Is it true the Bills didn’t “do enough” at WR to compete for championships?

[eball]

It has been repeated so often how the Bills are “in trouble” at WR because of Beane’s supposed mismanagement of the roster and the losses of Diggs and Davis, that I finally started really looking at what is going on around the league.  I started with the four teams who made the conference championships last season, and who they got there with:  KC, Baltimore, Detroit, and SF.  SF is sort of an anomaly because they are loaded at the skill positions — perhaps the best group in the league.

 

But the other three — a completely different story.

 

Last season:

KC:  Kelce, Rice, Pacheco, and…?

BAL:  Andrews, Flowers, Edwards, OBJ, and…?

DET:  St. Brown, LaPorta, Reynolds, Gibbs, and…?

 

Notice something about all three?  The TE may be the best receiver on the team, and their WR rooms are anything other than “loaded.”

 

The Bills will roll out Kincaid, Coleman, Shakir, Samuel, and Cook…aside from the unknown that is Coleman, this is a group one could very easily argue is more talented than what those other teams put on the field last season while getting to their conference championships.

 

Agree?  Disagree?

 

 

 

Edited May 4 by eball

[BillsFan130]

Potential to be with Kincaid, but he's nowhere near Kelce and Andrews yet. (I think he will be one day)

 

For the final 4 teams as I'll add SF in there- I would much rather SFs, Detroit's and baltimores weapons, And slightly would take Kcs just cause the Kelce factor

[GASabresIUFan]

You can’t really include Rice for KC because he is going to jail.  However, you need to add Worthy.

 

I think you should add GB to your list and Houston.  

Edited May 4 by GASabresIUFan

[Bill from NYC]

Well for starters, you omitted first round pick Detroit Lions WR Jameson Williams and included Gibbs, a running back. Williams is probably one of the fastest men in the NFL.

 

As for your overall post, it is unlikely that the Bills WR group is the most talented of those that you listed. I don't even think that McDermott expects them to be. A huge amount of their production is more due too Josh Allen than it is to their skills.  

 

Jmo.

[NoSaint]

4 minutes ago, GASabresIUFan said:

You can’t really include Rice for KC because he is going to jail.  However, you need to add Worthy.

 

I think you should add GB to your list and Houston.  

He’s comparing this years bills to last years contenders not this years contenders

16 minutes ago, eball said:

It has been repeated so often how the Bills are “in trouble” at WR because of Beane’s supposed mismanagement of the roster and the losses of Diggs and Davis, that I finally started really looking at what is going on around the league.  I started with the four teams who made the conference championships last season:  KC, Baltimore, Detroit, and SF.  SF is sort of an anomaly because they are loaded at the skill positions — perhaps the best group in the league.

 

But the other three — a completely different story.

 

KC:  Kelce, Rice, Pacheco, and…?

BAL:  Andrews, Flowers, Edwards, OBJ, and…?

DET:  St. Brown, LaPorta, Reynolds, Gibbs, and…?

 

Notice something about all three?  The TE may be the best receiver on the team, and their WR rooms are anything other than “loaded.”

 

The Bills will roll out Kincaid, Coleman, Shakir, Samuel, and Cook…aside from the unknown that is Coleman, this is a group one could very easily argue is more talented than what those other teams put on the field last season while getting to their conference championships.

 

Agree?  Disagree?

 

 

I think until proven otherwise we are the weakest group on that list

 

but that doesn’t mean it’s an insurmountable gap- Kincaid steps forward, Coleman shows up and we can be in the mix with Josh. 
 

But it underscores that we are a half step behind and it’ll likely be an uphill battle.

[eball]

Some of you aren’t understanding this…the players I listed for those teams are those who were their biggest contributors at the WR, TE, and RB positions.  Those groups as a whole are not demonstrably stronger than what the Bills have — in my opinion.

 

KC added Worthy.  Good for them.

 

I think the Bills have plenty to compete for a championship.

 

[Bill from NYC]

1 minute ago, eball said:

Some of you aren’t understanding this…the players I listed for those teams are those who were their biggest contributors at the WR, TE, and RB positions.  Those groups as a whole are not demonstrably stronger than what the Bills have — in my opinion.

 

KC added Worthy.  Good for them.

 

I think the Bills have plenty to compete for a championship.

 

Fine but the thread title does not indicate this.

[eball]

4 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

He’s comparing this years bills to last years contenders not this years contenders

I think until proven otherwise we are the weakest group on that list

 

but that doesn’t mean it’s an insurmountable gap- Kincaid steps forward, Coleman shows up and we can be in the mix with Josh. 
 

But it underscores that we are a half step behind and it’ll likely be an uphill battle.

 

Weaker than Baltimore and Detroit?  Come on.  St. Brown is a slot receiver.  Baltimore’s offense is always shut down in the playoffs.

 

KC got better with Worthy but who knows when Kelce starts slipping (and Rice is a ?).

 

It’s not an uphill battle at all.  As many have noted, Buffalo’s problem in the playoffs hasn’t been offense — it’s stopping Mahomes and Burrow.

 

[Fan in Chicago]

9 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

He’s comparing this years bills to last years contenders not this years contenders

 

Thats not clear but imo, the pass catchers on the Bills right now are better than those for the Chiefs last year

6 minutes ago, eball said:

 

 

I think the Bills have plenty to compete for a championship.

 

I totally disagree with you. We are still missing one WR piece. No amount of comparison of this years versus last years players will convince me otherwise. We may have stocked up on overall receivers who can catch the same number of passes, but we still dont have the required element of speed. Yet again, we will be relying on Allen buying time to wait until someone deep gets open. Good progress this off season but not enough.

 

Also, @eball your thread is a repeat and you could have added to this one instead: 

 

[FireChans]

29 minutes ago, eball said:

It has been repeated so often how the Bills are “in trouble” at WR because of Beane’s supposed mismanagement of the roster and the losses of Diggs and Davis, that I finally started really looking at what is going on around the league.  I started with the four teams who made the conference championships last season, and who they got there with:  KC, Baltimore, Detroit, and SF.  SF is sort of an anomaly because they are loaded at the skill positions — perhaps the best group in the league.

 

But the other three — a completely different story.

 

Last season:

KC:  Kelce, Rice, Pacheco, and…?

BAL:  Andrews, Flowers, Edwards, OBJ, and…?

DET:  St. Brown, LaPorta, Reynolds, Gibbs, and…?

 

Notice something about all three?  The TE may be the best receiver on the team, and their WR rooms are anything other than “loaded.”

 

The Bills will roll out Kincaid, Coleman, Shakir, Samuel, and Cook…aside from the unknown that is Coleman, this is a group one could very easily argue is more talented than what those other teams put on the field last season while getting to their conference championships.

 

Agree?  Disagree?

 

 

 

If you think Sam LaPorta is better than ASB, I’ll have what you’re having. 

[LABILLBACKER]

We don't know yet if Shakir can step up? That's an unknown.  We don’t know what we're going to get from Coleman.  That's another unknown.  Has Cook done enough in the off season to improve his brutal td drops? Really the only 2 semi guarantees are that Kincaid and Samuel should perform well.  But Kincaid is nowhere at the level of Kelce, Kittle or Andrews yet. So there is promise but also unknowns.

[SoTier]

I'm with you, eball.   The Bills have actually given Allen at least as many reasonable targets, especially if you include rookie RB Ray Davis, as he's ever had.  Allen won't have an elite WR but he will have a variety of decent or better receiving options.   IMO, a diverse offense is better than a one dimensional offense that can be planned for.

 

SF can afford to have lots of skilled players because they aren't paying Purdy like a franchise QB.  BTW, Miami still hasn't extended Tua, so they can still afford Hill, Waddle and now Odell.

[Mat68]

Comes down to Shakir and Kincaid.  If they maintain some of their efficiency with more volume Buffalo will have a very good offense.  Coleman is the x factor.  If he plays well the offense could be better.  Having top pass catcher also be a plus blocker opens alot up in play action. With smaller defenses and 2 deep coverage Buffalo is going with a more bully style of offense.  

[BarleyNY]

20 minutes ago, eball said:

Some of you aren’t understanding this…the players I listed for those teams are those who were their biggest contributors at the WR, TE, and RB positions.  Those groups as a whole are not demonstrably stronger than what the Bills have — in my opinion.

 

KC added Worthy.  Good for them.

 

I think the Bills have plenty to compete for a championship.

 

 

Not a single one of the four teams that made the conference championship games last season would trade their skill position group (minus QB) for ours. The big difference that immediately jumps out to me is that every one of those teams has at least one blue chip player in the mix. Not to say that one of our players couldn’t develop into one, but we don’t have one yet. Just look at Kelce on KC to see how much that matters. 

[Gugny]

Maybe when PGA Josh starts throwing the ball to guys who are open, instead of waiting for an opportunity to huck it 70 yards, our receivers will start looking better. 

[FireChans]

29 minutes ago, eball said:

Some of you aren’t understanding this…the players I listed for those teams are those who were their biggest contributors at the WR, TE, and RB positions.  Those groups as a whole are not demonstrably stronger than what the Bills have — in my opinion.

 

KC added Worthy.  Good for them.

 

I think the Bills have plenty to compete for a championship.

 

You are wrong.

Edited May 4 by FireChans

[Einstein's Dog]

You don't construct teams headed by the likes of J Goff or B Purdy the same way if you have a Josh "Freakin" Allen! 

 

Josh is arguably one of the best ever at firing 25-30 yard downfield lasers.  And the boundary WRs that are penciled in for 2024 for this extreme talent are 1 rookie?  Are you kidding me? 

 

I don't believe it actually, but a lot of you do and are seemingly fine with it.  I can only hope that the lack of uproar over the pathetic WR group doesn't affect the FO and they decide they can get away with rolling this mess out.

[DCofNC]

1 hour ago, BillsFan130 said:

Potential to be with Kincaid, but he's nowhere near Kelce and Andrews yet. (I think he will be one day)

 

For the final 4 teams as I'll add SF in there- I would much rather SFs, Detroit's and baltimores weapons, And slightly would take Kcs just cause the Kelce factor

Nothing left to say in this thread.  Those teams have far superior weapons, especially SF and Det. 

22 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

You don't construct teams headed by the likes of J Goff or B Purdy the same way if you have a Josh "Freakin" Allen! 

 

Josh is arguably one of the best ever at firing 25-30 yard downfield lasers.  And the boundary WRs that are penciled in for 2024 for this extreme talent are 1 rookie?  Are you kidding me? 

 

I don't believe it actually, but a lot of you do and are seemingly fine with it.  I can only hope that the lack of uproar over the pathetic WR group doesn't affect the FO and they decide they can get away with rolling this mess out.

Agree and disagree.  Those teams are built with talent that takes pressure off the QB.  You still should build a team to do that for Allen.  At this point, they have provided him less than Mahomes to work with and a Defense we know will fold like origami when it matters.  JA has to win the game before the last drives bc the team will lose 85% of the time if he doesn’t.   This is why the record has looked great when the blow teams out and mediocre when the teams they play don’t suck on O.

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, eball said:

Notice something about all three?  The TE may be the best receiver on the team, and their WR rooms are anything other than “loaded.”

 

The Bills will roll out Kincaid, Coleman, Shakir, Samuel, and Cook…aside from the unknown that is Coleman, this is a group one could very easily argue is more talented than what those other teams put on the field last season while getting to their conference championships.

 

Agree?  Disagree?

 

 

 

 

What else do you notice about all three that may be the primary difference?  

 

HINT:  particularly that we're talking about TE & Receivers more generally.  

 

 

[benderbender]

Before it goes down the old road, Brady didn’t need WRs to win championships.

 

He just needed a deflator, other teams playbooks, illegal substitutions/formations that weren’t illegal for them but made illegal the next season, video tapes of opponents practices, and TB12/doctor who wasn’t an actual doctor to provide supplements.