Why does Beane get a pass?

[HaldimandBills]

3 hours ago, FireChans said:

I think it's mostly Josh Allen/McD. Then again, I think Josh Allen is clear and away the second best QB in the league, and McD a top 10 coach in the regular season, at least. That's a recipe for a lot of wins, regardless of the teams' overall talent level.  We just have to look at the other great coach/great QB combos. Reid/Mahomes. BB/Brady. Their teams always fluctuate in talent, that's the NFL.  They usually still win a lot.

 

Where do you rank the 2024 Bills in regards to talent level in the NFL?  Where do you rank the 2020 Bills?

 

I think the 2024 Bills currently (pre-draft) have probably their worst roster since 2018.  Do you disagree?  I think the 2020 had the best roster of the Beane/McD era.  Do you disagree? How many years do you think it will take to get the Bills to a 2020 team level of talent again? 1? 2? 3?

 

At what point do you watch the GM take total zeros like Elam, Boogie Basham and Cody Ford, overdraft JAGS like Epenesa and Rousseau, take the 4th best DL player in the first round at pick #9, refuse to draft a WR before the 4th round for 4 seasons, all while watching the overall talent of the team circle the drain before you blame him for it?

Outside Diggs this offense is so much more loaded than 2020. Oline is leaps and bounds better. Beane will correct the receiver issue. I have no doubt about that. 

 

On the defensive side 2020 was better but I actually might take the 2024 front 7. That 2020 secondary though was All Pro level.

 

Kinda comes down to Bernard vs. Edmunds. Rosseau vs. Hughes. Epenesa/Miller vs. Addison and Jones vs. Harrison. 

 

Personally I am taking 2024 in every case with Rosseau vs. Hughes being a push and maybe Edmunds ahead of Bernard but its close. 

[FireChans]

34 minutes ago, HaldimandBills said:

Outside Diggs this offense is so much more loaded than 2020.

?????

 

Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Davis, Singletary.

 

Shakir, Samuel, Hollins, Cook.

 

??????????????

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, Don Otreply said:

True enough, but to a great degree our defense has been the reason for this plateau as it were, imo the soft zone / contain defense that worked acceptably for the most part in the regular has been the teams bane come the postseason, and that is on our HC for running back the same post season defensive scheme annually,  for lack of a better description. I like McDermott for the most part, but he has a stubborn streak a mile long…, and imo that’s where the trouble lies. 
 

 

I disagree there. I think personnel, not coaching is the bigger contributor.

[HaldimandBills]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

?????

 

Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Davis, Singletary.

 

Shakir, Samuel, Hollins, Cook.

 

??????????????

Beasley you might have an argument he was damn good that year. 

Brown was injured and done that season.

Davis was a rookie and outside a few sprinkles of flash plays didn't do much.

Singletary is no Cook and did next to nothing. 

Knox was a rookie and useless. 

 

Now let's add a Shakir and Samuel who blow the injured Brown and Rookie Davis socks off. 

Todays Knox destroys rookie Knox.

Kincaid is so much far and away better and more dynamic than the 2020 Tightends and quite honestly will be better than Beasley and allows the Bills to run much more dynamic looks. 

Cook is so much better than Singletary. Singletary just doesn't come close to being anywhere near as dynamic or as much as a game breaker. People forget that Cook was 5th in the NFL in all purpose yards. Singletary goes to bed at night of dreaming in the top 25. 

Oline is better across the board outside center. McGovern is no slouch either. 

Josh Allen is better today than back then.

So basically Diggs vs. to be named receivers. Does 2020 Diggs tilt the scale that much? He was awesome. I think the Bills win a Superbowl in either 2020 or 2021 with that Diggs and the current Bills supporting cast. 

 

I stand by what I said. The 2024 offensive roster is more talented and the 2020 Diggs is the only reason why its within a reach of the 2024 Buffalo Bills who could easily add a Tyler Boyd and Xavier Legette still to this roster and likely will. 

Edited April 6 by HaldimandBills

[Kornfed]

Off topic...sorry...... It feels like a punch in the chest loosing Diggs and I'm an older man. .. Can't imagine what a 10 year old feels.? (he had to go) ........ As far as Beane goes..... You must be Sh....ng me. ... Not perfect but easily best since Polian. ......... Some of us have become jaded. .....  GO BILLS   ...... I'd rather try replacing Diggs than Josh. ..... Ya gotta remember, this is the NFL 2024.

Edited April 6 by Kornfed

[bearstobills]

5 hours ago, Saint Doug said:

Two words: Josh Allen

 

He’d otherwise be middle of the road. 

Two words....Albert Einstein

No theory of relativity, he's just a cut-rate university professor

[Buffalo_Stampede]

We have to let things play out. Everyone misses on players. Bills have been one of the best franchises in the NFL. When that changes then blame can be handed out.

 

 

[GASabresIUFan]

10 hours ago, Sharky7337 said:

Just curious why he is so highly regarded when these issues have come to roost fully

6 playoff appearances in 7 seasons after not appearing in the playoffs for 17 years.  4 straight division titles after not winning the division title since 1995.  That's why he gets a pass so far.

 

Also he brought in All-pro caliber players like Hyde, Poyer, Morse, and Diggs.  He also drafted current starters Kincaid, Oliver, Torrence, Cook, Allen, Shakir, Rousseau, Brown, Taron Johnson, and Benford, plus solid role players like Epenesa, Phillips (now a starter on his new team), Davis, Knox, Singletary, Moss, Dane Jackson and Neal. 

 

Face-it, Beane has done a very good job, and has been the Bills best GM since Polian.  

Edited April 6 by GASabresIUFan

[Utah John]

Beane assembled the team that was poised to win the Super Bowl in the 13 seconds season.  It isn't his fault the coaches choked.  

 

And that team was not built at the expense of the future.  There were very few expensive rental players, people whose contracts stuck around long after they left.  The only real exception to that rule was the Von Miller signing, which McDermott insisted on because of, you guessed it, the 13 second debacle, where McD implied the reason for the loss was the lack of a pass rushing closer.  

 

It's very common in today's NFL for mediocre teams to bump along season after season, occasionally making the playoffs but not going very far, and then slipping back into mediocrity.  Beane has kept the Bills in a position to win, year after year. This past year, when the Bills got the #2 seed in the AFC, was actually a down year.  Think about that and then try to recall the drought years.

2 hours ago, FireChans said:

?????

 

Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Davis, Singletary.

 

Shakir, Samuel, Hollins, Cook.

 

??????????????

Did you forget Kincaid?  And really we can't compare the 2024 roster to any others, until we see what the 2024 roster actually turns out to be.

[Nephilim17]

2 hours ago, FireChans said:

?????

 

Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Davis, Singletary.

 

Shakir, Samuel, Hollins, Cook.

 

??????????????

It's really, really disingenuous of you to not list Kincaid there. You don't like Beane, I get it. I don't love him but I'd give him a B. Good but not great so far.

But for you to leave out Kincaid in the list of offensive weapons really says a lot.

[Billy Claude]

58 minutes ago, bearstobills said:

Two words....Albert Einstein

No theory of relativity, he's just a cut-rate university professor

 

Off topic, but actuallllly ....  Albert Einstein made amazing scientific accomplshments totally independent of the theory of relativity.  For example, his Nobel Prize was not for the theory of relativity which was still somewhat controversial at the time.  Einstein would not have, in any way, been a cut-rate university professor even if he never thought about relativity.

 

OK, back to football.

 

 

Edited April 6 by Billy Claude

[bearstobills]

2 minutes ago, Billy Claude said:

 

Off topic, but actuallllly ....  Albert Einstein made amazing scientific accomplshments totally independent of the theory of relativity.  For example, his Nobel Prize was not for the theory of relativity which was still somewhat controversial at the time.  Einstein would not have, in any way, been a cut-rate university professor even if he never thought about relativity.

 

OK, back to football.

 

 

I figured.  I went for the quick joke.  In all honesty, I think Beane is really good at his job.

 

Could you imagine this board if we rolled out K.C.'s receiving corp last year.  They actually traded a premium pick for Toney, and busted with 2nd rounder Sky Moore.  That's not to mention picking CEH in the first round, trading away the best receiver in the league, trading their top cornerback, drafting a first round pass rusher last year who could barely get on the field, etc. etc. But none of it matters because they win.   Their roster, in my opinion, doesn't look any better than ours.  But Mahomes and Kelce just find a way.  So Veach will be lauded on here, and Beane dinged....cuz it's all about the rings.  

[SoTier]

11 hours ago, FireChans said:

I think it's mostly Josh Allen/McD. Then again, I think Josh Allen is clear and away the second best QB in the league, and McD a top 10 coach in the regular season, at least. That's a recipe for a lot of wins, regardless of the teams' overall talent level.  We just have to look at the other great coach/great QB combos. Reid/Mahomes. BB/Brady. Their teams always fluctuate in talent, that's the NFL.  They usually still win a lot.

 

Where do you rank the 2024 Bills in regards to talent level in the NFL?  Where do you rank the 2020 Bills?

 

I think the 2024 Bills currently (pre-draft) have probably their worst roster since 2018.  Do you disagree?  I think the 2020 had the best roster of the Beane/McD era.  Do you disagree? How many years do you think it will take to get the Bills to a 2020 team level of talent again? 1? 2? 3?

 

At what point do you watch the GM take total zeros like Elam, Boogie Basham and Cody Ford, overdraft JAGS like Epenesa and Rousseau, take the 4th best DL player in the first round at pick #9, refuse to draft a WR before the 4th round for 4 seasons, all while watching the overall talent of the team circle the drain before you blame him for it?

 

Nobody can fairly rank the 2024 Bills compared to the rest of the NFL or the 2020 Bills because the 2024 roster is not close to being complete.  

 

 

6 hours ago, FireChans said:

?????

 

Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Davis, Singletary.

 

Shakir, Samuel, Hollins, Cook.

 

??????????????

 

How about Kincaid?   Did you forget about him or did you categorically exclude TEs because the Bills didn't have a good one in 2020?  How about Torrence, McGovern, and Brown?   The OL isn't a flashy unit but if a team doesn't have a good one, its offense is going to be significantly diminished no matter how good the skilled players are.   Beane has built one good enough to allow the Bills to run well, even on third and short or in the red zone, something that the Bills in 2020 couldn't do very well.

[Yantha]

Haven't read all the posts but just replying to the title.

 

He gets a pass because he built a playoff team from nothing.

 

LP Losman anyone?  How about Orton?

 

SINGLE digit win column from 2000-2018?

 

No playoffs?

 

Beane is a very good GM.  

[NoHuddleKelly12]

He’s gotten plenty of criticism around here when earned imho. But you get the franchise QB pick right, you’re a made man, that’s how that works! 🤷🏼‍♂️

[Royale with Cheese]

7 hours ago, FireChans said:

?????

 

Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Davis, Singletary.

 

Shakir, Samuel, Hollins, Cook.

 

??????????????

Holy crap talk about being disingenuous.

I guess Kincaid won’t be used.  

 

Is our roster complete?

 

By your replies, it sounds like you think our offensive line in 2020 was better than now.  Tight Ends were also better.  Running game was better in 2020?

[amprov56]

13 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Beane is not perfect and he is no genius.

I have liked most of his offseason moves over the years. 

I have posted my disagreements with his choices.  In many cases I was proven wrong - Bernard for sure. I hated the Oliver pick and didn't like the extension. Oliver is not a top 10 draft pick talent but he is very good. I hated trading Diggs and I hated Epenesa pick and now extension. 

I actually like the Benjamin trade and the Miller signing. Really like the Knox deal as he was one of my favorites though he simply has not developed.

He has been elite at getting guys to rework their deals.

His two flaws are giving up too many picks moving up in the draft and until this last year he failed at building a OL.

 

The problem is KC has a better team and a better HC. In almost every way we are the Manning/Dungy Colts. Our only hope is Allen can win at least one Lombardi 

Fire everybody!

[Westside]

You can’t question the cult of Beane. 

[Sweats]

......and don't forget Elam.

 

Everybody, get your torches and pitchforks ready for the riots that are sure to come with this draft

[todd]

16 hours ago, Sharky7337 said:

Please provide me with an example outside of Denver and Greenbay that have as much money tied up as us on no production 

 

I think it would be best if you back up your own (silly) argument. Or can't you?