All_Pro_Bills Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Brit said: Freedom of speech does have legal limitations. Always has and always will. This is true of every western nation. Even the USA. If you slander someone they can take legal action. If you libel someone you can take legal action. (Recent examples: Heard/Depp, Giuliani/false claims about multiple things, Fox News/false claims about voting machines). If you conspire to commit an illegal act - that is a crime. If you incite others to commit an illegal act - that is a crime. Freedom of speech does not protect you in such circumstances. This is not anything new. Julius Streicher was rightly hanged because of what he published, in the most extreme case. Those being investigated and prosecuted for incitement over things they wrote on various platforms will have their day in court. Similar things happened during the much more serious rioting in 2011. From several thousand miles away, it looks like some people in the UK are more equal than others when it comes to free speech. Government officials are free to threaten anyone they'd like to threaten with violence. Old lady's posting their opinion get harassed by the police. Killers of children get sympathy. The optics are not good. They even threaten to extradite citizens of foreign nations for violating their laws from another country. Comical Your government is dysfunctional and selectively enforces their decrees to suit their needs. As does the Washington administration in the U.S. There's something fundamentally wrong with these people. Stupid, evil, malicious, insane, misguided? Take your pick. But as far as being effective leaders they don't pass the test. Edited August 10 by All_Pro_Bills 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phypon Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 16 minutes ago, Brit said: Freedom of speech does have legal limitations. Always has and always will. This is true of every western nation. Even the USA. If you slander someone they can take legal action. If you libel someone you can take legal action. (Recent examples: Heard/Depp, Giuliani/false claims about multiple things, Fox News/false claims about voting machines). If you conspire to commit an illegal act - that is a crime. If you incite others to commit an illegal act - that is a crime. Freedom of speech does not protect you in such circumstances. This is not anything new. Julius Streicher was rightly hanged because of what he published, in the most extreme case. Those being investigated and prosecuted for incitement over things they wrote on various platforms will have their day in court. Similar things happened during the much more serious rioting in 2011. Good list. Let's add: - Criticize govt policies - Have an opinion about crimes committed by an immigrant ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 35 minutes ago, Brit said: Freedom of speech does have legal limitations. Always has and always will. This is true of every western nation. Even the USA. If you slander someone they can take legal action. If you libel someone you can take legal action. (Recent examples: Heard/Depp, Giuliani/false claims about multiple things, Fox News/false claims about voting machines). If you conspire to commit an illegal act - that is a crime. If you incite others to commit an illegal act - that is a crime. Freedom of speech does not protect you in such circumstances. This is not anything new. Julius Streicher was rightly hanged because of what he published, in the most extreme case. Those being investigated and prosecuted for incitement over things they wrote on various platforms will have their day in court. Similar things happened during the much more serious rioting in 2011. The US cases described above were addressed in the civil justice system, not the criminal justice system. The argument from free speech advocates isn’t freedom from consequence, it’s freedom from overzealous law enforcement and authoritarian policing. People were not concerned that Amber Heard was going to be tazed coming out of the LA Fitness because of her issues with Captain Jack. I understand we have different systems and you’re obviously supportive of yours. You’ve expressed that the targeted individuals represent the lowest rungs on humanity, and that may be the case. I’ve never been quite sure how to address ours here. I would be against our local town issuing a permit for a nazi gathering, but the very real question is where lines are drawn. The “day in court” issue is something to discuss as well. There are many ways for overzealous law enforcement to crush undesirables. One is to arrest and imprison them, force them to seek counsel, expose them to public ridicule and loss of employment and bury them in legal fees. In our system, a defendant can win and lose at the same time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundybout Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 10 minutes ago, Tommy Callahan said: Posting an article from 2013 is all you got? Cool! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phypon Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 4 minutes ago, Roundybout said: Posting an article from 2013 is all you got? Cool! That's pretty messed up dude. Do you support immigrants raping children? Why would it make a difference to you if it happened today, yesterday, or tomorrow? That's really messed up. You should probably walk that one back. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundybout Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 12 minutes ago, phypon said: That's pretty messed up dude. Do you support immigrants raping children? Why would it make a difference to you if it happened today, yesterday, or tomorrow? That's really messed up. You should probably walk that one back. Of course not. In this case, though, it's simply a non sequitur. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 22 minutes ago, phypon said: That's pretty messed up dude. Do you support immigrants raping children? Why would it make a difference to you if it happened today, yesterday, or tomorrow? That's really messed up. You should probably walk that one back. It doesn't have the self awareness. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanNC Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 3 hours ago, phypon said: Good list. Let's add: - Criticize govt policies - Have an opinion about crimes committed by an immigrant ... Curious observers too. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted August 10 Author Share Posted August 10 (edited) Do the left leaning people on this board honestly support this? Genuine question.. Edited August 10 by SCBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 6 hours ago, phypon said: committed by an immigrant you may need to familiarize yourself with the meaning of "immigrant" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phypon Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 3 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said: you may need to familiarize yourself with the meaning of "immigrant" You may need to familiarize yourself with the meaning of raping a 13 year old girl. If you want to defend that, then that's on you. Personally, I think it's abhorrent. Pretty messed up that you are defending it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanNC Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brit Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 10 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: The US cases described above were addressed in the civil justice system, not the criminal justice system. The argument from free speech advocates isn’t freedom from consequence, it’s freedom from overzealous law enforcement and authoritarian policing. People were not concerned that Amber Heard was going to be tazed coming out of the LA Fitness because of her issues with Captain Jack. I understand we have different systems and you’re obviously supportive of yours. You’ve expressed that the targeted individuals represent the lowest rungs on humanity, and that may be the case. I’ve never been quite sure how to address ours here. I would be against our local town issuing a permit for a nazi gathering, but the very real question is where lines are drawn. The “day in court” issue is something to discuss as well. There are many ways for overzealous law enforcement to crush undesirables. One is to arrest and imprison them, force them to seek counsel, expose them to public ridicule and loss of employment and bury them in legal fees. In our system, a defendant can win and lose at the same time. Well, the US law on incitement is broadly similar to UK law. (Brandenburg vs Ohio). Trump was impeached for incitement, for a more recent example. That was the crime for which he faced trial in the senate. So it is most definitely a criminal offence in the US. As for overzealous enforcement. The joy of deciding these cases is that the evidence is literally in black and white. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanNC Posted August 10 Share Posted August 10 6 hours ago, SCBills said: Do the left leaning people on this board honestly support this? Genuine question.. You can't qualify questions to these people with genuine question, serious question etc. and expect that you'll get anything other than the same programmed narrative responses. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted August 11 Share Posted August 11 5 hours ago, BillsFanNC said: You can't qualify questions to these people with genuine question, serious question etc. and expect that you'll get anything other than the same programmed narrative responses. nuh, say what?? stick to cartoons and meme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted August 11 Share Posted August 11 Kind of like our left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanNC Posted August 11 Share Posted August 11 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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