The Hard Knocks Thread

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, Beck Water said:

Speaking of Hard Knocks - is there any other way to watch it than NFL Network?

MAX.  Formerly known as HBO MAX.  The braintrust really went to work on the name change.

[bobobonators]

On 7/3/2024 at 4:44 AM, machine gun kelly said:

I can proudly say I’ve never watched an episode of Hard Knocks.  First, I can’t stand reality shows, and it’s not reality anyway.  They play for the cameras.

I don’t like reality TV either. But hard knocks is well done; and if you’re a fan of football, you’ll enjoy it. Give it a shot. 

[bobobonators]

On 7/3/2024 at 2:17 PM, eball said:

Schoen had no choice regarding the Barkley situation.  His big mistake was the Jones contract in the first place.  How do you look at that guy and think he is the answer for the franchise?  But he did, and now he's trying to support him.

 

In his defense, someone here posted number for Jones compared to T Lawrence and they were almost identical. 
 

The gamble with Jones might cost him his job; but Jones did show some flashes. Making the playoffs early on might be the worst thing that happened to Schoen and Daboll. False hope perhaps. 

On 7/4/2024 at 8:35 AM, Albany,n.y. said:

The best example is Green Bay. They've drafted their last 2 QBs in the 1st round years before they needed them to play. Both times they had a HOF QB with tread left on his tires. 

Kinda right about that. GB hasn’t had a truly horrible QB in like 30yrs 

[Albany,n.y.]

5 minutes ago, bobobonators said:

The gamble with Jones might cost him his job; but Jones did show some flashes. Making the playoffs early on might be the worst thing that happened to Schoen and Daboll. False hope perhaps. 

 

My initial reaction when they re-signed Jones was: Didn't they learn anything from when they were in Buffalo and the Bills decided it was best to get rid of Tyrod Taylor & do everything possible to get their QB in the draft.  Sure, the Bills could have been content with making the playoffs in 2017, but they knew better.  I really thought the Giants would do the same thing with Jones, especially after they didn't use the 5th year option.  

All along I thought signing Jones for franchise QB money was ridiculous.  They compounded the error that helped get Gettleman fired.  

 

 

[Beck Water]

On 7/17/2024 at 12:39 PM, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I didnt know it was ever on NFLN. It's on HBO, and now Hulu.

 

Hulu!  OK, will look there.  I think I miss-spoke, I meant that NFL thing you pay for to watch coach's film.  Hard Knocks was on there.

[DrDawkinstein]

20 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

Hulu!  OK, will look there.  I think I miss-spoke, I meant that NFL thing you pay for to watch coach's film.  Hard Knocks was on there.

 

Checked while I was in the app and it looks like you still need the HBO add-on in Hulu to get it. So for now, just HBO/Max.

[Captain Hindsight]

On 7/17/2024 at 6:34 PM, Albany,n.y. said:

My initial reaction when they re-signed Jones was: Didn't they learn anything from when they were in Buffalo and the Bills decided it was best to get rid of Tyrod Taylor & do everything possible to get their QB in the draft.  Sure, the Bills could have been content with making the playoffs in 2017, but they knew better.  I really thought the Giants would do the same thing with Jones, especially after they didn't use the 5th year option.  

All along I thought signing Jones for franchise QB money was ridiculous.  They compounded the error that helped get Gettleman fired.  

 

 

Jones is way more talented than Taylor. I was ok with giving him another year, but I would have tagged him and resigned Barkley. Poor use of resources if you ask me

[Thrivefourfive]

The music has been annoying. Schoen… I dunno.. I don’t ever see the smart people behave the way he does. He’s a little too impressed with himself. 

[Mister Defense]

On 7/3/2024 at 5:44 AM, machine gun kelly said:

I can proudly say I’ve never watched an episode of Hard Knocks.  First, I can’t stand reality shows, and it’s not reality anyway.  They play for the cameras.

 

Yup, same here, though I have watched parts of several episodes, and soo happy that the Bills, McDermott, and their leadership want nothing to do with that show, will clearly never be on it if they have their way.

 

It is meant for teams like the jets, browns, and the girls, and those type of weak never going to win anything teams with poor leadership.  While there have been some exceptions of, course.

 

Who would ever want to expose the inner workings of their team and its relationships to obtrusive cameras, microphones, and the additional scrutiny those teams face?  Winning and preparing to do so are tough enough as it is, no more obstacles are needed.

 

That type of show and the attention it brings goes against so much that this current Bills' organization is all about.  Keep away.

 

 

[Billy Claude]

3 hours ago, Mister Defense said:

 

Yup, same here, though I have watched parts of several episodes, and soo happy that the Bills, McDermott, and their leadership want nothing to do with that show, will clearly never be on it if they have their way.

 

 

 

 

The Bills won't be able to avoid it.  Pretty much all teams since 2013 on Hard Knocks are forced to participate by the NFL.  The only exception were the Rams and Chargers who volunteered the year they moved into Sofi.

 

The reason the Bills weren't on during the drought was HBO never chose them since there was no national interest in the Bills Afterwards, teams are allowed to decline if they were in the playoffs either of the two  previous seasons.

 

The playoff exemption does not hold for the new in-season and out-of season versions of Hard Knocks since the Dolphins were on the in-season version in 2023 after making the playoffs in 2022 and the Steelers will be on in the in-season Hard Knocks this coming season after making the playoffs last season.  So expect the Bills to be on pretty soon.

 

Edited July 21 by Billy Claude

[Mister Defense]

20 hours ago, Billy Claude said:

 

 

The Bills won't be able to avoid it.  Pretty much all teams since 2013 on Hard Knocks are forced to participate by the NFL.  The only exception were the Rams and Chargers who volunteered the year they moved into Sofi.

 

The reason the Bills weren't on during the drought was HBO never chose them since there was no national interest in the Bills Afterwards, teams are allowed to decline if they were in the playoffs either of the two  previous seasons.

 

The playoff exemption does not hold for the new in-season and out-of season versions of Hard Knocks since the Dolphins were on the in-season version in 2023 after making the playoffs in 2022 and the Steelers will be on in the in-season Hard Knocks this coming season after making the playoffs last season.  So expect the Bills to be on pretty soon.

 

 

Thanks and I hope you are wrong.  I cannot imagine this team, with this culture, doing that show.

 

But it seems like a great fit for Daboll and the Giants!

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

Anyone watch this past weeks episode?  There is a scene where they are contemplating what to do in the draft...move up for a QB or not.  And in this clip, they looked at all the first round QB's over the past 10 years drafted to determine how many were a "hit or miss".  

 

Couple interesting things came from that...they had Goff as a miss while they had Daniel Jones and Kyler Murray as "hits" LMAO.  Goff has played in a SB and multiple Championship games and been a lot better QB than either of those 2 guys for one.  

 

Second interesting thing was after they looked at all the first round QB's that "hit or missed" the past 10 years, they said to that list "Not a lot hit".  So then the GM asks Daboll "What do you take from that Dabs?" and Dabs seems to think he asked "Who" he would take from that list...and he says "Stroud".  Then someone else in the room off camera (as camera was still on Daboll) says "or Josh".  Daboll didn't react to it, but to be fair, they quickly cut to a new scene at that point too.  

 

Just found this clip interesting...how they can label Goff a "miss" just was stunning.  I mean I am not saying Goff is top 5...but he is far from a "miss".  Then Daboll throwing out Stroud over both Mahomes and Josh was another little surprise.

 

This is the same team that gave Daniel Jones a bunch of money though lol, so guess I shouldn't be too surprised

Edited July 30 by Alphadawg7

[GunnerBill]

20 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Anyone watch this past weeks episode?  There is a scene where they are contemplating what to do in the draft...move up for a QB or not.  And in this clip, they looked at all the first round QB's over the past 10 years drafted to determine how many were a "hit or miss".  

 

Couple interesting things came from that...they had Goff as a miss while they had Daniel Jones and Kyler Murray as "hits" LMAO.  Goff has played in a SB and multiple Championship games and been a lot better QB than either of those 2 guys for one.  

 

Second interesting thing was after they looked at all the first round QB's that "hit or missed" the past 10 years, they said to that list "Not a lot hit".  So then the GM asks Daboll "What do you take from that Dabs?" and Dabs seems to think he asked "Who" he would take from that list...and he says "Stroud".  Then someone else in the room off camera (as camera was still on Daboll) says "or Josh".  Daboll didn't react to it, but to be fair, they quickly cut to a new scene at that point too.  

 

Just found this clip interesting...how they can label Goff a "miss" just was stunning.  I mean I am not saying Goff is top 5...but he is far from a "miss".  Then Daboll throwing out Stroud over both Mahomes and Josh was another little surprise.

 

This is the same team that gave Daniel Jones a bunch of money though lol, so guess I shouldn't be too surprised

 

Goff is the most disrespected QB in football over the past decade IMO.

[Alphadawg7]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Goff is the most disrespected QB in football over the past decade IMO.

 

I know die hard Lions fans here in LA who still call him "Goof" instead of Goff.  Its crazy to me...and for them to list him as a "miss" is just as absurd as some random exec calling Allen "overrated".  

[Beck Water]

47 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Anyone watch this past weeks episode?  There is a scene where they are contemplating what to do in the draft...move up for a QB or not.  And in this clip, they looked at all the first round QB's over the past 10 years drafted to determine how many were a "hit or miss".  

 

Couple interesting things came from that...they had Goff as a miss while they had Daniel Jones and Kyler Murray as "hits" LMAO.  Goff has played in a SB and multiple Championship games and been a lot better QB than either of those 2 guys for one.  

 

Second interesting thing was after they looked at all the first round QB's that "hit or missed" the past 10 years, they said to that list "Not a lot hit".  So then the GM asks Daboll "What do you take from that Dabs?" and Dabs seems to think he asked "Who" he would take from that list...and he says "Stroud".  Then someone else in the room off camera (as camera was still on Daboll) says "or Josh".  Daboll didn't react to it, but to be fair, they quickly cut to a new scene at that point too.  

 

Just found this clip interesting...how they can label Goff a "miss" just was stunning.  I mean I am not saying Goff is top 5...but he is far from a "miss".  Then Daboll throwing out Stroud over both Mahomes and Josh was another little surprise.

 

This is the same team that gave Daniel Jones a bunch of money though lol, so guess I shouldn't be too surprised

 

Wow.

 

Bet Goff has that clip on his phone.  Lions play the Giants in preseason Week 1, in the normal course of preseason neither starting QB would be likely to play.

 

Yeah, Stroud over Mahomes or Josh at this point is nuts.  Don't get me wrong, I think Stroud looks very promising, but at this point he's had one promising season and one playoff win, then a pretty decisive loss.

 

I think Daboll has "Pygmalion Syndrome" where he thinks he made Josh Allen and he can make Daniel Jones, too.

 

 

23 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I know die hard Lions fans here in LA who still call him "Goof" instead of Goff.  Its crazy to me...and for them to list him as a "miss" is just as absurd as some random exec calling Allen "overrated".  

 

Maybe the random exec was Schoen or someone in his office?

 

Edited July 30 by Beck Water

[Low Positive]

43 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Anyone watch this past weeks episode?  There is a scene where they are contemplating what to do in the draft...move up for a QB or not.  And in this clip, they looked at all the first round QB's over the past 10 years drafted to determine how many were a "hit or miss".  

 

Couple interesting things came from that...they had Goff as a miss while they had Daniel Jones and Kyler Murray as "hits" LMAO.  Goff has played in a SB and multiple Championship games and been a lot better QB than either of those 2 guys for one.  

 

Second interesting thing was after they looked at all the first round QB's that "hit or missed" the past 10 years, they said to that list "Not a lot hit".  So then the GM asks Daboll "What do you take from that Dabs?" and Dabs seems to think he asked "Who" he would take from that list...and he says "Stroud".  Then someone else in the room off camera (as camera was still on Daboll) says "or Josh".  Daboll didn't react to it, but to be fair, they quickly cut to a new scene at that point too.  

 

Just found this clip interesting...how they can label Goff a "miss" just was stunning.  I mean I am not saying Goff is top 5...but he is far from a "miss".  Then Daboll throwing out Stroud over both Mahomes and Josh was another little surprise.

 

This is the same team that gave Daniel Jones a bunch of money though lol, so guess I shouldn't be too surprised

Daboll is very sensitive to the claims that his career was made by Josh Allen, so I can see why he didn't want to be the one who said his name.

[TBBills Fan]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Anyone watch this past weeks episode?  There is a scene where they are contemplating what to do in the draft...move up for a QB or not.  And in this clip, they looked at all the first round QB's over the past 10 years drafted to determine how many were a "hit or miss".  

 

Couple interesting things came from that...they had Goff as a miss while they had Daniel Jones and Kyler Murray as "hits" LMAO.  Goff has played in a SB and multiple Championship games and been a lot better QB than either of those 2 guys for one.  

 

Second interesting thing was after they looked at all the first round QB's that "hit or missed" the past 10 years, they said to that list "Not a lot hit".  So then the GM asks Daboll "What do you take from that Dabs?" and Dabs seems to think he asked "Who" he would take from that list...and he says "Stroud".  Then someone else in the room off camera (as camera was still on Daboll) says "or Josh".  Daboll didn't react to it, but to be fair, they quickly cut to a new scene at that point too.  

 

Just found this clip interesting...how they can label Goff a "miss" just was stunning.  I mean I am not saying Goff is top 5...but he is far from a "miss".  Then Daboll throwing out Stroud over both Mahomes and Josh was another little surprise.

 

This is the same team that gave Daniel Jones a bunch of money though lol, so guess I shouldn't be too surprised

I've learned that many folks on this site seem to put in just as much effort and work into this sport as they do

 

Why oh why didn't I intern for a team at 25?!

[DrDawkinstein]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Anyone watch this past weeks episode?  There is a scene where they are contemplating what to do in the draft...move up for a QB or not.  And in this clip, they looked at all the first round QB's over the past 10 years drafted to determine how many were a "hit or miss".  

 

Couple interesting things came from that...they had Goff as a miss while they had Daniel Jones and Kyler Murray as "hits" LMAO.  Goff has played in a SB and multiple Championship games and been a lot better QB than either of those 2 guys for one.  

 

Second interesting thing was after they looked at all the first round QB's that "hit or missed" the past 10 years, they said to that list "Not a lot hit".  So then the GM asks Daboll "What do you take from that Dabs?" and Dabs seems to think he asked "Who" he would take from that list...and he says "Stroud".  Then someone else in the room off camera (as camera was still on Daboll) says "or Josh".  Daboll didn't react to it, but to be fair, they quickly cut to a new scene at that point too.  

 

Just found this clip interesting...how they can label Goff a "miss" just was stunning.  I mean I am not saying Goff is top 5...but he is far from a "miss".  Then Daboll throwing out Stroud over both Mahomes and Josh was another little surprise.

 

This is the same team that gave Daniel Jones a bunch of money though lol, so guess I shouldn't be too surprised

 

On Goff and Jones...

 

I can see the argument that Goff was a miss. When you consider what the Rams gave in order to move up and get him, and the lack of success they tie directly to him as opposed to his coach, and the fact that they had to move on from him in order to take the next step. From a purely Rams perspective, it was a miss. Maybe still hit the backboard, but it wasnt a pick that settled their QB position for 10+years.

 

On Jones, well, the Giants staff is VERY aware they are on camera and everything they say, do, or show is being recorded. I dont believe anyone in that building expects Jones to be with them next year, but they cant say it. Just like there was NO WAY Schoen was re-signing Barkley, but he still had to go through the song and dance and say the right things to the camera.

 

If they thought Jones really was a hit, they wouldnt have been going through that entire exercise in the first place, nor spend all that time scouting and interviewing QBs.

 

Stroud over Mahomes and Josh (again, on camera) is a smart move for a team that needs to stack talent and Stroud is still on a fresh rookie deal.

[BillMafia716ix]

Off-Season Hard Knocks was definitely a success. Every episode was interesting. They’ll definitely be doing another one next season even though the team that gets chosen may not like it 

[GunnerBill]

On 7/30/2024 at 8:52 PM, DrDawkinstein said:

 

On Goff and Jones...

 

I can see the argument that Goff was a miss. When you consider what the Rams gave in order to move up and get him, and the lack of success they tie directly to him as opposed to his coach, and the fact that they had to move on from him in order to take the next step. From a purely Rams perspective, it was a miss. Maybe still hit the backboard, but it wasnt a pick that settled their QB position for 10+years.

 

 

I can't. Goff never got enough credit for his part in the early success the Rams had with McVay. All that "McVay reads the defense for him" stuff was the biggest load of garbage I have ever heard. McVay is a top OC, no question, and that helps a QB but the level of disrespect and ridicule Goff got was crazy and I'm glad he has proved in Detroit that he is a good Quarterback. I think the thing that maybe he doesn't have that leads to him being underrated is he seems to lack the general Quarterback arrogance. And maybe that does hold him back some. He just seems a bit low key. It worked out for the Rams moving on... they won their Superbowl (though had Goff played the Bengals and not Belichick in the first McVay Superbowl my guess is they win that one too). But the Lions did great in that deal too.