Alphadawg7 Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 4 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: The 40 time joke is just what it is - a joke. The same as we still call Isaiah McKenzie "McCittrick" and respond to every injury thread with "have they removed the spleen." I don't know or care about social media. That is an idiots charter. But there was lots of very considered, detailed, sensible, discussion of Coleman all spring. Pre-dating the combine. It was not just Kirby and I. Still not the majority, I was in all those discussions too. Pre draft the talk was minuscule compared to after we took him. Pre-draft discussions are more informed discussions because it’s by those who invest time into the players and discussion. Post drafting him it’s all the hot take reactions and the vast majority based that initial reaction on his 40 time. Just read the threads. Again, I am fully aware some of us had deeper thoughts (good or bad), but to think the hot take mob does is just not accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 56 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: Still not the majority, I was in all those discussions too. Pre draft the talk was minuscule compared to after we took him. Pre-draft discussions are more informed discussions because it’s by those who invest time into the players and discussion. Post drafting him it’s all the hot take reactions and the vast majority based that initial reaction on his 40 time. Just read the threads. Again, I am fully aware some of us had deeper thoughts (good or bad), but to think the hot take mob does is just not accurate. I have been through the first 6 pages of his draft thread (it is 108 pages in total so you gotta set a limit somewhere). Not one person mentioned the 40 time. 6 people (excluding two jokes) made reference to speed. Most of the comments were about him as a separator which is not the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: I have been through the first 6 pages of his draft thread (it is 108 pages in total so you gotta set a limit somewhere). Not one person mentioned the 40 time. 6 people (excluding two jokes) made reference to speed. Most of the comments were about him as a separator which is not the same thing. Gunner...come on...this is a silly disagreement here. What is the number 1 concern on Keon? Can he separate...where did that concern originate...off his 40 time for the majority. Go read the draft pick thread, not one now where opinions and assumptions were already made that originated from his combine 40 time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said: Gunner...come on...this is a silly disagreement here. What is the number 1 concern on Keon? Can he separate...where did that concern originate...off his 40 time for the majority. Go read the draft pick thread, not one now where opinions and assumptions were already made that originated from his combine 40 time. I HAVE read the draft pick thread. That is exactly the thread I read the first 6 pages of. In 6 pages, 8 mentions of speed as a concern (two of them clearly jokes). The separation concern came from him being a non-separator in college. To say people who said "separation" was code for "40 time" is completely untrue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP51 Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 On 8/19/2024 at 6:31 PM, MR8 said: I hear Reggie Germany is available... Bet you could convince Cole Beasley to come back LOL... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 16 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I HAVE read the draft pick thread. That is exactly the thread I read the first 6 pages of. In 6 pages, 8 mentions of speed as a concern (two of them clearly jokes). The separation concern came from him being a non-separator in college. To say people who said "separation" was code for "40 time" is completely untrue. I have read it too…first comment in the thread was about his speed as were several others. The vast majority don’t specify why they hate it just that they hate the pick. But it keeps getting talked about as the thread goes on and in dozens of other threads from that point on. I can believe we are even discussing this TBH. We will have to agree to disagree that Keons 40 time was not the catalyst for a majority of the initial negative views on him and just move on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 14 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: I have read it too…first comment in the thread was about his speed as were several others. The vast majority don’t specify why they hate it just that they hate the pick. But it keeps getting talked about as the thread goes on and in dozens of other threads from that point on. I can believe we are even discussing this TBH. We will have to agree to disagree that Keons 40 time was not the catalyst for a majority of the initial negative views on him and just move on. Yea, boyst mentions it as the first comment. He is one of the 6. The 40 time being the majority reason is a total strawman. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 (edited) 27 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Yea, boyst mentions it as the first comment. He is one of the 6. The 40 time being the majority reason is a total strawman. No...its not. The majority DON"T cite WHY they hate the pick in those first pages. You don't get to take all the "I hate this pick" and dismiss it has anything to do with speed just because they didn't state in that one comment within minutes of him being drafted. You act like those people didn't continue to comment in that thread and others where they did say what they didn't like, and it predominantly came down to speed. People think he can't separate...because they don't think he is fast enough...because he ran a slow 40 at combine...despite the fact he ran fast in other drills. I honestly can't believe we are still even talking about this. Again...just gonna have to agree to disagree like I said in my last post because there is a 0% chance you are going to convince me, or even make a logical case for, that the most talked about issue with Keon has not been about him being too "slow". Edited August 21 by Alphadawg7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 4 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: No...its not. The majority DON"T cite WHY they hate the pick in those first pages. You don't get to take all the "I hate this pick" and dismiss it has anything to do with speed just because they didn't state in that one comment within minutes of him being drafted. You act like those people didn't continue to comment in that thread and others where they did say what they didn't like, and it predominantly came down to speed. People think he can't separate...because they don't think he is fast enough...because he ran a slow 40 at combine...despite the fact he ran fast in other drills. I honestly can't believe we are still even talking about this. Again...just gonna have to agree to disagree like I said in my last post because there is a 0% chance you are going to convince me, or even make a logical case for, that the most talked about issue with Keon has not been about him being too "slow". I have made the logical case. You have ignored it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 (edited) 47 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I have made the logical case. You have ignored it. Gunner you are a great poster and I respect you. But if you think that reading 6 pages of one 109 page thread is making a logical case, then you are just saying things to just say things now. If you think assuming every comment that said they did not like the pick WITHOUT citing WHY automatically means it had nothing to do with speed...then you are again just saying things to say things. None of that is logic let alone a logical case. Furthermore, it was not just 8 times in 6 pages as you claimed...I just went through it again, there were 6 references to him being slow or compared to slow players on the very first page alone. And over the 6 pages, amongst the negative comments (which the majority were negative reactions) that actually said something that indicated what they didn't like about him, speed was the most common reason by either directly stating it or comparing him to Funchess, Kelvin, etc to reference how slow they see him as. I have not ignored anything...you just haven't presented anything to dispute the fact that people were not up in arms about his speed, and what little you did provide was incorrect So...For the 3rd time, lets just agree to disagree because this is maybe the 2nd most unnecessary conversation I have been in this offseason. Edited August 21 by Alphadawg7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubanmist Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 7 hours ago, JP51 said: Bet you could convince Cole Beasley to come back LOL... much rather trade for a particular Texan who was previously with the Bills. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreboding Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 On 8/19/2024 at 4:45 PM, Roundybout said: I have zero interest in Q. Johnston, and I doubt the Lions are going to give up Williams. Would love to give Pittsburgh a second for Pickens. They need draft capital. Isn't he a little young to go for just a 1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 9 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: Gunner you are a great poster and I respect you. But if you think that reading 6 pages of one 109 page thread is making a logical case, then you are just saying things to just say things now. If you think assuming every comment that said they did not like the pick WITHOUT citing WHY automatically means it had nothing to do with speed...then you are again just saying things to say things. None of that is logic let alone a logical case. Furthermore, it was not just 8 times in 6 pages as you claimed...I just went through it again, there were 6 references to him being slow or compared to slow players on the very first page alone. And over the 6 pages, amongst the negative comments (which the majority were negative reactions) that actually said something that indicated what they didn't like about him, speed was the most common reason by either directly stating it or comparing him to Funchess, Kelvin, etc to reference how slow they see him as. I have not ignored anything...you just haven't presented anything to dispute the fact that people were not up in arms about his speed, and what little you did provide was incorrect So...For the 3rd time, lets just agree to disagree because this is maybe the 2nd most unnecessary conversation I have been in this offseason. So it went from "40 time" to "speed" to "separator" to "compared to other bigger receivers who struggled to separate"? Yea. That is not proof of people being hung up on the 40 time. You are pissing in the wind. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 There’s no one from these lists that are worth it. The bottom line is we have to hope Samuel in 3-4 weeks can calm down that turf toe, rely heavily on Shakir and Kinkaid, as well as have some packages for Knox. wellhave lots of $ for next year to extend some and make at least one to two splashes. I’m confident one will be a top WR like Aiyuk. SF is dragging this out as they want to play him on the tag and probably walk away from him or Debo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 3 hours ago, machine gun kelly said: There’s no one from these lists that are worth it. The bottom line is we have to hope Samuel in 3-4 weeks can calm down that turf toe, rely heavily on Shakir and Kinkaid, as well as have some packages for Knox. wellhave lots of $ for next year to extend some and make at least one to two splashes. I’m confident one will be a top WR like Aiyuk. SF is dragging this out as they want to play him on the tag and probably walk away from him or Debo. Samuel was always destined to be injured and have a lost year/stolen contract. Turf toe is a perfect excuse for sucking all year. For 2024 the Bills will have to get very lucky. 2025 should focus on a top WR in the draft. If the Vikes stink we'll have pick say 38 plus our own which looks to be in the 12-15 range which should be enough to move up and get a top flight guy. They can’t be spending 30M on some loser like Aiyuk. It’ll be interesting to see which route we go with our new OC for 2025 and what style WR will be a good target. Then get a mid-tier FA for depth/experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 1 minute ago, 4merper4mer said: Samuel was always destined to be injured and have a lost year/stolen contract. Turf toe is a perfect excuse for sucking all year. For 2024 the Bills will have to get very lucky. 2025 should focus on a top WR in the draft. If the Vikes stink we'll have pick say 38 plus our own which looks to be in the 12-15 range which should be enough to move up and get a top flight guy. They can’t be spending 30M on some loser like Aiyuk. It’ll be interesting to see which route we go with our new OC for 2025 and what style WR will be a good target. Then get a mid-tier FA for depth/experience. You're a constant beacon of joy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP51 Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 9 hours ago, Cubanmist said: much rather trade for a particular Texan who was previously with the Bills. Indeed and both are about equally likely to happen LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 1 hour ago, oldmanfan said: You're a constant beacon of joy. Thanks. I thought some might focus on my not so fun outlook for 2024 and not see my optimism for 2025. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 16 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: Gunner you are a great poster and I respect you. But if you think that reading 6 pages of one 109 page thread is making a logical case, then you are just saying things to just say things now. If you think assuming every comment that said they did not like the pick WITHOUT citing WHY automatically means it had nothing to do with speed...then you are again just saying things to say things. None of that is logic let alone a logical case. Furthermore, it was not just 8 times in 6 pages as you claimed...I just went through it again, there were 6 references to him being slow or compared to slow players on the very first page alone. And over the 6 pages, amongst the negative comments (which the majority were negative reactions) that actually said something that indicated what they didn't like about him, speed was the most common reason by either directly stating it or comparing him to Funchess, Kelvin, etc to reference how slow they see him as. I have not ignored anything...you just haven't presented anything to dispute the fact that people were not up in arms about his speed, and what little you did provide was incorrect So...For the 3rd time, lets just agree to disagree because this is maybe the 2nd most unnecessary conversation I have been in this offseason. The draft process on WR's here on TSW was long and very involved. The data and tape on Coleman was pretty definitive.........he did not separate well in college. We knew this in November/December. He didn't enter the offseason draft process with the same trajectory he had in September/October. The narrative that he was great at contested catches was debunked slightly later in the process than the separation question. Perhaps that's what you are confused about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 (edited) 7 hours ago, GunnerBill said: So it went from "40 time" to "speed" to "separator" to "compared to other bigger receivers who struggled to separate"? Yea. That is not proof of people being hung up on the 40 time. You are pissing in the wind. Don't do the twisting words game so many do around here to save a bad take. That is beneath you. You were wrong when you said only 8 mentions about it in 6 pages...I mean there were 6 refences to him being slow on page 1 alone of 109 page thread of which is just one thread of dozens on him. And in those 6 pages, the number 1 complaint was he is slow. And the NUMBER ONE reason people think he can't separate is because they think he is SLOW. Why you are still going on about this is still is wild, especially when I threw out 4 times now to agree to disagree. 1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said: The draft process on WR's here on TSW was long and very involved. The data and tape on Coleman was pretty definitive.........he did not separate well in college. We knew this in November/December. He didn't enter the offseason draft process with the same trajectory he had in September/October. The narrative that he was great at contested catches was debunked slightly later in the process than the separation question. Perhaps that's what you are confused about. There is no confusion. So tell me, what is the number 1 reason why people don't believe he can separate in the NFL? Because they feel he is too slow. I mean why do I have to even spell this out at this stage is beyond me. And I am as involved in the pre-draft process as anyone around here. Edited August 22 by Alphadawg7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.