WR trade candidates, who do you want?

[Einstein's Dog]

2 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

Well there you go.  You tell us you don’t know much about a guy but he’s the answer to you.  Because he ran fast on one play.  So did Beebe.  Was he the “#1” back in the day?

 

Training camp can’t get here soon enough.

 

 

Really, it surprises you that someone might get excited about this team with DK Metcalf on it, even if they didn't watch a lot of Seattle games?  Why don't you ask Brady or McD if they would like a player that doesn't take plays off.

 

Metcalf does have prior 1,000+ seasons.  He would be our top rated WR by a lot.  That much we can know without knowing much about the guy.

 

One of the advantages of Metcalf over the veterans is that the Bills offensive playmakers would be set for several years.  A start of phase 2, DK Metcalf with new multi-year contract, K Coleman for 4 years, Kincaid for 4, Samuel for 3, Cook for 2, Shakir for 2.  That's a transitional reload, not a rebuild.  

[oldmanfan]

3 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

Really, it surprises you that someone might get excited about this team with DK Metcalf on it, even if they didn't watch a lot of Seattle games?  Why don't you ask Brady or McD if they would like a player that doesn't take plays off.

 

Metcalf does have prior 1,000+ seasons.  He would be our top rated WR by a lot.  That much we can know without knowing much about the guy.

 

One of the advantages of Metcalf over the veterans is that the Bills offensive playmakers would be set for several years.  A start of phase 2, DK Metcalf with new multi-year contract, K Coleman for 4 years, Kincaid for 4, Samuel for 3, Cook for 2, Shakir for 2.  That's a transitional reload, not a rebuild.  

It should surprise me that someone who has little knowledge of a player would somehow come to the conclusion that he’s the answer to a question they dream up in their mind.  But I’ve been around Bills fans long enough to not be surprised by anything anymore.

[Einstein's Dog]

8 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

It should surprise me that someone who has little knowledge of a player would somehow come to the conclusion that he’s the answer to a question they dream up in their mind.  But I’ve been around Bills fans long enough to not be surprised by anything anymore.

Only the most steadfast, blind, Bills fans would even consider the Bills WR room as anything even approaching average at this point.  The hope of this thread is to go into the details of what might be needed for a trade.

 

Would the 2025 2nd + 4th plus a salary of a little more than C Ridley's be enough for Metcalf?  Would you give Seattle our 2025 1st?

 

Of the younger ones would you rather have Metcalf or Aiyuk?

 

What about a 2nd for DHop and his reduced salary (that Tenn has eaten)?  It would be a short term 2-3 year deal.

 

What do you think it would take for D Adams, and what kind of salary would you give him?

[oldmanfan]

4 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

Only the most steadfast, blind, Bills fans would even consider the Bills WR room as anything even approaching average at this point.  The hope of this thread is to go into the details of what might be needed for a trade.

 

Would the 2025 2nd + 4th plus a salary of a little more than C Ridley's be enough for Metcalf?  Would you give Seattle our 2025 1st?

 

Of the younger ones would you rather have Metcalf or Aiyuk?

 

What about a 2nd for DHop and his reduced salary (that Tenn has eaten)?  It would be a short term 2-3 year deal.

 

What do you think it would take for D Adams, and what kind of salary would you give him?

Others have pointed out to you that you can’t manipulate the cap the way you think.  You stubbornly refuse to accept that.  And you stubbornly refuse to believe Beane.

 

Would I take an Adams?  Sure.  Can we make the deal you suggest?  Probably not.  I don’t worry about what it would take and so on because Beane isn’t going to do it, so I don’t waste my time worrying about it.

[SCBills]

I just don't really see us making a move for another WR at this point. 

 

We have 3 locks and 2 semi-locks on this roster.

 

They've brought in about 20 people to compete for WR6.

 

I'm certainly hoping for a surprise trade for Aiyuk or DK Metcalf, but I just don't logically see it. 

 

I think the 6/1 money is likely earmarked for another defensive piece, either on the DL or Secondary.. and if Von Miller & Dawuane Smoot show well in their workouts, maybe Beane just holds onto that money. 

 

 

Edited May 15 by SCBills

[Einstein's Dog]

58 minutes ago, SCBills said:

I just don't really see us making a move for another WR at this point. 

 

We have 3 locks and 2 semi-locks on this roster.

 

They've brought in about 20 people to compete for WR6.

 

I'm certainly hoping for a surprise trade for Aiyuk or DK Metcalf, but I just don't logically see it. 

 

I think the 6/1 money is likely earmarked for another defensive piece, either on the DL or Secondary.. and if Von Miller & Dawuane Smoot show well in their workouts, maybe Beane just holds onto that money. 

 

I appear to be in the minority and expect a trade (until it happens and you see all the people come out of the woodwork and say it was obvious).

 

I agree there are 3 locks but none of them are called a top tier WR.  The 7th rookie WR taken (in the 2nd round no less), WR3 from last year, and a less than $10M WR2/3 from Washington.  

 

To me, it's logical to get a top WR for 2024.  There is this huge hole at WR1 and it will also be there for 2025.  So take care of it now -prices just go up.  Also if you get one of the young ones you solidify the offense for several years.  A real phase 2 reload.

 

The main reason so many logical posters here think it won't happen is because of what Beane says.  Even so far as to elicit the "literally 0% chance" quote.  I think a lot of people misinterpret (in a way Beane wants them to) things like "don't expect a trade".  It's setting low expectations.  People have claimed Beane said 'there will be no trade".  I didn't hear this but even if he said it, obviously it doesn't mean no trade ever.  There is an implied time period on that.  The cap excuse is being exposed for the fraud that it is, Tre money coming in and plenty of future cap space is available.

 

Even if you expect a trade, the player will be a surprise.  I put in my top 4 guesses/hopes- Metcalf/Aiyuk/DHop/D Adams.  Any of those would bring Beane back into my good graces.

[SCBills]

4 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I appear to be in the minority and expect a trade (until it happens and you see all the people come out of the woodwork and say it was obvious).

 

I agree there are 3 locks but none of them are called a top tier WR.  The 7th rookie WR taken (in the 2nd round no less), WR3 from last year, and a less than $10M WR2/3 from Washington.  

 

To me, it's logical to get a top WR for 2024.  There is this huge hole at WR1 and it will also be there for 2025.  So take care of it now -prices just go up.  Also if you get one of the young ones you solidify the offense for several years.  A real phase 2 reload.

 

The main reason so many logical posters here think it won't happen is because of what Beane says.  Even so far as to elicit the "literally 0% chance" quote.  I think a lot of people misinterpret (in a way Beane wants them to) things like "don't expect a trade".  It's setting low expectations.  People have claimed Beane said 'there will be no trade".  I didn't hear this but even if he said it, obviously it doesn't mean no trade ever.  There is an implied time period on that.  The cap excuse is being exposed for the fraud that it is, Tre money coming in and plenty of future cap space is available.

 

Even if you expect a trade, the player will be a surprise.  I put in my top 4 guesses/hopes- Metcalf/Aiyuk/DHop/D Adams.  Any of those would bring Beane back into my good graces.

 

I look at the numbers we have competing for WR6 and just think they're planning not to.  That's my thinking on why I don't expect it. 

 

Because I definitely don't take anything Beane says at face value.  i.e. "no big fish", immediately signs Von Miller a day later.  

 

It does seem logical that if we are planning on bringing in a big fish next year at WR, that we should probably explore doing it this year.  Giving up a pick and shifting money around is completely worthwhile if they are planning on doing it anyway.  Why leave that bullet out of the chamber for one of Allen's prime years simply because it saves you a pick and provides you a slightly cleaner cap outlook?

[Einstein's Dog]

5 hours ago, The Jokeman said:

Okay, While likely not going to happen but I didn't see anyone name them but two WRs that I would trade for are Garrett Wilson or Chris Olave. 

Excellent WRs but I didn't consider them for the following reasons:

 

1.  Garrett Wilson - first, being a NYJ makes it unlikely, second they are all-in for this year so they want everyone.  Management may get fired if they don't make the playoffs.  The Jets don't seem like candidates to move a good WR.

2.  C Olave - he is the main man now in New Orleans.  They think they have a chance in the poor NFC South.  They got rid of M Thomas.

 

So, yes, I while I would love to get one of them, I would be very surprised if Beane could pull it off.  

[DJB]

 

[CSBill]

To the thread question: No one. Read the Rockpile Review posted by Shaw.

[BADOLBILZ]

On 5/15/2024 at 12:49 PM, SCBills said:

 

I look at the numbers we have competing for WR6 and just think they're planning not to.  That's my thinking on why I don't expect it. 

 

Because I definitely don't take anything Beane says at face value.  i.e. "no big fish", immediately signs Von Miller a day later.  

 

It does seem logical that if we are planning on bringing in a big fish next year at WR, that we should probably explore doing it this year.  Giving up a pick and shifting money around is completely worthwhile if they are planning on doing it anyway.  Why leave that bullet out of the chamber for one of Allen's prime years simply because it saves you a pick and provides you a slightly cleaner cap outlook?

 

 

The reason I don't think Beane will trade for a top WR is because he's consistently dropped the ball with adding pass catchers.

 

After the AFCCG loss in 2020 he cited the Bills lack of speed at the position as a key reason why.............then subsequently signed the slow Manny Sanders as his only WR move.

 

Each offseason since has just been another compromise at the position as they've gotten consistently worse there.   

[GunnerBill]

12 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

The reason I don't think Beane will trade for a top WR is because he's consistently dropped the ball with adding pass catchers.

 

After the AFCCG loss in 2020 he cited the Bills lack of speed at the position as a key reason why.............then subsequently signed the slow Manny Sanders as his only WR move.

 

Each offseason since has just been another compromise at the position as they've gotten consistently worse there.   

 

He talks about speed every January. Then drafts chain movers when it gets to April. Odd. 

[Kirby Jackson]

18 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He talks about speed every January. Then drafts chain movers when it gets to April. Odd. 

I think that is one of my biggest frustrations. I’m a big believer in speed. The Bills almost believe the opposite. I’m okay with balance but need speed and explosiveness. They should be a little better after the catch but still haven’t prioritized speed enough for my liking.

[boyst]

You last few posters have nailed it.

[Einstein's Dog]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

The reason I don't think Beane will trade for a top WR is because he's consistently dropped the ball with adding pass catchers.

 

After the AFCCG loss in 2020 he cited the Bills lack of speed at the position as a key reason why.............then subsequently signed the slow Manny Sanders as his only WR move.

 

Each offseason since has just been another compromise at the position as they've gotten consistently worse there.   

I think Beane is an excellent GM and it is really the basis for me thinking he has planned to add a prime WR all along.  He didn't drop the ball at all when he traded for Diggs - it was a brilliant move that elevated the Bills into contender status for the next 4 years.  He should do it again.

 

The graphic above showed how little money the Bills have currently invested in the WR room.  And if a similar one was done for RBs the Bills would once again be at the bottom (Cook/Davis/Ty).  The Bills should be spending money on playmakers someplace and that would be at WR (sorry Shaw they are not all the same).

 

I think Aiyuk has taken the lead as most likely.  The Bills may have a gentlemens agreement with SF.  SF double dipped at WR with one in the 1st round.  

[Einstein's Dog]

3 hours ago, CSBill said:

To the thread question: No one. Read the Rockpile Review posted by Shaw.

Are you saying you don't want another WR?  That you don't want to add an Aiyuk/Metcalf because it would hurt the strategy as laid out by Shaw? 

 

And what exactly was that strategy, not to invest in WRs while we already don't invest in RBs.  So where exactly should we put this money?

[Warriorspikes51]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He talks about speed every January. Then drafts chain movers when it gets to April. Odd. 

I agree, however Samuel and MVS are both explosive players.   Samuel has one of the very fastest releases off the line in the entire league per analytics/next gen tracking.  MVS is a legit deep threat.  Has previously led the league with a 20.9 ypc avg in a season 

[Einstein's Dog]

6 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

I agree, however Samuel and MVS are both explosive players.   Samuel has one of the very fastest releases off the line in the entire league per analytics/next gen tracking.  MVS is a legit deep threat.  Has previously led the league with a 20.9 ypc avg in a season 

What would you give up for Aiyuk?  You mentioned earlier you would go with a 1st+ for Metcalf.

 

How do you rate my 4 top contenders - Aiyuk/Metcalf/DHop/D Adams?

[Kirby Jackson]

16 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

I agree, however Samuel and MVS are both explosive players.   Samuel has one of the very fastest releases off the line in the entire league per analytics/next gen tracking.  MVS is a legit deep threat.  Has previously led the league with a 20.9 ypc avg in a season 

He still averages 10.7 YPC in his career. For context, Cole Beasley is 10.3 YPC in his career.

[BADOLBILZ]

24 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I think Beane is an excellent GM and it is really the basis for me thinking he has planned to add a prime WR all along.  He didn't drop the ball at all when he traded for Diggs - it was a brilliant move that elevated the Bills into contender status for the next 4 years.  He should do it again.

 

The graphic above showed how little money the Bills have currently invested in the WR room.  And if a similar one was done for RBs the Bills would once again be at the bottom (Cook/Davis/Ty).  The Bills should be spending money on playmakers someplace and that would be at WR (sorry Shaw they are not all the same).

 

I think Aiyuk has taken the lead as most likely.  The Bills may have a gentlemens agreement with SF.  SF double dipped at WR with one in the 1st round.  

 

 

The Diggs trade worked out but it was the culmination of 3 prior offseasons of failure at addressing WR1.    They had to trade for a vet at the worst possible time(a WR deep draft) because there was no longer any margin for error.    He's just refused to get out of front of the problem.  

 

I know we are in agreement on the issue.  The likelihood is that priority #1 going into next offseason will again likely be finding a WR1 so not addressing it now if they have the opportunity makes no sense.

 

Everyone feels brave about what they have on their roster until the pads come on and it becomes clear that you need to win matchups.    Kincaid was a dink-and-dunk option last season and could just as easily turn into Jimmy Graham with Seattle if he has a CB on him every play instead of those favorable S/LB matchups.   Curtis Samuel isn't going to have much success against the high pedigree CB1's in this division.    All it takes is not having somebody to soak up the "Sauce" to create bad matchups for the rest of the group.