Another reason to fire McDermott

[alg]

Josh was easily the most dominant player on the field in the divisional round. Mahomes just gets all the credit. He has a better team, mainly because their front office takes Humphries instead of Basham, or McDuffie instead of Elam.

[SoTier]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

I’m not sure how you could miss the point harder tbh.

 

So, your "point" is that you're either an ignorant fan or a trouble-making troll? 

 

1 hour ago, Returntoglory said:

Actually, wouldn't BB be the responsible one for the trade? 

^^^

1 hour ago, Gregg said:

 

I don't think Beane was the GM at the time. Doug Whaley was.

 

You are correct, but I think the idea behind it is solid: I don't think McDermott ever had complete control over draft decisions.  He was recently promoted from DC to HC for the first time, so it doesn't seem likely that he would have been given complete control over the roster.  After Beane was hired, Beane and McDermott worked together on personnel selection.

 

1 hour ago, BarleyNY said:

Whaley had been neutered by McDermott for the draft. He was so angry at being totally ignored that he left the draft room. Then he was fired immediately after the draft. The only reason he was kept through it was so that he wouldn’t leak info. 

 

I think this is partly true in that Whaley was definitely on the way out by the time of the 2017 draft.   Was that because there was a power struggle that McDermott won or had Whaley and Russ Brandon, who had solidified his position under the Pegulas after the Rex Ryan debacle, had a falling out?  Given Brandon's belief in "money ball" style of management that stressed maximizing profits, I think he would have been reluctant to draft another first round QB in 2017 after they drafted EJ Manuel in 2013 because he didn't want to pay 2 first round QB salaries.  Whaley recognized talent.  If he had truly been in charge of personnel in 2017, I'm fairly sure that the Bills would have drafted either Mahomes or Watson in 2017. 

 

I think that the Bills FO was in significant disarray in the spring of 2017.  I think that it's likely Brandon decreed no first round QB and then left Whaley and McDermott or McDermott himself to muddle through.  Whatever the situation was, the 2017 draft yielded three top players -- White, Dawkins and Milano -- for the Bills. 

 

I would definitely have preferred Mahomes at #10 in 2017 rather than Tre White but it doesn't matter at this point.  The Chiefs have Mahomes.  The Bills have Allen.  The QBs are so close in talent and leadership that the real difference between the two franchises is in coaching and the level of team talent, and even there, the separation is modest.   IMO, if the Bills had had Tre White and Matt Milano in the divisional game, they would have won the game.  Hell, maybe if they have Rasul Douglas and Terrell Bernard in that game, they might have even won the divisional game.   Manure happens.   In this case, injuries to key defensive starters -- and then to the next guys up just before the divisional round -- probably sealed the Bills' fate against the Chiefs.

Edited February 12 by SoTier

[FireChans]

5 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

So, your "point" is that you're either an ignorant fan or a trouble-making troll? 

 

^^^

 

You are correct, but I think the idea behind it is solid: I don't think McDermott ever had complete control over draft decisions.  He was recently promoted from DC to HC for the first time, so it doesn't seem likely that he would have been given complete control over the roster.  After Beane was hired, Beane and McDermott worked together on personnel selection.

 

 

I think this is partly true in that Whaley was definitely on the way out by the time of the 2017 draft.   Was that because there was a power struggle that McDermott won or had Whaley and Russ Brandon, who had solidified his position under the Pegulas after the Rex Ryan debacle, had a falling out?  Given Brandon's belief in "money ball" style of management that stressed maximizing profits, I think he would have been reluctant to draft another first round QB in 2017 after they drafted EJ Manuel in 2013 because he didn't want to pay 2 first round QB salaries.  Whaley recognized talent.  If he had truly been in charge of personnel in 2017, I'm fairly sure that the Bills would have drafted either Mahomes or Watson in 2017. 

 

I think that the Bills FO was in significant disarray in the spring of 2017.  I think that it's likely Brandon decreed no first round QB and then left Whaley and McDermott or McDermott himself to muddle through.  Whatever the situation was, the 2017 draft yielded three top players -- White, Dawkins and Milano -- for the Bills. 

 

I would definitely have preferred Mahomes at #10 in 2017 rather than Tre White but it doesn't matter at this point.  The Chiefs have Mahomes.  The Bills have Allen.  The QBs are so close in talent and leadership that the real difference between the two franchises is in coaching and the level of team talent, and even there, the separation is modest.   IMO, if the Bills had had Tre White and Matt Milano in the divisional game, they would have won the game.  Hell, maybe if they have Rasul Douglas and Terrell Bernard in that game, they might have even won the divisional game.   Manure happens.   In this case, injuries to key defensive starters -- and then to the next guys up just before the divisional round -- probably sealed the Bills' fate against the Chiefs.

There’s no need for name calling when you think Stefon Diggs is relevant to the conversation lmao

[BarleyNY]

13 minutes ago, SoTier said:

I think this is partly true in that Whaley was definitely on the way out by the time of the 2017 draft.   Was that because there was a power struggle that McDermott won or had Whaley and Russ Brandon, who had solidified his position under the Pegulas after the Rex Ryan debacle, had a falling out?

 

I think it was simply a matter of McDermott bringing in his own guy. He had been working with Beane, who was Assistant GM in Carolina. I’m not sure why he waited until after the draft to hire him though.

[SoTier]

26 minutes ago, FireChans said:

There’s no need for name calling when you think Stefon Diggs is relevant to the conversation lmao

 

Diggs is irrelevant if your purpose is to troll.   Ignoring White, Milano, and Dawkins also works for trolling purposes.

 

Forgetting about White and Milano on the Bills and including HIll as a factor in the Chiefs' last 2 SB wins suggests ignorance.

Edited February 12 by SoTier

[SoTier]

3 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

 

I think it was simply a matter of McDermott bringing in his own guy. He had been working with Beane, who was Assistant GM in Carolina. I’m not sure why he waited until after the draft to hire him though.

 

I think it was simply that the Bills had a GM in place when they hired McDermott.   Doug Whaley and Russ Brandon were best friends going back to their college days.  Something went wrong in that relationship between McDermott's hiring and the draft.  I think people assumed it was a power struggle between McDermott and Whaley but if Brandon still supported Whaley, there would have been no way for McDermott to win a power struggle.   I think Terry Pegula stayed out of team politics after his insistence in hiring Rex Ryan turned out so poorly.  I don't think we'll ever know exactly what happened.  

 

I will say that the best thing that ever happened to the Bills franchise in the 21st century was Russ Brandon being named head of both the Bills and Sabres.  Brandon's sexual harassment of a female Sabres employee who complained to Kim Pegula led directly to his ouster from the Bills in the spring of 2018.   Brandon's exit enabled Beane and McDermott to set the team on a path to success.

[FireChans]

18 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Diggs is irrelevant if your purpose is to troll.   Ignoring White, Milano, and Dawkins also works for trolling purposes.

 

Forgetting about White and Milano on the Bills and including HIll as a factor in the Chiefs' last 2 SB wins suggests ignorance.

Holy smokes this is painful to read.

 

The Bills had pick 10. They traded it to the Chiefs. The Chiefs selected Mahomes. Mahomes went to a team with Hill, Kelce, Chris Jones and coached by Andy Reid. They were a maxed out first or second round playoff team prior to that. We GAVE them the missing piece for their dynasty. And Patrick Mahomes has gone to the AFCCG 6 straight seasons, and won 3 Superbowls, and knocked the Bills out of the playoffs 3 out of the last 4 years.
 

I’m not forgetting about Dawkins or Milano or whatever the heck you are talking about. I’m not cherry-picking, because there’s nothing to cherry pick. If you want to say the trade was worth it because we also drafted Dawkins or traded for Diggs in 2020 or whatever the hell you are trying to say, more power to you. I prefer winning Superbowls so to me, the trade was definitively NOT worth it.

[FilthyBeast]

23 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Holy smokes this is painful to read.

 

The Bills had pick 10. They traded it to the Chiefs. The Chiefs selected Mahomes. Mahomes went to a team with Hill, Kelce, Chris Jones and coached by Andy Reid. They were a maxed out first or second round playoff team prior to that. We GAVE them the missing piece for their dynasty. And Patrick Mahomes has gone to the AFCCG 6 straight seasons, and won 3 Superbowls, and knocked the Bills out of the playoffs 3 out of the last 4 years.
 

I’m not forgetting about Dawkins or Milano or whatever the heck you are talking about. I’m not cherry-picking, because there’s nothing to cherry pick. If you want to say the trade was worth it because we also drafted Dawkins or traded for Diggs in 2020 or whatever the hell you are trying to say, more power to you. I prefer winning Superbowls so to me, the trade was definitively NOT worth it.

 

Any Bills fan that wouldn't trade Allen for Mahome straight up right now, or go back in time and reverse the events of the 2017 draft is delusional, or even trolling at this point. And again, it's not a knock on Allen at all for obvious reasons. But to say Dawkins, Milano, White, etc were getting over Mahomes is also hilarious.

 

I do believe in fate and destiny and after 17 straight years of failure, what might be the best player in NFL history when it's all said and done, fell right into the Bills lap that year and of course they punted and traded the pick away. You simply can't make this stuff up and if the Bills are really cursed this sealed their fate for eternity.

[beer can shower]

1 hour ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

And? He wasn’t taken till pick 10 meaning nine teams didn’t think enough of Patrick that someone wouldn’t trade up with them. Btw did you see who some of those teams before pick 10 had at Qb? You’re talking the Andy Daltons, Josh Mccowns, and Jimmy Garapolos of the world. 

Again,  misleading statement, not all teams before 10 Needed a QB.

Some teams pick for need other than best player available.
Oh Yeah, and  did you know who was drafted at 8?

Christian McCaffrey.
You refuse to  acknowledge the fact that Sean McDermott's first move in an NFL draft was to trade away the pick that would have brought Pat Mahomes to Buffalo.

Edited February 12 by beer can shower

[BananaB]

37 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Holy smokes this is painful to read.

 

The Bills had pick 10. They traded it to the Chiefs. The Chiefs selected Mahomes. Mahomes went to a team with Hill, Kelce, Chris Jones and coached by Andy Reid. They were a maxed out first or second round playoff team prior to that. We GAVE them the missing piece for their dynasty. And Patrick Mahomes has gone to the AFCCG 6 straight seasons, and won 3 Superbowls, and knocked the Bills out of the playoffs 3 out of the last 4 years.
 

I’m not forgetting about Dawkins or Milano or whatever the heck you are talking about. I’m not cherry-picking, because there’s nothing to cherry pick. If you want to say the trade was worth it because we also drafted Dawkins or traded for Diggs in 2020 or whatever the hell you are trying to say, more power to you. I prefer winning Superbowls so to me, the trade was definitively NOT worth it.

Mahommes is not Mahommes without Andy Reid. I think that’s pretty safe to say. Mahommes is definitely not Mahommes with Sean McDermot. 

[Teddy KGB]

10 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I will never understand the fire McDermott people.

Watch the second half of the Chiefs game 

 

or how he pulled off a loss to Mac Jones in 2023 

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

I never said that lol. He definitely can’t win one in 2023, or 2021, or 2020 because he already lost to Pat. 
 

Hopefully he can eventually squeak by and win one. Unfortunately Allen is gonna have to deal with Pat for likely his whole career. If only we traded Mahomes to some dog ***** franchise. 

 

You said Mahomes "absolutely" "guaranteed" is the reason the Bills haven't been to a SB.  So how will they ever get to one, barring Mahomes being traded away or retiring?  Given this isn't happening, how is it possible that the Bills will now get past Mahomes, if it is impossible. If it is possible, then go back and edit all your threads.

 

They traded the pick, not Mahomes.

 

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

18 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

Watch the second half of the Chiefs game 

 

or how he pulled off a loss to Mac Jones in 2023 

And? You can’t be critical without the ridiculous idea that we should fire McDermott?

[FireChans]

33 minutes ago, BananaB said:

Mahommes is not Mahommes without Andy Reid. I think that’s pretty safe to say. Mahommes is definitely not Mahommes with Sean McDermot. 

We gave Andy Reid Mahomes!!!!!!!!!

31 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

You said Mahomes "absolutely" "guaranteed" is the reason the Bills haven't been to a SB.  So how will they ever get to one, barring Mahomes being traded away or retiring?  Given this isn't happening, how is it possible that the Bills will now get past Mahomes, if it is impossible. If it is possible, then go back and edit all your threads.

 

They traded the pick, not Mahomes.

 

 

He is. He, with a little help from Joe Burrow, is why we haven’t won a Super Bowl yet. That’s a fact.

[boater]

Some posters will use any freaking occasion to beat their "Fire McDermott" drum. This thread is chock FULL of them. But there are other threads as well today.

 

The Mahomes trope is years old, worn out, and unimaginative. It is wrong and BORING!!!

 

This board.. sheesh.

[thenorthremembers]

4 hours ago, Budkin said:

Reid coached an amazing game in the second half. Hats off to him.

He's coached football for longer than I've been alive and I'm middle age.  He's coached in the NFL for over 30 years and called plays for 25.

 

There is a lot to be said about experience, he's been through almost every situation you can in football. 

Unfortunately in today's culture and NFL everyone wants a fast payoff. 

 

It took the guy 20 years as a head coach to win a Superbowl.   At least part of that first victory was due to what he learned losing 4 conference championships and 1 Super Bowl before he got one.

[Mr. WEO]

24 minutes ago, FireChans said:

We gave Andy Reid Mahomes!!!!!!!!!

He is. He, with a little help from Joe Burrow, is why we haven’t won a Super Bowl yet. That’s a fact.

 

you didn't answer the question.  if, as long as Mahomes is in KC, which is the reason the Bills can't "win a SB" in the past and obviously going forward...why are you still here?

[FireChans]

6 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

you didn't answer the question.  if, as long as Mahomes is in KC, which is the reason the Bills can't "win a SB" in the past and obviously going forward...why are you still here?

I never said that. It’s not as fun when you try to pivot and create strawmen because you lost. 
 

“obviously going forward.” Oh wait? No. Not obviously. 

Edited February 12 by FireChans

[Mr. WEO]

7 minutes ago, FireChans said:

I never said that. It’s not as fun when you try to pivot and create strawmen because you lost. 
 

“obviously going forward.” Oh wait? No. Not obviously. 

 

"Trading Mahomes to the Chiefs is the biggest reason we don’t have a title. It has actually cost us a title."

 

 

come on--don't run away from your take!

 

how can the Bills ever win a SB when Mahomes in KC prevents them from winning a SB?  Is he leaving soon?

Edited February 12 by Mr. WEO

[FireChans]

10 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

"Trading Mahomes to the Chiefs is the biggest reason we don’t have a title. It has actually cost us a title."

 

 

come on--don't run away from your take!

 

how can the Bills ever win a SB when Mahomes in KC prevents them from winning a SB?  Is he leaving soon?

He is. I’m not running away from anything. You just tried to add in “obviously” and something I never said to win. Sad.