Kurt Warner All22

[corta765]

14 hours ago, Bob Jones said:

Just watched part 1. My takeaways: the Bills' play designs suck (Warner even notes this), the Bills' receivers are not that good at separating from their defenders, and KC's secondary played very good/disciplined defense. Just as we've seen throughout the year, some of those plays put multiple receivers very close to each other down the field...not good.

 

The major issue the Bills offense would never escape fully is the offense still was Dorseys design. You cannot redraw from scratch mid season and I think Brady did what he could to add motion, disguise, screens, etc.. which you could see the offense did become more diversified and at least a bit more complex. But teams did catch on a bit and KC playing BUF again certainly had a good idea of stopping big plays.

 

I am 100% open to a new OC and not hiring Brady out of the gate. I think Brady showed the baseline for what should be acceptable as the offense went from broken/unwatchable at points to being decent to pretty good at times. I loved his fourth day play call on the final drive and I do not think once he was the OC there was a game he was overwhelmed as OC. He was not perfect and I still kind of think you need someone who can shake Josh when he has his yip moments to get him back on track the way Daboll did. But the offense itself needs youth at WR along with speed/separation to get back to the haylcon days of 2020-21. Kincaid/Shakir/Cook all are a great core for the future and while Diggs may be declining he can be a solid WR for another year or two. Get the right young guy or two this draft mixed with a new offensive gameplan that at minimum has the creativity and diversification Brady was trying for even if he is not the OC and I think next year the offense actually can really get back to something truly dynamic.

[bouds]

6 hours ago, BBFL said:

The 2nd & 9 wasn’t the problem. That was actually the right pass of Jones doesn’t push Dawkins back into Josh’s lap. That throw is no different than the shot downfield to Diggs who came up empty after it went through both hands…

 

 

The 3rd down after was an issue though… checking it down immediately instead of rushing out of the pocket and rolling to the side everyone flooded to is rough. Looking back on it, even though in the moment it would be hard to see, Josh should have stepped up in the pocket and bailed left instead of what he ended up doing…

 

Either way, Josh put us in a position to take a lead, tie or win the game several times. Collective miscues from the team as a whole let us finish the season Sunday. 

 

Hated that 3rd down design, if that's the best we can do then I don't like it.  Josh doesn't seem to be a big fan of those really short crossers in tight coverage, and that's the only option he had.  Plus, KC wasn't really rushing up field, they were looking to bat balls down, just like they did on the Knox 3rd down throw on the first drive of the game that resulted in FG.

 

Great content by Warner as always.

[Bruffalo]

14 minutes ago, corta765 said:

 

The major issue the Bills offense would never escape fully is the offense still was Dorseys design. You cannot redraw from scratch mid season and I think Brady did what he could to add motion, disguise, screens, etc.. which you could see the offense did become more diversified and at least a bit more complex. But teams did catch on a bit and KC playing BUF again certainly had a good idea of stopping big plays.

 

I think this is why we saw so many screens and short yardage play designs.  Dorsey's downfield stuff hardly made sense. 

[since79]

As stated "What our offense lacks is route technique and discipline."

 

Every route ran effects the routes around them.  Those mentioning that it tough for Brady to change the whole offense midseason is true, but to expect and teach better route technique and discipline can be done.  I remember when he first got named interim, they showed a video of him running routes with the receivers on the first day.  Maybe he gets it. Route discipline and technique forces defenders to make decisions, at times it is a sacrifice to do it for the benefit of others. It creates time and space and in fact maybe separation we are looking for. When you want to be lazy and cheat it takes everyone's opportunity away. If the players don't want to listen or get it, you better find ones who do.  Like I said before Tom Brady demanded it in his receivers, Josh will never do that.

 

Other sport, but I coached Hockey. One year I had trouble with our best player always toe dragging to the middle on the rush taking others time and space.  I would hound him on it.  One day he drives the puck wide draws the defender and he hits the trailer for an easy goal.  He comes to the bench and says "Man I can't believe how open he was".  I said you know how I have been harping on you, that is the reason. From that point forward he got it." If you are willing to sacrifice for your teammate they will for you.  Don't expect them to do it if you don't, so it starts with you. If all guys are running to the same open area for their glory nothing comes of it.

[bouds]

The almost int play was also so poor, we're trying to run a post with TE to free up a Dig route, really shows how a few changes can drastically alter a play design.  We swap routes for Kincaid/Diggs and that play probably works better, but as is, Josh had nothing but the check down to Cook.

[Fan in Chicago]

4 hours ago, Niagara Dude said:

I just hope if Brady is the OC then we change how we play, these long time consuming drives at not it.  Get back to quick strike and big chuck play football

That is fine if our D is good. I am pretty sure there was a deliberate strategy to keep the Chiefs O off the field (Like the Giants did with the Bills in the Superbowl). The intent also was to end those long drives in TDs as often as possible. This was a good plan given how undermanned we were on D. Mahomes marching down the field proved it. 

The issue was that we didn't have the reliable and multiple weapons to end in TDs. 

McBeane should have learned this lesson by now - you have to out gun the likes of the Chiefs and not build a multi layered D to stop them. With Reid and Mahomes, the Chiefs will find different ways to score TDs. We just have to be built to score more 

Edited January 24 by Fan in Chicago

[947]

It's shocking to how lazily some of our WRs ran routes in that game. The coaches film really tells the story that you can't see on TV. Diggs is the biggest offender, which is crazy.

[Niagara Dude]

4 minutes ago, 947 said:

It's shocking to how lazily some of our WRs ran routes in that game. The coaches film really tells the story that you can't see on TV. Diggs is the biggest offender, which is crazy.

Has anyone ever considered how these 14-15 play drives wear down our own offensive players.  McDermott will get one more season to get back to passing and quick strike offence and if her continues to play cavemen football then he is will be fired.

 

When your playing at home you need to score as quickly as possible to get the crowd into the game

[DCOrange]

That first play action play where Sherfield has the entire middle of the field open and just breaks the play by himself is so brutal. 

[corta765]

53 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

I think this is why we saw so many screens and short yardage play designs.  Dorsey's downfield stuff hardly made sense. 

 

It was literally what Warner said, two deep maybe a crossing route and a slant low. So damn predictable

[KCNC]

No football expert here, but I watch a ton of football and it *seems* like other teams at least sometimes have guys wide freaking open on plays for big yardage while for the Bills defenders are draped all over them constantly.  Scheme?, Players?, not sure but something sure feels a lot different than other teams.  I am all for them interviewing other guys but I have a feeling they are going to settle on Brady.

[finn]

Cosell and Simms have been saying the same thing for two years now, and they're right: The Bills aren't talented enough on offense. It would be more obvious with a less talented quarterback. That's why I'm worried about Beane's comment that he thinks Diggs is still a number one wideout. He's not, or at least you can't count on that. Let him be a Beasley-type possession receiver, the third option after a big-time player and Shakir. But you need that one superstar, not some lame Sherfield or Harty type. 

 

Star player plus Diggs, Shakir, and Kincaid, with Cook and Ty Johnson and solid backups everywhere. Then you'd see results. 

 

How much would it cost to trade up to a sure-fire wide receiver in the draft? 

[peterpan]

13 hours ago, Best Williams Available said:

Why are people advocating for Brady as OC if this is what’s on tape? If he inherited bad routes from Dorsey a good OC wouldn’t keep them, right? If the excuse is our WRs, sorry but Shakir and Diggs are sufficient route runners and it was still figured out. Maybe he’s not the upgrade we think. How can you trust an OC that can’t manufacture production from Stef Diggs apart from LOS WR screens?

Exactly.  Teams create entire new looks and plays every week.  Saying “it’s Dorsey’s playbook”, that’s simply not how it works 

[Nitro]

Discpline and execution is a constant issue with the Bills.  This group needs an overhaul.  Guys who know how to run routes and get separation is a must.

[ngbills]

13 hours ago, Best Williams Available said:

Why are people advocating for Brady as OC if this is what’s on tape? If he inherited bad routes from Dorsey a good OC wouldn’t keep them, right? If the excuse is our WRs, sorry but Shakir and Diggs are sufficient route runners and it was still figured out. Maybe he’s not the upgrade we think. How can you trust an OC that can’t manufacture production from Stef Diggs apart from LOS WR screens?

This board is famous for loving what we have. Then when that is gone it is they obviously sucked the new guy is better. Remember Dorsey was an upgrade over Daboll. Then Dorsey sucked and Brady is obviously way better. Remember McK was going to thrive in Beasley role. Then he sucked and Harty and Sherfield were huge upgrades. This offseason my bet is Harty and Sherfield will be gone and whoever is signed is another obviously better move. 

1 hour ago, Niagara Dude said:

Has anyone ever considered how these 14-15 play drives wear down our own offensive players.  McDermott will get one more season to get back to passing and quick strike offence and if her continues to play cavemen football then he is will be fired.

 

When your playing at home you need to score as quickly as possible to get the crowd into the game

How many teams with a $50M QB play cavemen football? That is usually saved for the terrible teams that have no Qb and are more concerned with keeping games close. There is something to be said for scoring on a team with just a couple of plays that demoralizes them. Or being able to score quick after a turnover or change of possession. While the long drives can be great in the second half to close out games, your first half should be coming out shooting to let them know they have no shot. 

Edited January 24 by ngbills

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, billieve420 said:

 

Again it was the timing of the play call and taking the shot there. If it was on 1st down I have less of a problem with it as KC knew that run was coming and sold out to stop it. The odds of a 30 yd TD being successful is much less than taking the check down. So yes you rather take that TD anyway you can get it. However, they should have been playing both the clock with trying to score at the same time. The timing of both those 2nd and 3rd down calls will always be terrible to me.

 

The percentages go up on converting the closer you get to that first down marker. They should have been been running something to get person underneath free as we were moving the ball dinking and dunking down the field. Diggs wasn't even looked at so my guess he was just playing decoy out there to draw attention. As he was immediately open after the snap and if he had been the primary read should have gotten the ball. People can bring up we couldn't trust him, what if it got tipped at the line, etc.. You can do the same for Shakir and as we saw we didn't convert because Allen couldn't set his feet as Dawkins bumped into him. Knowing how strong of a defense KC had. I am looking to get the ball out quick and not giving them a chance to get to the QB. 

 

No still not correct...you take the 4 point lead, doesn't matter the down.  

[JerseyBills]

10 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

They do but championship teams go down the field in the final minutes to a game winning TD. 

 

Championship teams stop an opposing defense to close the door 

 

McD led Bill team hasn't done either in the playoffs since he's arrived seven years ago. 

True but we did hold em to a 6 and put before our final drive,  which was amazing prior to the 2 min warning and Josh hits Shakir there probably 90% of the time, 

[TheWeatherMan]

7 hours ago, Matt_In_NH said:

This would be the dumbest draft by any team ever.  

Raiders fans would agree with your assessment.  

[Niagara Dude]

2 hours ago, ngbills said:

This board is famous for loving what we have. Then when that is gone it is they obviously sucked the new guy is better. Remember Dorsey was an upgrade over Daboll. Then Dorsey sucked and Brady is obviously way better. Remember McK was going to thrive in Beasley role. Then he sucked and Harty and Sherfield were huge upgrades. This offseason my bet is Harty and Sherfield will be gone and whoever is signed is another obviously better move. 

How many teams with a $50M QB play cavemen football? That is usually saved for the terrible teams that have no Qb and are more concerned with keeping games close. There is something to be said for scoring on a team with just a couple of plays that demoralizes them. Or being able to score quick after a turnover or change of possession. While the long drives can be great in the second half to close out games, your first half should be coming out shooting to let them know they have no shot. 

I agree that if you come out and go down the field quickly to score you put pressure on the other team to match. Had they played with more pace and scored more we would have allowed the crowd to get into the game,  crowd noise was never a factor

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, PBF81 said:

 

Again, the flaw in that logic is multifold, and you McD apologists won't ever acknowledge it, but just about any coach can get this team to make the playoffs.  

 

I mean seriously, is it actually a sensible argument that given the roster we're had, and the division that we're in, that it's even remotely difficult to make the playoffs?  

 

If anything it should be beyond clear that we've underachieved this season.  Twice, in 2017 and this season we've needed much luck to make the playoffs, and we got it.  The standards, injuries and other stuff, that we cry over as reasons why we lost our lose, we entirely dismiss in examining or wins, like our narrow win over the Chargers who were without a premier QB, a premier WR, and a premier DE.  

 

At the end of the day, here's what McD's Complimentary Football means, it means highlighting his defense, and having our offense adjust for purposes of doing that, or complimenting that.  

 

Why?  Probably because given that McD admittedly doesn't know offense, he wants to be regarded as great, and that's the only way he knows how to do it.  It's short-sighted thinking of that's the case.  It also explains why our offense is treated like a red-headed stepchild.  

 

Again, if we had drafted Allen before McD had gotten here, the odds of McD getting the gig would asymptotically approached zero.  

 

McD now admittedly doesn't know much if anything about offense.  Why on earth anyone supports a head coach like that at this point when we have Allen, a generational talent at QB, is inexplicable.  It makes no sense.  

 

In this piece Dunne puts it succinctly by saying that he's turning Allen into a Tannehill that can run.  

 

It's not even a mystery, it's palpably blatant.  ... for anyone with any objectivity.  Statistically, the "eye test," etc.  

 

Among the increasing proof in the pudding is that it offense is now regressing from season to season for no apparent reason.  We just drafted one of the best set of hands as a TE and made two solid improvements to our OL, which has been a huge problem until this season.  

 

We should never expect our entire OL to get through a season injury free again, ever.  

 

Yet, or offense is worse in PPG than any of Allen's last four seasons.  

 

This isn't difficult to figure out.  Emotions are getting in the way of those that don't.  

 

Wake me when McD hires an OC that would have the potential to replace him.  Won't ever happen!  

 

It's OJTs and yes-men, that's who will continue to be our OCs on his watch.  People that he can control to ensure that our offense supports his defensive strategies in the veiled disguise of "complimentary football." 

 

Sounds great, it works like siht in the playoffs.  But hey, it makes us winners of the regular season every season.  

 

Heaven forbid we actually take a chance and actually try to win a Lombardi.  Better to simply hope that we get hot for four games once we make the playoffs against much better coached teams.  

 

Too many people appear to be so afraid of "not making the playoffs," rather than realizing that we're squandering much greater opportunity.  

 

It really is a bit mind-boggling.  

 

Not that we have any say in the matter anyway, so it's nothing to get at each other over, just sayin'.  

 

 

 

Works for me.

 

Expect a CB in the first though.  Remember who's in charge, ultimately.  

 

BTW, you'd also have to actually play those rookies a lot.  Would that happen under this coach.  (Rhetorical). 

 

 

There’s no flaw in that logic unless he was got blown out again like we did against the Bengals.  Both KC divisional games came down to one or two plays in a team of comparable skill.  Football isn’t a severn game series so the margin of error is so slim that something as simple as a wind gust can completely change a narrative and careers.  

It’s real easy to become impatient in football because of that single elimination system and thinking waiving a magic wand for a better coach to get us over the hump is wishful thinking.  As long as we keep fielding a top team that hosts divisional games the law of averages will eventually swing our way.  I think you didn’t even have us finishing above .500 when we were 6-6 despite the three previous seasons where we’ve won out with at least five straight.  Maybe have some faith in a coach who’s gotten us there every year who will work to get better in those high pressure tight games.