What are your expectations for the draft picks?

[GunnerBill]

27 minutes ago, mrags said:

Well. It’s still a good idea. 
 

I don’t dislike Gilliam but what are you really getting out of him that says you can’t take a shot at this other guy. 

 

High level special teams play. The British guy isn't even a rugby player. Not really. He is an amateur rugby player and boxer. The chances of him being anything at all are very remote. 

[LABILLBACKER]

2 minutes ago, Logic said:

For what it's worth, Ray Davis had 12 receiving TDs in college to Cook's 6 (granted, Davis played an extra year).

Davis had 7 receiving TDs just last season, which was the most receiving touchdowns by an SEC running back in 25 years. Pretty impressive. 

That's another reason I think Davis can eat into Cook's playing time and maybe seize the starting job from him: He's just as capable -- and arguably more so -- as a receiver.

Davis's role on this team inside the 5 yard line will be critical in taking pressure and impact off of Josh. Clearly Ray has the "power back" ability to quickly make fans forget we ever had Murray or Harris. 

As far as Coleman, Bishop and Carter go, I think they'll all contribute early.  Coleman/Bishop will start quickly and players like Carter/Solomon will have heavy rotational reps.

[YattaOkasan]

50 minutes ago, Billl said:

What is the second round average you’re referring to?  Last year, 40 WRs had 750 yards receiving.  750 plus would put him as a high end number 2 WR. 

 

Coleman was the first WR taken in the second round and the 8th overall. Last year, the first WR taken in the second had 43 catches, 418 yards, and 0 TDs. The 8th WR taken had 22, 377, and 1.   Penciling Coleman in for 750+ is extremely optimistic. 

750 was me eyeballing how much the average was for Round 1 and Round 2 and then multiplying by 2 (figured the total numbers, not per game was easier to work with). 

 

It is optimistic but I think the number of available targets justifies the expectation.  First WR in Round 2 went to the panthers which has a very anemic offense.  8th WR overall went to the crowded Broncos WR room (7th in targets).  The point of this exercise was to look a bit more broadly to get a better understanding of what to expect.  You highlight two precise examples when others should also be considered (7th WR off the board, last WR of Round 1 had 900+ yards, 2nd WR of Round 2 had 750+ yards).  I think adding in these 3 pretty relevant data points indicate its not "extremely optimistic."  All 3 of those players went to good passing offenses and got 90+ targets.  Do you think Coleman's opportunity is closer to Mims & Mingo or closer to Rice, Reed, Addison?   

[Billl]

8 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said:

750 was me eyeballing how much the average was for Round 1 and Round 2 and then multiplying by 2 (figured the total numbers, not per game was easier to work with). 

 

It is optimistic but I think the number of available targets justifies the expectation.  First WR in Round 2 went to the panthers which has a very anemic offense.  8th WR overall went to the crowded Broncos WR room (7th in targets).  The point of this exercise was to look a bit more broadly to get a better understanding of what to expect.  You highlight two precise examples when others should also be considered (7th WR off the board, last WR of Round 1 had 900+ yards, 2nd WR of Round 2 had 750+ yards).  I think adding in these 3 pretty relevant data points indicate its not "extremely optimistic."  All 3 of those players went to good passing offenses and got 90+ targets.  Do you think Coleman's opportunity is closer to Mims & Mingo or closer to Rice, Reed, Addison?   

Just saw that Vegas has him right at 750, so he’s likely closer to that second group.  Seems like a big ask, but there are plenty of targets available. 

[H2o]

19 minutes ago, Logic said:

For what it's worth, Ray Davis had 12 receiving TDs in college to Cook's 6 (granted, Davis played an extra year).

Davis had 7 receiving TDs just last season, which was the most receiving touchdowns by an SEC running back in 25 years. Pretty impressive. 

That's another reason I think Davis can eat into Cook's playing time and maybe seize the starting job from him: He's just as capable -- and arguably more so -- as a receiver.

I think he could very well eat into Cook's playing time a little, but not much. Cook did have some terrible drops last year, three of which were walk-in TD's. I still think Cook is first man up given he had almost 1,600 total yards last year, with 1,122 of that coming on the ground. 

 

Coleman - 50-70 catches for 700-900 yards.

Bishop - Depends on how quickly he picks up the defense, but the athletic traits and instincts are there.

Carter - Will immediately be in the rotation, but I don't expect much in year one. 

Davis - Will immediately be a rotational guy, taking over the Murray snaps, and be a solid contributor.

Van-Ran Granger - I think he has a chance to push McGovern back to LG before the C experiment even starts. 

Ulofoshio - Will make the team, but mainly be a ST guy or likely inactive on Sunday's

Solomon - Has a chance if he can show some juice in TC and the preseason, but most likely PS

Grable - Has the chance to be one of the backup OL'men this year, but is most likely PS bound

Hardy - I think Hardy makes the 53 as our primary returner and a backup NCB

 

The rest are cut outright, with maybe three or four being stashed on the PS. 

[mrags]

27 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

High level special teams play. The British guy isn't even a rugby player. Not really. He is an amateur rugby player and boxer. The chances of him being anything at all are very remote. 

Nothing makes me want to puke more than the term “high level special teams player”

 

anyone not named Hester, Hall can literally be found anywhere. Guys that cover the gunner positions and anything else can literally be performed by a monkey. 
 

I’ll give it to Gilliam at least he provides something at FB and even TE in a pinch. But the usage of roster spots on guys like Kumerow should never happen. If they aren’t going to contribute to an actual offensive or defensive position, it’s a waste. 
 

yes, I know. You and probably 3,000 other people on this board don’t agree with me and think I’m an idiot. I don’t care. 

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, mrags said:

Nothing makes me want to puke more than the term “high level special teams player”

 

anyone not named Hester, Hall can literally be found anywhere. Guys that cover the gunner positions and anything else can literally be performed by a monkey. 
 

I’ll give it to Gilliam at least he provides something at FB and even TE in a pinch. But the usage of roster spots on guys like Kumerow should never happen. If they aren’t going to contribute to an actual offensive or defensive position, it’s a waste. 
 

yes, I know. You and probably 3,000 other people on this board don’t agree with me and think I’m an idiot. I don’t care. 

 

I don't think you are an idiot. Just wrong.

[wppete]

Javon Solomon gets 8 sacks.

[Rocky Landing]

Keon Coleman - I feel like his success has as much to do with Brady, as it does with him. If he really hits, I suspect it won't be until mid-season that he really starts to have a major impact-- just long enough for fans to start calling him a "bust." 

Cole Bishop - All the pundits have been saying "day one starter." But McD's defense can be complex where safety is concerned. I also have a higher opinion of Rapp, than most. I think he is one of the Bills' more underrated players, and I also think Mike Edwards was solid pickup. I suspect Bishop will be eased in, and start by midseason, and I'm fine with that.

DeWayne Carter - The Bills were so thin at the position. Obviously, he won't be the starter, but he'll get plenty of rotation.

Ray Davis - It'll be nice to have a third down power back who isn't in his mid thirties.

Sedrick Van Pran-Granger - I've never been comfortable with the idea of McGovern at center, and Edwards at LG. If Edwards were the better LG, he would have held that position last year. It's an obvious downgrade, IMO. I'm really hoping that VPG is comfortable to start early at center (if not Will Clapp, whom I believe is better than people think).

Edefuan Ulofoshio - I very much doubt that Milano is going to be back in week one. But, with the acquisition of Deion Jones, I doubt we're going to see much of Ede Ulo.

Javon Solomon - I think McD will know how to get the most out of this guy. And while I don't really expect much of anything out of Von Miller, it'll be nice for Solomon to have him as a mentor, and hopefully he'll be a solid rotational DE-- which we really do need at the position.

Tylan Grable - A wasted pick, IMO. He might make the PS.

Daequan Hardy - I'm hoping he's going to be Harty's replacement for P/KR. I'm sure we're going to see him returning kicks in the preseason, and that should be a good indication if that's where he'll be used. I'm also hoping he'll be Siran Neal's replacement as Taron Johnson's backup (and maybe eventual replacement?). Undersized, sure. But the buzz on his athleticism makes him someone I'm excited to see. Does it seem like Brandon Beane is better at assessing late-round talent than he is at early-round talent?

Travis Clayton - I have a fantasy that Clayton's going to make the 53, and be used in those Jumbo packages as the sixth lineman, and eligible receiver. I know it's not likely to happen, but I'd love to see him catch a short lob from Allen, and then flatten whomever's in front of him.

 

 

 

Edited May 21 by Rocky Landing

[Don Otreply]

2 hours ago, SCBills said:

 

Van Pran-Granger is not making it to the Practice Squad and I think has a decent shot at starting. 

This right here ^^^
 

On top of Coleman, Bishop, Solomon and Davis, all contributing, starting or rotational, i think we will be presently surprised, jmo. 

[Shaw66]

I'm long on hopes, hopes that I think are reasonable.   I'm relatively short on expectations, because I just don't know. 

 

Coleman - I have the most confidence in his being an impact player as a rookie.  The Bills weren't going to get one of the top three in the draft, and I think they got the guy they wanted.  (Kudos to Beane for trading back twice and still getting him.)   I think they drafted him because they can see how he fits in.  

 

Bishop - I want to believe, but he won't play until he understands what's going on out there.   Bishop, like Bernard two years ago, comes with a reputation for being a coach-on-the-field-type player, and Bernard couldn't sniff the field his rookie season.  I have high hopes, but I think he'll have to work his way into the role over the course of the season. 

 

Carter - I hope he's Kyle Williams.  I think he'll be in the rotation day 1, or very soon.  Whether he has an impact remains to be seen. 

 

Davis - I agree with others; he will be the #1 backup, and get significant snaps.  I hope he can push Cook for the #1 spot. 

 

Van Pran-Granger - highest hopes; if he can take over at center, the offensive line looks great.  Whether he can is anyone's guess. 

 

Ulofoshio - rookie linebackers don't play on this defense. 

 

Solomon - great hopes.   It sounds like he has some physical skills that will make it hard to keep him off the field.   Defining his role will be tough.  Again, great hopes, but expectations?   Bills likely will give snaps to a veteran before Solomon. 

 

Hardy - I expect him to make the 53.  

[YattaOkasan]

8 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Bishop - I want to believe, but he won't play until he understands what's going on out there.   Bishop, like Bernard two years ago, comes with a reputation for being a coach-on-the-field-type player, and Bernard couldn't sniff the field his rookie season.  I have high hopes, but I think he'll have to work his way into the role over the course of the season. 

 

Agree with much of what you wrote, but would note that Bernard had to beat out Tremaine Edmunds and Bishop has to be out Rapp (or Edwards).  I think Bishop has a much easier task than Bernard did.  

[Shaw66]

4 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said:

Agree with much of what you wrote, but would note that Bernard had to beat out Tremaine Edmunds and Bishop has to be out Rapp (or Edwards).  I think Bishop has a much easier task than Bernard did.  

Absolutely correct.  If Edmunds hadn't been on the squad, Bernard might have gotten a lot of first-team reps in training camp, and who knows.   On the other hand, when he did get in the game as a rookie, he didn't look anything like the player we saw the next season.  

[GASabresIUFan]

4 hours ago, Billl said:

Just saw that Vegas has him right at 750, so he’s likely closer to that second group.  Seems like a big ask, but there are plenty of targets available. 

The players most similar to Coleman drafted where Coleman was are Higgins  (33rd) and Pittman (34th) in 2020.  Higgins had 900 yards as a rookie and Pittman only 500, but Pittman was not an immediate starter like Coleman will be.  Also the average WR drafted 25-40 over the last 5 seasons has averaged 600+ yards and only one true bust.  I think it's perfectly reasonable to project Coleman at or around 700 yards next season.  

[stlbills13]

I think Coleman will be inconsistent. Assuming Shakir and Samuel split time in the slot, that leaves Coleman most consistently matched up against the opposing top outside CB. That's going to be tough for him most Sundays. But I think Brady will scheme him up enough that he'll have his moments. 

 

Bishop is a guy that may need time to earn the trust of McD but I hope he gets the keys from day 1. Mainly because I think Rapp is best as a 3rd safety and I don't want to see Hamlin out there. 

 

Carter will get reps and I think he's going to be pretty good even if the stat sheet isn't stuffed

 

Davis is going to play a lot. Especially if Cook doesn't clean up fumbles/drops. Even though I think Cook's hands are better than he gets credit for, you can't afford any slip ups. Davis also may save some tread on Josh's tires early in the season.

 

VPG is the guy I most hope explodes. If he starts, it trickles down all across the o-line. I hope they give him every chance possible.

 

The others - who knows. Solomon could be a situational guy. The others I like their upside but it's still a good roster and hard to make the 53.

[Putin]

6 hours ago, Logic said:

I'll throw a wrench into the discussion and say that I think Ray Davis has a chance to take real playing time away from James Cook. As it is, there were times last season where the staff seemed to want to move him to more of a change of pace role and give more snaps to Latavius Murray, but Murray was looking long in the tooth by that point in the season and wasn't up to the task.

I think James Cook's best role -- based on his college career, his size, his skillset, etc -- is as a change of pace, timeshare, 1B kind of guy. I think the way you get the most out of him is to have him split reps evenly with another guy, or even to outright be the change of pace guy while someone else is the starter. 

I also think that James Cook is a below average pass blocker. I'm not sure how Ray Davis is in that department, but IF he's a better pass blocker than Cook, that'll be his first ticket to eating into Cook's reps. Beyond that, and just generally speaking, I can see Davis doing more of the 1st and 2nd down dirty work, short yardage and goal line stuff, and Cook being more of the 3rd down back, splash plays guy, and being more involved as a receiver.

I don't think this will happen immediately, by any means. But by, say, week 10, I can see Ray Davis being the de facto starter at running back for the Buffalo Bills.

We finally get a 1000 yard rusher in Cook who also led the team in total yards , and now a forth round rookie will come in and take over as # 1 RB I really doubt that will happen ,

Edited May 21 by Putin

[Nephilim17]

While I'm rooting for the kid, I expect Coleman to be integrated a bit slowly and don't expect him to be a day 1 starter.

I'm guessing after a handful of games he sees more time. I'd love to be wrong but he just turned 21. We need realistic expectations for the kid.

[Logic]

2 minutes ago, Putin said:

We finally get a 1000 yard rusher in Cook who also led the team in total yards , and now a forth round rookie will come in and take over as # 1 RB I really doubt that will happen ,

I gave my reasons why (potentially superior pass blocking ability, surer hands in the receiving game, and to keep Cook fresher and to more strategically employ his specific skillset), mentioned that I didn't think it would happen right away, and pointed out that it would still likely be a 1A/1B or "1st and 2nd down back" vs "3rd down back" type of thing.

I guess in time we'll see if I'm crazy or not.

[Buffalo716]

4 hours ago, Rocky Landing said:

Keon Coleman - I feel like his success has as much to do with Brady, as it does with him. If he really hits, I suspect it won't be until mid-season that he really starts to have a major impact-- just long enough for fans to start calling him a "bust." 

Cole Bishop - All the pundits have been saying "day one starter." But McD's defense can be complex where safety is concerned. I also have a higher opinion of Rapp, than most. I think he is one of the Bills' more underrated players, and I also think Mike Edwards was solid pickup. I suspect Bishop will be eased in, and start by midseason, and I'm fine with that.

DeWayne Carter - The Bills were so thin at the position. Obviously, he won't be the starter, but he'll get plenty of rotation.

Ray Davis - It'll be nice to have a third down power back who isn't in his mid thirties.

Sedrick Van Pran-Granger - I've never been comfortable with the idea of McGovern at center, and Edwards at LG. If Edwards were the better LG, he would have held that position last year. It's an obvious downgrade, IMO. I'm really hoping that VPG is comfortable to start early at center (if not Will Clapp, whom I believe is better than people think).

Edefuan Ulofoshio - I very much doubt that Milano is going to be back in week one. But, with the acquisition of Deion Jones, I doubt we're going to see much of Ede Ulo.

Javon Solomon - I think McD will know how to get the most out of this guy. And while I don't really expect much of anything out of Von Miller, it'll be nice for Solomon to have him as a mentor, and hopefully he'll be a solid rotational DE-- which we really do need at the position.

Tylan Grable - A wasted pick, IMO. He might make the PS.

Daequan Hardy - I'm hoping he's going to be Harty's replacement for P/KR. I'm sure we're going to see him returning kicks in the preseason, and that should be a good indication if that's where he'll be used. I'm also hoping he'll be Siran Neal's replacement as Taron Johnson's backup (and maybe eventual replacement?). Undersized, sure. But the buzz on his athleticism makes him someone I'm excited to see. Does it seem like Brandon Beane is better at assessing late-round talent than he is at early-round talent?

Travis Clayton - I have a fantasy that Clayton's going to make the 53, and be used in those Jumbo packages as the sixth lineman, and eligible receiver. I know it's not likely to happen, but I'd love to see him catch a short lob from Allen, and then flatten whomever's in front of him.

 

 

 

What you're not understanding about McGovern and Edwards is that it's possible we just had two good left guards... Beane has been steadily building our line for years

 

Just because McGovern was better than Andrews doesn't mean Andrews is bad lol

 

Go back 4 years and Andrews would be one of the best two guards on the team 

 

McGovern also played center in college and has been groomed to play the position... He isn't somebody who has zero clue how to play center 

 

It's physically the easiest position and now he is one of the most physical centers in the NFL... He's going to be getting paid by another team in 2 years 

 

He's going to be getting a Payday at center for another team because he's going to be top 10

 

A short-armed bad technique rookie is not going to win the starting center job... He needs to be groomed

Edited May 21 by Buffalo716

[BillsFan130]

8 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I’m not trying to be “that guy” but I think that it’s important to add Javon Solomon to the mix. He led college football in sacks and plays a position of need. He’s going to play meaningful snaps at an impact position. I have his o/u at 4.5 sacks. 
 

 

I hope you're right. If bills get 5 sacks from Solomon, that would be huge production for a 5th round rookie edge