Calling it now: You're all about to witness the arrival of Shakir

[SoonerBillsFan]

Just now, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Absolutely fair points...the way I see it though is that this offense has more talent on it than people give it credit for now and will be adding more talent to the WR group here shortly.  And with the spread the ball around offense we have, its going to be hard for them to key on Shakir maybe much more than they have because Kincaid is likely going to be even better, Samuel is still got to be considered, and whatever outside WR(s) we add are as well like in the draft or maybe by trade (but most likely early in the draft).  

I agree on those points.  We are going to see a better Allen that will gladly spread the ball among all the receivers vs. Having to placate 1 diva

[CouldBe]

I have to add my seldom heard voice to this thread.

I watched Shakir's college  highlights the night before TC in 2022 and hoped for early success. That would of course be unusual in Buffalo.

What i look for in a WR is someone who can catch the ball. He is as good as anyone with this.

What is exciting is the slipperiness after the catch.

Will he be a WR1, who knows? But he will be a weapon that Allen will trust.

[Alphadawg7]

FWIW...Here is Josh Allen, Kyle Allen, and Jordan Palmer with high praise for Shakir and Allen talking about keeping his momentum going this year.  From an interview last week.  

 

CLICK HERE FOR CLIP DISCUSSING SHAKIR

 

The whole interview is a fun one if you want to watch the whole thing.  I clipped the Shakir part which is about 45 seconds, but whole interview is just over 8 minutes.  Josh talks about WR's in the draft, talks up Kincaid and Shakir, and there is a funny golf story between the 3 of them at the end as well.  

 

Below is a link to the full interview if you rather watch the full interview.  High praise for Kincaid was good to hear too, another guy I am excited to see grow now with Diggs and his 160 target volume gone.  

 

 

 

Edited April 5 by Alphadawg7

[Charles Romes]

Shakir is a nice complementary receiver. Let’s not get carried away. 

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

But he isn't a ball dropper, he led the NFL for all receivers in catch rate.  He isn't that vertical outside threat, but neither is Deebo Samuel for example who is actually a ball dropper.  But it is what Deebo can do with the ball in his hands that makes him different.  Its also how dangerous he can be in that short to mid zone.  

 

The bigger issue is his shorter arms when it comes to his down field game, he has a lower margin of error on the throw with a smaller catch radius as he isn't the go up and get it WR Diggs was in his similar sized frame.  But he can still attack the deeper part of the field, especially out of the slot.  And as far as stopping his feet, not sure how a WR 40 yards down field stops his feet without the ball going past them unless its to catch an underthrown ball.  If you haven't already, I encourage you to watch the highlight reel in my OP because he makes a lot of his catches in stride down field and he only stops or comes back on underthrown passes.    

 

 

The highlighted is not what I said.  I said when he was tried deep he was a ball dropper in the 2022 season/postseason.   The drop of the wide open bomb in the WC game versus Miami was brutal.   The concerns about his hands after 4 drops on just 27 targets grew from there when he had a really bad training camp.   And given the great hype,  people were shocked to consider he could already be on the bubble going into year 2.

 

The Bills did a good job of keeping his throws short to intermediate this year.   They just asked him to do what he was good at.   That's how you get the most out of players with limitations.

 

As for what I mean about stopping his feet on DEEP throws..........it's basically the "can you walk and chew gum at the same time" thing with receivers.   Some can track the deep ball and catch it in stride.........others like Shakir have to stop their feet or jump so they can just focus on catching the ball.    On short to intermediate throws Shakir is good at catching the ball and doing it in stride....... but doing it on the deep ball is an aspect that separates those with the highest ceiling from the rest and something you definitely want from an outside receiver.   

 

 

[H2o]

I think he could definitely play that Beasley role we've, Josh has, been missing the last couple of years. Shakir has more ability after the catch than Beasley had though. Tough to say whether he can survive on the outside, facing opposing teams' boundary CB's. You could see the improvement from year one to year two for sure. Can he be Amon Ra? 🤞🤞

Edited April 5 by H2o

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

The highlighted is not what I said.  I said when he was tried deep he was a ball dropper in the 2022 season/postseason.   The drop of the wide open bomb in the WC game versus Miami was brutal.   The concerns about his hands after 4 drops on just 27 targets grew from there when he had a really bad training camp.   And given the great hype,  people were shocked to consider he could already be on the bubble going into year 2.

 

The Bills did a good job of keeping his throws short to intermediate this year.   They just asked him to do what he was good at.   That's how you get the most out of players with limitations.

 

As for what I mean about stopping his feet on DEEP throws..........it's basically the "can you walk and chew gum at the same time" thing with receivers.   Some can track the deep ball and catch it in stride.........others like Shakir have to stop their feet or jump so they can just focus on catching the ball.    On short to intermediate throws Shakir is good at catching the ball and doing it in stride....... but doing it on the deep ball is an aspect that separates those with the highest ceiling from the rest and something you definitely want from an outside receiver.   

 

 

 

Gotcha...misunderstood what you were saying about that, so thanks for clearing that up.  

 

To be clear, I am pretty sure he only had 3 drops as a rookie not 4.  2 in the reg season and the one playoff one you mentioned that was overturned on replay.  But the one everyone harps on is the playoff one.  Except they forget that was a rookie who had just 20 regular season targets in a playoff game catching a bullet rope from Allen that traveled on a rope 60 yards in the air.  Should he have caught it, definitely, and he almost did, ball touched the ground on the roll over.  But should that play now define him forever in terms what he can or can't do?  No.  

 

Make no mistake about it, catching passes from a cannon arm like Allen takes time to adjust to.  Ball gets there way faster and harder than you expect, and it takes reps and time to build up that timing and chemistry.  Ask any WR or QB they will not only tell you the same, but also tell you its even more important than even I am saying.  Shakir got just 20 targets all reg season, he was behind McKenzie and then Cole all year and playoffs.  He wasn't getting a lot of first team reps.  And he was now in his first playoff game catching a 60 yard pass on a rope from Allen.  Still should have caught it, just saying maybe lets not define his career arc on what he can or can't do on this one single play.  Its not like Diggs, Hill, Jefferson, etc haven't dropped easier passes than this one too, it happens.  

 

As far as training camp...I know that you and I both know that camp reports are useless and people get overly excited or down every camp over them.  Perfect example...Shakir vs Gabe Davis.  Davis was once again the "star" of camp and an unstoppable monster this same camp.  How did that play out for Davis?  Still meh...still dropping passes.  Still disappeared.  Meanwhile couple drops were mentioned out of the thousands of reps and drills they run in camp by Shakir and now everyone was like he sucks, cant catch, is nothing but a 4th or 5th WR who then goes out and leads the NFL in catch rate and led the Bills in receiving under Joe Brady.  

 

So yeah...lets not talk about camp news as if that is any indicator of anything.  I know you feel the same way about that because you get mad when people were believing the hype on Davis or amping up some camp fodder scrub.  

 

And for the record...I agree with the bolded too above.  Keep in mind, I am not claiming him to be a boundary WR, just saying he will be more than a typical slot WR and can move around.  

 

Edited April 6 by Alphadawg7

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Gotcha...misunderstood what you were saying about that, so thanks for clearing that up.  

 

To be clear, I am pretty sure he only had 3 drops as a rookie not 4.  2 in the reg season and the one playoff one you mentioned that was overturned on replay.  But the one everyone harps on is the playoff one.  Except they forget that was a rookie who had just 20 regular season targets in a playoff game catching a bullet rope from Allen that traveled on a rope 60 yards in the air.  Should he have caught it, definitely, and he almost did, ball touched the ground on the roll over.  But should that play now define him forever in terms what he can or can't do?  No.  

 

Make no mistake about it, catching passes from a cannon arm like Allen takes time to adjust to.  Ball gets there way faster and harder than you expect, and it takes reps and time to build up that timing and chemistry.  Ask any WR or QB they will not only tell you the same, but also tell you its even more important than even I am saying.  Shakir got just 20 targets all reg season, he was behind McKenzie and then Cole all year and playoffs.  He wasn't getting a lot of first team reps.  And he was now in his first playoff game catching a 60 yard pass on a rope from Allen.  Still should have caught it, just saying maybe lets not define his career arc on what he can or can't do on this one single play.  Its not like Diggs, Hill, Jefferson, etc haven't dropped easier passes than this one too, it happens.  

 

As far as training camp...I know that you and I both know that camp reports are useless and people get overly excited or down every camp over them.  Perfect example...Shakir vs Gabe Davis.  Davis was once again the "star" of camp and an unstoppable monster this same camp.  How did that play out for Davis?  Still meh...still dropping passes.  Still disappeared.  Meanwhile couple drops were mentioned out of the thousands of reps and drills they run in camp by Shakir and now everyone was like he sucks, cant catch, is nothing but a 4th or 5th WR who then goes out and leads the NFL in catch rate and led the Bills in receiving under Joe Brady.  

 

So yeah...lets not talk about camp news as if that is any indicator of anything.  I know you feel the same way about that because you get mad when people were believing the hype on Davis or amping up some camp fodder scrub.  

 

And for the record...I agree with the bolded too above.  Keep in mind, I am not claiming him to be a boundary WR, just saying he will be more than a typical slot WR and can move around.  

 

 

 

Like I said, my rationale is based on Shakir not having made these plays.   I'm not presuming he couldn't possibly get better but the good tape isn't there.   And instead some bad tape is.  

 

You make an interesting point about the bullets that Allen throws.   Allen can reach parts of the field with low trajectory bullets that maybe no other QB can.......and that trait can elevate a receiver if they can catch a 40 yard rope.

 

Early on Allen's range made the field huge for a guy like Gabe Davis and allowed him to really press coverage deep and then comeback to huge open spaces that CB's weren't used to having to defend.   Aided Diggs greatly as well.   But that gave a false read on Davis' potential.   Coverage adapted to his limited route tree, exposed his inability to catch contested passes etc..

 

Not having players who can take advantage of Allen's rather unique arm talent makes Allen less special as a passer.    That's what we saw last season.......he just covered for it by running the ball to keep the chains moving.

 

What Shakir does well translates more to the league in general than what Davis can do but it's also stuff that maybe a Brock Purdy could do just as well or better than Allen.   If Shakir could add the ability to track and catch those low trajectory, high rpm deep throws that would make him far more valuable to the Bills.  

 

As it stands the Bills don't really have ANY WR that can help them take advantage of Allen's arm talent.       

[Alphadawg7]

35 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Like I said, my rationale is based on Shakir not having made these plays.   I'm not presuming he couldn't possibly get better but the good tape isn't there.   And instead some bad tape is.  

 

You make an interesting point about the bullets that Allen throws.   Allen can reach parts of the field with low trajectory bullets that maybe no other QB can.......and that trait can elevate a receiver if they can catch a 40 yard rope.

 

Early on Allen's range made the field huge for a guy like Gabe Davis and allowed him to really press coverage deep and then comeback to huge open spaces that CB's weren't used to having to defend.   Aided Diggs greatly as well.   But that gave a false read on Davis' potential.   Coverage adapted to his limited route tree, exposed his inability to catch contested passes etc..

 

Not having players who can take advantage of Allen's rather unique arm talent makes Allen less special as a passer.    That's what we saw last season.......he just covered for it by running the ball to keep the chains moving.

 

What Shakir does well translates more to the league in general than what Davis can do but it's also stuff that maybe a Brock Purdy could do just as well or better than Allen.   If Shakir could add the ability to track and catch those low trajectory, high rpm deep throws that would make him far more valuable to the Bills.  

 

As it stands the Bills don't really have ANY WR that can help them take advantage of Allen's arm talent.       

Nice post, really good actually, and I’m on the same page with most of this and agree with what you are saying.  
 

Admittedly, I think the only major difference is I have a higher level of confidence in Shakir being able to be capable to make some of those down field plays moving forward.  
 

And to just make sure there is no confusion, I am not projecting him to be that boundary deep type WR or even that he would play a lot there.  But I do think he can be a Deebo Samuel type WR with better hands.  Someone who is a menace in the short to mid areas of the field who is a dangerous YAC player and has the speed and savvy to take it up field or even to the house. 
 

I have no delusion, our future boundary and WR1 is coming from this draft.  And I think it’s plausible we take a second WR on day 3 who can play on the boundary.  

[Scott7975]

Why do people do these “calling it now” or whatever other corny stuff type headings. Like just make a normal thread. This adds nothing except that maybe you have some possibility of looking like a fool down the road. People call ya fool and move on. Less manufactured drama. More better posts. 
 

I was banging the table last season that Shakir was our most explosive receiver on the team. 

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

6 hours ago, Charles Romes said:

Shakir is a nice complementary receiver. Let’s not get carried away. 

Bills fans always get carried away … they’ve got Justin Shorter in the HOF 😂

[HOUSE]

This is a risky prediction 😬 

[TBBills Fan]

[Toyo321]

He will have a chance to prove it in 2024,  that is all up to him & Josh.

 

Enough said.

[ColoradoBills]

Not sure I understand why there is this need for one of the Bills WRs to take over as the primary target and needing to amass a bunch of yards.

I feel that Josh Allen is best when he distributes the ball more evenly.  There have been times that has happened, and it was successful.

 

Spread the ball around this season.  Shakir will get his targets but doesn't need 100+ of them.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Hope you are right.  Shakir does a lot of things well, most notably catching the dam football. The problem will be Kincaid and Shakir will compete for similar routes and touches.  I could easily see Shakir catching more passes than Samuel especially if they draft a true#1.  I could see Shakir and Samuel both right around 70 catches with the rookie maybe getting 40 or so.  Diggs and Davis combined for 152 receptions and the spare parts of Sherfield and Harty added 26 in 2023.   Kincaid had 73 and Knox only 22 missing several games.  If you figure Knox gets closer to 35 and Kincaid maybe gets 75, then you can easily get Shakir and Samuel around 70.  This takes the pressure off the rookie in year 1 but still gives him room to contribute.    

[akcash]

Best case scenario he is Fred Jackson at WR, which would be great.

[muppy]

22 minutes ago, akcash said:

Best case scenario he is Fred Jackson at WR, which would be great.

I would take a Fred Jackson clone at WR any day and twice on Sunday 🙂 yep!

[BrainwashedBillsFan]

On 4/4/2024 at 11:07 PM, Alphadawg7 said:

Heading into the draft in 2022 I posted about keeping an eye on Shakir and the Bills.  I missed rounds 3 and 4 and came back to the draft right as we were announcing our pick in the 5th having no idea he was still on the board and was stunned when they called his name and thought I misheard it because I figured he would go in rounds 2 or 3.  I was thrilled when we called his name, maybe the most excited I have ever been about a pick that wasn't an early round choice, and I have been maybe his biggest cheerleader since getting here.  Ive got a pretty good track record on WR's around here, and he was one I felt from the get go was going to be different and develop into a great player for us.  

 

Ive posted threads and countless comments about him since we took him, and here is a quote back in early May after the draft showing an example of that belief in him early on and not just since his mini breakout this year.  

 

 

Now after reading that above from May of 2022...watch this highlight video and tell me that doesn't look spot on to how I described hm.  From how he plays as a WR, to how he has some Deebo and AJ Brown in him with the ball in his hands.

 

SHAKIR HIGHLIGHTS CLICK HERE (highly suggest you watch before commenting to at least see what I am referencing)

 

This man is an excellent route runner...has sure hands...runs a 4.43 forty...is shifty...excels with YAC and is tough when running...and he is a smart player.  Most importantly, he has the drive to be great and trains in the offseason with players like Moulds.  His biggest shortcoming is he doesn't have long arms which makes him less of a go up and get it WR, but we don't need him to be that when he is so good at everything else.

 

2023 Stats: 87% Catch Rate, 39 Rec on 45 Targets, 611 Yards (13.5 yards per TARGET - insane), 15.6 YPC, 2 TD's

 

Diggs had 160 targets in 2023 for 1183 yards.  Now I know Diggs is drawing the best of the defense a lot of the times, so its not an apples to apples comparison.  But just out of curiosity, what does Shakir's season look like on 160 targets based on his stats last year?  

 

Diggs:  160 Targets, 107 Rec, 1183 yards, 8 TD's

Shakir:  160 Targets, 139 Rec, 2160 yards, 7 TD's

 

Again, I know that is an unrealistic comparison given the level of defensive attention both got and how Shakir benefits from the extra attention Diggs takes.  BUT...that is a massively different level of efficiency and effectiveness.  And defenses STILL will have to contend with Shakir, what ever rookie we draft, Kincaid, Samuel, Knox, Cook as receiver and Allen running.  So Shakir still should see plenty of opportunities against the defenses moving forward.  

 

I mean, even if he just gets up to 100 targets, that is still a 1,350 yard season, and make no mistake about it, he very well could (and probably should) see 100 targets this year.  He is going to be the ONLY WR with any experience and rapport with Josh entering camp, he definitely caught Josh's attention and the teams last year and became a play making machine who they trust.  This team notoriously likes to ease Rookies in as much as they can, so doubtful any rookie is coming in commanding anywhere near Diggs target share.  

 

Dorsey was an idiot for not using him in 2022 when we needed help bad in the slot...he was a bigger fool for not getting him involved earlier in 2023.  In Joe Bradys first game, Shakir had his first career 100 yard game and would go on to end the season with another one.  Diggs had 0 games with 100 yards during that stretch.  

 

In the aftermath of the Diggs trade...the time is now.  I think you will see Shakir emerge as a legit WR and legit weapon for this team and not only will he break 1000 yards this year, he very well may lead the team in both receptions and yards.  And I think he is one of the reasons they felt confident to trade Diggs now rather than later.  

 

You heard it hear first...and have been hearing it here about him since before the 2022 draft.  

 

#WitnessTheArrival

Dude… lay off the blow 

[MasterStrategist]

Beane hyped Davis and Shakir, coming into LY.  Josh hyped Gabe as well, and the desire of getting him more short/intermediate targets for YAC.  

 

Not saying Shakir won't step up, but I go by what I've seen and Shakir has good traits but some key limitations. 

 

I sincerely hope that Beane sees we need 2 boundary guys.  Counting on Samuel or Shakir for significant boundary snaps is foolish, for many reasons...partly due to eachs limitations but puts a TON of pressure on what we presume will be a RD1 boundary guy.  Then we have Mack Hollins, who soupdnt see more than 20 targets all year, if that.

 

Shakir should be getting 80% of his snaps from the slot.  Samuel can be more versatile, but again is best used in the slot/short, quick passes or screens/bubble routes.  

 

This is the year to go back to back picks at WR.  Get a 3 tech DT, S, CB, and possibly RB with rest of picks.  

 

We will have more cap to sign guys after June 1, get that 1 yr rental at DE and a Rb2 if necessary.

 

A WR room of say:  Rd 1, Samuel, Rd2, Shakir, and Hollins looks nice.  We will have plenty of talented WRs to pick from at picks 28 and 60, who would be drafted higher in any other years draft.

 

I think Brady saw our limitations at WR, besides Diggs, and decided to be more balanced with a run game.  At the urging of McD as well.  But if we can add some more explosive receivers (Rd1 and 2), I think we could see more of a 2020 offensive group of weapons.  

 

Back to Shakir, I think he was 3rd or 4th concern by the opponents LY.  Diggs getting doubled, safety shading over Gabe, then Kincaid.  Hope I'm wrong, just don't see Shakir being good enough to jump any higher than a 3rd or 4th option (complementary piece)