Success Posted January 26 Posted January 26 2 minutes ago, FireChans said: Mahomes brought one of the worst defenses in the NFL to the AFCCG. Josh Allen has had a top 5 defense every year but one, and ironically that was the year he got to the AFCCG. And how have our defenses performed in the playoffs? How were they on Sunday? Quote
FireChans Posted January 26 Posted January 26 4 minutes ago, Success said: And how have our defenses performed in the playoffs? How were they on Sunday? About as good as Kansas City’s. 2 Quote
SCBills Posted January 26 Posted January 26 (edited) 22 minutes ago, FireChans said: Mahomes brought one of the worst defenses in the NFL to the AFCCG. Josh Allen has had a top 5 defense every year but one, and ironically that was the year he got to the AFCCG. Mahomes had Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce in his prime. Then Travis Kelce in his prime and the best OL in the NFL. Patrick Mahomes had trash at WR all year, right? How have they looked in the playoffs so far? KC, as a team, elevates in the playoffs. Reid > McDermott hell… Spags > McDermott Chris Jones is, by far, the best defensive player of the two teams for the past 4 years. L’Jarius Snead, probably second best. We have one guy who elevates consistently in the playoffs.. Josh Allen. I expect those outside our fanbase to play dumb about the reality of the Playoffs Bills, but not those within. Edited January 26 by SCBills 1 1 Quote
FireChans Posted January 26 Posted January 26 6 minutes ago, Success said: And how have our defenses performed in the playoffs? How were they on Sunday? As an aside, Mahomes in the postseason, when his defense allows 20+ points. 10-3 Josh Allen in the postseason when his defense allows more than 20 points. 2-5. It’s joever. 1 2 Quote
FireChans Posted January 26 Posted January 26 16 minutes ago, SCBills said: Mahomes had Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce in his prime. Then Travis Kelce in his prime and the best OL in the NFL. Patrick Mahomes had trash at WR all year, right? How have they looked in the playoffs so far? KC, as a team, elevates in the playoffs. Reid > McDermott hell… Spags > McDermott Chris Jones is, by far, the best defensive player of the two teams for the past 4 years. L’Jarius Snead, probably second best. We have one guy who elevates consistently in the playoffs.. Josh Allen. I expect those outside our fanbase to play dumb about the reality of the Playoffs Bills, but not those within. Poyer elevated this week, he made a game saving forced fumble. We just don't talk about it because we lost. Just like if Josh Allen gets the first down after missing Shakir in the end zone, we wouldn't be talking about Chris Jones who had one tackle on the night lol. Quote
SCBills Posted January 26 Posted January 26 (edited) 5 minutes ago, FireChans said: Poyer elevated this week, he made a game saving forced fumble. We just don't talk about it because we lost. Just like if Josh Allen gets the first down after missing Shakir in the end zone, we wouldn't be talking about Chris Jones who had one tackle on the night lol. Ok, so Poyer made one game-saving play. Jones made one game preserving play. Butker hit his FG’s. Bass missed the game tying one. MVS made a contested catch downfield over our All-Pro corner. Sherfield came up with 0/2 50/50 balls thrown downfield to him. Kelce got open all night. Doggs, 3 for 21 with a fumble and a 65 yard drop middle of the 4th quarter. Mahomes missed an open TD, twice early in the game, if we’re going to put the loss on Allen for Dawkins getting beat. Cook dropped a TD, and Allen picked him up and still got the TD. We can do this all day, because your argument starts and ends with Poyer making one play. Edited January 26 by SCBills Quote
HappyDays Posted January 26 Posted January 26 34 minutes ago, FireChans said: I think it’s possible that McD has one and Reid has zero, yeah. You don't think Allen with three seasons of the GOAT pass catching TE, the GOAT vertical WR, the GOAT offensive coach, and the best defensive coordinator in the league, would win a Super Bowl in that time frame? You might as well just say Allen will never win a Super Bowl. I honestly think any top 12ish QB would have a very strong chance of winning one Super Bowl in that situation. Quote
FireChans Posted January 26 Posted January 26 (edited) 3 minutes ago, SCBills said: Ok, so Poyer made one game-saving play. Jones made one game preserving play. Butker hit his FG’s. Bass missed the game tying one. MVS made a contested catch downfield over our All-Pro corner. Sherfield came up with 0/2 50/50 balls thrown downfield to him. Kelce got open all night. Doggs, 3 for 21 with a fumble and a 65 yard drop middle of the 4th quarter. Mahomes missed an open TD, twice early in the game, if we’re going to put the loss on Allen for Dawkins getting beat. Who is our all-pro corner? What are we even talking about? You also forgot Shakir making a tremendous TD catch. And Diggs didn't even lose his fumble, so don't forget Josh's fumble either. Edited January 26 by FireChans Quote
SCBills Posted January 26 Posted January 26 Just now, FireChans said: Who is our all-pro corner? What are we even talking about? You also forgot Shakir making a tremendous TD catch. And Diggs didn't even lose his fumble lol. Taron Johnson. Yes, Shakir stepped up. He’s in Year 2. Hopefully I can FINALLY add another name to the list, outside Josh Allen, that step up in the postseason. Nah, we just lost 10 yards and the down because Kincaid had to save him. Quote
FireChans Posted January 26 Posted January 26 Just now, HappyDays said: You don't think Allen with three seasons of the GOAT pass catching TE, the GOAT vertical WR, the GOAT offensive coach, and the best defensive coordinator in the league, would win a Super Bowl in that time frame? You might as well just say Allen will never win a Super Bowl. I honestly think any top 12ish QB would have a very strong chance of winning one Super Bowl in that situation. Spags wasn't their DC in 2018. They had one of the worst defenses in the league. They went to the AFCCG anyway. Fair enough, Allen probably wins a Superbowl. But I think the Mahomes Allen debate is still close, not a 4-0 lead. Quote
billrooter Posted January 26 Posted January 26 (edited) On 1/24/2024 at 8:04 PM, Process said: You either have Pat Josh or Lamar or you don't , impossible to rank the rest I'm guessing some are leaving Burrows out because he got injured? Heck Lamar has had a good year but I think everyone is overreacting a bit with him, his previous two years were nothing special passing wise and I wouldn't be surprised one bit if he regresses next year. Think Dak catches too much heat for underperforming in the playoffs as well, he was amazing during the year. Edited January 26 by billrooter Quote
HappyDays Posted January 26 Posted January 26 (edited) 13 minutes ago, FireChans said: Spags wasn't their DC in 2018. They had one of the worst defenses in the league. They went to the AFCCG anyway. Fair enough, Allen probably wins a Superbowl. But I think the Mahomes Allen debate is still close, not a 4-0 lead. So when I said three years of that situation I meant three years... But okay thanks for acknowledging that Allen would win 1 Super Bowl with three years of arguably the greatest surrounding cast that a QB has ever had. I don't know why you ever doubted this to begin with. Hell let's look at just last year. Imagine if in the wildcard round Allen missed 20% of snaps to injury. Is it likely our journey ends there? I would say so. But let's say somehow the team gets through it and wins. The next week against the Bengals in the AFCCG Allen leads the Bills to just 23 points. In crunch time he inexplicably fumbles the ball at midfield and the Bengals take over with a chance to win. In fact on his final 4 drives Allen leads his team to just 3 points, which is aided by a drive starting at the 50 and a roughing the passer penalty. But for argument's sake, the Bills somehow win. Now we're in the Super Bowl against the best team in the league. Allen throws for just 182 yards, adding another 44 on the ground. Be honest - do you think if everything I just described happened in the exact same manner but to Allen and the Bills instead of Mahomes and the Chiefs, would the Bills have won a Super Bowl last year? Personally I don't think they would have made it out of the wildcard round and certainly not the divisional round. Outcomes are relative. Individual performances are not. Edited January 26 by HappyDays 1 Quote
Success Posted January 26 Posted January 26 (edited) I mean, it comes out in the end that Mahomes is 3-0 against Allen in the playoffs. People forget: in that 1st AFCCG - the top 4 Bills receivers had significant injuries. Diggs had an oblique. Beasley had a broken leg. Allen left the field w/ the lead w/ 13 seconds in the next one. Not much more to say on that. Last Sunday - decimated defense, drops from Diggs & Sherfield (while KC receivers made tough catches they were dropping all year), missed FG. Football, as we know, is a team game. We pull our hair out about McDermott, while Reid is now widely acknowledged as the best coach in the league. As another poster just pointed out - if any one of a few plays goes the Bills way and they pull it out on Sunday, at least some of the conversation this week would have been 'is Allen the best now?' That's how quickly narratives can turn. Edited January 26 by Success 1 Quote
wppete Posted January 26 Posted January 26 On 1/24/2024 at 8:08 PM, chongli said: 1. Mahomes 2. Jackson 3. Burrow 4. Allen 5. Rodgers 6. Herbert 7. Hurts 8. Stroud 9. Love 10. (tie) Prescott, Lawrence, Stafford I like this list But for me Josh is #1. Best QB in the NFL, just need to get him some weapons and a healthy defense. 1 1 Quote
DrBob806 Posted January 26 Posted January 26 33 minutes ago, SCBills said: Ok, so Poyer made one game-saving play. Jones made one game preserving play. Butker hit his FG’s. Bass missed the game tying one. MVS made a contested catch downfield over our All-Pro corner. Sherfield came up with 0/2 50/50 balls thrown downfield to him. Kelce got open all night. Doggs, 3 for 21 with a fumble and a 65 yard drop middle of the 4th quarter. Mahomes missed an open TD, twice early in the game, if we’re going to put the loss on Allen for Dawkins getting beat. Cook dropped a TD, and Allen picked him up and still got the TD. We can do this all day, because your argument starts and ends with Poyer making one play. This How it continues to happen, wow. PS- Herbert might become a top 10 QB, but he's not now. I cannot figure out why he's so hyped. Is it because he's in LA? 30 wins 32 losses. Quote
FireChans Posted January 26 Posted January 26 19 minutes ago, HappyDays said: So when I said three years of that situation I meant three years... But okay thanks for acknowledging that Allen would win 1 Super Bowl with three years of arguably the greatest surrounding cast that a QB has ever had. I don't know why you ever doubted this to begin with. Hell let's look at just last year. Imagine if in the wildcard round Allen missed 20% of snaps to injury. Is it likely our journey ends there? I would say so. But let's say somehow the team gets through it and wins. The next week against the Bengals in the AFCCG Allen leads the Bills to just 23 points. In crunch time he inexplicably fumbles the ball at midfield and the Bengals take over with a chance to win. In fact on his final 4 drives Allen leads his team to just 3 points, which is aided by a drive starting at the 50 and a roughing the passer penalty. But for argument's sake, the Bills somehow win. Now we're in the Super Bowl against the best team in the league. Allen throws for just 182 yards, adding another 44 on the ground. Be honest - do you think if everything I just described happened in the exact same manner but to Allen and the Bills instead of Mahomes and the Chiefs, would the Bills have won a Super Bowl last year? Personally I don't think they would have made it out of the wildcard round and certainly not the divisional round. Outcomes are relative. Individual performances are not. Woah woah woah, throwing for 182 yards and rushing for 44 yards made Allen spectacular this week. Now, it’s some middling performance in the Super Bowl? 1 Quote
SCBills Posted January 26 Posted January 26 2 minutes ago, DrBob806 said: This How it continues to happen, wow. PS- Herbert might become a top 10 QB, but he's not now. I cannot figure out why he's so hyped. Is it because he's in LA? 30 wins 32 losses. Herbert is the opposite of Allen, in the sense that people over-compensate for his shortcomings by blaming those around him. Very good QB. Elite talent. But something is missing in him, along with the issues around him. If anyone can change that, it would be Harbaugh though. 2 1 Quote
HappyDays Posted January 26 Posted January 26 1 minute ago, FireChans said: Woah woah woah, throwing for 182 yards and rushing for 44 yards made Allen spectacular this week. Now, it’s some middling performance in the Super Bowl? See the difference between you and me is I watch the games. So I watched Mahomes' surrounding cast maximize every play he made in that Super Bowl. His 182 passing yards is exactly what he earned as a player. Allen meanwhile lost, what, 100 yards and likely a TD on just the three dropped deep passes. But also you just made my point for me... Allen plays with his hair on fire, but the exact production that Mahomes won a Super Bowl with was not enough for Allen to advance past the divisional round. Think about that. You're well on your way to understanding that team accomplishments do not equate to QB accomplishments. 1 2 Quote
JerseyBills Posted January 26 Posted January 26 Allen Mahomes Lamar Stroud Burrow, Herbert, Purdy, Dak , Goff AFC is LOADED 1 Quote
FireChans Posted January 26 Posted January 26 (edited) 6 minutes ago, HappyDays said: See the difference between you and me is I watch the games. So I watched Mahomes' surrounding cast maximize every play he made in that Super Bowl. His 182 passing yards is exactly what he earned as a player. Allen meanwhile lost, what, 100 yards and likely a TD on just the three dropped deep passes. But also you just made my point for me... Allen plays with his hair on fire, but the exact production that Mahomes won a Super Bowl with was not enough for Allen to advance past the divisional round. Think about that. You're well on your way to understanding that team accomplishments do not equate to QB accomplishments. Okay so you agree that Mahomes was elite in that Super Bowl? You’re trying to have it both ways. Edited January 26 by FireChans Quote
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