leh-nerd skin-erd Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 17 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Were left leaning people complaining about? I would say there are many. Michael Brown comes to mind. Jakob Blake another. Besides that, maybe this can give perspective: https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4878934/user-clip-vice-president-joe-biden-police-shoot-leg-heart You have to wonder how hard JB went after the officer that shot AB? It’s got all the elements of a BLS (Biden leg shot). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted June 18 Author Share Posted June 18 8 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: I would say there are many. Michael Brown comes to mind. Jakob Blake another. Besides that, maybe this can give perspective: https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4878934/user-clip-vice-president-joe-biden-police-shoot-leg-heart You have to wonder how hard JB went after the officer that shot AB? It’s got all the elements of a BLS (Biden leg shot). With all the UN-warrented shooting, shouldn't be a surprise, though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 6 minutes ago, Tiberius said: With all the UN-warrented shooting, shouldn't be a surprise, though You feel the Michael Brown shooting was unwarranted? What about the Ashley Babbitt shooting, warranted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted June 18 Author Share Posted June 18 27 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: You feel the Michael Brown shooting was unwarranted? What about the Ashley Babbitt shooting, warranted? Michael Brown, he was approaching police officer acting nuts, I think one shot would of been enough, cop just lit him up. Ashley Babbitt, that was totally ok, one shot, put her down. She had no business invading the Capital and should have left. I don't think they shot enough of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 3 hours ago, stevestojan said: You referring to Ashli Babbitt? She has one person to thank for being 6 feet under and that’s herself. She fell victim to trumps rhetoric - probably believed him when he said he was going to go march to the capitol with them; that obese orange stain wasn’t marching anywhere. She attempted to go through a broken window into a secure area of the capitol building with a gun pointed at her. Darwin won. “Babbitt, who died while wearing a Trump campaign flag wrapped around her shoulders like a cape…” I mean if the bullet didn’t stop her, death by humiliation would have gotten her soon enough. But my favorite part about that traitor is she tweeted - while on the plane flying to DC - that “nothing will stop us!” I think something stopped her. I must disagree with you on this point. She has at least two people to blame, herself and Donald J Trump. If not for Trump's lies and urging people to come to the Capital, she would not have died on that day. To a lesser extent, we could include Fox News, OAN, Newsmax and others in the right wing echo chamber for giving legitimacy to Trump's lies instead of doing honest reporting. 2 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlBUNDY4TDS Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 21 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Michael Brown, he was approaching police officer acting nuts, I think one shot would of been enough, cop just lit him up. Ashley Babbitt, that was totally ok, one shot, put her down. She had no business invading the Capital and should have left. I don't think they shot enough of them. Oh the hypocrisy! This is gold Jerry! Gold! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 22 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Michael Brown, he was approaching police officer acting nuts, I think one shot would of been enough, cop just lit him up. Hmm. So you see this one as unjustified? You never said. 22 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Ashley Babbitt, that was totally ok, one shot, put her down. She had no business invading the Capital and should have left. I don't think they shot enough of them. AB, you see as justified because she was in the Capitol, and should have left. Not because the officer considered his life to be in jeopardy, not because he thought she had a weapon, not because his gun misfired....just because she existed in that place and time. Under the guidance of--stay with me now--the President of The United States, this shooting was unjustified. She was unarmed, the officer not in any imminent danger from her, and he abandoned the "shoot the leg" plan that JB touts as the answer. On the others that you say should have been shot--after surveillance often shows law enforcement directing and herding people around the Capitol as if in a glorified meet and greet--would you have them herded into a particular room where all the unarmed civilians could be shot en masse? Or, pick the unarmed civilians off in small groups, like at Kent State? And would they be kill shots, or leg shots? Btw--I agree with you that she should not have been in the Capitol, should not have wandered about, should not have climbed through that barrier. We have laws that address that, and none of them involve summary execution of people simply because they had no business being in one place or the other. Of course, that brings us full circle to the most reasoned and reasonable approach--law enforcement identifying people that broke the law, bring them to account under the rules of justice, and if as judged appropriate by the appropriate legal authority, pardoned, sentence commuted, or left to serve out their sentence. Easy breezy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted June 18 Author Share Posted June 18 1 minute ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Hmm. So you see this one as unjustified? You never said. AB, you see as justified because she was in the Capitol, and should have left. Not because the officer considered his life to be in jeopardy, not because he thought she had a weapon, not because his gun misfired....just because she existed in that place and time. Under the guidance of--stay with me now--the President of The United States, this shooting was unjustified. She was unarmed, the officer not in any imminent danger from her, and he abandoned the "shoot the leg" plan that JB touts as the answer. On the others that you say should have been shot--after surveillance often shows law enforcement directing and herding people around the Capitol as if in a glorified meet and greet--would you have them herded into a particular room where all the unarmed civilians could be shot en masse? Or, pick the unarmed civilians off in small groups, like at Kent State? And would they be kill shots, or leg shots? Btw--I agree with you that she should not have been in the Capitol, should not have wandered about, should not have climbed through that barrier. We have laws that address that, and none of them involve summary execution of people simply because they had no business being in one place or the other. Of course, that brings us full circle to the most reasoned and reasonable approach--law enforcement identifying people that broke the law, bring them to account under the rules of justice, and if as judged appropriate by the appropriate legal authority, pardoned, sentence commuted, or left to serve out their sentence. Easy breezy. He had every right to shoot her. Sure stopped the invasion in the senate. Just like you can shoot someone who breaks in your home. I'm not waiting to see if they try and kill me, bang! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 9 minutes ago, Tiberius said: He had every right to shoot her. Sure stopped the invasion in the senate. Just like you can shoot someone who breaks in your home. I'm not waiting to see if they try and kill me, bang! No one is breaking in your house to kill you and steal your Beanie Baby collection, Tibsy. Mark yourself safe and stay strong! 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 I guess George Floyd has 1 person to blame: himself for passing-off counterfeit bills and taking enough fentanyl to kill an elephant. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted June 18 Author Share Posted June 18 3 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: No one is breaking in your house to kill you and steal your Beanie Baby collection, Tibsy. Mark yourself safe and stay strong! So marked!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 4 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: No one is breaking in your house to kill you and steal your Beanie Baby collection, Tibsy. Mark yourself safe and stay strong! As I recall, she was with a mob that tried to break down a barricaded door. When that didn't work, they broke a window and she was the first person through the window. From the guard's perspective, it was reasonable to believe that she would just be the first of many, as was happening in other locations at the Capital. The Guard's life could have been at risk from this mob and he shot at the center of mass, as per training. Seems reasonable. Why did she go through a broken window when there was an armed guard pointing a gun at her on the other side? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 (edited) Meanwhile, while the idiot Left are concerned about those big, bad criminals from January 6th, they are more than OK with this sort of 💩 happening….. https://www.foxnews.com/us/migrant-arrested-broad-daylight-rape-13-year-old-new-york-park.amp Women and children being raped and murdered everywhere by the illegals the communist Left adore. Edited June 18 by Beast 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 3 hours ago, stevestojan said: 😂😂😂 That’s it? Why do I imagine your house has a lot of wood paneling in it? I’m imagining a dark, dank cellar with a dehumidifier running endlessly to withstand the muggy nc summer right now. And he’s still dripping sweat on his keyboard and smells like a locker room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 (edited) On 6/16/2024 at 9:54 AM, leh-nerd skin-erd said: But that’s not how the justice system works, Tibs. If you have a problem with that you should move to Russia! Last time you asked me a question, I answered and believe you ended up on a milk carton. I find that a waste of time. I spoke out against the actions of 1/6 defendants on 1/6. I’ve not changed nor waivered on that, but if you are advocating for the Tibs mode of locking people up forever because they chanted something, you’re on the wrong side of history. I read a Washington Post analysis of the sentences the Jan 6 defendants were receiving relative to defendants in other cases not involving Jan 6. Their analysis was that the Jan6 criminals were getting lighter sentences. If you can't provide contrary data, I'll tend to believe the Washington Post article. I haven't seen a single Jan 6 defendant who should be locked up forever. I can't disagree with your statement that "I’m not in favor of across the board pardons, but pardons/commutations on a case-by-case basis makes sense" but looking at Trump's use of the pardon/commutation authority, he didn't follow the protocol of previous administrations of relying on the Office of Pardon Authority. Instead, used it on well connected people, frequently people who worked for him or were related. Using that power to free people like Rod Blagojevich, Michael Milken, Joe Arpaio, Dinesh D'Souza, Clint Lorance, Bernard Kerik, Paul Manafort, Roger Stone, Michael Flynn, Stephen K. Bannon, George Papadopoulos and Charles Kushner hardly leaves the appearance than careful consideration was given to right a wrong. It appears more like favoritism and self promotion. Given his rhetoric on the campaign trail, I expect his consideration for the Jan 6 convicts will be similarly shallow, self serving, more resembling across the board pardons. Edited June 18 by Scraps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 34 minutes ago, Scraps said: As I recall, she was with a mob that tried to break down a barricaded door. When that didn't work, they broke a window and she was the first person through the window. From the guard's perspective, it was reasonable to believe that she would just be the first of many, as was happening in other locations at the Capital. The Guard's life could have been at risk from this mob and he shot at the center of mass, as per training. Seems reasonable. Why did she go through a broken window when there was an armed guard pointing a gun at her on the other side? Are you looking for an argument? If you are, I'm the wrong person to have it with. I said then, and said now, that it was quite likely he felt strongly that his life was in danger and acted accordingly. His job was to go home that day to his family, and in the moment, he made a decision. Certainly, it's obvious she wasn't armed, carried no weapon and wasn't an immediate threat in that regard, but that's the problem with chaos and dangerous situations. As for the mob/crowd factor solely as a reason to fire, some of you keep saying that--but where in America is it acceptable for police officers to fire into crowds of people simply because they're angry or hostile? I'll answer for you--nowhere. My point remains the same--if every law enforcement officer involved in a scenario where his/her life is in jeopardy was given the same benefit of the doubt as that officer, I'd be fine with that. Would you? If so, welcome to the club. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 12 minutes ago, Scraps said: I read a Washington Post analysis of the sentences the Jan 6 defendants were receiving relative to defendants in other cases not involving Jan 6. Their analysis was that the Jan6 criminals were getting lighter sentences. If you can't provide contrary data, I'll tend to believe the Washington Post article. https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/18/politics/capitol-rioters-split-sentences-appeals/index.html https://rollcall.com/2023/12/13/supreme-court-to-decide-issue-tied-to-hundreds-of-jan-6-cases/ 12 minutes ago, Scraps said: I haven't seen a single Jan 6 defendant who should be locked up forever. Fair enough. I think reasonable people can disagree on this issue. 12 minutes ago, Scraps said: I can't disagree with your statement that "I’m not in favor of across the board pardons, but pardons/commutations on a case-by-case basis makes sense" but looking at Trump's use of the pardon/commutation authority, he didn't follow the protocol of previous administrations of relying on the Office of Pardon Authority. Instead, used it on well connected people, frequently people who worked for him or were related. Using that power to free people like Rod Blagojevich, Michael Milken, Joe Arpaio, Dinesh D'Souza, Clint Lorance, Bernard Kerik, Paul Manafort, Roger Stone, Michael Flynn, Stephen K. Bannon, George Papadopoulos and Charles Kushner hardly leaves the appearance than careful consideration was given to right a wrong. It appears more like favoritism and self promotion. Given his rhetoric on the campaign trail, I expect his consideration for the Jan 6 convicts will be similarly shallow, self serving, more resembling across the board pardons. I have no desire to go down a rabbit hole where we pretend there are no other controversial pardons, it seems an extraordinary waste of time. The rules are what they are, and I understand you would prefer Biden holds the authority to pardon v Trump. I prefer the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 3 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: I would say there are many. Michael Brown comes to mind. Jakob Blake another. Besides that, maybe this can give perspective: https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4878934/user-clip-vice-president-joe-biden-police-shoot-leg-heart You have to wonder how hard JB went after the officer that shot AB? It’s got all the elements of a BLS (Biden leg shot). Your man Trump seems fond of the leg shot. https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-asked-shooting-migrants-crossing-border-legs/story?id=66003927 https://www.axios.com/2022/05/02/mark-esper-book-trump-protesters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 1 minute ago, Scraps said: Your man Trump seems fond of the leg shot. https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-asked-shooting-migrants-crossing-border-legs/story?id=66003927 https://www.axios.com/2022/05/02/mark-esper-book-trump-protesters Well, to be fair, the indiscriminate firing into crowds is much more in line with your philosophy (and Tibs and others) than mine. I only suggest that because it's what you guys have said. I did notice Trump suggested this was a false story, anonymous sourcing, I see we have people selling books....I view this accusation as false. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraps Posted June 18 Share Posted June 18 Just now, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Well, to be fair, the indiscriminate firing into crowds is much more in line with your philosophy (and Tibs and others) than mine. I only suggest that because it's what you guys have said. I did notice Trump suggested this was a false story, anonymous sourcing, I see we have people selling books....I view this accusation as false. Trump frequently suggests things are false that turn out to be true. Firing into crowds is not my philosophy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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