I'm really starting to love this WR room. We quietly got better

[BananaB]

50 minutes ago, 90sBills said:

I think Reid is a great coach. He never got a championship before Mahomes. I think Mahomes impact on Reid getting 3 rings is undervalued. 

Andy Reid had Alex Smith, Michael Vick, Kevin Kolb, Donavan McNabb and Jeff Garcia play their best football in his system. That’s 5 QBs he got the very best out of and came up short. Mahomes was the guy that helped him get his rings but I think it’s pretty safe to say Reid has had a big impact on his play. 

[Yawning Frog]

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

yes, and we could delve deeper into how both contracts were structured to almost ensure they remained underpaid relative to their peers but my point was- using lack of SBs w highest paid wideouts to determine their value is very shallow analysis

They were still in the top 20 paid, so that’s a moot point.  And neither won any Super Bowls with any high priced WRs.  

[mrags]

Well, the WR took looks better than the LB room now, so there’s that. 

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

no its meaningless

 

if zero of the top 10 highest paid QBs (by far the most important position) have SB rings, what it tells you is that using lack of SB rings amongst highest-paid players to suggest they're not important to winning super bowls is bad analysis

I guess you missed that part where Brady retired who had 7.  
 

Edited August 15 by Alphadawg7

[90sBills]

1 hour ago, BananaB said:

Andy Reid had Alex Smith, Michael Vick, Kevin Kolb, Donavan McNabb and Jeff Garcia play their best football in his system. That’s 5 QBs he got the very best out of and came up short. Mahomes was the guy that helped him get his rings but I think it’s pretty safe to say Reid has had a big impact on his play. 

Reid unlocked all of Mahomes’ potential. Mahomes opened up all of Reid’s play designs. Just like any legendary coach qb relationships throughout NFL history they compliment each other. 

[first_and_ten]

1 hour ago, BananaB said:

Andy Reid had Alex Smith, Michael Vick, Kevin Kolb, Donavan McNabb and Jeff Garcia play their best football in his system. That’s 5 QBs he got the very best out of and came up short. Mahomes was the guy that helped him get his rings but I think it’s pretty safe to say Reid has had a big impact on his play. 

 

We will look back and regret not giving Josh Allen a great offensive mind as head coach. He's being wasted under this head coach. But, hey, at least we get to the playoffs just to watch McD's defenses get roasted. That's Better than the drought years, right? Or do we want a championship? Not getting one under McD. 

Edited August 15 by first_and_ten

[Meatloaf63]

On 8/11/2024 at 3:28 PM, BADOLBILZ said:

 

I believe the gaming sites are projecting between 3700-3800 yards passing for Allen.   As I've said all offseason my opinion is based on likelihoods.......and the players are likely to produce at levels near where the professional handicappers believe.   My PREDICTION remains that they won't be satisfied with their WR corps as they approach midseason and that Beane will be in the trade market for a WR1 in October.   

Cupboards are bare, it would have to be draft picks at this point.

[Royale with Cheese]

2 hours ago, BananaB said:

Andy Reid had Alex Smith, Michael Vick, Kevin Kolb, Donavan McNabb and Jeff Garcia play their best football in his system. That’s 5 QBs he got the very best out of and came up short. Mahomes was the guy that helped him get his rings but I think it’s pretty safe to say Reid has had a big impact on his play. 

 

Got the very best out of?

 

Vick under Reid was 20-20 record, 56 TD's to 33 INT's.  Benched due to his performance.

 

Kevin Kolb had a 3-4 record, 11 TD's to 10 INT's.  He was just never good.

 

Jeff Garcia only played 8 games with Reid.  He was a 3 time Pro Bowler in SF.

 

Alex Smith you might have a point, he was good in SF and he did go an entire season under Reid without a TD pass to a WR.  That is unheard of.

 

McNabb played only 2 out of his 14 seasons without Reid.  The last 2 and he was at the end of his career.

[BananaB]

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Got the very best out of?

 

Vick under Reid was 20-20 record, 56 TD's to 33 INT's.  Benched due to his performance.

 

Kevin Kolb had a 3-4 record, 11 TD's to 10 INT's.  He was just never good.

 

Jeff Garcia only played 8 games with Reid.  He was a 3 time Pro Bowler in SF.

 

Alex Smith you might have a point, he was good in SF and he did go an entire season under Reid without a TD pass to a WR.  That is unheard of.

 

McNabb played only 2 out of his 14 seasons without Reid.  The last 2 and he was at the end of his career.

You’re only looking at record and overlooking performance. Vick had his best statistical season with Reid and lost his job when Chip Kelly took over.  Got paid because of that season with Reid

Garcia had them winning most of those games after he was basically a backup. Remember him scoring a lot as well and not many turnovers. His career was pretty much over taking backup jobs but was playing great under Andy. Browns paid him that off-season and he went back to being a backup. Yeah he might not of got the absolute best out of him, but he had him playing at a high level

Edited August 15 by BananaB

[Gunsgoodtime]

21 minutes ago, first_and_ten said:

 

We will look back and regret not giving Josh Allen a great offensive mind as head coach. He's being wasted under this head coach. But, hey, at least we get to the playoffs just to watch McD's defenses get roasted. That's Better than the drought years, right? Or do we want a championship? Not getting one under McD. 

Agree 100%

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, BananaB said:

You’re only looking at record and not performance. 

 

Michael Vick was benched because of his performance lol.

What did Kolb show in 7 games?

What did Garcia do in 8 games? He wasn't offered a contract a year later.

 

I think you just thought of any former QB under Reid and just assumed they played their best football.

Is Kevin Kolb's 11/10 TD to INT ratio and 2,200 yards in 13 games is impressive? (Error on my first post on Kolb...he played 13 games.)

[GoBills808]

2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

They were still in the top 20 paid, so that’s a moot point.  And neither won any Super Bowls with any high priced WRs.  

No DE in the top10 of salaries has a Super Bowl, so don't pay DEs

 

No corner in the top10 of salaries has a Super Bowl so don't pay DBs

 

No QB in the top 10 salaries has a Super Bowl so don't pay quarterbacks

 

Can you not see how bad this argument you're making is

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, BananaB said:

You’re only looking at record and overlooking performance. Vick had his best statistical season with Reid and lost his job when Chip Kelly took over.  Got paid because of that season with Reid

Garcia had them winning most of those games after he was basically a backup. Remember him scoring a lot as well and not many turnovers. His career was pretty much over taking backup jobs but was playing great under Andy. Browns paid him that off-season and he went back to being a backup. Yeah he might not of got the absolute best out of him, but he had him playing at a high level

 

He threw for 1,300 yards and 10 TD's in 8 games with the Eagles.

 

He made the Pro Bowl the very next year after leaving Philly in Tampa Bay....and they made the playoffs.  

 

He threw for over 30 TD's twice in SF prior to that.

Dude....he wasn't playing the best ball of his career under Andy Reid lol.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

No DE in the top10 of salaries has a Super Bowl, so don't pay DEs

 

No corner in the top10 of salaries has a Super Bowl so don't pay DBs

 

No QB in the top 10 salaries has a Super Bowl so don't pay quarterbacks

 

Can you not see how bad this argument you're making is

 

First, I never said anything about salaries.  I said 1400 yard receivers which has nothing to do with salaries.  Another poster mentioned salaries and I simply corrected your notion about QB's because you only looked at QB's still playing today which eliminates the majority of the SB winners the past 20 years.  

 

And just like QB's your anlaysis is wrong...again.  You can't look at a list of the top 10 paid TODAY to see how many won the SB the past 20 years as most were not playing yet.  The fact I have to tell you that is troubling.  

 

The top 10 paid at each position are usually the younger top end players as they reset the market when they get their contracts, meaning they haven't been playing very long.  

 

So before you start calling someones argument "bad"...maybe make sure yours even makes sense first

 

Edited August 15 by Alphadawg7

[BADOLBILZ]

8 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

They weren’t the top 2 receivers, that assessment is wrong.  So your whole premise here is based on their performance when they were NOT the top 2 guys.  
 

So it’s a completely irrelevant statement.  
 

And wrong.  The objective is to reach and win a Super Bowl.  Something those other teams didn’t do.  When was the last time a team won a SB and had a 1400 receiver that season?  And how many SB winning teams had a 1400 yard receiver that year the past 20 years?  Hint…it’s not the number you seem to think it is not is it a prerequisite like many of you think around here.  

 

My premise is based on what I originally responded to.........the false narrative that they were top 2 receivers by the end of last season.  Try to keep up.   

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

My premise is based on what I originally responded to.........the false narrative that they were top 2 receivers by the end of last season.  Try to keep up.   

 

Except, that isn't the narrative...where are you coming up with that?  You know being the teams top primary receiver is not the same thing as stating someone led the team in receiving during that stretch right?  So for example, someone stating Shakir was our leading WR those 10 games does not mean they are saying he was our TOP receiver those 10 games, everyone and their mom knows that was Diggs.  

 

 

 

 

Edited August 16 by Alphadawg7

[Thrivefourfive]

Unfortunately, I think. I should stop there.

 

I think the down talk of games 1-8 is how incredibly inconsistent this WR room will be. The OLine will be fine with JA17. They’ll run block like monsters, so RBs will be rolling. Defense will be full of excuses. That’s McDermott’s realm, and he gets to create that narrative.. our standards will be so low that we’ll be happy with regular middle of the pack play, and probably no big plays from anyone not named Bernard and Douglas, for however long they’re healthy. 
 

Bass could be a sorer spot than WR, but he’ll get axed if he’s actually costing the Bills games. 
 

There is just no way that this thing gets off the ground smoothly. Brady would have to be as creative as Reid to keep the pressure off young, career underwhelming middling WRs. Samuel will make a play and disappear. Shakir should get stuffed by opponents if he shows any WR1 potential during the season. The Rookie won’t get off until he learns how to play against NFL DBs and schemes. He doesn’t have the talent to win on talent, so he’ll have to learn to play, and that will take more than 8 games. 

[BADOLBILZ]

40 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Except, that isn't the narrative...where are you coming up with that?  You know being the teams top primary receiver is not the same thing as stating someone led the team in receiving during that stretch right?  So for example, someone stating Shakir was our leading WR those 10 games does not mean they are saying he was our TOP receiver those 10 games, everyone and their mom knows that was Diggs.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Tell that to @hondo in seattle and @NeverOutNick.........who @Dr. Who was responding to and who I agreed with.

 

Hondo said "The best receivers at the end of the season were Kincaid and Shakir and they're both still on the team."   Nick gave that an "Amen!"

 

Again.........too much is made of Shakir and Kincaid's play down the stretch..........Diggs and Davis production underwhelmed..........but Shakir and Kincaid didn't tear it up either.   Even in that limited stretch their production didn't resemble what you'd want from a top option.    And that was against lesser defender's than they figure to have to face this season.

 

Comprende?   Or do you still want to argue out of context for the sake of arguing with me?   Because I'm done explaining the obvious.   50 and 40 yards per game ain't going to get it done for the top weapons.

[hondo in seattle]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Tell that to @hondo in seattle and @NeverOutNick.........who @Dr. Who was responding to and who I agreed with.

 

Hondo said "The best receivers at the end of the season were Kincaid and Shakir and they're both still on the team."   Nick gave that an "Amen!"

 

Again.........too much is made of Shakir and Kincaid's play down the stretch..........Diggs and Davis production underwhelmed..........but Shakir and Kincaid didn't tear it up either.   Even in that limited stretch their production didn't resemble what you'd want from a top option.    And that was against lesser defender's than they figure to have to face this season.

 

Comprende?   Or do you still want to argue out of context for the sake of arguing with me?   Because I'm done explaining the obvious.   50 and 40 yards per game ain't going to get it done for the top weapons.

 

Last season, Shakir and Kincaid were not the "top weapons" - not schematically.  The passing game tended to revolve around Diggs.  

 

I expect their targets and production will go up this year.    And if that doesn't happen, we're in trouble.