Marquise Brown going to the Chiefs

[finn]

9 hours ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

except Josh throws picks at a high rate whenever Gabe is targeted

I won't miss Gabe. I can say that even as I recognize the valuable qualities he brought to the team. We need a big WR who can block, get deep, win contested throws, catch the ball in clutch moments, and block downfield. Gabe did some of that, but not all. 

[The Jokeman]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Hill was on the team a year before Mahomes was drafted--and two years before he was starter.

 

MVS has been a decent WR2/3.

 

JuJu had a cup of coffee in KC.

 

As for the drafted guys--KC hits on their WR drafts pretty well.  But Mahomes made those 2 guys.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mecole Hardman and Skyy Moore beg to differ, both were 2nd Round picks and let's just say they haven't been consistent producers. 

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, SWATeam said:

MVS had 21 catches for 300 yards this year.  That’s not decent WR2/3 territory.

 

Who are these drafted hits?  Rice is one but Moore has been an absolute bust.

 

OK so MVS is not a good weapon--solidifies my point (Mahomes hasn't been lavished with weapons in KC)

 

Hardman was a solid pick while he was in KC. 

[BBFL]

2 hours ago, NeverOutNick said:

I think Hollywood brings the vertical threat we need to this offense and the eye test shows when healthy he’s the more dynamic player.

What makes you believe that? I don’t see the deep threat you do but I am intrigued as to how you are at that view.

 

Also, injury wise he’s been relatively healthy out with the fractured foot his first year in AZ. Came back and seemed to be fine.  
 

I think he’s a solid player, don’t get me wrong. But the only season he had worth of note was the year prior to the trade. That season they targeted him 146 times. 146! 
 

Mark Andrews had 7 more targets but came away with 350 more yards…

 

 

So again, I’m very curious how you are at the conclusion he would have been a solid vertical threat for this team?

[Mr. WEO]

3 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

Mecole Hardman and Skyy Moore beg to differ, both were 2nd Round picks and let's just say they haven't been consistent producers. 

 

see above

6 minutes ago, finn said:

I won't miss Gabe. I can say that even as I recognize the valuable qualities he brought to the team. We need a big WR who can block, get deep, win contested throws, catch the ball in clutch moments, and block downfield. Gabe did some of that, but not all. 

 

 

lol everyone wants that.  How many teams have it?

[SaulGoodman]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Would anyone trade straight up right now their top 4 for our top 4?

 

Stefon Diggs

Curtis Samuel

Khalil Shakir 

Dalton Kincaid
 

For

Rashee Rice

Marquise Brown

Justin Watson

Travis Kelce

 

 

Probably not, but Watson won't be in the top 4 when the season starts. 

 

I'd take KC's top three over Buffalo's though. 

[NeverOutNick]

7 minutes ago, BBFL said:

What makes you believe that? I don’t see the deep threat you do but I am intrigued as to how you are at that view.

 

Also, injury wise he’s been relatively healthy out with the fractured foot his first year in AZ. Came back and seemed to be fine.  
 

I think he’s a solid player, don’t get me wrong. But the only season he had worth of note was the year prior to the trade. That season they targeted him 146 times. 146! 
 

Mark Andrews had 7 more targets but came away with 350 more yards…

 

 

So again, I’m very curious how you are at the conclusion he would have been a solid vertical threat for this team?

At work now so I’ll dig more into it later but it’s obvious watching hollywood, he continually takes the top off the defense. Yes both he and Samuel have had suspect QB play that you have to take into account when evaluating them but they are clearly 2 different flavors of WR. Samuel is fantastic with the ball in his hands but hasn’t shown he’s a go route or even a great route runner period. He’s consistently been 2nd fiddle to any other WR on his team which is fine but for our offense and what we do well Hollywood Brown is a better route runner and a consistent deep threat. All you have to do is watch any game he’s playing in and you’ll see that. His availability is his biggest weakness. I don’t think either player is amazing but I do think both can help any offense if used correctly.
 

My biggest point that given the money and skill set I’d prefer the guy that does something we don’t have right now over the guy who could supplant Shakir in the same role. If you disagree I’m sorry we don’t see it the same but that’s what I see from watching both players for years. I hope Brady finds a way to get the most out of both Samuel and Shakir on the field at the same time.

 

Lastly, I don’t think getting either player means the bills or chiefs are done with WRs. Both teams will and should draft multiple in this years class so they have real cheap weapons for their franchise QBs future

[BBFL]

11 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

see above

 

 

lol everyone wants that.  How many teams have it?

 

Quite a few, from the top of my head without much thought I can come up with 13 teams. 
 

Justin Jefferson, Minnesota

Jamar Chase/Tee Higgins, Cincinnati

DJ Moore, Chicago

Brandon Aiyuk, San Fran

DK Metcalf, Seattle

AJ Brown, Philadelphia 

Mike Evans, Tampa

George Pickens, Pittsburgh

Amari Cooper, Cleveland

Amon St. Brown, Detroit

Chris Olave, New Orleans

Christian Watson, Green Bay

Puka Nacua, LA Rams

 

That’s over a 1/3 of the NFL. 

 

Could even go further and add other guys like:

Michael Wilson, Arizona

CeeDee Lamb, Dallas

Nico Collins, Houston

Josh Palmer, LA Chargers

Courtland Sutton, Denver

Drake London, Atlanta

 

 

Thats well over half the league that have a guy who does all of what he suggested…

 

Not that much of a rarity. 

 

🤷‍♂️

 

[DrDawkinstein]

5 minutes ago, BBFL said:

 

Quite a few, from the top of my head without much thought I can come up with 13 teams. 
 

Justin Jefferson, Minnesota

Jamar Chase/Tee Higgins, Cincinnati

DJ Moore, Chicago

Brandon Aiyuk, San Fran

DK Metcalf, Seattle

AJ Brown, Philadelphia 

Mike Evans, Tampa

George Pickens, Pittsburgh

Amari Cooper, Cleveland

Amon St. Brown, Detroit

Chris Olave, New Orleans

Christian Watson, Green Bay

Puka Nacua, LA Rams

 

That’s over a 1/3 of the NFL. 

 

Could even go further and add other guys like:

Michael Wilson, Arizona

CeeDee Lamb, Dallas

Nico Collins, Houston

Josh Palmer, LA Chargers

Courtland Sutton, Denver

Drake London, Atlanta

 

 

Thats well over half the league that have a guy who does all of what he suggested…

 

Not that much of a rarity. 

 

🤷‍♂️

 

 

The very first qualifier was "who can block" and I'd say half those guys don't block. George Pickens alone invalidates that entire list.

 

If those guys fit your criteria, Diggs absolutely does as well.

[Beck Water]

9 hours ago, Billl said:

It doesn’t even make sense.  There’s no way he should have signed for this little.

 

In part, that's called the "Superbowl Champion Discount".  The Patriots and Brady used to get it, now KC will get it.

 

But you're also sounding a little starry-eyed here.  Brown followed-up his 1000+ yd season in 2021 with two "down" years in AZ where he got dinged, and last year only caught 50% of his targets in 14 games.  I don't follow AZ enough to know what that means - were those balls thrown vaguely in his vicinity, did he not have good focus, or both?  But the bottom line is,  Brown is a former 1st round pick who bitched his way out of town with the Ravens, then underperformed for his 2nd team (who traded a 1st round pick for him).  The Cardinals traded a 1st round pick and paid Brown $13M last season, and got 51 receptions for 574 yds from a guy who was on the field 85% of the snaps in 14 games.

 

It makes perfect sense to me that it would be attractive to Brown to go to a pass-first offense captained by a great passing QB, and that he might take a discount to do it on a 1 year "prove it" deal and try to turn his career around.  If it works out, he's going to want to get paid.

 

 

10 hours ago, KDIGGZ said:

Now do the year before that. Or don't cherry pick stats and do their whole careers. Chiefs got the better player for the better deal

 

Can you share your reasoning on why Brown is the better player, and (absent contract details) why the Chiefs have the better deal?

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, NeverOutNick said:

I want to see the final numbers but if I’m being totally honest I would rather have Hollywood Brown for 1 year at $7 Mil than Samuel at 2 year $15 mil guaranteed. I think Hollywood brings the vertical threat we need to this offense and the eye test shows when healthy he’s the more dynamic player. I’m fine with Samuel but hopefully the bills change their offensive philosophy and get the ball to him and other RAC guys in space (they haven’t done that with Hines or Harty in the past). Probably on my own island with this take but it’s just how I see it. Hoping the bills go strong at WR in the draft because we need to invest in long term solutions for Josh outside of Kincaid.

 

I mean, you're entitled to your opinion, but first, I'll look at the contracts to see what the details are - they usually aren't quite as initially reported.

The fact is, Brown only caught half his targets last season and contributed 574 yds and 51 receptions.  For Brown as a former 1st round pick, who AZ traded a 1st round pick to receive and paid $13.4M last season, that's kind of "bust" territory.
 

Now there may be mitigating circumstances in having Murray and Joshua Dobbs throwing to him, but Murray was a #1 overall pick himself, and Dobbs played decently for 'Zona.

Edited March 15 by Beck Water

[Beast]

11 hours ago, MPL said:

Chiefs are so predictable. Boring. 

I’d love to out-bore them next season.

Edited March 15 by Beast

[NeverOutNick]

24 minutes ago, BBFL said:

 

Quite a few, from the top of my head without much thought I can come up with 13 teams. 
 

Justin Jefferson, Minnesota

Jamar Chase/Tee Higgins, Cincinnati

DJ Moore, Chicago

Brandon Aiyuk, San Fran

DK Metcalf, Seattle

AJ Brown, Philadelphia 

Mike Evans, Tampa

George Pickens, Pittsburgh

Amari Cooper, Cleveland

Amon St. Brown, Detroit

Chris Olave, New Orleans

Christian Watson, Green Bay

Puka Nacua, LA Rams

 

That’s over a 1/3 of the NFL. 

 

Could even go further and add other guys like:

Michael Wilson, Arizona

CeeDee Lamb, Dallas

Nico Collins, Houston

Josh Palmer, LA Chargers

Courtland Sutton, Denver

Drake London, Atlanta

 

 

Thats well over half the league that have a guy who does all of what he suggested…

 

Not that much of a rarity. 

 

🤷‍♂️

 

Told everyone about this dude before last years draft. If only

[MPL]

6 minutes ago, Beast said:

11 hours ago, MPL said:

Chiefs are so predictable. Boring. 

I’d love to out-bore them next season.

I don't know... us out-boring them would be losing in the divisional round again

[BBFL]

18 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

The very first qualifier was "who can block" and I'd say half those guys don't block. George Pickens alone invalidates that entire list.

 

If those guys fit your criteria, Diggs absolutely does as well.

😂
 

Very petulant of you…

 

A list of 19 teams and one guy invalidates it all because you feel he doesn’t block. He might not block regularly but he does and can. 
 

You know what, I’m not even going to waste my time. If you dismissed the whole list because of one guy then good on you. 
 

Simple thing, teams having that isn’t as rare as you made it out to be. 

[Bruffalo]

If you want a guy who can take the top off of a defense, this draft is absolutely full of them.  Running mostly straight and fast is one of the easiest things a WR can do. That's Hollywood Brown, and he's really not shown much else since being traded.

 

Know what this draft isn't full of? Deebo-like Curtis Samuel types. The Chiefs were in on him too. Brown is the consolation prize.  

[BBFL]

29 minutes ago, NeverOutNick said:

At work now so I’ll dig more into it later but it’s obvious watching hollywood, he continually takes the top off the defense. Yes both he and Samuel have had suspect QB play that you have to take into account when evaluating them but they are clearly 2 different flavors of WR. Samuel is fantastic with the ball in his hands but hasn’t shown he’s a go route or even a great route runner period. He’s consistently been 2nd fiddle to any other WR on his team which is fine but for our offense and what we do well Hollywood Brown is a better route runner and a consistent deep threat. All you have to do is watch any game he’s playing in and you’ll see that. His availability is his biggest weakness. I don’t think either player is amazing but I do think both can help any offense if used correctly.
 

My biggest point that given the money and skill set I’d prefer the guy that does something we don’t have right now over the guy who could supplant Shakir in the same role. If you disagree I’m sorry we don’t see it the same but that’s what I see from watching both players for years. I hope Brady finds a way to get the most out of both Samuel and Shakir on the field at the same time.

 

Lastly, I don’t think getting either player means the bills or chiefs are done with WRs. Both teams will and should draft multiple in this years class so they have real cheap weapons for their franchise QBs future

I agree he’s a talent just that I don’t see him as much of a downfield/vertical threat. Neither is Samuel. 
 

Both their bread and butter is in the intermediate and underneath game. Decent receivers but not exactly a guy of that style who comes to mind. 

[90sBills]

2 hours ago, FireChans said:

Their QB is greater.

Hard to argue against that but the philosophy of filling the roster with decent cap friendly wr’s should still apply with Allen.

 

Looking back tying that much resource to 1 receiver in Diggs has set the Bills back. KC let their star receiver go and opted for a platoon of so so guys that don’t cost much. That has certainly worked out very well for them. 

[K D]

39 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

Can you share your reasoning on why Brown is the better player, and (absent contract details) why the Chiefs have the better deal?

You can put down any stats you want (which Hollywood wins, also check out the huge difference in TD's) but then everyone will say because Samuels hasn't played with a good QB. So then we are guessing at who is better and yet we gave him more money based on Beane scouting him coming out of college 7 years ago which doesn't give me a lot of confidence. I just watch the tape and make my own conclusions. Hollywood is much better, better hands, much more dynamic. He will be a 1000 yard guy in KC. Samuels will be lucky to get to Gabe Davis levels. He's a converted RB and he looks like it when he catches the ball. We know who the bigger name is but watch the tape and see for yourself 

Edited March 15 by KDIGGZ

[stinky finger]

11 hours ago, zevo said:

whelp. knew something was going to happen with them.solid signing

Meh - I know, I know he’ll have PM but this guy gets an awful lot of run for, to me, not a lot of success. 
 

Color me unimpressed.