Chiefs-Bills trade that landed Kansas City Patrick Mahomes

[BobbyC81]

14 hours ago, SinceThe70s said:

 

What about the teams that drafted 1-9? 

 

BTW, nice memory wrt @jeffismagic I seem to recall a few other people lobbying for Mahomes and the debate swirling around the Air Raid offense and whether it would translate to the NFL. We'll always be linked to Mahomes due to the trade out of 10 - but that's hindsight. If his greatness was so obvious he never would have made it to 10 - let alone past Mitch Trubisky. 

Most of the comments in this thread are hindsight BS.  In the 2018 draft, many here, including me, thought they picked the wrong Josh QB.  Look how that turned out.

 

The draft is also hit and miss.  For every Josh Rosen, there’s a Matt Milano.

[Chicken Boo]

15 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

If JA17 never wins a superbowl in Buffalo this will go down as the worst trade in NFL (and quite frankly pro sports) history. Sean McDivisional will also be the most hated figure in Buffalo sports history as well.

 

McDivisional still has me chuckling.  That's quality.  

14 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

The Bills win that trade if Tre hadn't had all the injuries.  Everyone forgets, that Mahomes has never beaten us, KC has.  

 

Unless you're suggesting the Bills would have won 3 Super Bowls with a pre-injury Tre White, this take is invalid.

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

I honestly think if Mahomes wasn't in the league, Allen and the Bills would have at least two super bowl appearances and Allen would be talked about as the baby GOAT to Brady. That is how good Allen is and how much of a PITA the Chiefs and Mahomes have been to the Bills. The difference between Allen and Mahomes in ability is miniscule compared to the differences between all the other parts of the two teams.

 

No Mahomes in the league and the Bills make the Super Bowl in 2020 and 2023 seasons. They probably make the conference title games in '21 and '22. They lose to the Bengals in one of those seasons. 

[Success]

10 hours ago, SaulGoodman said:

So….the player who’s been much more mistake-prone (137 INTs/fumbles vs 99 in fewer games) with a defense that has provided far more takeaways (163 to 138) would have accomplished more than Mahomes in KC? By upgrading his offensive talent for a few seasons while downgrading defensively every year but one?

 

Seems doubtful. Especially considering Allen was very inaccurate his first two years (at that point Mahomes had already notched a historic MVP season and a SB victory). 
 

KC had better offensive skill players during Mahomes’ first few years but hasn’t the last few. They’ve also had a weak running game most years, weak tackle play in half of Mahomes’ seasons, receivers that led the league in drops by a mile this year, the worst run blocking in the league for a few years, and weak defense every year but one. They’ve also been among the most penalized teams annually while their opponents are among the least.
 

Somehow this adds up to a situation so much better than Allen’s that he’d have 6x as many AFC title game appearances as he has now, 3 or more SB rings and at least two MVPs?
 

Also, is the difference in coaching as drastic as you make it out to be if one of Reid’s most lauded plays was stolen from the “uncreative” Bills?

And was it the defense’s fault that Allen led his offense to 10 points vs Cincinnati last year? A hobbled Mahomes scored more than twice as many points vs the same team the next week, while throwing to a depleted WR corps consisting of MVS, Skyy Moore and Marcus Kemp from the practice squad. 
 

I don’t think the facts support your assertion. 

 

This is like a cherrypicking festival.

 

Allen throws more picks than Mahomes, for sure.  But he also had 44 TD's to Mahomes' 27 TD's this past year.  That's more the kind of QB Allen is - he takes more risks, but makes more big plays.  And how is his playoff ratio of TD's to INT's?

 

And Allen was admittedly bad in last year's Cincy game.  But why do you choose that game, but fail to mention Mahomes' meltdown in the 2nd half against Cincy in the game right after 13 seconds?

 

Beyond that, you keep bringing up how KC stole a SINGLE PLAY from the Bills.  No one ever said the Bills staff has zero creativity.  Singling out 1 play for any kind of coaching comparison is the height of cherrypicking, and completely unscientific.

 

My assertion is based on a much more broad overview of MANY stats and factors that make up a more true comparison between both QB's, both coaching staffs and both teams as a whole.  It's a much more holistic view.  Ergo, the facts actually DO support my assertion.

 

Edited February 24 by Success

[90sBills]

1 hour ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

I honestly think if Mahomes wasn't in the league, Allen and the Bills would have at least two super bowl appearances and Allen would be talked about as the baby GOAT to Brady. That is how good Allen is and how much of a PITA the Chiefs and Mahomes have been to the Bills. The difference between Allen and Mahomes in ability is miniscule compared to the differences between all the other parts of the two teams.

 

No Mahomes in the league and the Bills make the Super Bowl in 2020 and 2023 seasons. They probably make the conference title games in '21 and '22. They lose to the Bengals in one of those seasons. 

In the multiverse somewhere Allen is debated as challenging Brady for goat status while Mahomes is racking up CY Young awards in MLB. 

[SoonerBillsFan]

2 hours ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

McDivisional still has me chuckling.  That's quality.  

 

Unless you're suggesting the Bills would have won 3 Super Bowls with a pre-injury Tre White, this take is invalid.

Pure BS.  This trade has nothing to do with coaching. It's 2 all pros received vs. 1 in Mahomes. That's a win for this trade.

 

We can't help that KC loaded up a better roster to support Mahomes vs. What has been given to Allen.  

 

Bottom line, Mahomes on this team with the coaching staff that has been here still =0 superbowls.  Allen on KC still = Superbowl wins.  

 

Why is this still so hard to understand?

 

 

 

 

Edited February 24 by SoonerBillsFan

[Chicken Boo]

35 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Pure BS.  This trade has nothing to do with coaching. It's 2 all pros received vs. 1 in Mahomes. That's a win for this trade.

 

We can't help that KC loaded up a better roster to support Mahomes vs. What has been given to Allen.  

 

Bottom line, Mahomes on this team with the coaching staff that has been here still =0 superbowls.  Allen on KC still = Superbowl wins.  

 

Why is this still so hard to understand?

 

 

 

 

 

What would you rather have, those 2 all-pros or Mahomes?

 

Be serious.

[Mat68]

8 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

What would you rather have, those 2 all-pros or Mahomes?

 

Be serious.

What changes with Mahomes on the Bills and Allen on the Chiefs?  They were looking for a qb.  Assume if Buffalo picks Mahomes Kc a year later trade up for Allen.  I dont believe Bills mafia would be thrilled in that universe either. 

[SoonerBillsFan]

18 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

What would you rather have, those 2 all-pros or Mahomes?

 

Be serious.

The 2 all pros.  Esp. Since one is Allen. Allen is a guy I'll take over Mahomes 100% of the time.

[The 9 Isles]

ugh

[JerseyBills]

Whaley had a great draft as a parting gift, allowed us the ammo to get Josh and added quality

 

Trade is pretty even,  we're a play or 2 from having 2 SBs, potentially,  21 and 23 

[Jimmy Harris 69]

This is not the right question. Which franchise has had a better head coach, offensive game plan and a big game defensive coordinator during the last seven years ? Kansas City—we all know. The plan and the pieces Andy Reid put around Mahomes has made ALL the difference offensively. Spagnuolo has stopped the patriot machine, the niners, the bills. We don’t have a defense that can beat The chiefs in the playoffs. The winner of the trade is Pat Mahomes.  His career would be distinctly different anywhere else, even in BFO. 

[WyoAZBillfan]

🤦🏼‍♂️ this place. Seriously one could speculate the turnout 10000 different ways. Buffalo gets PM and flounders, KC then gets Allen wins the next 50 years worth of Super Bowls…Buffalo should’ve traded KC the pick and waited for Allen..🤦🏼‍♂️ just for starters..

[Chicken Boo]

23 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

What changes with Mahomes on the Bills and Allen on the Chiefs?  They were looking for a qb.  Assume if Buffalo picks Mahomes Kc a year later trade up for Allen.  I dont believe Bills mafia would be thrilled in that universe either. 

 

First off, Allen wasn't in the original post of compensation for the trade.  

 

And I'm not a fan of dealing in these type of hypotheticals.  Allen isn't on the Chiefs, like Marino wasn't on the Bills and Rodgers wasn't a Patriot.

 

I'm not arguing the Bills should have taken Mahomes.  I'm arguing they lost the trade and they did.  

25 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

The 2 all pros.  Esp. Since one is Allen. Allen is a guy I'll take over Mahomes 100% of the time.

 

I don't recall Allen being in the original post.  Somehow I was thinking of Dawkins.

[mannc]

19 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

Kansas City won the trade. Without question. They drafted the best QB in football. 

 

But the Bills did about as good a job losing a trade as you could ever do. An all pro corner and then a pick that helped them land the 2nd best QB in football the following year.

You have to do a lot of mental gyrations to explain why the Bills screwed up here. On the other hand, the Bears passed on Mahomes for Mitch Trubisky and the Niners passed on him for a JAG defensive tackle.  Those teams should really be ashamed…

[Augie]

20 hours ago, Virgil said:

I wouldn't trade Josh Allen for anything.  Keep Mahomes' wife and brother the hell away from this team.  

 

People used to ask if I would trade for Brady or the Hoodie for one ring, and I said no.  Same answer with Mahomes.

 

Also, absolutely no one could have predicted Mahomes was going to have the career he's had.  He fell to 10 for a reason.  Yes, some people thought he had potential, but at the time, no one was harping on the Bills for that trade

 

Can we do 13 seconds again next??? 

 

 

😋

[McBean]

21 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Allen, Mahomes, Reid, McDermott 

 

One of those four is not like the other three

 

End of thread

Needs to go into the hall of fame posts here.

 

spot on.

[st pete gogolak]

Forget for a second who KC selected with the pick.  I’m not a draft guru but it seems like we didn’t get a whole lot for dropping from #10 to #27.  What would it cost us to move to #10 this draft?  It cost us next year’s #1 to move from #8 to #4 to draft Sammy Watkins.  Note: bad teams should NEVER trade next year’s #1, right Carolina?

[Utah John]

Both teams won.  The Chiefs and Bills both got better, and if the Chiefs didn't have Andy Reid the Bills would have been to the SB at least once so far.  

[Brand J]

KC’s defense has supported Mahomes in the playoffs much more than Josh’s has, BUT the fact that we’re coming up short against Mahomes time after time has to factor into that equation. Or in other words, the Chiefs defense has forced Allen and the Bills to punt more than the other way around, regardless of defensive rankings.

 

The hypothetical of switching QBs and how their careers would be different, I’d love if there was a real answer for it. All we can do is speculate this and that, but I personally believe the takes that Buffalo would have zero championships while KC wouldn’t miss a beat with Allen are ridiculous. I don’t believe there’s a chasm of talent between the two QBs at all, but there’s still a gap, and however small it is, it has led to one QB winning league and Super Bowl MVPs while the other is simply planning his next tee time.