Is it true the Bills didn’t “do enough” at WR to compete for championships?

[PBF81]

57 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

We don't know yet if Shakir can step up? That's an unknown.  We don’t know what we're going to get from Coleman.  That's another unknown.  Has Cook done enough in the off season to improve his brutal td drops? Really the only 2 semi guarantees are that Kincaid and Samuel should perform well.  But Kincaid is nowhere at the level of Kelce, Kittle or Andrews yet. So there is promise but also unknowns.

 

Factor in whether Cook's even up for a full NFL season in running the ball.  Over his last five games his rushing average plummeted from 5.2 to 3.6.  

 

 

[PBF81]

11 minutes ago, benderbender said:

Before it goes down the old road, Brady didn’t need WRs to win championships.

 

Brady was a master at the short-medium high-percentage passing game.  That's why he was so good in large part. 

 

Allen's the worst of the best at that, easily.  With the case we have, he'll have to master that right quickly.  

 

Otherwise, this team has no identity on Offense besides letting Allen run loose when we can't beat teams with our talent differential alone because our offense lacks any creativity and because our defense folds like origami as someone pointed out.

 

The question is why it lacks offensive creativity.  The answer is obvious, some simply have their fingers in their ears and hands over their eyes.  

 

 

Sometimes, often in fact, it's not entirely what you have, it's how you use it.  

 

 

[BillsFan130]

Let's put it this way- What player is going to "scare" other teams for game planning against the Bills?

 

KC- You have to take away Kelce

Balt- You take away Andrews

SF- Pick your poison- all pro after all pro

Det- St brown and if you do, La porta will crush you.

 

Bills don't have a "guy" yet. Hopefully Kincaid will develop into one

[Bills Bud]

They never did enough. Allen has never had the proper weapons to win a Super Bowl, and our group now may be the worse

[PBF81]

17 minutes ago, Bills Bud said:

They never did enough. Allen has never had the proper weapons to win a Super Bowl, and our group now may be the worse

 

He's had enough," but that's only because he's Allen.  Where he hasn't had enough is from the scheming/coaching.  It's done precious little to elevate the play of the Offense.  Rather than the whole being greater than the sum of its parts, we've been fortunate to get the sum of the parts, often less than the sum of the parts.  

 

That's the biggest difference between the teams that advance in the playoffs and us.  

 

Imagine if we had an average QB, not even a poor one, just an average one.  Mayfield, Carr, Murray for example.  Where would we be.  Not where we've been.  

 

 

[BeastMaster]

I do think that we have improved the depth of our receiving group, and we are stronger everywhere besides at the top.

 

This group is more capable and should be more reliable with catching the football overall than last seasons group...particularly the second half of last seasons group where Diggs really wasn't much of a factor.

 

How much the loss of a top end boundary receiver will affect the group and Josh as a whole is an unknown, and likely depends on what Coleman can bring to the table. 

[Billl]

2 hours ago, eball said:

 

Weaker than Baltimore and Detroit?  Come on.  St. Brown is a slot receiver.  Baltimore’s offense is always shut down in the playoffs.

 

KC got better with Worthy but who knows when Kelce starts slipping (and Rice is a ?).

 

It’s not an uphill battle at all.  As many have noted, Buffalo’s problem in the playoffs hasn’t been offense — it’s stopping Mahomes and Burrow.

 

Every team on that list has at least 2 pass catchers better than anything Buffalo has.  

[CodeMonkey]

1 hour ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I don't believe it actually, but a lot of you do and are seemingly fine with it.  I can only hope that the lack of uproar over the pathetic WR group doesn't affect the FO and they decide they can get away with rolling this mess out.

 

I believe the "lack of uproar" stems from Beane's statements and a general understanding of the current cap situation, realizing that Beanes hands were tied this upcoming season.  Now you could make a case that an uproar should be made over how the Bills got themselves into this cap situation in the first place.

Edited May 4 by CodeMonkey

[PauleeeWalnuts]

They did not do enough at WR. You have JA17 as your friggin QB, he needs as many targets and downfield threats as possible. Instead you traded away his #1 and his #2 left in FA and really didn’t replace either. Samuel you can argue may replace Davis, but there is definitely no #1 in that building.
 

Knox is invisible, Kincaid has cement hands, Cook drops too many easy balls, and you have no idea what you’re getting from the rookie Coleman. You can’t compete for a championship when the Bills always address the WR position as they do. You can, however, compete for an early playoff exit which they consistently do. 

Edited May 4 by PauleeeWalnuts

[blacklabel]

Yeah, I agree. I mean, is it nice to have a "true #1" WR? Sure, I guess. Is it a necessity? I don't really think so. Diggs has some great moments but when it came down to make or break in the playoffs he wasn't much of a factor save for the 2020 playoffs. 

 

They're gonna have different guys schemed to step up from week to week without worrying about "how do we make sure Diggs gets his 10 targets?" It'll all depend on their opponent and who they think can take advantage the best. They have a number of different players with different skill sets with a pretty creative OC. I really think it's gonna be alright. 

[North Buffalo]

2 hours ago, eball said:

Some of you aren’t understanding this…the players I listed for those teams are those who were their biggest contributors at the WR, TE, and RB positions.  Those groups as a whole are not demonstrably stronger than what the Bills have — in my opinion.

 

KC added Worthy.  Good for them.

 

I think the Bills have plenty to compete for a championship.

 

Depends to me partly on Brady and how well he can design plays... I would argue partly the design makes the passing game.  For me the question is can the Bills run game overcome the receiver deficiencies.

[BADOLBILZ]

 

The Bills haven't started a season with a wide receiving corps without one player who had produced at least a 900 yard season once in their career since the 1980's.  

 

And that didn't end well despite having a 27 year old Jim Kelly at QB..........and was also an era when the run game was more important than the pass game.    You could envision getting by with less at WR then than you can now.

 

But the Bills are back there.    Nobody that's proven that they are more than a complementary piece in an NFL WR corps.

 

Additionally, the bar has been raised.   There has been a huge influx of WR talent in the drafts over the past 5-6.   The Bills don't match up well to other contending WR corps.   

[BADOLBILZ]

7 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

Depends to me partly on Brady and how well he can design plays... I would argue partly the design makes the passing game.  For me the question is can the Bills run game overcome the receiver deficiencies.

 

 

The NFL is a matchup league.  

 

A well designed offense helps but if you don't have matchup winners NFL DC's will figure out very quickly how to force you to play to your weaknesses.  

 

[transient]

I think the Chiefs the last 2 years have been a bit of an anomaly in that Kelce and Mahomes have been able to overcome an otherwise lackluster WR room. Without their defense last season they would have been a sub 0.500 team. 

 

Personally, I don't think the Bills came into the offseason intending to trade Diggs, I think something forced their hands insofar as if they didn't do it NOW he would have lost all value to them on the field in 2024 and as a trade chip next offseason. I think this WR room with Diggs would have been fine, even if Brady only used Diggs to draw coverage away from other receiving options, and I think the plan would then have been to replace him next offseason.

 

Unfortunately, the Bills are going into 2024 with a Diggs size hole in their roster.  I'm personally not down on them for not drafting more WRs in this draft. If they didn't have a 1st or 2nd round grade on someone and/or think they could contribute THIS season, with so many holes elsewhere on the roster, drafting someone they didn't believe in for the sake of shutting the fans up would have made things worse.

 

I do think the WR corps is more well-rounded at the bottom of the group than in past seasons but given the lack of talent at the top of the roster I think this is destined to be a down year on offense. I think those assuming Shakir will make this meteoric rise to replace Diggs are going to be met with the same disappointment we had when Davis continued to prove he was not a legitimate WR2 when/if he's asked to draw the coverage Diggs used to.

 

Like it or not, I think they're going to have to be more deliberate on offense and bleed the clock to some degree. I think Brady is going to have to be creative and use the talent at hand to the best of their ability. And I think it's going to be ugly for the first half of the season at least. This is obviously not going to be the most complete or deepest team of the Allen era. Hopefully they can put together a gritty, successful season despite that. I'm expecting a lot of white knuckle football this season.

 

What do I know, though. Maybe their intent is instead of beating coverage in 2024 they'll just run them over at the line and WRs will be running free all over the field...

[FireChans]

14 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

The Bills haven't started a season with a wide receiving corps without one player who had produced at least a 900 yard season once in their career since the 1980's.  

 

And that didn't end well despite having a 27 year old Jim Kelly at QB..........and was also an era when the run game was more important than the pass game.    You could envision getting by with less at WR then than you can now.

 

But the Bills are back there.    Nobody that's proven that they are more than a complementary piece in an NFL WR corps.

 

Additionally, the bar has been raised.   There has been a huge influx of WR talent in the drafts over the past 5-6.   The Bills don't match up well to other contending WR corps.   

There’s no reason to get this in-depth with your analysis.

 

This topic is a precursor to @eball’s December 2024 magnum opus, “Keon Coleman wasn’t a 1000 yard receiver because Bills fans didn’t believe in him enough.”

[90sBills]

3 hours ago, eball said:

Some of you aren’t understanding this…the players I listed for those teams are those who were their biggest contributors at the WR, TE, and RB positions.  Those groups as a whole are not demonstrably stronger than what the Bills have — in my opinion.

 

KC added Worthy.  Good for them.

 

I think the Bills have plenty to compete for a championship.

 

I think you’re missing the point of what a great qb can do to elevate his weapons. So on paper KC’s weapons have been meh the last two years but they’ve won it all due in large to their qb. 
 

Same can be said of Allen and this current Bills group. 

[Shortchaz]

If the defense is good enough it doesn’t matter who’s playing wr. I.e. if the defense improves the wr’s we have are good enough. 

[Mat68]

Second rd Rb, First rd tightend after paying one top 10 money.  Second Rd wr.  Using more draft capital instead of cap space might be the better answer.  Giving Samuel a decent deal pairs well with the rest of the options.  Its different than what they had but doesnt mean worst. 

[Don Otreply]

3 hours ago, Gugny said:

Maybe when PGA Josh starts throwing the ball to guys who are open, instead of waiting for an opportunity to huck it 70 yards, our receivers will start looking better. 

This right here folks ^^^
Josh is not willing to play the short to medium pass game to move the chains, control the clock, keep the opposing offense off the field, and wear out the opposing defenses by the start of the fourth quarter. Imo Josh and the Bills aren’t going to win it all until Josh wraps his brain around this winning formula, notice I did not say don’t throw the long pass, on occasion it’s fine, but it is a very low success percentage option, when the short to medium pass is the much higher success percentage option, just is, like it or not. I so very much hope this happens this season, 

[Dr. Who]

8 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

This right here folks ^^^
Josh is not willing to play the short to medium pass game to move the chains, control the clock, keep the opposing offense off the field, and wear out the opposing defenses by the start of the fourth quarter. Imo Josh and the Bills aren’t going to win it all until Josh wraps his brain around this winning formula, notice I did not say don’t throw the long pass, on occasion it’s fine, but it is a very low success percentage option, when the short to medium pass is the much higher success percentage option, just is, like it or not. I so very much hope this happens this season, 

Well, I hadn't considered the reverse psychology angle on the WR room.