McDermott - Excuses, Valid but concerning

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

What's mind blowing is they did a superlative job of executing the possession strategy up to that point in time.  

 

So either:

1. Allen went off script, ignored those shorter underneath throws to move the chains, and took those deeper throws.  Which means he ignored the instructions of the HC/OC. 
2. Or Allen was given no specific instructions, and they never discussed anything specific about remaining focused and committed to the ball control time of possession game and keeping the defense off the field as long as possible.

 

Both are concerning possibilities. 

 

I think on the first Allen thought he had Shakir. I am not going to kill a QB there for thinking open throw to the endzone. If Dawkins held his block a second longer, if Shakir cleared the coverage a split second longer, or if Josh had just slid 6 inches before setting to throw that is a touchdown.

 

Maybe then the Chiefs march down and score and we have a different conversation. But Josh there while waiting for Diggs underneath saw what he thought was a touchdown and tried to make that play. I'll never hammer him for that but the reality is we didn't quite execute.

 

On the second one the protection seemed to rush him a bit and he was on the move before his first down play to Shakir the other side of the field came available.

[LABILLBACKER]

On 1/22/2024 at 7:43 AM, warrior9 said:

We will never win a SB with McDermott as our coach, it's as simple as that. 

If Terry is so smart and made all this money why can't he see the obvious. Does he have to get kicked in the face by the same horse 8 straight years to figure it out.  I knew our coaching future was in trouble after Houston & 13 seconds.

[All_Pro_Bills]

2 minutes ago, phypon said:

If I'm the coach I tell them to play for the first down.  At all costs.  I'm more concerned with the clock.  I tell my QB to not go for the kill shot in the endzone because there is too much time on the clock and I don't have faith in my defense and the Chiefs can score very quickly.  I have to play the chess game there.  If I can't get a first down in 4 tries with JA, we deserve to lose, but that's how I'm playing it.  I already know what can happen in 13 seconds, and again the following year with only 12 seconds, so I'm looking to make a score with 5 seconds or less left on the clock.  I want to win, but I would settle for the tie, but I also want to get more yards for my shaky kicker.  I would go for a first down there on 4th down if I haven't picked it up.  I only kick the field goal if we are at the 15 yard line on 4th down with low time on the clock.

If you're like me you thought this while watching the game and not after Monday morning quarterbacking the thing to death with the benefit of hindsight.  That's why the missed FG didn't bother me as much as it should have because while they lined up for that missed kick I said even if they tie the game they'll lose 30-27. 

[phypon]

1 minute ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

If you're like me you thought this while watching the game and not after Monday morning quarterbacking the thing to death with the benefit of hindsight.  That's why the missed FG didn't bother me as much as it should have because while they lined up for that missed kick I said even if they tie the game they'll lose 30-27. 

I absolutely did.  When I saw the 2nd down play I knew it was stupid.  And then they did it AGAIN!  I was watching the clock and just hoping at the very least they burned more clock and got closer for a better shot at a FG in the worst case scenario.  It was like watching a slow trainwreck.

[GunnerBill]

6 minutes ago, phypon said:

If I'm the coach I tell them to play for the first down.  At all costs.  I'm more concerned with the clock.  I tell my QB to not go for the kill shot in the endzone because there is too much time on the clock and I don't have faith in my defense and the Chiefs can score very quickly.  I have to play the chess game there.  If I can't get a first down in 4 tries with JA, we deserve to lose, but that's how I'm playing it.  I already know what can happen in 13 seconds, and again the following year with only 12 seconds, so I'm looking to make a score with 5 seconds or less left on the clock.  I want to win, but I would settle for the tie, but I also want to get more yards for my shaky kicker.  I would go for a first down there on 4th down if I haven't picked it up.  I only kick the field goal if we are at the 15 yard line on 4th down with low time on the clock.

 

Well I have watched that play and I am convinced was the plan. Josh thought he saw a touchdown. He went for it and if either he, Dawkins or Shakir execute like an inch or two better it works. But he was waiting for Diggs underneath on the crosser and then Shakir flashed and he thought "he is going to be open in the endzone" in that moment any QB needing a touchdown to win is going to try and make that throw. Wasn't quite executed perfectly unfortunately (not mainly on Josh).

 

Then maybe the Chiefs then score and we are having your other conversation. That is possible. We will never know.

 

Third down the protection fails before the route he wants develops. I'm 50/50 on whether Josh could have stood in but knowing that Josh can make miracles happen when he escapes again it isn't a decision to kill him on. 

 

Those games come down to those precise execution points at the end. We weren't precise enough in that moment. 

 

None of which detracts from the defense being run over or giving up 8 yards on 1st down after the FG miss. But the plays were there coming out of the 2 minute warning. The Bills didn't make them.

[T master]

6 minutes ago, warrior9 said:

I understand what you're saying but do you really want to be a Rodgers and McCarthy situation? 1 SB in 13 years with Aaron Rodgers is REPULSIVE. 

 

I was saying that using the fact that Andy Reid took a while to get there so it's "OK" that we do is absolutely a loser mentality and should not be acceptable. 

 

I was just reading the average time a coach is given in the NFL to be a winner is 3 years and that fits with Bills fans wanting McD gone, the drought years in B/Lo that was about as long as any of the coaches stayed and it took 17 years well Ralph fired 1 of the better coaches we had but from then till now was way to long . 

 

I never understood why any owner would fire a winning coach even if they have a bad season i would rather be a winner and make the play offs than be on the out side looking in . 

 

If your not in the play offs you have no chance of making it to the big game at least if your in it you have a better chance at winning it . 

 

To this point the 13 second game was the best this team has looked, i think that laps was more on Frazier playing like a prevent D rather than being aggressive & that is one big reason why Frazier is gone & McD took over because he realized although being #1 D in the NFL is a good thing crunch time is when it counts .

 

But i as a Bills fan would be totally happy with 1 SB win yes yes yes ...  But i am not willing to go backwards to get it !

 

There is no guarantee by changing the HC that they have any better chance at getting there than with what they have here now . The stability to me is huge which i feel is one reason why teams like the Steelers, Baltimore, Bills, Pats (for a long time) and other teams are successful because they don't have a  lot of change when they find something that works .

[zow2]

10 minutes ago, phypon said:

If I'm the coach I tell them to play for the first down.  At all costs.  I'm more concerned with the clock.  I tell my QB to not go for the kill shot in the endzone because there is too much time on the clock and I don't have faith in my defense and the Chiefs can score very quickly.  I have to play the chess game there.  If I can't get a first down in 4 tries with JA, we deserve to lose, but that's how I'm playing it.  I already know what can happen in 13 seconds, and again the following year with only 12 seconds, so I'm looking to make a score with 5 seconds or less left on the clock.  I want to win, but I would settle for the tie, but I also want to get more yards for my shaky kicker.  I would go for a first down there on 4th down if I haven't picked it up.  I only kick the field goal if we are at the 15 yard line on 4th down with low time on the clock.

 

That's what I'm saying.  Sunday eve with my son next to me, as we are both standing nervously watching the TV, we both agree during the 2-minute warning that Buffalo should get the first down and try to walk it off at the end with a late TD.... or at worst a walk off tying FG to send it to OT (from closer in).  Make KC use their timeouts.  Even in the moment i said TIME is most important thing.  This was great, it was our time to finally end KC and not even give them a chance to have the ball back.  And our coaches are so effing dumb and not clutch at the end of close playoff games.

 

I'm not going to blame Allen simply because the Bills are literally nothing without him.  He should have been coached there.

[Nihilarian]

What is it with all this negative BS? 

 

Buffalo lost this last game to KC 24-27 by 3 points because Norwood went wide right. Think about how depleted that Buffalo defense was and they were still in the game! 

 

McD has no control over the defensive injuries both this season and last. All you complaining brainiacs should be signing his praises for the job he has done this season without all-pro LBer Matt Milano, and all-pro CB Tre White. Plus, so many players dinged up the last few weeks the team had to pull a guy off the streets to start at linebacker...and the game was still so close. 

 

The Buffalo defense still finished in the top ten #4 in points allowed, and #9 in yards allowed. 

 

For some reason, the Bill's top WR went invisible in the last two games. Against KC, Diggs 8 targets for 3 receptions for 21 yards. against the Steelers 9 targets, 7 receptions for 52 yards no TDs. 

 

Where has Diggs been since week 6? Because he hasn't had a 100-yard game since then.

 

Now, think about where this team has drafted the last few seasons and Beane still manages to find diamonds in the later rounds

 

Dalton Kincade, and O' Cyrus Torrence with those first two picks.

 

Be grateful that the Buffalo Bills have an HC that has taken this team to the playoffs 6 of 7 years and won the division the last 4. This season after being 6-6 the team went on a tear to finish 11-6. McD saw a problem with his OC and replaced him with a man who calls running plays.

39 runs, 39 passes with a ToP 37:03 to KC 22:57. 

[TheFunPolice]

the truth is that, whatever we or anyone else thinks, McDermott will be here for Allen's entire career. 

 

With Allen he will win a ton of games. Eventually he'll be the winningest coach in franchise history, regardless of any playoff success. 

 

Can't fire that guy. Remember the drought? That will always be the answer. So we must hope he either gets lucky (which could certainly happen) or finds the next Daboll but gets along with the guy. 

[Gregg]

Just now, TheFunPolice said:

the truth is that, whatever we or anyone else thinks, McDermott will be here for Allen's entire career. 

 

With Allen he will win a ton of games. Eventually he'll be the winningest coach in franchise history, regardless of any playoff success. 

 

Can't fire that guy. Remember the drought? That will always be the answer. So we must hope he either gets lucky (which could certainly happen) or finds the next Daboll but gets along with the guy. 

 

Good luck to Terry getting Bills fans to buy tickets with raised ticket prices and PSL fees if the fans feel they can't win with McDermott. The new stadium will buy Terry a year. Everyone will be curious to check it out. Once the "new-ness" wears off then say hello to empty seats and non-sellouts. Terry will have to do something then so I think McDermott will be on the hot seat maybe as soon as next year.

[TheFunPolice]

4 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

Good luck to Terry getting Bills fans to buy tickets with raised ticket prices and PSL fees if the fans feel they can't win with McDermott. The new stadium will buy Terry a year. Everyone will be curious to check it out. Once the "new-ness" wears off then say hello to empty seats and non-sellouts. Terry will have to do something then so I think McDermott will be on the hot seat maybe as soon as next year.

 

nah, we all (rightly) love Allen and many of the other players, and the team wins a lot of games. 

 

Once you get into the tournament crazy things can happen. The Bucs were right there with the Lions most of that game, as were the Packers with the 49ers. 

 

We were very close to a Packers/Bucs NFC title game. So insane stuff happens in a 1 off playoff game where one muffed punt, one timely fumble, one holding call, can make all the difference. 

[All_Pro_Bills]

3 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

What is it with all this negative BS? 

 

Buffalo lost this last game to KC 24-27 by 3 points because Norwood went wide right. Think about how depleted that Buffalo defense was and they were still in the game! 

 

McD has no control over the defensive injuries both this season and last. All you complaining brainiacs should be signing his praises for the job he has done this season without all-pro LBer Matt Milano, and all-pro CB Tre White. Plus, so many players dinged up the last few weeks the team had to pull a guy off the streets to start at linebacker...and the game was still so close. 

 

The Buffalo defense still finished in the top ten #4 in points allowed, and #9 in yards allowed. 

 

For some reason, the Bill's top WR went invisible in the last two games. Against KC, Diggs 8 targets for 3 receptions for 21 yards. against the Steelers 9 targets, 7 receptions for 52 yards no TDs. 

 

Where has Diggs been since week 6? Because he hasn't had a 100-yard game since then.

 

Now, think about where this team has drafted the last few seasons and Beane still manages to find diamonds in the later rounds

 

Dalton Kincade, and O' Cyrus Torrence with those first two picks.

 

Be grateful that the Buffalo Bills have an HC that has taken this team to the playoffs 6 of 7 years and won the division the last 4. This season after being 6-6 the team went on a tear to finish 11-6. McD saw a problem with his OC and replaced him with a man who calls running plays.

39 runs, 39 passes with a ToP 37:03 to KC 22:57. 

That's what they told Sabres fans about HC Lindy Ruff's tenure and one Stanley Cup final appearance in 14+ seasons and for a football reference the Bengals fans through 16 years of Marvin Lewis.  Continuity.  

I'm not advocating for firing McDermott but his time as HC is littered with one time in a million last minute gaffes and inexplicable and unexplained decisions and events.  If there's somebody out there ownership and the front office believe gives the organization a better shot then don't be afraid to take it. 

[LABILLBACKER]

Every damn accolade Sean McDermott receives during his career with Buffalo will be 100% because of Josh Allen.  Not because he's this amazing defensive strategist. Without Josh this team would be 5-12 every year and clappy would've been fired ages ago. The only process he preaches is the excuses every damn year for his worthless playoff defense. 

[warrior9]

30 minutes ago, T master said:

 

I was just reading the average time a coach is given in the NFL to be a winner is 3 years and that fits with Bills fans wanting McD gone, the drought years in B/Lo that was about as long as any of the coaches stayed and it took 17 years well Ralph fired 1 of the better coaches we had but from then till now was way to long . 

 

I never understood why any owner would fire a winning coach even if they have a bad season i would rather be a winner and make the play offs than be on the out side looking in . 

 

If your not in the play offs you have no chance of making it to the big game at least if your in it you have a better chance at winning it . 

 

To this point the 13 second game was the best this team has looked, i think that laps was more on Frazier playing like a prevent D rather than being aggressive & that is one big reason why Frazier is gone & McD took over because he realized although being #1 D in the NFL is a good thing crunch time is when it counts .

 

But i as a Bills fan would be totally happy with 1 SB win yes yes yes ...  But i am not willing to go backwards to get it !

 

There is no guarantee by changing the HC that they have any better chance at getting there than with what they have here now . The stability to me is huge which i feel is one reason why teams like the Steelers, Baltimore, Bills, Pats (for a long time) and other teams are successful because they don't have a  lot of change when they find something that works .

Fair point. I don't think we can win with McDermott but I also agree that firing him wouldn't NECESSARILY mean the new coach would be an upgrade

Edited January 25 by warrior9

[zow2]

15 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Every damn accolade Sean McDermott receives during his career with Buffalo will be 100% because of Josh Allen.  Not because he's this amazing defensive strategist. Without Josh this team would be 5-12 every year and clappy would've been fired ages ago. The only process he preaches is the excuses every damn year for his worthless playoff defense. 

 

Next season the Bills will be regrouping due to cap reasons...and hopefully reloading.  Unless they get lucky on some young guys, it's likely a regression season.  That might be what the brass is waiting for to thank Sean for his service. Regression. 

 

It's a tough look to fire a head coach with his record over the past few years...and leading them to 5 straight wins, Division title (again), another playoff win and a razor thin loss to Mahomes/Reid.   His Dec/Jan record is sick. in a good way.  Although as you said, he has Allen to thank for that record.

Edited January 25 by zow2

[Nihilarian]

Just now, LABILLBACKER said:

Every damn accolade Sean McDermott receives during his career with Buffalo will be 100% because of Josh Allen.  Not because he's this amazing defensive strategist. Without Josh this team would be 5-12 every year and clappy would've been fired ages ago. The only process he preaches is the excuses every damn year for his worthless playoff defense. 

Ha, The man took the Buffalo Bills to the playoffs with Tyrod Taylor!

 

Just an FYI, his defenses have been in the top 5 for many seasons. They went from 20th or so to #2 overall in 2019 and #1 overall in 2021. The Bills need his defense. 

 

The man is an Andy Reid disciple and he knows how important that passing game is as he recently said so. Injuries to the defense derailed the team the last two seasons and with that 13-second debacle, that DC is gone. 

 

Crying and whining about this won't change a thing...but, keep it up if it makes some feel better to complain. 

 

 

Think about this in terms of what happened with Dan Marino and with other teams. The Buffalo Bills kept ole Dan from the SB and kept KC, and Denver outta the SB too back in the early 90's. 

 

Look at it this way. As good as John Elway was, he didn't win an SB until Shanahan built a power run game in Denver with RB Terrell Davis. Look at this past Buffalo game to see what Joe Brady has done with the Buffalo run game. I'm already excited for the 2024 season. 

 

 

[All_Pro_Bills]

53 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Ha, The man took the Buffalo Bills to the playoffs with Tyrod Taylor!

 

Just an FYI, his defenses have been in the top 5 for many seasons. They went from 20th or so to #2 overall in 2019 and #1 overall in 2021. The Bills need his defense. 

 

The man is an Andy Reid disciple and he knows how important that passing game is as he recently said so. Injuries to the defense derailed the team the last two seasons and with that 13-second debacle, that DC is gone. 

 

Crying and whining about this won't change a thing...but, keep it up if it makes some feel better to complain. 

 

 

Think about this in terms of what happened with Dan Marino and with other teams. The Buffalo Bills kept ole Dan from the SB and kept KC, and Denver outta the SB too back in the early 90's. 

 

Look at it this way. As good as John Elway was, he didn't win an SB until Shanahan built a power run game in Denver with RB Terrell Davis. Look at this past Buffalo game to see what Joe Brady has done with the Buffalo run game. I'm already excited for the 2024 season. 

 

 

What matters as much as winning at this point in McDermott's tenure as HC is expectations.  In his first year this team exceeded expectations, made the playoffs with help from an act of God dramatic ending from the Bengals against the Ravens the last week of the season, and played a close game with a valiant effort in the wildcard round but lost.  Against the background of the historical playoff drought Sean McDermott was nothing short of a savior.  Good times were ahead and improvement in the seasonal record was coming.  And so it did, with the team winning 4 straight AFCE titles capped by this seasons amazing come from behind title at the wire.

 

But in the last 4 years they've lost to the Chiefs in the AFCC and 3 times in the divisional round against, the Chiefs, Bengals, and Chiefs.  And the current Bills have played under, not make the playoff expectations, but Super Bowl expectations.  I'll challenge anyone to argue the Bills met their personal expectations or the expectations of the team, or football "experts" picking them to win it all or make the big game.  

 

I think you can win the SB with Sean McDermott but in order for that to happen he's going to need an improved roster, a bit of luck, Josh Allen at his best, and some improvement in his decision making in order to give him the greater margin of error required to counter the impact of his errors and shortcomings.  For 2024, that means getting better all around the HC.  Getting the coordinator and coaching staff decisions right, solving the cap problem, getting injured players back at 100%, hitting on almost every single draft pick this Spring, and having an lower tier free agents signed playing above their pay level.  I'm a little hesitant to take that bet. 

[Buffalo03]

4 hours ago, Gregg said:

 

The Eagles moved on from Reid even with those 4 NFCCG appearances. Like many have said here McDermott is a good coach but it appears this is as far as he can take them. Are we going to wait 20 years for him to figure it out. Allen will be wearing a gold jacket in Canton, Ohio by then. 

I completely understand what you mean. But how many regimes do we have to go through before we find the one that wins it all. We had 4 super bowl losses under one regime, the music city miracle under another regime. A 17 year drought with a bunch of others and now the current regime can't get past the divisional round with a generational talent at QB. Not saying we shouldn't fire McDermott but in 5 years, you will he here saying the same thing about the next regime. We aren't winning anything. It's time to accept that

[Toyo321]

2 hours ago, T master said:

 

I was just reading the average time a coach is given in the NFL to be a winner is 3 years and that fits with Bills fans wanting McD gone, the drought years in B/Lo that was about as long as any of the coaches stayed and it took 17 years well Ralph fired 1 of the better coaches we had but from then till now was way to long . 

 

I never understood why any owner would fire a winning coach even if they have a bad season i would rather be a winner and make the play offs than be on the out side looking in . 

 

If your not in the play offs you have no chance of making it to the big game at least if your in it you have a better chance at winning it . 

 

To this point the 13 second game was the best this team has looked, i think that laps was more on Frazier playing like a prevent D rather than being aggressive & that is one big reason why Frazier is gone & McD took over because he realized although being #1 D in the NFL is a good thing crunch time is when it counts .

 

But i as a Bills fan would be totally happy with 1 SB win yes yes yes ...  But i am not willing to go backwards to get it !

 

There is no guarantee by changing the HC that they have any better chance at getting there than with what they have here now . The stability to me is huge which i feel is one reason why teams like the Steelers, Baltimore, Bills, Pats (for a long time) and other teams are successful because they don't have a  lot of change when they find something that works .

 

In 4 just words

 

Super Bowl or Bust!!!

 

Anything else is of no consequence and not acceptable.  You don't get remembered or praised for wins in the regular season.  This only happens based what you do in the playoff's.  This teams HC and GM have their heads so far up each others butt holes they will never see the light again.  Their end of season press conferences were the worst projectile vomit I have heard in quite a while "You cover my ass and I will cover yours"   it was absolutely ridiculous, and these guys are so out of touch with the NFL trends today its mind blowing.  Their tweak it philosophy and attitude has not worked in 7 seasons.

 

With out risk there is no reward,  and Bills HC and GM are incapable of taking risks, because they are too scared to lose.  So the result is no reward.

 

The 2024 season is going to have more player turn over and there is no way this team wins 10 games next year because of the players we are going to lose to the cap due to Beane's pathetic free agent signings and contracts he extended to players that are on this team.  We all know who these players are too, so no need to mention them here.

 

 

Edited January 25 by Toyo321

[Aussie Joe]

2 hours ago, Gregg said:

 

Good luck to Terry getting Bills fans to buy tickets with raised ticket prices and PSL fees if the fans feel they can't win with McDermott. The new stadium will buy Terry a year. Everyone will be curious to check it out. Once the "new-ness" wears off then say hello to empty seats and non-sellouts. Terry will have to do something then so I think McDermott will be on the hot seat maybe as soon as next year.

The fans will keep buying the tickets as long as they have Josh Allen playing close to the level he is now… so how long is that ? 5 or 6 years minimum probably