Keon Coleman Plays

[HappyDays]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

If it was the regular season, I would want him to get it.  

 

I'm just not sure I want a guy in a preseason game to put his body in the line on a throw like that.  That safety has a clear shot at him with a ball thrown like that and he might be trying to win a job....he isn't holding back on the hit.  At least that's my perspective.

 

I don't think he turtled up at all. Keon isn't afraid of contact, that's his whole game. The pass itself was just awkward. It's a wobbly almost knuckle ball, almost looks like it got tipped when you watch it in slow motion. He never get his hands on it cleanly. It's a little disappointing but I'm less discouraged by the failed catch than I am encouraged that he made a move to get open in the endzone off his release. That's the progress we wanted to see from week 1. One awkward throw dropping to the turf doesn't bother me.

 

21 minutes ago, Charles Romes said:

is a clip available of Keon’s supposed drop.  I missed that part of the game and it’s not on the highlight reel since it was a misconnect. 

 

Here you go:

 

You can see on the first angle he isn't hearing footsteps, he just doesn't expect the ball to end up that far in front of him and he doesn't make a clean attempt at the catch.

 

Edited August 20 by HappyDays

[Blackbeard]

I like that Coleman took ownership of the pass.   Shows character. 

He'll be fine.

[Billl]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He should have caught the ball. Despite it being a bad throw.

It wasn’t a bad throw.  It looked like a bad throw because Coleman pulled up a bit.  Now whether he was justified in doing so because it was preseason is a different story, but that’s a ball that needs to be caught when it counts.  Coleman was drafted to provide a target with a large catch radius and the strength to win through contact.  This is precisely the type of play that encapsulates both.  If you’re not a speed guy and you’re not a separation guy, then you’d better use your size and strength to make that catch.

[GoBills808]

30 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I don't think he turtled up at all. Keon isn't afraid of contact, that's his whole game. The pass itself was just awkward. It's a wobbly almost knuckle ball, almost looks like it got tipped when you watch it in slow motion. He never get his hands on it cleanly. It's a little disappointing but I'm less discouraged by the failed catch than I am encouraged that he made a move to get open in the endzone off his release. That's the progress we wanted to see from week 1. One awkward throw dropping to the turf doesn't bother me.

 

 

Here you go:

 

You can see on the first angle he isn't hearing footsteps, he just doesn't expect the ball to end up that far in front of him and he doesn't make a clean attempt at the catch.

 

Dunno about that tbh

 

I think he sees the safety coming and short arms it. The ball isn't a perfect spiral but placement looks ok

 

If you're worried about getting blended there just don't call that play in preseason, otherwise make the catch

 

 

[Charles Romes]

33 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I don't think he turtled up at all. Keon isn't afraid of contact, that's his whole game. The pass itself was just awkward. It's a wobbly almost knuckle ball, almost looks like it got tipped when you watch it in slow motion. He never get his hands on it cleanly. It's a little disappointing but I'm less discouraged by the failed catch than I am encouraged that he made a move to get open in the endzone off his release. That's the progress we wanted to see from week 1. One awkward throw dropping to the turf doesn't bother me.

 

 

Here you go:

 

You can see on the first angle he isn't hearing footsteps, he just doesn't expect the ball to end up that far in front of him and he doesn't make a clean attempt at the catch.

 

 

1. It was clearly a drop

 

2. I’m glad he dropped it, because if he caught it he’d be out for three weeks. 

[GunnerBill]

16 minutes ago, Billl said:

It wasn’t a bad throw.  It looked like a bad throw because Coleman pulled up a bit.  Now whether he was justified in doing so because it was preseason is a different story, but that’s a ball that needs to be caught when it counts.  Coleman was drafted to provide a target with a large catch radius and the strength to win through contact.  This is precisely the type of play that encapsulates both.  If you’re not a speed guy and you’re not a separation guy, then you’d better use your size and strength to make that catch.

 

It was a bad throw. I don't disagree with you Coleman has to make that catch. But it still isn't a good throw. It is fluttering and not where it needs to be. It is still definitely catchable. But it is a poor ball.

[JohnNord]

5 hours ago, MikePJ76 said:

Just killing time here at the moment and went and looked at the all 22.  Not going to talk about the slant at the goal line because I have said my peace here, it was a terrible throw and as Bill Walsh said slants are to be six inches in front of the numbers and never high.

 

anyway,

Here are a couple of plays where I think had Josh Allen been in the game the ball goes to Coleman and a few of them are chunk plays of 20 yards (ish).  For whatever reason Trubisky did not even look his way a number of times and another time it was Ben Dinucci and you can not put any fault on him after being on the team for 3 days.

 

This play  Coleman ran from outside on the left he was wide open and although trubisky had pressure if that is Josh, that ball is going to Coleman.  Its a 20 yard play missed.

 

Here is a simple curl, pressure again but if that is Josh that ball is going to coleman.

 

Here off of play action coleman is running a cross and again although there is pressure this is a ball Allen is firing to Coleman

 

This play Coleman is wide open and who knows how far he will run, this is DiNucci though and its not fair to blame him.  But in the regular season if a team plays a zone coverage like this Allen is hitting Coleman for a big play

This play is the Trubisky interception where he was just staring to his left and then made a horrific throw, again if this is Allen I believe this ball is going to Coleman who is right in the window of the zone between the corner and safety.  This could be a play where Coleman gets a high ball and has to go up and get it on the sideline.  This is another 20 yard play.

 

anyway, its preseason so teams are just sitting in zones and not really scheming to force quarterbacks to move, or to throw it to a certain spot etc...but if Coleman gets these looks in the regular season Allen is going to hit him.   I think the stuff I have read about this kid is pretty foolish and pretty premature.

 

 

Everything I’ve read about Coleman is that he’s good in zone coverage but needs help with route running to consistent beat m2m.  Still should be a red zone target even some are down on him after the drop

[GASabresIUFan]

Mike, good OP.  
 

With Josh on the field everything is different.  Defenses essentially are playing one defender down as they have to spy on Josh.  The O Line was good against Pit and when Mitch was sacked, Josh would have time to find someone open.  He checked down to Cook on one of the plays.

 

I excited by what Coleman can do. Sadly because of injuries we the fans aren’t getting a clear picture of what is happening with the offense in general and Coleman in particular this preseason.  
 

 

[Dablitzkrieg]

With himself?

[Cash]

1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

 

You can see on the first angle he isn't hearing footsteps, he just doesn't expect the ball to end up that far in front of him and he doesn't make a clean attempt at the catch.

 

 

I disagree.  Looking at the first angle, it looks to me like as part of Coleman's catching motion, he starts turning his head from the QB towards the S.  Once his helmet is facing the S, it looks like Coleman takes his eye off the ball.  Which makes sense, because the S was coming in for a massive hit, and it would've been fully legal if Coleman had the ball in his hands when they met.  Luckily for us, he only took a minor shot - both because Coleman was protecting his body, and because the S wisely let up once the ball was dropped.  In other words, whether intentional or not, it was a Business Decision by Coleman.  Even for a rookie, I have zero problem with a business decision in preseason.

 

With that said, I'm also glad Coleman is calling it a drop himself and saying he needs to get that ball.  That's the right (winning) attitude, and absolutely what you should be saying publicly, even if you don't mean it.  It was a bad but catchable throw, and even under the circumstances I think Coleman could've potentially caught it and still had a split second to protect himself from the incoming killshot.

 

Thanks for posting the clip!

[Alphadawg7]

5 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Completely agree. I was looking at it from a fan standpoint.  Obviously Brady will determine his week1 pecking order based on the camp. I guess my personal frustration stems from a) having garbage backups throwing "quails" to your new group...b) a super vanilla play calling that equally gives us fans no clue what's going on with these receivers?  I'll be glad when preseason drops to 2 games because we get nothing from them.

Preseason isn’t for the fans, entertainment, or showing your hand in terms of plays, creativity, etc.  They don’t game plan for these games.  
 

It’s for the coaches to see the players in a more live scenario than just practice.  
 

No disrespect, but just don’t get why people complain about preseason or things being vanilla.  I mean just don’t watch.  You don’t have to take away evaluation tools because you do find it entertaining.  

[hondo in seattle]

2 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

I don't think he turtled up at all. Keon isn't afraid of contact, that's his whole game. The pass itself was just awkward. It's a wobbly almost knuckle ball, almost looks like it got tipped when you watch it in slow motion. He never get his hands on it cleanly. It's a little disappointing but I'm less discouraged by the failed catch than I am encouraged that he made a move to get open in the endzone off his release. That's the progress we wanted to see from week 1. One awkward throw dropping to the turf doesn't bother me.

 

 

Here you go:

 

You can see on the first angle he isn't hearing footsteps, he just doesn't expect the ball to end up that far in front of him and he doesn't make a clean attempt at the catch.

 

 

Not a beautiful throw but not a great attempt to catch it either.  Look at his right hand.  He should get his hands to intercept the trajectory of the ball.  Instead, his right hand is moving overhand trying to grasp at the ball - and failing.  It's as if he was expecting the ball to be thrown at his body/head and didn't adjust when he saw that it wasn't.  

 

As you say, not a 'clean attempt' at the catch.  But not something I would damn him over.  

 

It looked worse live.

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Cash said:

 

I disagree.  Looking at the first angle, it looks to me like as part of Coleman's catching motion, he starts turning his head from the QB towards the S.  Once his helmet is facing the S, it looks like Coleman takes his eye off the ball.  Which makes sense, because the S was coming in for a massive hit, and it would've been fully legal if Coleman had the ball in his hands when they met.  Luckily for us, he only took a minor shot - both because Coleman was protecting his body, and because the S wisely let up once the ball was dropped.  In other words, whether intentional or not, it was a Business Decision by Coleman.  Even for a rookie, I have zero problem with a business decision in preseason.

 

With that said, I'm also glad Coleman is calling it a drop himself and saying he needs to get that ball.  That's the right (winning) attitude, and absolutely what you should be saying publicly, even if you don't mean it.  It was a bad but catchable throw, and even under the circumstances I think Coleman could've potentially caught it and still had a split second to protect himself from the incoming killshot.

 

Thanks for posting the clip!

 

If it has not been explicitly said, I am glad he didn’t stupidly get CRUSHED in a meaningless preseason game. That is true whether he saw it coming or not. 

[HappyDays]

38 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

Not a beautiful throw but not a great attempt to catch it either.  Look at his right hand.  He should get his hands to intercept the trajectory of the ball.  Instead, his right hand is moving overhand trying to grasp at the ball - and failing.  It's as if he was expecting the ball to be thrown at his body/head and didn't adjust when he saw that it wasn't.  

 

As you say, not a 'clean attempt' at the catch.  But not something I would damn him over.  

 

It looked worse live.

 

Yeah he didn't track the trajectory of the ball right. I get why a lot of people think he turtled up/short armed it, but that's not my interpretation of it. Looks to me like it does to you, he expected it to be thrown into his body and didn't adjust to the poor throw fast enough so he only got fingertips on it. Kid just turned 21 and only started focusing on football a couple years ago. I'll give him some time to ramp up and adjust to the speed of the game. I'm not remotely concerned about his toughness or willingness to absorb contact.

[NewEra]

5 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

For me, I didn't mind it in preseason.  I think in the regular season, I would want him to get that or go fully into the ball and just take the hit.

Coleman is going to say he's supposed to catch anything thrown his way....I like that attitude.  

💯 

[NewEra]

3 hours ago, Billl said:

It wasn’t a bad throw.  It looked like a bad throw because Coleman pulled up a bit.  Now whether he was justified in doing so because it was preseason is a different story, but that’s a ball that needs to be caught when it counts.  Coleman was drafted to provide a target with a large catch radius and the strength to win through contact.  This is precisely the type of play that encapsulates both.  If you’re not a speed guy and you’re not a separation guy, then you’d better use your size and strength to make that catch.

It was a bad throw.  Could he have caught it?  Yes.  Would we be upset if he didn’t catch it in a regular season/playoffs?  Absolutely.  Was it a bad throw?  Yup

[Punch]

3 hours ago, JohnNord said:

Everything I’ve read about Coleman is that he’s good in zone coverage but needs help with route running to consistent beat m2m.  Still should be a red zone target even some are down on him after the drop

I agree, I think some of these photos generally illustrate what zone coverage looks like, rather than a clear indication Coleman is winning routes. That doesn't mean completions aren't there but windows close quickly and static photos don't provide much evidence of how the play would progress if he were targeted.

[Scott7975]

6 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

For me, I didn't mind it in preseason.  I think in the regular season, I would want him to get that or go fully into the ball and just take the hit.

Coleman is going to say he's supposed to catch anything thrown his way....I like that attitude.  

Agree its a good attitude to have.  Some receivers think they should catch anything they get a hand on.  Others make excuses like "the ball was thrown too hard" or "I wasnt ready yet."

[ganesh]

9 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

We're never going to be able to evaluate any of these new wrs while Trubisky & DiNucci are on the field.  It's basically pointless. And because we're terrified they'll get injured,  we'll see them for just a few seconds over the span of 3 preseason games. By the time week 1 roles around,  we'll have no clue what we have receiver-wise?  

We may not, but the coaches see them in every practice.  I am sure they have a good idea

[Cray51]

4 hours ago, JohnNord said:

Everything I’ve read about Coleman is that he’s good in zone coverage but needs help with route running to consistent beat m2m.  Still should be a red zone target even some are down on him after the drop

It’s understandable why they like Coleman so much then.  Chris long made a comment the other day that teams are playing so much zone against Allen because he kills man coverage.

 

i see if I can find the stats