Marquez Valdes-Scantling meeting with the Bills (UPDATE: Signed)

[MasterStrategist]

3 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Your response doesn't have anything to do with my point you are responding to.    

 

I'm sure you had no idea that Chris Jones had done so little in those games,  did you?   Most Bills fans think he's been a force of nature because the grass is greener on that other side.

 

What I know is that the sky is the f#cking limit offensively with Josh Allen at QB if you give him weapons..........not this bullsh!t half-stepping job of stocking the cupboard that they are trying now.

 

I want to see what it looks like when he's actually surrounded with studs on that side of the ball and doesn't have to run the ball 9x per game to win and subsequently be compromised by elbow and shoulder injuries all season.  

 

I'd rather be the memorable Air Coryell Chargers than the totally forgettable Marty/Norv Chargers(which is what the Allen Bills have been to this point).

 

Because I ALREADY know that having 8 good rotational DL and an excellent back 7 with a HC whose expertise is on that side of the ball has been tried repeatedly and has failed many times already.

 

 

You're clearly not understanding.  It's OK if that's the case.  I've said my peace, we seem to have different opinions.

 

I did know Jones stats against us.  Don't act like you dug up some "gold" nugget there.  It's an easy thing to find in about 30 seconds.  

 

Allen doesn't need to be surrounded by studs.  OMG, see you're back on this crusade that if we somehow had Jerry Rice and Megatron that we wouldn't lose.

 

I'm trying to say there's alot more to it than that.  Our defense lacks a game changer up front, maybe Ed or Groot take a leap into that category.  Until then, or we find 1/2 lock down corners....we are behind these other teams on defense.  And injuries have hurt us more than our competitors (KC and Cincy) on defense.

 

I know your MO is to start throwing insults when someone doesn't agree with you, after multiple posts.  That's fine if that's where you're at now.

 

You've gone from discussing to a whole different tone in 2 posts.  Moving on...

[SoonerBillsFan]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Have the 3 Chiefs SB winning teams all had elite DL units or secondaries?  

 

I don't think that's the case.

 

I go back to being able to adapt your defensive scheme to your opponent.    That's Spag's calling card.

 

 

And McDermott runs the same **** all the time, that is why Reid owns him.

[NewEra]

24 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

False.

 

I am not a McDermott hater.

 

It's just clear that he's been and still is learning how to win in the playoffs via on the job training.   The Bills hired a first time HC who was more of a culture guy than a quick-thinking, clever mind and guys like that........Schotty, Cowher or even Reid........tend to have to take a WHOLE LOTTA' lumps in the playoffs before they win a SB.

 

But I believe McD's been trying hard to get better and I am not eager to start over from scratch(that's Josh Allen's decision anyway).   

 

As much as you guys push back against the notion that his defensive scheme hasn't proven challenging enough to opponents.........I think he clearly has decided to make changes on that side of the ball to try to diversify their defense.   It's obviously a huge issue.   They've become fish in a barrel defensively against Burrow and Mahomes.   

 

i agree that sometimes it is a big issue.  I agree that, under Frazier, the scheme wasn’t challenging enough.  It was a huge issue.  And I agree that he’s making changes on that side of the ball to try and diversify the defense.  I’m sure we both agree that we’re happy about that.  Every coaching staff needs to evolve.  He’s doing that.  
 

 

But the bottom bolded, I think you’re exaggerating.  How did we hold KC to 20

and 17 points in two of the last 3 games we played if they’ve become fish in a barrel?

Maybe Reid and Mahomes weren’t trying that game?  🤷🏻‍♂️ your narrative that Reid/Mahomes always have their way with McD’s D is wrong.  Funny how that always happens when we are healthier and have better players on the field. Beat them in 21 with Tre-  lost to them in 13 seconds without Tre.  Beat then in 22 with Von.  Beat them in 23 with Benford, TB, healthy Douglas.  Lost without them.  

Burrow, well that’s been a different story.  He’s stomped on McDs D.  Ain’t no doubt
 

 

28 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Hey I'm game to just sit tight and wait for the totally common occurrence of having every defensive player 100% healthy come the postseason😂😂

Moving the goalposts.  But I that’s what you’ve done this entire debate.  It’s all based on your dislike for McD.  And that’s all.  You’re entitled.  But it doesn’t mean that you’re right

[BADOLBILZ]

8 minutes ago, MasterStrategist said:

You're clearly not understanding.  It's OK if that's the case.  I've said my peace, we seem to have different opinions.

 

I did know Jones stats against us.  Don't act like you dug up some "gold" nugget there.  It's an easy thing to find in about 30 seconds.  

 

Allen doesn't need to be surrounded by studs.  OMG, see you're back on this crusade that if we somehow had Jerry Rice and Megatron that we wouldn't lose.

 

I'm trying to say there's alot more to it than that.  Our defense lacks a game changer up front, maybe Ed or Groot take a leap into that category.  Until then, or we find 1/2 lock down corners....we are behind these other teams on defense.  And injuries have hurt us more than our competitors (KC and Cincy) on defense.

 

I know your MO is to start throwing insults when someone doesn't agree with you, after multiple posts.  That's fine if that's where you're at now.

 

You've gone from discussing to a whole different tone in 2 posts.  Moving on...

 

 The Bills lack an All Pro pass rusher.   Sure.   But so did the 2018 Patriots, 2019 Chiefs and 2020 Bucs........3 years in a row.   And they beat teams that did have them.  

 

Chris Jones has just 2.5 sacks in 19 career playoff games!  

 

Pardon me that my patience wears thin on these ridiculous McDermott D excuse narratives but has it occurred to you that maybe you are fixated on something just because the Bills don't have that and not because it's what's holding them back?  

 

Not being able to get to these elite QB's has never been the reason that the Bills can't even put up a fight against Burrow or Mahomes.

 

They are just flat-out getting out-coached.

 

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, NewEra said:

i agree that sometimes it is a big issue.  I agree that, under Frazier, the scheme wasn’t challenging enough.  It was a huge issue.  And I agree that he’s making changes on that side of the ball to try and diversify the defense.  I’m sure we both agree that we’re happy about that.  Every coaching staff needs to evolve.  He’s doing that.  
 

 

But the bottom bolded, I think you’re exaggerating.  How did we hold KC to 20

and 17 points in two of the last 3 games we played if they’ve become fish in a barrel?

Maybe Reid and Mahomes weren’t trying that game?  🤷🏻‍♂️ your narrative that Reid/Mahomes always have their way with McD’s D is wrong.  Funny how that always happens when we are healthier and have better players on the field. Beat them in 21 with Tre-  lost to them in 13 seconds without Tre.  Beat then in 22 with Von.  Beat them in 23 with Benford, TB, healthy Douglas.  Lost without them.  

Burrow, well that’s been a different story.  He’s stomped on McDs D.  Ain’t no doubt
 

 

Moving the goalposts.  But I that’s what you’ve done this entire debate.  It’s all based on your dislike for McD.  And that’s all.  You’re entitled.  But it doesn’t mean that you’re right

My dislike of McDermott is no secret. And yes I'm sure it colors my judgement...but it's hardly w out rationale. We don't just play bad defense in the postseason, we play terribly. Like league-worst metrics. It's an issue at full health like the AFCCG and w injuries. And it's consistent enough through multiple DCs and personnel iterations now

 

The defense WILL fall apart in the playoffs. You can take that to the bank. The only remedy I can see at this point is building an overwhelming offense to offset the other side's inevitable collapse. 

 

 

 

[HappyDays]

2 hours ago, NewEra said:

our mlb and player that gave up 2 TDs, was on the couch every Sunday a month prior.  

 

You are aware that Klein didn't force his way onto the field, right? He was on the field in place of another player. A player that came into the game in the 4th quarter and made a couple of stops on his own. Wish we could have seen what that looked like from the start. Again, oh well.

 

This isn't hindsight analysis by the way. I said before the game Dorian Williams should get the start and only be pulled if he looked completely lost. McDermott turtled up and chose the safe comfortable option instead because that's what he does. That's what he'll continue to do. I've made my peace with that and adjusted my personal philosophy on how the team should be built to account for that handicap.

 

Similarly Dane Jackson played like garbage in the divisional round. Douglas was limping around out there. What happened to our 1st round CB that made a game changing INT one week before? McDermott isn't comfortable with him so he rides the bench while the safe known products get do-si-do'd.

 

You want to talk about injuries? In the 2022/2023 playoffs the Chiefs lost Mahomes for an entire quarter of play in the wildcard round and then he played on a high ankle sprain the rest of the playoffs. Their #1 WR played injured and their #3 WR missed the divisional round. They suffered all of this en route to a Super Bowl win. Do you think our LB injuries were more impactful than that?

 

Like I've said, our coaching isn't on par with the competition. We aren't able to overcome some of the things that our main rival can overcome. We will need the offensive talent to clearly outmatch the competition to have a real shot. If we have to win a shootout to get over the playoff hump, so be it. Maybe McDermott will find a way to screw it up anyways, he's done it once before, but it's pretty clearly our best chance.

 

Edited May 15 by HappyDays

[Mikie2times]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I agree that Chris Jones is a stud and the Bills don't have a comparable individual player on the DL.

 

But Bills fans think Chris Jones is way more impactful against the Bills than he actually is.

 

In the 3 wins over Buffalo in the playoffs Chris Jones has a paltry 3 total tackles, 1 TFL and ZERO sacks.

 

Ed Oliver......who all Bills fans will agree hasn't played well against Mahomes in the playoffs..... has 4 tackles, 2 TFL and 1 sack in those same 3 games.

 

The perception is that Jones has made huge impacts.   That's not the truth though.  

Derek Brown led the NFL in tackles for a DT 

8 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

You are aware that Klein didn't force his way onto the field, right? He was on the field in place of another player. A player that came into the game in the 4th quarter and made a couple of stops on his own. Wish we could have seen what that looked like from the start. Again, oh well.

 

This isn't hindsight analysis by the way. I said before the game Dorian Williams should get the start and only be pulled if he looked completely lost. McDermott turtled up and chose the safe comfortable option instead because that's what he does. That's what he'll continue to do. I've made my peace with that and adjusted my personal philosophy on how the team should be built to account for that handicap.

 

Similarly Dane Jackson played like garbage in the divisional round. Douglas was limping around out there. What happened to our 1st round CB that made a game changing INT one week before? McDermott isn't comfortable with him so he rides the bench while the safe known products get do-si-do'd.

 

You want to talk about injuries? In the 2022/2023 playoffs the Chiefs lost Mahomes for an entire quarter of play in the wildcard round and then he played on a high ankle sprain the rest of the playoffs. Their #1 WR played injured and their #3 WR missed the divisional round. They suffered all of this en route to a Super Bowl win. Do you think our LB injuries were more impactful than that?

 

Like I've said, our coaching isn't on par with the competition. We will need the offensive talent to clearly outmatch the competition to have a real shot. If we have to win a shootout to get over the playoff hump, so be it. Maybe McDermott will find a way to screw it up anyways, he's done it once before, but it's pretty clearly our best chance.

 

How about the Bengals have like 2 healthy offensive lineman when they blew us out? 

[HappyDays]

1 hour ago, MasterStrategist said:

And yet, we have fans saying we need better WRs to win?  Which is it?  Is the offense underperforming or the defense?

 

The defense is underperforming which means the offense needs to overperform. Nothing contradictory about that statement at all.

[Malazan]

The debate about a 4th or lower receiver is always a time for popcorn here.

[Rubes]

I don’t even know what the hell this thread is about anymore…

 

[Dr. Who]

3 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

The defense is underperforming which means the offense needs to overperform. Nothing contradictory about that statement at all.

My pal @NewEra thinks folks are forgetting or discounting the crippling injuries on D. I'm not. We came close to beating KC with a decimated defense, but it wouldn't really have been close without a very fortuitous goal line fumble, which was preceded by a desperate and bonehead gamble on a fake punt. Once you hit the division round, with the exception of games against the Ravens, our D folds.

 

Maybe McD evolves. I like him, actually, but there's no denying he is super tight, even in the off-season. Admirable character, dogged, a wrestler, not a genius strategic coach. Maybe he's good, but so far, out-classed in the post-season. I don't see how that is arguable. What we have never really tried is seeing what would happen if you gave your extraordinary franchise qb truly excellent weapons. Folks want to argue about that, that's their prerogative.

 

It appears Brady has a plan to spread the targets around so that no one can focus on WR1, because there isn't one. I think that is mind games to rationalize a step back from what was a mediocre WR room to begin with. Makes it harder for the offense to overperform. Have to hope Kincaid makes a leap from a good rookie year, that the run game becomes a consistent weapon, and that Coleman has a strong initial impact despite being a raw talent. And then better pray there aren't any significant injuries at the top of the bottom third in the league WR room (it's worse than that, probably).

 

I think that's playing for an inside straight. Folks talk about a reset and the salary cap. Trading Diggs and not replacing him, taking on a massive cap hit, letting Davis walk (good), a lot of that was chosen by Beane, and what wasn't is a product of the way he handled the WR room in previous years. He's a hero if it works, but I don't buy extenuating circumstances if it doesn't.

[Freak-O]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 The Bills lack an All Pro pass rusher.   Sure.   But so did the 2018 Patriots, 2019 Chiefs and 2020 Bucs........3 years in a row.   And they beat teams that did have them.  

 

Chris Jones has just 2.5 sacks in 19 career playoff games!  

 

Pardon me that my patience wears thin on these ridiculous McDermott D excuse narratives but has it occurred to you that maybe you are fixated on something just because the Bills don't have that and not because it's what's holding them back?  

 

Not being able to get to these elite QB's has never been the reason that the Bills can't even put up a fight against Burrow or Mahomes.

 

They are just flat-out getting out-coached.

 

If someone had just coached Bass to kick the ball straight instead of wide right…

[Buffalo_Stampede]

53 minutes ago, Freak-O said:

If someone had just coached Bass to kick the ball straight instead of wide right…

I was definitely confident we’d stop Mahomes with over a minute left in the 4th.

[Gunsgoodtime]

3 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I was definitely confident we’d stop Mahomes with over a minute left in the 4th.

Exactly.  That game was lost when they sent Bass out to attempt the kick.  Didn't matter if he made it or not.  

Edited May 15 by Gunsgoodtime

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 hour ago, Gunsgoodtime said:

Exactly.  That game was lost when they sent Bass out to attempt the kick.  Didn't matter if he made it or not.  

Remember, the QB said he didn’t care how much time he left, he wanted the TD. The QB could’ve ran the clock down to zero by taking the shorter pass to Diggs.

Let’s not blame the coaches there. That end sequence was all player error. From Dawkins getting destroyed to Allen getting greedy.

 

Edited May 15 by Buffalo_Stampede

[Realist]

So what page is the last discussion about MVS in this thread, can't seem to find it...

[NewEra]

7 hours ago, Dr. Who said:

My pal @NewEra thinks folks are forgetting or discounting the crippling injuries on D. I'm not. We came close to beating KC with a decimated defense, but it wouldn't really have been close without a very fortuitous goal line fumble, which was preceded by a desperate and bonehead gamble on a fake punt. Once you hit the division round, with the exception of games against the Ravens, our D folds.

 

Maybe McD evolves. I like him, actually, but there's no denying he is super tight, even in the off-season. Admirable character, dogged, a wrestler, not a genius strategic coach. Maybe he's good, but so far, out-classed in the post-season. I don't see how that is arguable. What we have never really tried is seeing what would happen if you gave your extraordinary franchise qb truly excellent weapons. Folks want to argue about that, that's their prerogative.

 

It appears Brady has a plan to spread the targets around so that no one can focus on WR1, because there isn't one. I think that is mind games to rationalize a step back from what was a mediocre WR room to begin with. Makes it harder for the offense to overperform. Have to hope Kincaid makes a leap from a good rookie year, that the run game becomes a consistent weapon, and that Coleman has a strong initial impact despite being a raw talent. And then better pray there aren't any significant injuries at the top of the bottom third in the league WR room (it's worse than that, probably).

 

I think that's playing for an inside straight. Folks talk about a reset and the salary cap. Trading Diggs and not replacing him, taking on a massive cap hit, letting Davis walk (good), a lot of that was chosen by Beane, and what wasn't is a product of the way he handled the WR room in previous years. He's a hero if it works, but I don't buy extenuating circumstances if it doesn't.

I agree 💯 

 

I wasn’t saying McD isn’t without fault.  I’d just like to see how he does in a game without 

 

@GoBills808regarding how many defensive starters we were missing-

milano, Bernard, Tre, Benford, von miller (he played but nowhere near 💯), floyd played 38% of the snaps and was useless, jones was coming back from major injury and wasn’t heard from all game, Dodson managed to play 78% of the snaps on one leg, Douglas almost didn’t play due to his knee injury suffered the previous week, 2nd string MIKE Spector would have been a starter over AJ.  Poyer and Hyde were shells of themselves. But yeah, we were missing 3 players.  4 of 11 starters were out- a would be starter in Spector was out- 5.  That’s almost 50% as I had stated plus several others that had ability changing injuries. 

[NewEra]

8 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

You are aware that Klein didn't force his way onto the field, right? He was on the field in place of another player. A player that came into the game in the 4th quarter and made a couple of stops on his own. Wish we could have seen what that looked like from the start. Again, oh well.

 

This isn't hindsight analysis by the way. I said before the game Dorian Williams should get the start and only be pulled if he looked completely lost. McDermott turtled up and chose the safe comfortable option instead because that's what he does. That's what he'll continue to do. I've made my peace with that and adjusted my personal philosophy on how the team should be built to account for that handicap.

 

Similarly Dane Jackson played like garbage in the divisional round. Douglas was limping around out there. What happened to our 1st round CB that made a game changing INT one week before? McDermott isn't comfortable with him so he rides the bench while the safe known products get do-si-do'd.

 

You want to talk about injuries? In the 2022/2023 playoffs the Chiefs lost Mahomes for an entire quarter of play in the wildcard round and then he played on a high ankle sprain the rest of the playoffs. Their #1 WR played injured and their #3 WR missed the divisional round. They suffered all of this en route to a Super Bowl win. Do you think our LB injuries were more impactful than that?

 

Like I've said, our coaching isn't on par with the competition. We aren't able to overcome some of the things that our main rival can overcome. We will need the offensive talent to clearly outmatch the competition to have a real shot. If we have to win a shootout to get over the playoff hump, so be it. Maybe McDermott will find a way to screw it up anyways, he's done it once before, but it's pretty clearly our best chance.

 

That’s fair-  you don’t like his decisions on who he decided to start.  I didn’t either. I was also hoping for elam and Dorian. From my vantage point sitting at the bar with a beer and not in the clubhouse, I can pretend to know what’s best too.  Problem being, we can’t see much from the bar.  We don’t know if dorian was able to play Mike efficiently and call the plays.  
 

and like I’ve said forever-  I agree, our coaching isn’t on par with KC.  I also don’t think there’s a team in the league that is on par with them.  Hence back to back SBs with below average WR units 

[BarleyNY]

9 hours ago, Mikie2times said:

How about the Bengals have like 2 healthy offensive lineman when they blew us out? 

Whoa there! Injuries are only a valid excuse for the Bills on TBD. Ditto any impact that refereeing has on the outcome of the game. 

[Augie]

8 hours ago, Rubes said:

I don’t even know what the hell this thread is about anymore…

 

 

I just checked the title, and was surprised to learn that it’s not whining about McD, but that tends to be where most things end up.