Diggs cryptic comments - 2024 edition

[JoPoy88]

23 hours ago, Tim Tindale said:

Honestly, while I have no idea if this rumor has merit, identifying Houston as a landing spot isn’t crazy at all:

 

1). Nico Collins is on the last year of his rookie deal in 2024.  He’s going to want 1a WR money. Is that the WR you want to pair with Stroud and pay 1a money to? I would be questioning that. 
 

2) Tank Dell is a 5’8” 165-pound slot receiver on a rookie contract coming off a major injury. It’s irrelevant to whether you want to bring in an expensive WR1 to pair with Stroud.

 

3) Metchie is one year removed from leukemia with two years left on a rookie deal.  He caught 16 balls this year for 160 yards. I mean, WR4 perhaps?

 

4) Robert Woods will be 32 next year coming off a 40-catch season with one year left on his contract. He’s maybe a JAG, at best, at this point in his career.

 

5) If I’m Houston, I’m trying to find my Jamar Chase, Tyreek Hill, Ceedee Lamb, or dare I say, Steph Diggs to pair with my franchise QB. A Ferrari at WR1 that I’m willing to pay.  Tee Higgins fits the bill but he is probably going to get franchised, and then you have to outbid other suitors after 2024. You can go the draft, but you have to hit the pick correctly.

 

I don’t view that WR room as loaded at all and Diggs makes a lot of sense there, particularly if the WR1 is not in the building.  Niko Collins may not be the guy you want to pay top 10 WR money to after next season. 
 

They have the room because Collins and Stroud are on rookie contracts.

 

I mean, it’s not a crazy rumor at all from Houston’s side. 
 

If you are Beane/Bills, you make the deal because you think Houston believes Diggs is still a top 10 WR while you are convinced he’s on the decline with a massive contract.

 

Seems like a reasonable rumor to me. 

 

so they wouldn’t pay Collins but gladly pay up for Diggs who’s 7 years older? Sure

Edited February 10 by JoPoy88

[Tim Tindale]

18 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said:

so they wouldn’t pay Collins but gladly pay up for Diggs who’s 7 years older? Sure

 

1) You have no idea how they grade out their own players, especially after only one good year in Nico’s case (after two below average years without Stroud). 
 

2) They are $60MM under the cap currently in 2024 and over $100MM+ in 2025, with a franchise QB already in place on the cheap.  That affords them an awful lot of flexibility. 
 

I don’t why I’m pushing this, honestly. I just hate the implicit “zero percent probability” comments.  We have no idea how either GM might attack this when you have lighter skill talent, a cheap stud QB, and a ton of cap flexibility on one side and the other side is more aged and in cap hell. These types trades happen in the NBA quite often. I just don’t see why it’s just so impossible in this case.  

[JoPoy88]

5 minutes ago, Tim Tindale said:

 

1) You have no idea how they grade out their own players, especially after only one good year in Nico’s case (after two below average years without Stroud). 
 

2) They are $60MM under the cap currently in 2024 and over $100MM+ in 2025, with a franchise QB already in place on the cheap.  That affords them an awful lot of flexibility. 
 

I don’t why I’m pushing this, honestly. I just hate the implicit “zero percent probability” comments.  We have no idea how either GM might attack this when you have lighter skill talent, a cheap stud QB, and a ton of cap flexibility on one side and the other side is more aged and in cap hell. These types trades happen in the NBA quite often. I just don’t see why it’s just so impossible in this case.  

None of us know how they grade out players. Not sure that even needs mentioning. Beyond that though I actually agree with you - I don’t see it as a zero percent possibility either. Just very very close.

Edited February 10 by JoPoy88

[Low Positive]

5 minutes ago, Tim Tindale said:

 

1) You have no idea how they grade out their own players, especially after only one good year in Nico’s case (after two below average years without Stroud). 
 

2) They are $60MM under the cap currently in 2024 and over $100MM+ in 2025, with a franchise QB already in place on the cheap.  That affords them an awful lot of flexibility. 
 

I don’t why I’m pushing this, honestly. I just hate the implicit “zero percent probability” comments.  We have no idea how either GM might attack this when you have lighter skill talent, a cheap stud QB, and a ton of cap flexibility on one side and the other side is more aged and in cap hell. These types trades happen in the NBA quite often. I just don’t see why it’s just so impossible in this case.  

There is nothing like dead cap in the NBA. 

[BillsFanForever19]

6 hours ago, Tim Tindale said:

 

1) You have no idea how they grade out their own players, especially after only one good year in Nico’s case (after two below average years without Stroud). 
 

2) They are $60MM under the cap currently in 2024 and over $100MM+ in 2025, with a franchise QB already in place on the cheap.  That affords them an awful lot of flexibility. 
 

I don’t why I’m pushing this, honestly. I just hate the implicit “zero percent probability” comments.  We have no idea how either GM might attack this when you have lighter skill talent, a cheap stud QB, and a ton of cap flexibility on one side and the other side is more aged and in cap hell. These types trades happen in the NBA quite often. I just don’t see why it’s just so impossible in this case.  

 

I suppose nothing is a 0% possibility in the NFL. But this is as close as it gets.

 

Your main argument is they have money. And we don't. But it would cost us money to move on from Diggs and we'd have to replace him on top of it. And if money is no object for them, why not just go out and pay for Texas A&M hero Mike Evans, who wouldn't cost them any Draft compensation?

 

You also completely ignore one of the biggest issues at play here - why would we help 1 of the 3 other teams in the AFC who made it to the Divisional Playoffs?

 

Brandon Beane is someone who is careful and looks at all possibilities. And it's easily possible if he made that trade that he'd have to stand up at a Podium at the end of the year and explain why he handed the Texans a weapon that helped eliminate us from the Playoffs.

 

If he paid money to give a competing team a player that booted us from the Playoffs - that's a fireable offense. 

 

Your argument that maybe they look at Nico Collins as someone they wouldn't want to pay is dubious at best. If you Draft a guy, who at 24 years old is #8 in the NFL in Yardage, no GM would evaluate that and say "not worth paying". You don't see Top 10 WR's at that age on the market, like ever. Teams don't do that. Especially when your young QB became a star using that player as his #1 option and they're growing together.

 

At 24, he could still get even better than he was this year. No GM is going to make it harder on themselves to bring back an ascending 24 year old star to bring in a 31 year old star. This whole concept you're arguing is a myriad of malpractice by both Brandon Beane and Nick Caserio. And comparing trades in the NFL to trades in the NBA really doesn't help the validity of your arguments.

Edited February 11 by BillsFanForever19

[Thrivefourfive]

We have to be real serious about what a true WR1 is and level our expectations. Almost every top WR has weaknesses except like three.. Jefferson, Chase, Hill, in that exponentially descending order. 
 

It’s obvious, the draft is where these guys are found. Not free agency, and not second/third contracts. Diggs is not a true WR1 anymore. His peak is in the past and I feel he’s an overachiever. Best-for-best, Thielen was better. JA17 and Thielen would have been a better combo in Buffalo. I still think if you take the 15th best WR in the league, JA17 can get top five production from him/her. 
 

Higgins and Collins are prime examples of a very good receiver that will be featured as a WR1 and depending on their QB, very well could disappoint a fanbase. Higgins is more gifted, Collins has more heart, both are slow but long. 
 

OBD should add another wing to the building just for finding potential WR superstardom in each and every draft. You need a steady flow of these guys to truly contend for a title every season. It’s a sure fire way to get there. 
 

The game is 60-65-70% passing. To neglect this position in anyway is minor league stuff. Good luck making McBeane follow through on that. 

[Beck Water]

10 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Who would trade a 1st at this point for Diggs and his contract?

 

One answer is certainly not a team that clearly knows how to draft WRs....

Diggs contract isn’t that bad to a trade partner.  It slots him in about 15-17 in average value.  
 

But yeah. that’s not the performance you trade a 1st for either

[transplantbillsfan]

Watched a couple Diggs interviews.

 

Honestly... I think he's just sick of people asking about it. I think he believes he clearly squashed any thought of him wanting out of Buffalo when in Training Camp he spoke glowingly of the Bills and said he wanted to retire a Bill.

 

Even his interviews now he says he doesn't want to be traded. He says he and Josh are family and Josh has done so much for him.

 

The whole "where there's smoke there's fire" statement came in the middle of him riffing.

 

We can't move Diggs.

 

We won't move Diggs.

 

Diggs will continue to be evasive all offseason because that's just how he is.

 

#/thread

[TheWeatherMan]

Another factor to consider is that if McDermott thinks/knows he’s on the hot seat do you think he’s trading his #1WR?  If I’m him, I’m not.  I’m focused on the short term!  

[without a drought]

"Where there's smoke there's fire."

 

It looks like he's either heading to California with their wild fires or he's leaving to become a fireman.

 

 

[billsfan_34]

On 2/3/2024 at 10:54 PM, SoonerBillsFan said:

Meh,whatever.  Show up in the fall and perform.  

Or….find a trade partner that takes a lot of his cap hit, make a push for Tee Higgins and draft a stud WR in the first. Tall order for sure!!!

[Beck Water]

58 minutes ago, billsfan_34 said:

Or….find a trade partner that takes a lot of his cap hit, make a push for Tee Higgins and draft a stud WR in the first. Tall order for sure!!!

 

Not just directed at you, but I get a bit frustrated at people who don't learn the basics about how NFL contracts are structured and how they work with regard to the cap in the case of a trade or cut.  So they say something like this, and other people "like" or agree with them.

 

There is no way that I know of (and I have tried to learn about this) to decrease Diggs cap hit to the Bills in the case of a trade.

 

Diggs cap hit this season is $27.9M. 

 

Of that cap hit, 2/3 is Diggs salary of $18.4M, which is not guaranteed until 5 days into the new league year in March.  The salary would go to the trade partner, although there have been deals where the trading team agrees to pay part of the salary.

 

BUT the Bills cap hit from Diggs would INCREASE not decrease if Diggs were traded.  This is because teams are allowed to pro-rate or amortize up-front bonus payments over the length of the contract (and even beyond it, by adding on "void years").  This is money Diggs has already been paid up-front, and per the collective bargaining agreement he can not be asked to return any part of it to the Bills, (unless he retires).  It all accelerates into 2024 if he is traded or cut, totalling $31.1M.

 

The Bills could trade Diggs post-June 1, and divide his cap hit into $8.85M of amortized bonus payments due this year, and $22.25M due next season.  BUT, that would mean the Bills must account for all $27.9 of Digg's cap until after June 1, AND his $18.5M salary would guarantee - so if the trade partner backed out or Diggs didn't pass their physical, the Bills would owe it all.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/

Edited February 11 by Beck Water

[billsfan_34]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

Not just directed at you, but I get a bit frustrated at people who don't learn the basics about how NFL contracts are structured and how they work with regard to the cap in the case of a trade or cut.  So they say something like this, and other people "like" or agree with them.

 

There is no way that I know of (and I have tried to learn about this) to decrease Diggs cap hit to the Bills in the case of a trade.

 

Diggs cap hit this season is $27.9M. 

 

Of that cap hit, 2/3 is Diggs salary of $18.4M, which is not guaranteed until 5 days into the new league year in March.  The salary would go to the trade partner, although there have been deals where the trading team agrees to pay part of the salary.

 

BUT the Bills cap hit from Diggs would INCREASE not decrease if Diggs were traded.  This is because teams are allowed to pro-rate or amortize up-front bonus payments over the length of the contract (and even beyond it, by adding on "void years").  This is money Diggs has already been paid up-front, and per the collective bargaining agreement he can not be asked to return any part of it to the Bills, (unless he retires).  It all accelerates into 2024 if he is traded or cut, totalling $31.1M.

 

The Bills could trade Diggs post-June 1, and divide his cap hit into $8.85M of amortized bonus payments due this year, and $22.25M due next season.  BUT, that would mean the Bills must account for all $27.9 of Digg's cap until after June 1, AND his $18.5M salary would guarantee - so if the trade partner backed out or Diggs didn't pass their physical, the Bills would owe it all.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/

Thanks my friend. I totally get this, and why I said “tall order…”. I believe Diggs is on the Bills roster next year because of exactly what you point out in a much more thorough way. I was too lazy to do all that lol 😂. Enjoy the super bowl too bad its not our Bills.

[Tim Tindale]

19 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

I suppose nothing is a 0% possibility in the NFL. But this is as close as it gets.

 

Your main argument is they have money. And we don't. But it would cost us money to move on from Diggs and we'd have to replace him on top of it. And if money is no object for them, why not just go out and pay for Texas A&M hero Mike Evans, who wouldn't cost them any Draft compensation?

 

You also completely ignore one of the biggest issues at play here - why would we help 1 of the 3 other teams in the AFC who made it to the Divisional Playoffs?

 

Brandon Beane is someone who is careful and looks at all possibilities. And it's easily possible if he made that trade that he'd have to stand up at a Podium at the end of the year and explain why he handed the Texans a weapon that helped eliminate us from the Playoffs.

 

If he paid money to give a competing team a player that booted us from the Playoffs - that's a fireable offense. 

 

Your argument that maybe they look at Nico Collins as someone they wouldn't want to pay is dubious at best. If you Draft a guy, who at 24 years old is #8 in the NFL in Yardage, no GM would evaluate that and say "not worth paying". You don't see Top 10 WR's at that age on the market, like ever. Teams don't do that. Especially when your young QB became a star using that player as his #1 option and they're growing together.

 

At 24, he could still get even better than he was this year. No GM is going to make it harder on themselves to bring back an ascending 24 year old star to bring in a 31 year old star. This whole concept you're arguing is a myriad of malpractice by both Brandon Beane and Nick Caserio. And comparing trades in the NFL to trades in the NBA really doesn't help the validity of your arguments.

Honestly, the parallels between where the Chiefs were (Tyreek was getting disenchanted, the Chiefs were strapped for cash, though Hill was two years younger than Steph) and where the Dolphins were (wanted more skill players around a cheap, promising Tua and a young Waddle and had cap room) are notable.  No one would have called that trade before it happened either, especially because the Chiefs were trading in conference. One might say that Veach had goodwill to burn after winning the Super Bowl three years before this trade, but the Chiefs had just blown a lead at home in the AFCCG and lost big to the Bucs the year before that. Then they turn around and trade The Cheetah.  I’m sure Chiefs’ fans were apoplectic, especially because it was theoretically creating competition within conference. And Tyreek is more of a game-wrecker than Steph. 
 

I just think something is possible here and the odds are higher than “near-zero/impossible”.  It doesn’t have to be Houston, but yes, a similar situation where the other franchise has plenty of cap room and a cheap QB in the place where they want to add more talent to the WR room.
 

Incidentally, I re-looked up some articles written in the immediate aftermath of that Hill-to-the-Dolphins deal.  Tyreek was pushing his way out of Kansas City behind the scenes in part because he was unhappy with the number targets he was getting in Reid’s offense. He actually called his agent mid-season and told him he isn’t playing in Kansas City in ‘22.  It’s not inconceivable that Steph may be doing the same with the change to Brady. To be fair, he also wanted more money. Steph’s contract is trickier with the dead cap (I think 27MM after June 1st) on Buffalo’s side, though I do wonder if there is restructuring that can be done to work around it.  

 

I’m not saying it’s absolutely going to happen, but I do think the odds are higher than others in this discussion.  I think when it comes down to humans and incentives are aligned, things can get done that might seem shocking to outsiders. Anyway, good offseason debate and go Bills!!! Let’s hope Beane pulls off some magic and both improves the cap situation and Josh’s weapons.  

[Tim Tindale]

38 minutes ago, Tim Tindale said:

Honestly, the parallels between where the Chiefs were (Tyreek was getting disenchanted, the Chiefs were strapped for cash, though Hill was two years younger than Steph) and where the Dolphins were (wanted more skill players around a cheap, promising Tua and a young Waddle and had cap room) are notable.  No one would have called that trade before it happened either, especially because the Chiefs were trading in conference. One might say that Veach had goodwill to burn after winning the Super Bowl three years before this trade, but the Chiefs had just blown a lead at home in the AFCCG and lost big to the Bucs the year before that. Then they turn around and trade The Cheetah.  I’m sure Chiefs’ fans were apoplectic, especially because it was theoretically creating competition within conference. And Tyreek is more of a game-wrecker than Steph. 
 

I just think something is possible here and the odds are higher than “near-zero/impossible”.  It doesn’t have to be Houston, but yes, a similar situation where the other franchise has plenty of cap room and a cheap QB in the place where they want to add more talent to the WR room.
 

Incidentally, I re-looked up some articles written in the immediate aftermath of that Hill-to-the-Dolphins deal.  Tyreek was pushing his way out of Kansas City behind the scenes in part because he was unhappy with the number targets he was getting in Reid’s offense. He actually called his agent mid-season and told him he isn’t playing in Kansas City in ‘22.  It’s not inconceivable that Steph may be doing the same with the change to Brady. To be fair, he also wanted more money. Steph’s contract is trickier with the dead cap (I think 27MM after June 1st) on Buffalo’s side, though I do wonder if there is restructuring that can be done to work around it.  

 

I’m not saying it’s absolutely going to happen, but I do think the odds are higher than others in this discussion.  I think when it comes down to humans and incentives are aligned, things can get done that might seem shocking to outsiders. Anyway, good offseason debate and go Bills!!! Let’s hope Beane pulls off some magic and both improves the cap situation and Josh’s weapons.  

Just read that the Chiefs only took a $2.65MM cap hit by trading Tyreek. Puts somewhat of a vat of cold water on that comparison.  

[Johnnyp566]

Careful what you wish for dude. You may just wind up in Carolina. 

[zow2]

I've seen enough Diggs interviews now that it's plainly obvious.  He would very much welcome a trade to another team...probably somewhere in a larger market where he can oversee his upcoming clothing line and post NFL fashion career.

 

His heart in not in Buffalo anymore.  The best he can say about Allen is he will "always be fam the way they welcomed him in".  But that's about it.  Diggs' drop in the biggest moment will be the culmination of his Bills career.  He acted like his disappearing act in the 2nd half of the season, was not his doing. 

[ndirish1978]

I'm tired of his drama. Diggs and Miller are just cap millstones around this team's neck next year - they are both declining and not helping our team much next year. 

[Peter]

It is amazing how some people know how to say the right words and how easy it is to do so. It is not hard and takes less time than coming up with cryptic responses:

 

 

Edited February 14 by Peter

[BarleyNY]

On 2/11/2024 at 11:45 AM, Beck Water said:

 

Not just directed at you, but I get a bit frustrated at people who don't learn the basics about how NFL contracts are structured and how they work with regard to the cap in the case of a trade or cut.  So they say something like this, and other people "like" or agree with them.

 

There is no way that I know of (and I have tried to learn about this) to decrease Diggs cap hit to the Bills in the case of a trade.

 

Diggs cap hit this season is $27.9M. 

 

Of that cap hit, 2/3 is Diggs salary of $18.4M, which is not guaranteed until 5 days into the new league year in March.  The salary would go to the trade partner, although there have been deals where the trading team agrees to pay part of the salary.

 

BUT the Bills cap hit from Diggs would INCREASE not decrease if Diggs were traded.  This is because teams are allowed to pro-rate or amortize up-front bonus payments over the length of the contract (and even beyond it, by adding on "void years").  This is money Diggs has already been paid up-front, and per the collective bargaining agreement he can not be asked to return any part of it to the Bills, (unless he retires).  It all accelerates into 2024 if he is traded or cut, totalling $31.1M.

 

The Bills could trade Diggs post-June 1, and divide his cap hit into $8.85M of amortized bonus payments due this year, and $22.25M due next season.  BUT, that would mean the Bills must account for all $27.9 of Digg's cap until after June 1, AND his $18.5M salary would guarantee - so if the trade partner backed out or Diggs didn't pass their physical, the Bills would owe it all.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/

 

Well said. I’ve been studying the NFL cap for about 20 years now. I do not expect everyone to know the finer details, but the basics are pretty easy to understand, especially with Spotrac and OTC. 

 

If the Bills trade Diggs they can manage his cap hit with some other moves. I’ve worked through it on OTC and it’s doable. Beyond restructures, releases and pay cuts (White) they they can kick some cap hits from expiring contracts into next season with void years. Here’s a link if you want to mess around with OTC’s interactive cap calculator. Just click on the Cut (pre 6/1) buttons for options:

https://overthecap.com/calculator/buffalo-bills

Edited February 14 by BarleyNY