I'm really starting to love this WR room. We quietly got better

[3rdand12]

18 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't think they ever loved Gabe like they love Shakir. Beane was waxing lyrical again on the Ross Tucker podcast this week. Of course there is a chance Shakir just has insane demands but my very strong belief is that they will extend him. They talk about him like he is their own son.

 

For those asking "well why wouldn't you?" My answer would be that it is really hard the play offense inside out now in the NFL. I know Brady managed it for years but even he at the end went to Tampa where they had two studs that can play and win outside. Cooper Kupp was a #1 mainly from the slot. St Brown is too. But they are few and far between and I think there are already reasons based on what we saw at the start of this year to suggest Shakir isn't that. What he IS is a really fine slot receiver who if you spread defenses out, make them defend the entire field and give him some room to operate can really be a weapon inside. The question is that something you pay or not? I have my doubts but strongly believe when the Bills add Shakir's character and attitude into thay mix their answer will be yes.

 

My guess is the Bills do a 3 year extension. That has tended to be their go to for guys like Milano and Taron who were clearly valuable players but in less valuable positions. Spotrac has him between $18.3m AAV and $20.4m AAV. I have him top end of that range in return for taking a shorter deal. Something like 3 years $62m, $40m guaranteed but because the Bills still have him under contract next year and will pay the signing bonus in that year it is basically a 4 year $63m deal. They can put a few mill onto the 2025 cap and keep a bit of flexibility down the road. 

 

Might depend on what they want to do with Cooper as well I suppose. 

For starters, it aint my money. General statement towards no one i particular

But to respond more productively... Shakir's work as a Bill is worth the reward he earned. Consistently improving. Perhaps its Brady.

 But the kid has shown up big time, inside outside and regardless of route. He blocks so well , as well
I don't care what they pay him. Beane will figure it out with Shakir et al

Keep him.

Earned it

 

[ganesh]

On 11/1/2024 at 2:13 AM, Einstein's Dog said:

They tried to replace Beasley cheaply.  The thought was to promote McKenzie (he had that great game against New England) and they got Crowder.  I would prefer not to see this type of philosophy used again.  Keep this good thing rolling.

 

I hadn't thought much of the Shakir's affect on Kincaid.  Just ride the hot hand.  The Kincaid decision is a long way away.  I'm inclined to think the FO will be extending him.  Having two good players Shakir/Kincaid would be a good thing.

 

While it will come down to the money, the advantage the Bills have is being able to give a market value guaranteed extension before his current contract expires, much like they did with Knox.  If both sides are reasonable and fair this can work out, and I think it will.

They would need to get out of the Samuel's contract in order for them. to pay for Shakir.

[EmotionallyUnstable]

I thought a cool statistic through 8 weeks is that the Bills (Allen) lead the NFL in big time throws. Obviously this is mostly a passer statistic, I think it reflects the changing landscape of the passing offense. Allen has always done well in this metric, it is impressive that he’s maintained this ability while limiting turnovers. I think it speaks to the shifting focus on efficiency we’ve seen. Other items to note: 

 

Through week 8 2023 vs. 2024 Passing stats: 

 

Passing Yards:

23’ - 2108

24’ - 1766

 

Passing Touchdowns: 

23’- 17

24’ - 14

 

Interceptions: 

23’ - 8

24’ - 1

All in all, I don’t think you can say the WR room is better and to credit with this…but I think you can claim they managed to find a way to make it work. 

Edited November 2 by EmotionallyUnstable

[Drew21PA]

3 hours ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

I thought a cool statistic through 8 weeks is that the Bills (Allen) lead the NFL in big time throws. Obviously this is mostly a passer statistic, I think it reflects the changing landscape of the passing offense. Allen has always done well in this metric, it is impressive that he’s maintained this ability while limiting turnovers. I think it speaks to the shifting focus on efficiency we’ve seen. Other items to note: 

 

Through week 8 2023 vs. 2024 Passing stats: 

 

Passing Yards:

23’ - 2108

24’ - 1766

 

Passing Touchdowns: 

23’- 17

24’ - 14

 

Interceptions: 

23’ - 8

24’ - 1

All in all, I don’t think you can say the WR room is better and to credit with this…but I think you can claim they managed to find a way to make it work. 

I think Gabe Davis was a bigger problem than we realized - just seemed half or more of those picks last year were because of Gabe 

[BADOLBILZ]

11 hours ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

I thought a cool statistic through 8 weeks is that the Bills (Allen) lead the NFL in big time throws. Obviously this is mostly a passer statistic, I think it reflects the changing landscape of the passing offense. Allen has always done well in this metric, it is impressive that he’s maintained this ability while limiting turnovers. I think it speaks to the shifting focus on efficiency we’ve seen. Other items to note: 

 

Through week 8 2023 vs. 2024 Passing stats: 

 

Passing Yards:

23’ - 2108

24’ - 1766

 

Passing Touchdowns: 

23’- 17

24’ - 14

 

Interceptions: 

23’ - 8

24’ - 1

All in all, I don’t think you can say the WR room is better and to credit with this…but I think you can claim they managed to find a way to make it work. 

 

 

1)  The better your WR talent the less BTT's you probably need to attempt/make.   That's likely why Allen didn't rank as highly in that stat in the 2020 season as he has since.   In 2020 he had perhaps the top WR corps in the NFL and had clearly his best passing season.   Not just statistically but mechanically and how the ball was coming out of his hand etc..

 

2) It's hard for me to read too much into the bulk stats because of this very odd schedule.   The eyeball test is that they've only played 2 good teams and their lack of boundary WR talent got exposed by them and they had 2 really awful offensive games.   But the Bills have since addressed the boundary with a veteran WR1 and Coleman looks to be rounding into form.   Obviously the Chiefs/Niners/Rams/Lions stretch will be when we get to see how much of a difference those improvements made.  

[Bills!Win!]

Haters. Where are you??? It’s been quiet 

[Jauronimo]

25 minutes ago, Bills!Win! said:

Haters. Where are you??? It’s been quiet 

You trying to take a victory lap after a week where a RB was our leading receiver?  Running back and two tight ends were 3 of our top 4 receivers.  Seems ill advised but strut your stuff.

[Kirby Jackson]

49 minutes ago, Bills!Win! said:

Haters. Where are you??? It’s been quiet 

They were fine and have been pretty good. They still had 9/111/1 of the 362 passing yards. Shakir was the only WR with more than 1 catch. This conversation was about the wide receivers and not the pass catchers. The receivers have been fine but they are still just okay.  

[Logic]

2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

They were fine and have been pretty good. They still had 9/111/1 of the 362 passing yards. Shakir was the only WR with more than 1 catch. This conversation was about the wide receivers and not the pass catchers. The receivers have been fine but they are still just okay.  

Indeed.

The Bills' historic offensive production this season makes me think of Beane's offseason quote: "let's not forget we can throw to tight ends and running backs, too. Last I checked, it's not just receivers that can catch passes".

I laughed at the quote as being silly at the time, but now the joke's on me. All three running backs and both tight ends contribute to the passing game in a big way. 

But as far as pure wide receiver production and viability, Kirby is right: just average.

Shakir is a great security blanket for Josh. Cooper is more or less a low end WR1 at this point in his career. Coleman has shown promise and may eventually turn into a viable WR1. 

All in all, the pass catching corps as a whole (taking into account all positions) has been good, but the wide receivers are essentially who we thought they were.

[Mikey152]

10 minutes ago, Logic said:

Indeed.

The Bills' historic offensive production this season makes me think of Beane's offseason quote: "let's not forget we can throw to tight ends and running backs, too. Last I checked, it's not just receivers that can catch passes".

I laughed at the quote as being silly at the time, but now the joke's on me. All three running backs and both tight ends contribute to the passing game in a big way. 

But as far as pure wide receiver production and viability, Kirby is right: just average.

Shakir is a great security blanket for Josh. Cooper is more or less a low end WR1 at this point in his career. Coleman has shown promise and may eventually turn into a viable WR1. 

All in all, the pass catching corps as a whole (taking into account all positions) has been good, but the wide receivers are essentially who we thought they were.

 

 

If we're still using stats to describe the WR group, we still haven't learned anything.

 

 

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, Bills!Win! said:

Haters. Where are you??? It’s been quiet 

Haha this topic was made before Beane desperately had to make a WR trade in October.  
 

The “haters” already won. It’s quiet because more victory laps just feel gratuitous.

Edited December 16 by FireChans

[Buffalo_Stampede]

I don’t think the WR group is playing better than expected to be honest.  No one has gone above what was expected. 
 

Everybody eats is working like they talked about though. We don’t have a go to guy on 3rd down or when we need a play. The ball can go anywhere. It’s working.

[stevewin]

1 hour ago, Bills!Win! said:

Haters. Where are you??? It’s been quiet 

Was waiting for this to be bumped 😛

[Sharky7337]

15 minutes ago, stevewin said:

Was waiting for this to be bumped 😛

 

1 hour ago, Bills!Win! said:

Haters. Where are you??? It’s been quiet 

Dude this was already decided when the gm had to trade a third round pick. 

 

You lost bro it was a bad take move on.

[Bills!Win!]

Last comment was November 2nd. Other than this week (because we utilized Rbs and Te) they have been playing lights out 

[JerseyBills]

MOST COMPLETE OFFENSE IN THE GAME!!

 

OL - PHENOMENAL; Beane is a wizard 

QB - MVP

RB - LETHAL - 3 Beasts

WR - DYNAMIC- Coleman is official,  Shakir is the real deal, Hollins is an enigma, Cooper is dominant 

TE - BEST DUO IN THE GAME 

[Kirby Jackson]

18 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I don’t think the WR group is playing better than expected to be honest.  No one has gone above what was expected. 
 

Everybody eats is working like they talked about though. We don’t have a go to guy on 3rd down or when we need a play. The ball can go anywhere. It’s working.

Perfectly said!!

 

Ironically, if there is a play on 3rd down and we need to force it to a WR, it’s the guy that they traded for. He didn’t have a target this week but did have 14 the week before. He’s probably the guy that they are most comfortable “winning” his matchup. 

These guys have all played fine. Hollins has blocked well and made some tough/clutch catches. Shakir has developed into a rich man’s Beasley with his ability to run after the catch. Coleman has flashed. His strengths coming out have been his strengths and his weaknesses coming out have been his weaknesses. The Cooper addition was big and it will play dividends. He’s a consummate pro. He can get open and make plays down the field. He can explode in any given game. Samuel was always going to be a gadget guy. That’s fine if they knew how to use him. Throw the ball down the field to him. Use misdirection. Get him in space. Don’t just throw WR screens to him. 
 

As a whole @Buffalo_Stampede hit the nail on the head. It is working. I’ve enjoyed this last season of Joe Brady as OC. The offense has been excellent.

 

 

Edited December 17 by Kirby Jackson

[H2o]

The group has worked. The main reason it has worked is because Josh Allen has turned into everything we could have possibly hoped for and more. I said the Diggs move was most likely going to be addition by subtraction. His attitude and constant screaming for the ball being out of the locker room has allowed Josh to just go back to having fun playing football. He reads the defense and throws the ball to the open man. To see him have this type of success with guys considered "lesser" by most pundits just proves how great of a player he really is. Now go get that Lombardi. 

[MJS]

20 hours ago, Logic said:

All in all, the pass catching corps as a whole (taking into account all positions) has been good, but the wide receivers are essentially who we thought they were.

Many were claiming it was the worst group in the league. A few even claimed, hilariously, that it was historically bad. I think average is a lot better than what many Bills fans expected, and certainly a lot better than expected nationally.

 

Many didn't like the Coleman pick. Many scoffed at Mack Hollins and questioned his roster position all offseason and into the season.

 

So, I think it is not accurate to say "the wide receivers are essentially who we thought they were".

[Avisan]

41 minutes ago, MJS said:

Many were claiming it was the worst group in the league. A few even claimed, hilariously, that it was historically bad. I think average is a lot better than what many Bills fans expected, and certainly a lot better than expected nationally.

 

Many didn't like the Coleman pick. Many scoffed at Mack Hollins and questioned his roster position all offseason and into the season.

 

So, I think it is not accurate to say "the wide receivers are essentially who we thought they were".

Yeah, loving the revisionism going on in this thread.

 

Lots of folks acting like they didn't insist we were supposed to be a bottom-half passing attack on a playoffs-missing team that wouldn't be able to move the ball at all.

 

We traded for, Cooper, sure.  He replaced MVS and has been on the field for what, 1/3 of our games this season?  And an active factor in what, two games?  We could have never made the trade and we would still be a top offense on a team waltzing into the 2-seed.