I'm really starting to love this WR room. We quietly got better

[Einstein's Dog]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I agree with this. There isna section of this board has been guily of over valuing our talent and under valuing the job our coaching staff has done. And since 13 seconds - which was a coaching failure - a group has totally attached themselves to that narrative and it is hard for them to come off it. 

I would add that there is a section of this board that brings past favorable bias into the evaluation of Beane's moves this year.   While you had warned of us of Beane's past in Carolina, I think most here (including myself) had been very pleased with Beane's prior moves. 

 

Few seem to be modifying their views on Beane's job.  This OP is a great example, the ".....love this WR room.  We quietly got better" make it seem like Beane made great strides and McDermott would be responsible for a setback.

 

The cries that McDermott should be fired if there is no AFCCG while not holding Beane accountable don't make sense to me.

 

[Alphadawg7]

4 hours ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I would add that there is a section of this board that brings past favorable bias into the evaluation of Beane's moves this year.   While you had warned of us of Beane's past in Carolina, I think most here (including myself) had been very pleased with Beane's prior moves. 

 

Few seem to be modifying their views on Beane's job.  This OP is a great example, the ".....love this WR room.  We quietly got better" make it seem like Beane made great strides and McDermott would be responsible for a setback.

 

The cries that McDermott should be fired if there is no AFCCG while not holding Beane accountable don't make sense to me.

 

Beanes past in Carolina?  He’s a first time GM in Buffalo, so what past are you talking about as he has no “past” as a GM.

 

Edited August 5 by Alphadawg7

[Alphadawg7]

12 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

MVS is the only true field stretcher on the roster though, and his salary is fully guaranteed. For those 2-3 practices where he wasn't with the 1s at all I wondered if he would be the first guaranteed signing since OJ Howard to manage to lose his roster spot, but now that he's firmly back in with the starters I am back to thinking he is a roster lock. He has a set role in the offense as a field stretcher, and while he may represent the bare minimum that you can get out of that role it is a necessary role and no one else on the roster is even ostensibly competing against him for it.

 

Hamler I think is a PS lock. He'll be our emergency call up if Samuel ever gets injured. Sounds like Hardy is winning the kick return job and has shown enough on defense to warrant a spot on the roster, so that leaves Hamler as a redundant player.

He was back to dropping balls today, easy ones.  IMHO the only locks right now are Keon, Shakir, Samuel, and Hollins.  MVS for me still has to earn a spot, including having to contend with Claypool who is kind of the forgotten man with his being out with a toe injury.  That being said, being out certainly isn’t helping Claypool, but when you keep dropping passes like MVS was today, it keeps the door open for other players.  
 

MVS absolutely still in the mix with a real shot at the roster, but he has probably had the most inconsistent camp of all the WR’s seriously competing to make the 53.  So I personally don’t see him as a “lock”.  
 

 

[hondo in seattle]

5 hours ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I would add that there is a section of this board that brings past favorable bias into the evaluation of Beane's moves this year.   While you had warned of us of Beane's past in Carolina, I think most here (including myself) had been very pleased with Beane's prior moves. 

 

Few seem to be modifying their views on Beane's job.  This OP is a great example, the ".....love this WR room.  We quietly got better" make it seem like Beane made great strides and McDermott would be responsible for a setback.

 

The cries that McDermott should be fired if there is no AFCCG while not holding Beane accountable don't make sense to me.

 

 

Agreed.  

 

Beane has built a good roster.  He has yet to build a Super Bowl caliber roster.   There hasn't been a season under Beane yet when I felt like we had the best roster in the AFC.

 

The Von Miller contract, on the whole, was a mistake.  Imagine the players we could have signed with Von's money.  And this year we're paying a WR $31 million to play for someone else.  Beane's been hit-or-miss in the draft; hit or miss in free agency; hit-or-miss with cap management.  Under his reign, the Bills have been a team with a lot of depth but few bonafide stars.  

 

For years, I was puzzled why Beane drafted a franchise QB but didn't bother to put together a front-five bodyguard to protect his health and optimize his talent.  It seems like that would be an obvious priority.  

 

I'm also puzzled that so many want to fire McD and so few want to send Beane packing.  I don't want to fire either, actually, but I fault Beane (and bad injury luck) for the empty trophy case more than I blame McD.  

 

 

[GoBills808]

6 hours ago, Einstein's Dog said:

The cries that McDermott should be fired if there is no AFCCG while not holding Beane accountable don't make sense to me.

 

allow me

 

there are two answers, the very simple one first-

 

Beane, for all his missteps, managed to pluck Allen from out of the morass of Darnolds and Rosens. He's responsible for the single most important Bills draft pick ever and that's always going to trump whatever roster deficiencies may exist in a given year. McDermott has no such singular victory. In fact quite the opposite- he's directly accountable for one of the worst collapses in league history.

 

the more complex answer is that NFL roster construction is as we know a bicameral process executed by the GM and informed by the tendencies and preferences of the staff. there is very little doubt in my mind that Beane's drafts and pro personnel moves would differ significantly under a different HC. that, along w the obvious fact that despite incredibly disingenuous protestations to the contrary we very much did have Super Bowl caliber rosters in both 2021 and 2022, is why McDermott is correctly under more scrutiny than Beane

[QCity]

1 hour ago, hondo in seattle said:

Beane has built a good roster.  He has yet to build a Super Bowl caliber roster. 

 

I would say 2021 and 2022 were.

 

1 hour ago, hondo in seattle said:

For years, I was puzzled why Beane drafted a franchise QB but didn't bother to put together a front-five bodyguard to protect his health and optimize his talent.  It seems like that would be an obvious priority. 

 

 

Not a single fan should be puzzled by this. The coach and GM work together and defensive coaches favor defensive players. Do you think McD and Frazier were banging the table for Creed Humphrey and Beane decided to pass on that and give them a "swiss-army knife" player in Basham?

 

[GunnerBill]

33 minutes ago, QCity said:

 

I would say 2021 and 2022 were.

 

 

Not a single fan should be puzzled by this. The coach and GM work together and defensive coaches favor defensive players. Do you think McD and Frazier were banging the table for Creed Humphrey and Beane decided to pass on that and give them a "swiss-army knife" player in Basham?

 

 

I think when Brandon Beane says he will "never apologise" for prioritising the defensive front seven that is because he means it. It is how he was taught in Carolina. It is how he has drafted. It is how he would draft regardless of who the coach was if he, as he is here, is in charge of personnel decisions. 

[Simon]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think when Brandon Beane says he will "never apologise" for prioritising the defensive front seven that is because he means it. It is how he was taught in Carolina. It is how he has drafted. It is how he would draft regardless of who the coach was if he, as he is here, is in charge of personnel decisions. 

 

And it is, with no reservations, my absolute favorite thing about him as the GM of my favorite football team.

[BillsFanForever19]

9 hours ago, Einstein's Dog said:

While you had warned of us of Beane's past in Carolina, I think most here (including myself) had been very pleased with Beane's prior moves. 

 

His prior moves in Carolina? As Assistant GM?

 

Knocking Beane for Carolina's Picks while he was Assistant is like praising Joe Schoen for selecting Josh Allen...

Edited August 5 by BillsFanForever19

[FireChans]

4 hours ago, hondo in seattle said:

For years, I was puzzled why Beane drafted a franchise QB but didn't bother to put together a front-five bodyguard to protect his health and optimize his talent.  It seems like that would be an obvious priority

In fairness, he tried.
 

The 19 OL was better than 18, but it would be hard to be worse. 
 

the 20 OL was our best OL in a while, and probably the best of Josh’s career here except for 23.

 

It is not as simple as “overpay 5 good OL players.” It’s unaffordable. Beane’s philosophy for OL was being in like 8 guys on decent money, cut/trade who doesn’t stick. It was a money waster but they cobbled something together and they had dudes like Daryl Williams playing like borderline All-Pros or Spain who was a fine RG for cheap. It just didn’t last. 
 

but yes, I fear that Beane has skated because he drafted Josh. And that’s fine if that’s your argument. But the rest of the team is massively overrated.

[Blackbeard]

10 hours ago, Einstein's Dog said:

The cries that McDermott should be fired if there is no AFCCG while not holding Beane accountable don't make sense to me.

Agreed. 
 

Everyone just is so quick to place it all on the head coach, but in reality it’s really quite simple, and there’s a much bigger picture:  how good are your players? 

Edited August 5 by Blackbeard

[Doc]

7 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

He was back to dropping balls today, easy ones.  IMHO the only locks right now are Keon, Shakir, Samuel, and Hollins.  MVS for me still has to earn a spot, including having to contend with Claypool who is kind of the forgotten man with his being out with a toe injury.  That being said, being out certainly isn’t helping Claypool, but when you keep dropping passes like MVS was today, it keeps the door open for other players.  
 

MVS absolutely still in the mix with a real shot at the roster, but he has probably had the most inconsistent camp of all the WR’s seriously competing to make the 53.  So I personally don’t see him as a “lock”. 

 

He can be put on the PS easily.  No camp with a new team and dropping balls doesn't make for an attractive roster player for other teams.

 

4 hours ago, QCity said:

I would say 2021 and 2022 were.

 

You could argue last year as well.  Forgetting losing Milano a quarter of the way into the season, losing Benford and Bernard for just the Chefs game was killer.

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

 

He can be put on the PS easily.  No camp with a new team and dropping balls doesn't make for an attractive roster player for other teams.

 

 

You could argue last year as well.  Forgetting losing Milano a quarter of the way into the season, losing Benford and Bernard for just the Chefs game was killer.

 

Not to mention the back ups, Spector was out and Dodson had a shoulder injury.  

[Einstein's Dog]

3 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

His prior moves in Carolina? As Assistant GM?

 

Knocking Beane for Carolina's Picks while he was Assistant is like praising Joe Schoen for selecting Josh Allen...

GunnerBill had speculated from Beane's background with Carolina that Beane would not be prioritizing WRs.  GB said this at least a year ago, and for me it had never been a real consideration.  But this year Beane has had, IMO, a real WR problem (contrary to what the OP is trying to sell us).

 

No one is knocking Beane for his Carolina picks, but GB used that background as a basis to predict that Beane would not be prioritizing the WR room.  I don't buy his reasoning, but his prediction has certainly come through.

[f0neguy]

I did see somewhere recently that the Chiefs might be looking for WR help and they’d consider MVS if he doesn’t make the 53 here.  So if we try to put him on the PS he might be gone.

[Avisan]

So... when our offense is excellent, per usual, this year, are y'all still dooming going to acknowledge you were wrong?  Asking for a friend.

[Augie]

6 minutes ago, Avisan said:

So... when our offense is excellent, per usual, this year, are y'all still dooming going to acknowledge you were wrong?  Asking for a friend.

 

If we don’t win the Super Bowl…… everybody should be fired. That seems to be the sentiment from some. 

[Doc]

37 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Not to mention the back ups, Spector was out and Dodson had a shoulder injury.  

 

Davis was also out.

[Royale with Cheese]

12 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Davis was also out.

 

Diggs was mentally out.  Just imagine what would have happened if that non-fumble was overturned.

[BarleyNY]

3 hours ago, FireChans said:

In fairness, he tried.
 

The 19 OL was better than 18, but it would be hard to be worse. 
 

the 20 OL was our best OL in a while, and probably the best of Josh’s career here except for 23.

 

It is not as simple as “overpay 5 good OL players.” It’s unaffordable. Beane’s philosophy for OL was being in like 8 guys on decent money, cut/trade who doesn’t stick. It was a money waster but they cobbled something together and they had dudes like Daryl Williams playing like borderline All-Pros or Spain who was a fine RG for cheap. It just didn’t last. 
 

but yes, I fear that Beane has skated because he drafted Josh. And that’s fine if that’s your argument. But the rest of the team is massively overrated.

 

One aspect that has been overlooked when discussing the OL is that the offense has been geared toward getting the ball out of Allen’s hand quickly (in general). That has helped the OL’s pass blocking greatly. With this group of WRs and TEs I have to think that continues.