hot laps did Rolf do before plowing into the wall at turn 13 on Friday? One? Are you joking? Tell everyone except the Ferraris "just drive slower". Yeah, that'll make for a competetive race. And no, they CAN'T just change tires more frequently. They can't change tires AT ALL!! That was the whole problem, they aren't allowed to change tires during the race and FIA refused to allow them to put the safe tires on their cars before the races started. Maybe you should learn the basic rules before commenting on them. There were two solutions: Allow all teams to change tires (good solution) or add a chicane before turn 13 (bad solution but better than not having a race). The FIA ignored both options. Let me guess, you're one of those people who was happy about the whole thing because your guy "won". 362403[/snapback] Michelin claims the tire can be used for 10 laps if it was used at top speed on the 13th turn. So if the dirvers wanted to use it at top speed, they can change it for every 8 laps, or like I said, drive slower. And no, they can change tires, as long as using the same branch. F1 changes tires all the time at pit stops. However, the rule states they can't change to different branch of tires. Again, no, you guess wrong. I'm no happy about the race, so I said "What a joke". And no, I'm not a fan of any F1 teams, I just do some researches to understand the whole thing. At least, I know they can change tires during the race. Michelin never complained when they had advantage on other speedways and won all the races before US Grand Prix. And when they have one disadvantage on one race ( need to drive slower on one turn ), they want the rules to be changed so they can still win.
OBXBILLSFAN Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 I'm a Formula 1 fan, and have absolutely no sympathy for the Michelin teams. The configuration at Indy was no different than previous years, and every team tested and practiced on the course before the race. It is up to the tire manufacturer to produce a tire that performs properly at each venue. Ferrari and Bridgestone have been at a disadvantage all year, thus no wins for Michael Schumacher - the best driver in the world - going into this race. But I didn't see any courses being changed to accommodate them. It's a shame for all fans of F1 racing that Michelin couldn't produce a decent tire for this race, as Bridgestone did. But change the course the day before the race because Michelin and its teams didn't do their homework? Absurd. Who do these guys think they are, NASCAR?
jester43 Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 i was really bummed that the race was not televised here in new zealand, and i was a little surprised, to say the least, when i read what happened. the story did get some coverage on the national sportscast, and the look on bernie's face when he realized what happening was priceless: he was standing there in that crazy toupee like "WHA- WHA- WHAAAAT??!?!" ! (on a happier note, sky sports not only shows all the nextel cup races live, but they are also COMMERCIAL FREE with in car audio/video feeds through each break. it rules.) but after what happened to ralf in practice, i am glad michelin had the stones to say they f'd up and the tires were unsafe- they may have saved someone's life. of course it is their fault for engineering a defective tire and not figuring it out until it was too late to do anything about it. i'm not sure fia is to blame here, except for the fact that they are the ones who came up with this idiotic tire rule in the first place. imo, it indirectly led to this mess because requires manufacturers to gamble too much in construction to make fast-yet-durable tires, and then puts the drivers in a very unsafe situation if there is a problem during the race. kimi's wreck on the flat-spotted tire is a perfect example. sure, he could have pitted to change it, but he would ave had to TRUST the official not to penalize him. and as bills fans know, when you have to put your into the hands of an official, bad things happen. the thing fia should NOT have done is change the rules before the race. it's funny, i never root for ferrari(for the uninformed, it is like rooting for the yankees), but it is obvious that 90% of the rule changes in the past 3 years have been to slow them down...well i'd say this one bit them in the ass, didn't it?
Beerball Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 Some of the changes are - no launch control 362216[/snapback] What's launch control? Seriously, I have no clue.
jester43 Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 Michelin claims the tire can be used for 10 laps if it was used at top speed on the 13th turn. So if the dirvers wanted to use it at top speed, they can change it for every 8 laps, or like I said, drive slower. And no, they can change tires, as long as using the same branch. F1 changes tires all the time at pit stops. However, the rule states they can't change to different branch of tires. Again, no, you guess wrong. I'm no happy about the race, so I said "What a joke". And no, I'm not a fan of any F1 teams, I just do some researches to understand the whole thing. At least, I know they can change tires during the race. Michelin never complained when they had advantage on other speedways and won all the races before US Grand Prix. And when they have one disadvantage on one race ( need to drive slower on one turn ), they want the rules to be changed so they can still win. 362466[/snapback] have you been watching the races this year? the rules state they have to use the same set of tires all weekend...only exception is if the tire is damaged: then they may change them for "safety reasons." while they might have been allowed to run that way this weekend under the current rules(pitting every 10 laps for tires), it is untrue to say they change tires all the time...not this year they don't.
jester43 Posted June 20, 2005 Posted June 20, 2005 What's launch control? Seriously, I have no clue. 362516[/snapback] keeps the tires from spinning out of control when they romp on the gas at the start of the race...they do standing starts in f1. i hate launch control.
syhuang Posted June 20, 2005 Author Posted June 20, 2005 have you been watching the races this year? the rules state they have to use the same set of tires all weekend...only exception is if the tire is damaged: then they may change them for "safety reasons." while they might have been allowed to run that way this weekend under the current rules(pitting every 10 laps for tires), it is untrue to say they change tires all the time...not this year they don't. 362518[/snapback] Right, I shouldn't say "all the time"., I should just say F1 CAN change tires.
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