Kick the Ball in Overtime

[Doc Brown]

2 hours ago, mannc said:

You don't see a distinct advantage in having four plays to make a first down instead of just three?

There was nothing stopping the 49ers from treating every new set of downs as four down territory on the first drive of overtime.

[mannc]

6 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

There was nothing stopping the 49ers from treating every new set of downs as four down territory on the first drive of overtime.

That’s true, but if they fail to convert one time, the game’s over.  Why not just take the ball second?

[Albany,n.y.]

16 hours ago, VaMilBill said:

I have no idea why any coach would take the ball first in overtime in the playoffs. If your defense is supposedly that good and you trust them to get a stop, kick it. Let them get the stop, force a punt and get better field position and higher chances for getting the requisite yards for a FG 

 

If your defense stinks and will just allow a TD anyways, you know exactly what you need on offense and have four downs per set of downs to achieve it. Plus if you do score a TD, and your defense stinks, just go for 2 and win the game with your offense and don’t give the other team another chance once it goes to sudden death. 
 

It doesn’t seem like a cosmic idea to me. What do I know. 

Very simple answer why you always take the ball: If both teams don't score on the 1st drive, you have a distinct advantage in number of possessions & are much more likely to win the game.  On the 1st 3 possessions you have 2 chances to score where if you defer, you may only have one.  No coach in his right mind would give away that advantage.  

[Doc Brown]

2 minutes ago, mannc said:

That’s true, but if they fail to convert one time, the game’s over.  Why not just take the ball second?

Same goes for the Chiefs on their first possession.  The sudden death aspect on the third possession is too big of an advantage not to take the ball first imho.

[Pokebball]

Great conversation on strategy in this thread. I enjoyed it.

[Albany,n.y.]

12 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

 

Always best to take "last ups." You gain more information on what you need to win. They let KC walk them off. Inexcusable given they had coin toss. 

 

You'd think a home team in baseball would say: "Oh no, you're the visitor, you go last." LoL...

 

Maybe Shanahan was just being polite. 😆 

 

I really hope he knew how the OT rules in the playoffs differed from regular season. Even if 1st OT quarter ended, it just goes to OT quarter #2 and so on!

 

Why do you think Vinovich stated emphatically: "This is like the start of a new game."

 

Shanahan is an idiot.  😆 

This isn't baseball.  The baseball equivalent is if the road team scores in the top of the 11th, the game ends.  In baseball the home team still gets the bottom of the 11th, in football the team that defers doesn't get a 2nd chance if the receiving team scores on the 2nd possession.  Huge difference between baseball & the NFL.  

[mannc]

13 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

Same goes for the Chiefs on their first possession.  The sudden death aspect on the third possession is too big of an advantage not to take the ball first imho.

Except the Chiefs absolutely knew they had to score at least three points on their drive.  Knowing exactly what you need is a huge advantage.  Way too many ifs to worry about that third possession.  

[ExiledInIllinois]

44 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said:

This isn't baseball.  The baseball equivalent is if the road team scores in the top of the 11th, the game ends.  In baseball the home team still gets the bottom of the 11th, in football the team that defers doesn't get a 2nd chance if the receiving team scores on the 2nd possession.  Huge difference between baseball & the NFL.  

Yeah. The switch to sudden death is after the 1st inning. 😆 

 

How stupid.  Game is predicated on an opening coin toss and a possible OT coin toss... 😕 

Correction okay after the 10th inning. Still dumb.

[VaMilBill]

3 hours ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Very simple answer why you always take the ball: If both teams don't score on the 1st drive, you have a distinct advantage in number of possessions & are much more likely to win the game.  On the 1st 3 possessions you have 2 chances to score where if you defer, you may only have one.  No coach in his right mind would give away that advantage.  

If you’re going against Patrick Mahomes you don’t do that. 

[djp14150]

6 hours ago, BBFL said:

Not understanding the point you’re making… They didn’t. In that time frame I referenced all 5 were on 1st down or 2nd down w/ 10 or < …. 🤷‍♂️

CMC had 27 yards on 7 attempts in their first 3 drives. 19 total plays on them. 
 

That’s 36% of the plays being a run by CMC and you had success barring the fumble. Coupled that with a 3.8 YPC is the reason why it’s perplexing they went away from that.

 

You talk about success and rankings et cetera but the stats in that game show they didn’t run on 2nd/3rd and long but we’re successful period when they chose to run. 
 

I like Shannahan but his choices directly led to keeping KC hanging around long enough. You lost your last SB appearance against the same by doing the same thing… Mostert ripped off a massive run on their penultimate drive which afterward he chose to make Jimmy G sling the ball 6 times in a row after that play… Turning the ball over on downs via a sack. Their final drive they had to throw the ball due to time constraints and ended up with an INT to ice it. 
 

Kyle’s a heck of a coach but there’s a lot of questions marks for his decisions on the field without even factoring the OT coin toss…

 

Sorry but they blew it being up 10, not running the ball to try and burn some clock and giving Mahomes and the Chiefs some semblance of hope. 
 

2019 season they were the #2 rushing team behind Baltimore but decided to lean on the pass in the biggest game of the season.

 

2023 season, #3 team in rushing with the league leader by 300 yards!!!! And again, with a lead they decided to lean on the pass to pull ahead. Mental. 
 

The stats for the year prove they were the most successful team in a 22 personnel running the ball against a heavy box so the excuse people say “they couldn’t run on KC” was bogus. See the point about the stats over the first 3 drives before the abandoned the run game. 
 

 

 

Shanahan knows if the teams are playing 8 in the box that he will look to throw. The team has a decent group of receivers.  They need play action. They were a full ground and pond team.