Buffalo_Stampede Posted January 24 Posted January 24 1 minute ago, MPL said: Overspending for a "WR 2" in Free Agency seems to never work out for any team. I can't think of a single example Overpaying? Not sure what you mean? There’s examples every year of WR2’s making impacts. I think you mean overpaying for WR1 in UFA. I mean I can name 2 Bills related players off the top of my head. Beasley was a good signing coming here and Robert Woods was a great signing by LA. Quote
Rigotz Posted January 24 Posted January 24 Best WR draft in years and we need a long term solution for both #2WR and #1WR. .... and you guys want to spend big money in Free Agency? 2 Quote
DrDawkinstein Posted January 24 Posted January 24 14 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: I agree Beane needs to go for the new WR1 this year. I don't agree with Diggs sticking around for the end of his contract. His cost (before they restructure probably one more time) is $28.4M in 2026. Current dead cap that year is $13.4M. Could be gone that year. NO WAY he is playing for $22M+ in 2027 when he is 34 years old with a $4.5M dead cap. I'm not necessarily advocating for him to play out the contract. Just saying it becomes more justifiable when you combine his salary with the new #1 rookie deal, and look at the total spend across your #1 and #2 WRs. 14 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: I think allowing our young WR to develop is also key. Shakir is ready for a breakout next year but we shouldn’t depend on that. Sign a tier 2 WR2. Starts next year with… WR1 Diggs WR2 UFA WR3 Shakir WR4 Rookie 1st round pick WR5 Shorter WR6 Rookie mid round round pick If we take a WR in the 1st round this year, from this class, and they are our 4th option for ANY amount of time, then McD and the entire Offensive staff should be fired. Most of the guys that will go early this class should be immediate starters, if not immediate #1 guys. If you want to slot the rookie in as starting the year as our WR2, just to make the transition easier (for both him AND Diggs), then fine. But whoever we are taking in the 1st this year needs to contribute right away, and should even have a better year than Kincaid had in '23. 1 Quote
GASabresIUFan Posted January 24 Posted January 24 12 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: Sherfield and Harty were dart throws. Think more Beasley and John Brown. Crowder had the injuries, but that was his career. This team needs to get younger, cheaper, and more talented. Diggs is a 2 now and we can't afford (and shouldn't invest) in a true No. 1 receiver. We are better off drafting and trying to develop one instead. 1 Quote
Buffalo_Stampede Posted January 24 Posted January 24 12 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: I refuse to believe that catching a football is brain surgery. Just draft a guy with the physical tools and have Josh throw him the football! I couldn’t care less whether anyone considers him a #1 or #2. Hard part for a rookie WR is route running and learning a new playbook. Route running is key because a lot of these WRs in college don’t run many routes. Also understanding coverages. The announcers pointed out a great play by Rice for the Chiefs where he sat down on a zone rather than taking it up field. Said earlier in the year he doesn’t read that coverage. 1 Quote
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted January 24 Author Posted January 24 41 minutes ago, Beck Water said: I threw up a little in my mouth at your 2nd tier. But IMHO we need to be all-in in the draft AND sign a reasonable vet. I don't disagree. It is not a group that inspires confidence. But that is the current market. Quote
947 Posted January 24 Posted January 24 Mooney & Samuel are Slot WRs, we do not need that. Shakir is a very good Slot & will likely be for years to come. What we need is an outside WR. I think we draft that guy in the 1st, but we also need a bargain-priced vet for that role. The ones who fit that bill are Chark & Josh Reynolds. Chark would probably be the cheaper of the 2, but I'd be ok with either. Quote
Buffalo_Stampede Posted January 24 Posted January 24 (edited) 9 minutes ago, GASabresIUFan said: This team needs to get younger, cheaper, and more talented. Diggs is a 2 now and we can't afford (and shouldn't invest) in a true No. 1 receiver. We are better off drafting and trying to develop one instead. They shouldn’t rely on a late 1st round rookie. I know it’s a deep class and the 7th WR drafted is probably as good as any WR drafted in the first last season but I would still add. That’s why I like Curtis Samuel because he can play every position and won’t block a rookie X or z WR for playing time. Edited January 24 by Buffalo_Stampede Quote
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted January 24 Posted January 24 Beane said he'd be crazy not sign Gabe Davis with the caveat at the right price. However, I feel like Beane's value of Davis is probably higher than it should be. Quote
Mark Vader Posted January 24 Posted January 24 31 minutes ago, Mynamemike said: I’m all for drafting one early and see if the titans will let Dhop go for a late round pick. I like this idea. Quote
Buffalo_Stampede Posted January 24 Posted January 24 5 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: I'm not necessarily advocating for him to play out the contract. Just saying it becomes more justifiable when you combine his salary with the new #1 rookie deal, and look at the total spend across your #1 and #2 WRs. If we take a WR in the 1st round this year, from this class, and they are our 4th option for ANY amount of time, then McD and the entire Offensive staff should be fired. Most of the guys that will go early this class should be immediate starters, if not immediate #1 guys. If you want to slot the rookie in as starting the year as our WR2, just to make the transition easier (for both him AND Diggs), then fine. But whoever we are taking in the 1st this year needs to contribute right away, and should even have a better year than Kincaid had in '23. That’s why Samuel is my free agent target. He can be on the field with Diggs, rookie, Shakir, and Kincaid and scare the crap out of opposing defenses. Im just being conservative with the rookie expectations next year. But yes, they should be starting. 1 Quote
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted January 24 Author Posted January 24 12 minutes ago, MPL said: Overspending for a "WR 2" in Free Agency seems to never work out for any team. I can't think of a single example I would say that the top end of my hopes would be an equivalent to Emmanuel Sanders in 2021. He picked up 750 yards that year as part of his last stop before retirement at $6 M. So it can be done. 31 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: We do NOT need a #2 WR. We need a new #1 who pushes Diggs down to #2. That is the best way to keep Diggs here and afford to let him play out his contract (which we'll need to do on a dead money basis). Then as Diggs' contract expires in 4 years, we still have the new #1 on a 5th year option cheap before having to shift Stef's money to the #1's extension. I agree in principal, but I do not see *any* WR in the draft who takes #1 from Diggs as the Week 1 starter. After a year or so? Yes, that seems like a fair aim. Personally I am all in favor of burning some capital to move into the teens or early 20s if the right guy drops. CeeDee Lamb, Justin Jefferson and Zay Flowers were all taken around there, so there is often value to be had. 2 Quote
Mark Vader Posted January 24 Posted January 24 2 minutes ago, D. L. Hot-Flamethrower said: Beane said he'd be crazy not sign Gabe Davis with the caveat at the right price. However, I feel like Beane's value of Davis is probably higher than it should be. I've said this before, do not trust Beane with what he initially says, because most of the time he will do the opposite. 1 Quote
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted January 24 Posted January 24 Just now, Mark Vader said: I've said this before, do not trust Beane with what he initially says, because most of the time he will do the opposite. You're correct, thanks for reminding me. It could just be he setting the table to be outpaced by the market. Quote
Buffalo_Stampede Posted January 24 Posted January 24 Just now, D. L. Hot-Flamethrower said: You're correct, thanks for reminding me. It could just be he setting the table to be outpaced by the market. I do think they want Gabe Davis back at the right price. I don’t think it prevents the Bills from drafting a WR in the 1st. Gabe is a true outside WR2/3. The Bills are in the market for a future WR1 and a true WR2/3. Quote
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted January 24 Posted January 24 1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: I do think they want Gabe Davis back at the right price. I don’t think it prevents the Bills from drafting a WR in the 1st. Gabe is a true outside WR2/3. The Bills are in the market for a future WR1 and a true WR2/3. It could be sure. I still think the error of ways was not getting another top guy like Deandre Hopkins when he was out there. All those other guys don't look so bad with him in there. Quote
Mark Vader Posted January 24 Posted January 24 1 hour ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said: I share the opinion that I have seen in many places on this board: that WR #2 is a major weakness going into the offseason. I am also part of the group that believes that the Bills should spend draft resources to address the problem for one reason: WR #2 gets stupid money in free agency. Stupid money. But there is always a case to be made for best pick available. Having something in the pipeline in case we roll box cars in the draft, or we take a guy with high upside but we want to ease in. So, here is a quick list at notable receivers that Spotrac has considered notable for the free agent class. I have exluded known slot receivers (We have Shakir and he's doing just fine) For comparisons sake, let's start with a known quality. Gabe Davis. I believe that Gabe Davis was a very solid #3/4 option, but was badly inconsistent as a #2. According to Spotrac, he is expected to make an average of $13.6 M per year. That would be pricey for the Bills in 2024 and we would want an upgrade. So...here is the class Most likely out of our price range Mike Evans OBJ Tyler Boyd Tee Higgins Michael Pittman Jr. Calvin Ridley I put these out here not because I think they are fits, but because this is what the top end of the market will be getting. Now, if any one of those is not snapped up on Day 1 you absolutely make a call, but he is a more likely list of what will be waiting around on Day 2 Curtis Samuel Nelson Aghalor Josh Reynolds Randall Cobb Darnell Mooney So, any interest or are we all in on the draft? Good write-up. That 2nd tier is not that inspiring, although Darnell Mooney would be intriguing. I would really love to make a play for Calvin Ridley, but you might be right that he could be too expensive. Quote
ngbills Posted January 24 Posted January 24 If there is a guy that can takeover for Diggs and is younger then maybe you spend the money and move on from Diggs the following season. Guys that may fit that are: Pittman Evans (age is getting up there) Ridley Not sure I overpay for any of these three. But on the right kind of deal maybe Evans or Pittman. So if you are then going for a more typical #2 your looking at: Higgins - likely too pricey Reynolds Samuel Brown Chark Mooney See what the market is like and snag one of them or two. Quote
Buffalo_Stampede Posted January 24 Posted January 24 (edited) 5 minutes ago, D. L. Hot-Flamethrower said: It could be sure. I still think the error of ways was not getting another top guy like Deandre Hopkins when he was out there. All those other guys don't look so bad with him in there. Yeah. Kind of reminds me of when the Bills had the chance to get Von Miller the 13 second year but didn’t. Only to go offer a crazy contract in the offseason. You could add OBJ to that as well. I wouldn’t be surprised if the Bills make a splash move at WR, even though Beane says no splash. The splash might not be money but draft picks traded to move up. Edited January 24 by Buffalo_Stampede Quote
Mango Posted January 24 Posted January 24 39 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: I agree Beane needs to go for the new WR1 this year. I don't agree with Diggs sticking around for the end of his contract. His cost (before they restructure probably one more time) is $28.4M in 2026. Current dead cap that year is $13.4M. Could be gone that year. NO WAY he is playing for $22M+ in 2027 when he is 34 years old with a $4.5M dead cap. I agree that he won’t see the end of his contract. Everybody in the building knows it. But restructuring basically guarantees we get close.. Out of pocket so keeping this simple with pre-June cuts. 2024 is the only time cutting/trading Diggs hurt us currently. Restructuring ties the teams hands and kicks the can down the road. The current situation is below. I think (ouch) a restructure ties us together until 2026. 2024: -$3M net cap 2025: $5M 2026: $15M 2027: $18M Quote
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