Do think Beane will make any trades before week 1?

[Royale with Cheese]

2 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

I'm sorry, I'll do my best to avoid insulting the sacred cow again. Mea Culpa

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I do think Beane discussed the budget with Pegula for the upcoming season.   Are you saying you don't think they talk?  I don't think Pegula is cheap but do think they are using a more cap constrained model than in the past.  This year is looking like a reset and I don't think Beane would be doing that by himself.

I mean he owns the team, of course they talk just for the sake of him being kept in the loop.  But in no way do I remotely think Pegula is influencing Beanes decisions in any way or his spending.  Pegula is not asking Beane to use “a more cap constrained model”.  There is not one shred of evidence of that.

 

This is Beanes team.  And the only person he counsels with for input is McD, and even then, make no mistake about it, Beane is the unquestioned final decision maker.  Just like how McD has 100% authority over how he coaches the team without Beane trying to influence who he wants to see play more or less.  
 

It’s as good of a HC/GM relationship as there is in the league.  And Pegula does not at all meddle in either of their business even though (like for any owner) I am sure he is aware of what is happening and being kept in the loop.

[Einstein's Dog]

12 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I mean he owns the team, of course they talk just for the sake of him being kept in the loop.  But in no way do I remotely think Pegula is influencing Beanes decisions in any way or his spending.  Pegula is not asking Beane to use “a more cap constrained model”.  There is not one shred of evidence of that.

 

This is Beanes team.  And the only person he counsels with for input is McD, and even then, make no mistake about it, Beane is the unquestioned final decision maker.  Just like how McD has 100% authority over how he coaches the team without Beane trying to influence who he wants to see play more or less.  
 

It’s as good of a HC/GM relationship as there is in the league.  And Pegula does not at all meddle in either of their business even though (like for any owner) I am sure he is aware of what is happening and being kept in the loop.

I used to hold Beane in as high of regard as you, but this year he is slipping IMO (yes, the WR room).  I was giving Beane a break with the possible Pegula influence.  

 

Do you think Beane has open check book policy?  For instance, if Beane could bring in a top tier WR but it would require an upfront $25M signing bonus (immediate cash), along with a big guarantee (say around $50M), can Beane just pull the trigger? 

 

We have a pretty good idea it doesn't work like that in Cincy, and in Dallas it looks like they are going reigning it in this year -probably to correspond with an ouster of McCarthy.

 

Do you think if they don't make the playoffs Beane/McD will get fired?  

[Alphadawg7]

10 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I used to hold Beane in as high of regard as you, but this year he is slipping IMO (yes, the WR room).  I was giving Beane a break with the possible Pegula influence.  

 

Do you think Beane has open check book policy?  For instance, if Beane could bring in a top tier WR but it would require an upfront $25M signing bonus (immediate cash), along with a big guarantee (say around $50M), can Beane just pull the trigger? 

 

We have a pretty good idea it doesn't work like that in Cincy, and in Dallas it looks like they are going reigning it in this year -probably to correspond with an ouster of McCarthy.

 

Do you think if they don't make the playoffs Beane/McD will get fired?  

Yes, as I’ve stated multiple times now.  Beane has no restrictions and there is categorically no evidence of that.  

You personally not liking the WR room and your personal preference of wanting to frivolously spend like the “can’t win anything” Dolphins at WR are in no way evidence that Beane is being restricted on spending by Pegula.  
 

It’s fine that in your opinion you would have done something different.  It’s fine you’re skeptical it will work.  But to draw these wild conspiracy theories that Pegula closed the check book on Beane makes no sense and has no evidence to support that.

Edited June 11 by Alphadawg7

[Einstein's Dog]

19 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Yes, as I’ve stated multiple times now.  Beane has no restrictions and there is categorically no evidence of that.  

You personally not liking the WR room and your personal preference of wanting to frivolously spend like the “can’t win anything” Dolphins at WR are in no way evidence that Beane is being restricted on spending by Pegula.  

Wouldn't the default position be there would be budgetary restrictions on what the GM can do?  Where is your evidence that Beane has no restrictions?  And where is your evidence that that hasn't changed?  Often times when you have modification of ownership a focus on profitability can take place.

 

It takes a very Bills-centric view to think this WR room is one of the better ones in the league.  I was hoping to see year over year improvement in the on-paper look of the WR room for 2024.  That hasn't happened.  And while I like the youngster core of Kincaid/Shakir/Cook I wanted Brady to have a full complement of WRs to work with.  As it stands now, the Bills have a lot of sure handed slot types with RAC ability and very little in terms of boundary WRs.  It's frustrating to me to see this type of WR composition while having such a strong armed, mobile QB like Josh- this would be a good group for Mac Jones or Brock Purdy.

[TheBrownBear]

3 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

JuJu was still just JuJu...a mediocre WR on the decline of his career who wasn't worth his contract.  He didn't have that good of a season for KC to where they had to bring him back, in fact everyone knew they needed to upgrade from him still and tried through the draft and also needed to save money because of cap issues.

 

If Claypool turns it on here, he has his whole prime years ahead of him, brings so much more to the table than what JuJu was going to bring to KC if they brought him back. 

 

JuJu was coming off his age 26 season when the Chiefs let him walk.  Chase Claypool is entering his age 26 season.

 

You're right that JuJu wasn't anything special with the Chiefs, and they were smart not to re-sign him.  Even then, I'd be ecstatic if we got similar production from Claypool this season (950 yards, 3 TDs).  And if Claypool does that, given his past issues, you let him walk as well. 

 

One (or both) of two things need to occur for me to consider re-signing Claypool in 2025 (assuming he even makes the team): He puts up legitimate top-10 receiving numbers and shows elite, difference-making talent on the field, OR he puts up solid numbers and he really proves to the staff that his attitude is a thing of the past and he emerges as a beloved teammate and team leader in the receiving room.   

[TheBrownBear]

6 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

It takes a very Bills-centric view to think this WR room is one of the better ones in the league.  I was hoping to see year over year improvement in the on-paper look of the WR room for 2024.  That hasn't happened.  And while I like the youngster core of Kincaid/Shakir/Cook I wanted Brady to have a full complement of WRs to work with.  As it stands now, the Bills have a lot of sure handed slot types with RAC ability and very little in terms of boundary WRs.  It's frustrating to me to see this type of WR composition while having such a strong armed, mobile QB like Josh- this would be a good group for Mac Jones or Brock Purdy.

I agree.  I like Kincaid and Shakir, but I'm not bullish on this group.

 

But...you can only do so much when you're in cap hell.  Beane at least attempted to address the boundary wide receiver issue with the drafting of Coleman and signing of MVS and Claypool.  These guys might all end up sucking, but he didn't ignore it completely.  And I'm guessing Beane is sort of rolling the dice this year with plans to address it in 2025 when we have both draft capital and cap room to work with.

[MikePJ76]

Probably only if core special teamers or core reserves get hurt and will miss camp and or the early part of the season.

[Paup 1995MVP]

On 6/10/2024 at 11:57 AM, LeGOATski said:

I could see him making a trade for a high upside DB or C at low value.

Agree about bringing in another boundary CB.  Benford, Douglas (anyone know why he has not been at OTA's) and Elam as your top 3 is good, if Benford can stay healthy and Elam steps up his game several notches.  But I would like another solid CB who can start when needed.

[Alphadawg7]

41 minutes ago, TheBrownBear said:

JuJu was coming off his age 26 season when the Chiefs let him walk.  Chase Claypool is entering his age 26 season.

 

You're right that JuJu wasn't anything special with the Chiefs, and they were smart not to re-sign him.  Even then, I'd be ecstatic if we got similar production from Claypool this season (950 yards, 3 TDs).  And if Claypool does that, given his past issues, you let him walk as well. 

 

One (or both) of two things need to occur for me to consider re-signing Claypool in 2025 (assuming he even makes the team): He puts up legitimate top-10 receiving numbers and shows elite, difference-making talent on the field, OR he puts up solid numbers and he really proves to the staff that his attitude is a thing of the past and he emerges as a beloved teammate and team leader in the receiving room.   

 

I will admit, I thought JuJu was older like 29...when they did, just further illustrates how mediocre he is because he looked shot last year.  

 

For me its less about his total stats for Claypool.  We have a lot of mouths to feed and its been made very clear "everyone is gonna eat" in this offense.  So I won't gauge whether he is worth resigning based on needing "top 10 numbers" and more on what he does on the field both in production and as a teammate.  I mean you can only catch what is thrown to you...the odds of him getting enough targets to put up a top 10 season are almost impossible with Keon, Kincaid, Shakir, and Samuel also here, not to mention 2 RB's who can catch too and will combine for 80-100 targets as well.  No one is getting 160 Diggs like targets this year, but several guys will get 80-120 targets each.  

 

This notion Chase must be a top 10 producing WR to resign just doesn't make sense to me.  

[Alphadawg7]

49 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

Wouldn't the default position be there would be budgetary restrictions on what the GM can do?  Where is your evidence that Beane has no restrictions?  And where is your evidence that that hasn't changed?  Often times when you have modification of ownership a focus on profitability can take place.

 

It takes a very Bills-centric view to think this WR room is one of the better ones in the league.  I was hoping to see year over year improvement in the on-paper look of the WR room for 2024.  That hasn't happened.  And while I like the youngster core of Kincaid/Shakir/Cook I wanted Brady to have a full complement of WRs to work with.  As it stands now, the Bills have a lot of sure handed slot types with RAC ability and very little in terms of boundary WRs.  It's frustrating to me to see this type of WR composition while having such a strong armed, mobile QB like Josh- this would be a good group for Mac Jones or Brock Purdy.

 

I really don't get how this is so confusing to you...we have $31M in dead cap in a WR...and yet you seem to be crafting all these wild conspiracy theories about Pegula clamping down on spending because we didn't go get another WR making $28M this year tying up $60M in a single position that doesn't have a lot of cap space and was not in any way some magic pill to win a SB in 2024.  

 

Your confusion on the Bills needing to clear cap this year because we were like $50M over the cap reminds of the misguided outrage in 2017 and 2018 by people who could not grasp the concept Beane was cleaning the cap up to start the rebuild before spending big on new players.

 

And how you can doubt Beane's ability to spend when we were one of the most over the cap teams in the league coming into this season, have like the 2nd largest dead cap hit in NFL history on one player, and still hovering near the max cap is just puzzling to say the least.  This is the same Beane that paid Von Miller a gazillion dollars for 40 years in an offseason we were also near the max cap because they were looking for that one player to get over the hump after Mahomes put up 17 points in the final 2 minutes of the 13 second game. 

 

We will have to agree to disagree.  There is absolutely categorically nothing that has happened as Beane has built this team that remotely suggests Pegula is restricting spending other than your personal disappointment in our WR room.

[oldmanfan]

2 hours ago, TheBrownBear said:

I agree.  I like Kincaid and Shakir, but I'm not bullish on this group.

 

But...you can only do so much when you're in cap hell.  Beane at least attempted to address the boundary wide receiver issue with the drafting of Coleman and signing of MVS and Claypool.  These guys might all end up sucking, but he didn't ignore it completely.  And I'm guessing Beane is sort of rolling the dice this year with plans to address it in 2025 when we have both draft capital and cap room to work with.

When one doesn't understand how the cap works and refuse to acknowledge it when multiple people explain it, then it becomes easy to just throw $$ around.  You recognize that, others don't.

[JerseyBills]

On 6/10/2024 at 11:22 AM, Blackbeard said:

For me, it's hard to believe we're going into the season with this receiving corp.  A rookie and a bunch of jags imo.    Not throwing shade on Shakir or anyone, but I hope this corp keeps us in games.

 

Yes, i'm nervous.  Also need more edge.   This could be a long season.

Andy Isabella was playing vs KC last year. 

This WR room is much deeper than any year w Allen. Not as top heavy.

Plus arguably best TE duo in the league and a stud RB

[Einstein's Dog]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I really don't get how this is so confusing to you...we have $31M in dead cap in a WR...and yet you seem to be crafting all these wild conspiracy theories about Pegula clamping down 

 

We will have to agree to disagree.  There is absolutely categorically nothing that has happened as Beane has built this team that remotely suggests Pegula is restricting spending other than your personal disappointment in our WR room.

I don't understand what is so confusing to you - this was a choice.  There were options even if you can't see what they were.  They (and you seem to think that just means Beane) are choosing this particular route.   I question that, I think there was buy-in from Pegula.

 

And when you say "there is absolutely categorically nothing that has happened" you are of course excluding the whole Kim departure and change in ownership structure.  Lets hope nothing has changed.

 

I don't understand, or like,  Beane's plan(?) for the WR room when he traded Diggs.  Did Beane really think it was a good idea to get a second round WR and a couple low priced misfits (C Samuel was before the trade).

 

If Pegula really had no say in this situation I would think Beane would be on the hot seat if the team doesn't make the playoffs.

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I don't understand what is so confusing to you - this was a choice.  There were options even if you can't see what they were.  They (and you seem to think that just means Beane) are choosing this particular route.   I question that, I think there was buy-in from Pegula.

 

And when you say "there is absolutely categorically nothing that has happened" you are of course excluding the whole Kim departure and change in ownership structure.  Lets hope nothing has changed.

 

I don't understand, or like,  Beane's plan(?) for the WR room when he traded Diggs.  Did Beane really think it was a good idea to get a second round WR and a couple low priced misfits (C Samuel was before the trade).

 

If Pegula really had no say in this situation I would think Beane would be on the hot seat if the team doesn't make the playoffs.

 

 

 

Keon was a first rounder...we traded back.  NE was trying to trade ahead of us to get him in the first too.  Technicality of us moving back 1 made him a 2nd.  

 

Again, there is nothing to support your Pegula is cheap theory.  You wanting to handle WR differently isnt proof of that

[Einstein's Dog]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Keon was a first rounder...we traded back.  NE was trying to trade ahead of us to get him in the first too.  Technicality of us moving back 1 made him a 2nd.  

 

Again, there is nothing to support your Pegula is cheap theory.  You wanting to handle WR differently isnt proof of that

No, Keon was a second rounder.  The Bills traded back more than once. 

 

The Bills also traded out of the first round and gave up the 5th year option, which seems to be something Carolina wanted for their WR.

[DeepPass]

On 6/10/2024 at 10:58 AM, Alphadawg7 said:

In years past, with a deep and talented roster Beane has found some value for a guy who either finished further down the depth chart at a crowded position or was someone that they were going to cut.  But this year is a little bit different with a bigger mix of vets and youth than we have seen in the past, so it's a bit harder to project right now.  We also have three 4th round picks next year, which might open up the possibility for Beane to pull the trigger to bolster somewhere if another team makes an interesting player available as we also have a little cap flexibility too.    

 

So, is there anyone or even a positional group on the roster where you think Beane may try and trade someone out and get a little value for?  And do you think Beane may make a trade to bolster a positional group, and if so, which one?

If one of our starting OT's go down definitely

[Alphadawg7]

41 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

No, Keon was a second rounder.  The Bills traded back more than once. 

 

The Bills also traded out of the first round and gave up the 5th year option, which seems to be something Carolina wanted for their WR.

lmao

[BillsFanForever19]

4 hours ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I don't understand what is so confusing to you - this was a choice.  There were options even if you can't see what they were.  They (and you seem to think that just means Beane) are choosing this particular route.   I question that, I think there was buy-in from Pegula.

 

And when you say "there is absolutely categorically nothing that has happened" you are of course excluding the whole Kim departure and change in ownership structure.  Lets hope nothing has changed.

 

I don't understand, or like,  Beane's plan(?) for the WR room when he traded Diggs.  Did Beane really think it was a good idea to get a second round WR and a couple low priced misfits (C Samuel was before the trade).

 

If Pegula really had no say in this situation I would think Beane would be on the hot seat if the team doesn't make the playoffs.

 

You act as though we didn't go into this offseason *54 million* over the cap - with 21 Free Agents, even before we traded or cut 8 more.

 

I don't know how you look at that and go "don't care, big splash on a single WR when they're going for historically high prices or he's failed us".

 

You can argue he shouldn't have put us in that situation in the first place and that's a fine opinion to have. But that doesn't change the fact that's the exact situation we were in and that meant any one big spending move couldn't work with everything we had to do.

 

As it is, we paid out our biggest veteran FA contract this offseason from another team to a WR (Curtis Samuel) and our top Draft Pick was spent on a WR (Keon Coleman). So that's our two biggest investments this offseason put into the WR position. I'm sorry you wanted more, but it simply was not in the cards this year.

Edited June 12 by BillsFanForever19

[ganesh]

On 6/10/2024 at 8:52 PM, Blackbeard said:

For me, it's hard to believe we're going into the season with this receiving corp.  A rookie and a bunch of jags imo.    Not throwing shade on Shakir or anyone, but I hope this corp keeps us in games.

 

Yes, i'm nervous.  Also need more edge.   This could be a long season.

I am less worried about our WR group.  I am more worried about the CB and DE situation.  We had zero Pass Rush against the Chiefs in the playoffs and we continue to not improve there.