Buffalo716 Posted June 6 Posted June 6 7 minutes ago, Saint Doug said: Maybe he’s never heard of: Matt Barkley Sam Darnold Mark Sanchez Matt Leinart Rob Johnson Carson Palmer was ok, just too fragile These guys would’ve fit better on a Baywatch set than a football field. It's not up to the school how good of a pro they are lol It's their job to win college football games and get the best high school player and develop him What they do in the pros is all up to the player... And it's more than just talent you have to be a leader of grown men... Darnold had talent coming out... He's too much of a laid-back surfer boy to lead grown ass man Quote
Captain Hindsight Posted June 6 Posted June 6 41 minutes ago, Saint Doug said: Maybe he’s never heard of: Matt Barkley Sam Darnold Mark Sanchez Matt Leinart Rob Johnson Carson Palmer was ok, just too fragile These guys would’ve fit better on a Baywatch set than a football field. Carson Palmer was awesome. He just played for the worst team in the league for too long. Him and Stafford should have had much more success in their careers. Unreal talent 1 Quote
Billl Posted June 6 Posted June 6 1 hour ago, Simon said: I only ever had the chance to watch him play one time; he was utterly confused and flat out scared because of it. I don't know if he played with that kind of fear regularly but it was bad enough in the one game I saw that he would have been so far down my draft board that he might as well have been off it. What game was that? Quote
Saint Doug Posted June 6 Posted June 6 51 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: It's not up to the school how good of a pro they are lol It's their job to win college football games and get the best high school player and develop him What they do in the pros is all up to the player... And it's more than just talent you have to be a leader of grown men... Darnold had talent coming out... He's too much of a laid-back surfer boy to lead grown ass man That’s cool and all. But when I see, not one bust, but a string of busts, you have to start wondering about the school’s QB developmental system. Are they recruiting QBs to maximize their profits or are in the business of getting their QBs ready to be pros. 1 Quote
Simon Posted June 6 Posted June 6 47 minutes ago, Billl said: What game was that? I think it was against Notre Dame. They just controlled their lanes, contained him in the pocket and forced him to play as a traditional QB. He fell apart like a Robert Hall suit. 1 Quote
finn Posted June 6 Posted June 6 1 hour ago, boyst said: Do you not know what this term means? Wow "Golden boy" has a long history as a description of someone fortune has smiled on. For example, in Song of Achilles, Madeline Miller describes Achilles as a golden boy. The OP used in a more narrow sense, as someone growing up privileged in California. That usage might be in vogue, but I'm still not sure if stunned disbelief is warranted. Quote
muppy Posted June 6 Posted June 6 (edited) I personally didn't like him from his college ball at USC. I think, and I could be wrong, but I think he could bust. He is at the beginning of his career. Of course he requires time to acclimate to the NFL. I am not a fan. which means nothing it's JMO 16 minutes ago, Simon said: I think it was against Notre Dame. They just controlled their lanes, contained him in the pocket and forced him to play as a traditional QB. He fell apart like a Robert Hall suit. there was a game USC played against their arch rival UCLA and he folded in that game like a cheap suit. I'm going to search for a link. I have a buddy who is a UCLA alumni and I heard an earful from him regarding that specific game. It was basically how he gave up. https://www.latimes.com/sports/usc/story/2023-11-18/caleb-williams-usc-loss-ucla-possible-final-game Edited June 6 by muppy Quote
bearstobills Posted June 6 Posted June 6 (edited) On 6/7/2024 at 3:27 AM, Alphadawg7 said: Two things...one for him, and one against him: Reports were that Patrick Mahomes was looking bad and throwing a lot of picks during the offseason leading up to his first starting season. Obviously those early reports meant nothing and he lit the league up and hasn't stopped since. So I would caution anyone over analyzing anything going on right now. Jamar Chase was also reportedly dropping passes everywhere his rookie camp and then blew up as a rookie. Coming into the draft I have not been on the Caleb bandwagon, I think he is overrated just like I kept telling everyone Sam Darnold and Josh Rosen were overrated leading up to those drafts and thought both had high bust potential. Darnold just made so many head scratching or bad decisions at USC that I was shocked his hype was so high. Rosen was so unlikable that I just felt his ceiling was Jeff George/Jay Cutler and his floor was Ryan Leaf. I know several people who knew Rosen and every one of them couldn't stand him and said he was a total douche and didn't take football seriously. But why Caleb - I question if he has the "it" factor. Im not saying he will be a bust, but I definitely don't think he is a sure thing like so many seem to think. Its more than his suspect play in some big games...it's just something about him just makes me doubt his ability to be the leader a QB needs to be to get to a higher level in the NFL. I actually think Maye has a higher ceiling than Caleb, just also has more risk and a lower floor than Caleb. I don't dislike Caleb like I did Rosen, its more similar to how I felt about Darnold where I understood the high draft status, but still have concerns and doubts he can live up to the hype and potential. Rosen on the other hand I was certain would be a bust, I wanted no part of him whatsoever. Good stuff here. I watched one interview with Rosen during the pre draft process and was personally out on him. I stayed away from Allen because of the completion percentage for as long as I could. But you could tell Beane was interested. So I watched a highlight clip. Much like Keon's one handed spear, Josh did his roll to the right and dart across his body to a breaking receiver in the end zone thing, and it was just different. So I watched an interview. And he so clearly had that "it" factor. It almost felt like a no-brainer. I love that about Beane, that he looks for the complete person. Watching Coleman's combine interview, I instantly thought Beane would have a hard time passing on him. He really values personality. And is able to look past 40 times and completion percentage that would turn away other gm's. He sees football players. I mean....DeWayne Carter, Ray Davis, Solomon....these guys are off the charts. As for Caleb, he has a creepy confidence that would be give me pause if I were selecting. Edited June 8 by bearstobills 1 2 Quote
Alphadawg7 Posted June 6 Posted June 6 2 hours ago, Simon said: I only ever had the chance to watch him play one time; he was utterly confused and flat out scared because of it. I don't know if he played with that kind of fear regularly but it was bad enough in the one game I saw that he would have been so far down my draft board that he might as well have been off it. Yeah, I know the look, and I wouldn't say anything extreme that it was all the time as he had some impressive games and moments too...like Darnold did. But there was more of this than I would like to see for a guy I was taking number 1 overall. There is just something about how he carries himself when its not going well, almost like his confidence is fragile or something. For example, Josh Allen might throw a pick but he is coming to kill you on the next drive still. And if he is off that day with his arm, he is gonna try and truck over every defender with his legs. He just lays it all on the line every play, every game, with the mindset he can get it done. I don't get that at all from Caleb when things are rough, its like he doesn't know what to do. Allen dont give a ****, he will revert to playground ball to try and win. I get why the Bears took him...but me personally, after years of QB purgatory, I would have tried to dangle the #1 pick to either Washington or NE for a nice haul and taken Maye personally. I would rather roll the dice on Maye's higher upside and hedge my bet with valuable draft assets in the trade down that can arm me to get another QB in a future draft if Maye flops. But I am also not an NFL GM trying to keep his job either lol Then again, this is the Bears who have never developed a QB really maybe ever...so maybe the safer Caleb is more appropriate. But I think Maye has some of that Josh Allen dog in him, the leave it all on the line demeanor out there. And that is the kind of stuff players around them love and rally for, and its what I think Caleb lacks. I would rather take a guy who oozes the things you can't teach but needs to work on the things that are coachable...then take a guy who has better fundamentals or base skills but maybe is lacking in some of those unteachable traits. And who knows, Caleb may excel there, they are loaded with weapons. By no means am I condemning the kids career, but I do feel like his future greatness isn't as sure of a thing as some think. 1 1 Quote
4merper4mer Posted June 6 Posted June 6 2 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: It's not up to the school how good of a pro they are lol It's their job to win college football games and get the best high school player and develop him What they do in the pros is all up to the player... And it's more than just talent you have to be a leader of grown men... Darnold had talent coming out... He's too much of a laid-back surfer boy to lead grown ass man So let me see if I have this straight…..laid back surfer = can’t lead……cries to mommy when he loses = General Patton? 1 Quote
Buffalo716 Posted June 6 Posted June 6 (edited) 11 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said: So let me see if I have this straight…..laid back surfer = can’t lead……cries to mommy when he loses = General Patton? Caleb has some odd quirks... But is an intense leader on and off the field He earns respect on the field from his teammates ... Laying it all on the field will earn your respects.. every Young quarterback has to earn it from the veterans in the locker room Darnold was never known as the greatest leader at USC Edited June 6 by Buffalo716 1 Quote
Simon Posted June 7 Posted June 7 1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said: I would rather take a guy who oozes the things you can't teach but needs to work on the things that are coachable...then take a guy who has better fundamentals or base skills but maybe is lacking in some of those unteachable traits. 1 Quote
boyst Posted June 7 Posted June 7 14 hours ago, Saint Doug said: Maybe he’s never heard of: Matt Barkley Sam Darnold Mark Sanchez Matt Leinart Rob Johnson Carson Palmer was ok, just too fragile These guys would’ve fit better on a Baywatch set than a football field. Honestly, I'm curious if he was offended because he thought it was some slanderous term. The way this culture is today everybody's looking to be triggered and offended by something. 12 hours ago, finn said: "Golden boy" has a long history as a description of someone fortune has smiled on. For example, in Song of Achilles, Madeline Miller describes Achilles as a golden boy. The OP used in a more narrow sense, as someone growing up privileged in California. That usage might be in vogue, but I'm still not sure if stunned disbelief is warranted. Oh, we got ourselves a road scholar...🤪 Quote
finn Posted June 7 Posted June 7 11 hours ago, boyst said: Honestly, I'm curious if he was offended because he thought it was some slanderous term. The way this culture is today everybody's looking to be triggered and offended by something. Oh, we got ourselves a road scholar...🤪 "Road scholar"? Must be thinking of Jack Kerouac. 1 Quote
Jon in Pasadena Posted June 7 Posted June 7 1 hour ago, finn said: "Road scholar"? Must be thinking of Jack Kerouac. Beats me. 🤷♂️ 2 1 Quote
Sammy Watkins' Rib Posted June 8 Posted June 8 I think Caleb's floor is Kyler Murray. Kyler is pretty good IMO. Kyler's biggest flaw though is that he is injury prone. That's a pretty bad flaw to have. Quote
MJS Posted June 8 Posted June 8 On 6/6/2024 at 3:46 PM, Saint Doug said: That’s cool and all. But when I see, not one bust, but a string of busts, you have to start wondering about the school’s QB developmental system. Are they recruiting QBs to maximize their profits or are in the business of getting their QBs ready to be pros. You think college coaches are trying to get their players ready to be pros? They are trying to win football games! That's all. Quote
boyst Posted June 8 Posted June 8 17 hours ago, finn said: "Road scholar"? Must be thinking of Jack Kerouac. It's an old term around here. A tbd-ism going back to the days of pickle juice. 1 Quote
Drew21PA Posted September 19 Posted September 19 I’m one that said he would bust - still don’t get the hype but whatever no where near some of the “guaranteed” pro talent of the past Quote
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