BillsPride12 Posted January 21 Posted January 21 I would take Allen over Lamar anyday of the week, he is the better QB for sure. Allen at his best this season is better than Lamar at his best this season.....BUT...the thing that killed Allen's chances at winning MVP this year was having more bad games/moments as well. Particularly the Jets game which was really a loss squarely on Josh's shoulders. I mean Dorsey might have played a role in this problem too but the voters won't look at it like that. I still think Allen wins an MVP or two before his career is over but this season just wasn't meant to be with some of the turnovers and poor performances mixed in with the brilliance. 1 1 Quote
MJS Posted January 21 Author Posted January 21 7 minutes ago, BillsPride12 said: I would take Allen over Lamar anyday of the week, he is the better QB for sure. Allen at his best this season is better than Lamar at his best this season.....BUT...the thing that killed Allen's chances at winning MVP this year was having more bad games/moments as well. Particularly the Jets game which was really a loss squarely on Josh's shoulders. I mean Dorsey might have played a role in this problem too but the voters won't look at it like that. I still think Allen wins an MVP or two before his career is over but this season just wasn't meant to be with some of the turnovers and poor performances mixed in with the brilliance. Lamar has his poor games, too. But he doesn't turn it over as much as Allen, so those don't get talked about as much. I also feel like he is protected by the media a lot more. Nobody is ever really willing to criticize Lamar Jackson. They only say nice things. Fans can be critical, though, and sometimes too critical. 1 Quote
Billl Posted January 21 Posted January 21 5 hours ago, Patrick Fitzryan said: Anytime Lamar runs into a coach in the postseason who has any defensive acumen, he turns into a poor man's Tyrod Taylor. He's not as good as Allen, Burrow, or Mahomes, for sure, and I don't think as good as A- guys like Herbert and Hurts either. You think Herbert is better than Lamar? 🤣 Quote
Generic_Bills_Fan Posted January 21 Posted January 21 6 hours ago, VW82 said: If it wasn't Lamar, it should have been Purdy. I think it was Barnwell who pointed out that Purdy had the 4th greatest statistical season of all time by any/a+. Dak had a better statistical season as well. Mahomes was about the same as Josh and arguably had less weapons. Josh will hopefully prove he's the best player in the NFL with this upcoming SB run, but as for 2023 MVP, No. mahomes was 11th in total tds. Josh was 1st. How is that the same? 1 Quote
Low Positive Posted January 21 Posted January 21 5 hours ago, Patrick Fitzryan said: Anytime Lamar runs into a coach in the postseason who has any defensive acumen, he turns into a poor man's Tyrod Taylor. He's not as good as Allen, Burrow, or Mahomes, for sure, and I don't think as good as A- guys like Herbert and Hurts either. Demeco Ryans is not a good defensive coach? You can say that you love Josh Allen and still admit that Lamar Jackson is a good QB. There are two QBs that I would rather have than Josh (Mahomes and Burrow), but I still think that Lamar is the 2023 MVP. Quote
Billl Posted January 21 Posted January 21 9 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said: mahomes was 11th in total tds. Josh was 1st. How is that the same? Buffalo lost multiple games this season because Josh gave them away. The same can’t be said of Mahomes. Lamar is going to win the MVP this season, and he’s going to deserve it. That doesn’t mean he’s the best QB in the league. If it were a “best player in the league” award, it would go to Mahomes or Allen every year. 2 1 Quote
Generic_Bills_Fan Posted January 21 Posted January 21 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Billl said: Buffalo lost multiple games this season because Josh gave them away. The same can’t be said of Mahomes. Lamar is going to win the MVP this season, and he’s going to deserve it. That doesn’t mean he’s the best QB in the league. If it were a “best player in the league” award, it would go to Mahomes or Allen every year. I can remember one pick or fumble six in Josh’s entire career and mahomes gave up one of each on back to back drives this year to lose to a team thats qb through for 61 yards 😂. Multiple turnovers in a loss to Denver too. A lot of one turnover games where he was just cr*ppy too lol Mahomes had two huge turnovers overturned vs jets and pats also that absolutely should not have been on top of that. Still had a two turnover game against NE despite it Edited January 21 by Generic_Bills_Fan 1 Quote
Billl Posted January 21 Posted January 21 1 minute ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said: I can remember one pick or fumble six in Josh’s entire career and mahomes gave up one of each on back to back drives this year to lose to a team thats qb through for 61 yards 😂. Multiple turnovers in a loss to Denver too You’re 100% correct, and you’re proving my point. Mahomes doesn’t deserve the MVP this year even though he’s a better player than Lamar. Lamar had the better regular season, and it’s a regular season award. Mahomes is much more willing to run in the postseason, and he’s an extremely effective runner. Lamar runs in the regular season. He deserves the award. Quote
Generic_Bills_Fan Posted January 21 Posted January 21 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Billl said: You’re 100% correct, and you’re proving my point. Mahomes doesn’t deserve the MVP this year even though he’s a better player than Lamar. Lamar had the better regular season, and it’s a regular season award. Mahomes is much more willing to run in the postseason, and he’s an extremely effective runner. Lamar runs in the regular season. He deserves the award. How am I proving your point? My point is I don’t trust the judgement of a poster that said mahomes and Allen were even this year because it is absolutely not true lol I think you’re underselling him pretty hard if you think mahomes has the same body of work this season Edited January 21 by Generic_Bills_Fan 1 Quote
Cray51 Posted January 21 Posted January 21 31 minutes ago, Billl said: Buffalo lost multiple games this season because Josh gave them away. The same can’t be said of Mahomes. Lamar is going to win the MVP this season, and he’s going to deserve it. That doesn’t mean he’s the best QB in the league. If it were a “best player in the league” award, it would go to Mahomes or Allen every year. Both Allen and Mahomes “lost” one game for their team this season (Allen Jets and Mahomes Raiders) allen and Mahomes had very similar passing statistics this season, with Allen having a profoundly better rushing season. to your point, Mahomes amps up running in the postseason, but the MVP is a focus on the regular season. i agree that Lamar will win the MVP, but if Lamar doesn’t exist, Allen is likely top3 in MVP, Mahomes might not be top 10 Quote
folz Posted January 21 Posted January 21 25 minutes ago, Billl said: Buffalo lost multiple games this season because Josh gave them away. The same can’t be said of Mahomes. Lamar is going to win the MVP this season, and he’s going to deserve it. That doesn’t mean he’s the best QB in the league. If it were a “best player in the league” award, it would go to Mahomes or Allen every year. I guess you didn't actually watch the video. The video shows pretty clearly that the bold statement in your post is incorrect. You can really only put one game on Josh, the Jets on opening day. Also noted in the video... Do you think Mahomes shouldn't have won the MVP in 2018? Because Pat had 21 turnovers that season, yet was still the unanimous MVP. Josh had 22 turnovers in 2023. I'm not saying Josh should absolutely win it, but I don't understand the people that think Allen shouldn't even be in the race with Jackson. It's amazing to me how many people (fans/media) still seem to have a bias against Allen. Josh accounted for 308 points this season. Lamar accounted for 203 points this season. That's basically one more touchdown for Josh in every game this year. Josh Lamar Total Yards 4,830 4,499 Passing Yards 4,306 3,678 Rushing Yards 524 821 Total TDs 44 29 Passing TDs 29 24 Rushing TDs 15 5 Completion % 66.5% 67.2% Total Turnovers 22 13 Yes, Lamar played one less game than Josh, but if you added one game at his season averages, he would still be 50 yards behind Josh and still way behind Josh's TD totals. You could also argue that Lamar had 9 less turnovers than Josh. But, even if each of those extra turnovers turned into a TD (which they didn't), that would only be a 63-point differential---while Josh's extra TDs (over Lamar's number) equates to 105 points. The difference in completion percentage is negligible. They are the #1 and #2 seeds in the AFC. So, is it simply because the Ravens have two more wins? Does that make an MVP? Otherwise, I'm having a hard time seeing why Lamar is the clear-cut leader. What makes his case so superior to Josh's case? 1 1 4 Quote
LABILLBACKER Posted January 21 Posted January 21 7 hours ago, Donuts and Doritos said: Who cares about the MVP. It's about winning the SB. An MVP w/o a SB is worthless I agree...win a couple SB mvps and I could care less if he ever wins this AP regular season mvp. 1 Quote
MJS Posted January 21 Author Posted January 21 1 hour ago, Billl said: Buffalo lost multiple games this season because Josh gave them away. The same can’t be said of Mahomes. Lamar is going to win the MVP this season, and he’s going to deserve it. That doesn’t mean he’s the best QB in the league. If it were a “best player in the league” award, it would go to Mahomes or Allen every year. That's one fallacy that is addressed in the video. Allen did not lose multiple games himself. Quite the opposite, actually. 1 Quote
RosenNOTchosen1 Posted January 21 Posted January 21 No he was terrible for most of the year. Maybe if was Dorsey's fault but he can't be considered for MVP. 1 1 Quote
miketysonslisp Posted January 21 Posted January 21 4 hours ago, folz said: They are the #1 and #2 seeds in the AFC. So, is it simply because the Ravens have two more wins? Does that make an MVP? Otherwise, I'm having a hard time seeing why Lamar is the clear-cut leader. What makes his case so superior to Josh's case? Ravens had the most wins while playing in the winningest division in the NFL. They literally blew out playoff caliber teams week in week out. Lamar didnt need 50 tds they were already up on their opponents by the 4th q. We barely scrapped into the playoffs and played a lighter schedule. Give jackson his due. We have another MVP we are eyeing. 1 Quote
Matt_In_NH Posted January 21 Posted January 21 13 hours ago, VW82 said: Mahomes was about the same as Josh and arguably had less weapons. Only if you ignore rushing Quote
peterpan Posted January 21 Posted January 21 When is the voting? If it’s later in the year Allen’s playoff performances could easily get him the MVP (if the voting isn’t over) Quote
Coach Tuesday Posted January 21 Posted January 21 8 hours ago, BillsPride12 said: I would take Allen over Lamar anyday of the week, he is the better QB for sure. Allen at his best this season is better than Lamar at his best this season.....BUT...the thing that killed Allen's chances at winning MVP this year was having more bad games/moments as well. Particularly the Jets game which was really a loss squarely on Josh's shoulders. I mean Dorsey might have played a role in this problem too but the voters won't look at it like that. I still think Allen wins an MVP or two before his career is over but this season just wasn't meant to be with some of the turnovers and poor performances mixed in with the brilliance. Ironically, that makes Allen more deserving of the honor. As he goes his team goes, usually. Quote
DCOrange Posted January 21 Posted January 21 6 hours ago, folz said: I guess you didn't actually watch the video. The video shows pretty clearly that the bold statement in your post is incorrect. You can really only put one game on Josh, the Jets on opening day. Also noted in the video... Do you think Mahomes shouldn't have won the MVP in 2018? Because Pat had 21 turnovers that season, yet was still the unanimous MVP. Josh had 22 turnovers in 2023. I'm not saying Josh should absolutely win it, but I don't understand the people that think Allen shouldn't even be in the race with Jackson. It's amazing to me how many people (fans/media) still seem to have a bias against Allen. Josh accounted for 308 points this season. Lamar accounted for 203 points this season. That's basically one more touchdown for Josh in every game this year. Josh Lamar Total Yards 4,830 4,499 Passing Yards 4,306 3,678 Rushing Yards 524 821 Total TDs 44 29 Passing TDs 29 24 Rushing TDs 15 5 Completion % 66.5% 67.2% Total Turnovers 22 13 Yes, Lamar played one less game than Josh, but if you added one game at his season averages, he would still be 50 yards behind Josh and still way behind Josh's TD totals. You could also argue that Lamar had 9 less turnovers than Josh. But, even if each of those extra turnovers turned into a TD (which they didn't), that would only be a 63-point differential---while Josh's extra TDs (over Lamar's number) equates to 105 points. The difference in completion percentage is negligible. They are the #1 and #2 seeds in the AFC. So, is it simply because the Ravens have two more wins? Does that make an MVP? Otherwise, I'm having a hard time seeing why Lamar is the clear-cut leader. What makes his case so superior to Josh's case? In addition to not playing the final week, Baltimore was also able to coast in a lot of their games this year. It bit them in the ass a couple times as they blew leads, but by the time you hit the second half or a couple minutes into the second half, they had a 90+% chance of winning basically every game this year and you could pretty clearly tell they took their foot off the gas in those situations a lot. Ultimately, I don’t think Lamar should win MVP. Don’t think Allen should this season either. But I think Lamar was better than his numbers indicate and Allen was worse than his numbers indicate (though I think his turnovers are overstated this season). 20 minutes ago, peterpan said: When is the voting? If it’s later in the year Allen’s playoff performances could easily get him the MVP (if the voting isn’t over) Voting is done before the playoffs begin. Quote
LarryMadman Posted January 21 Posted January 21 (edited) 2 hours ago, miketysonslisp said: Ravens had the most wins while playing in the winningest division in the NFL. They literally blew out playoff caliber teams week in week out. Lamar didnt need 50 tds they were already up on their opponents by the 4th q. We barely scrapped into the playoffs and played a lighter schedule. Give jackson his due. We have another MVP we are eyeing. Like yesterday when he ran the ball into the endzone with 5 minutes to go in the 4th up by 14. Why is he running the ball there, just to pad his "TD" stats, I seen that coming 1000 miles away. The Ravens are good because of their defense, not because of Lamar, so no I wont give him "his due" he dosent deserve it being a middling QB or RB playing the QB position. Lamar is nowhere close to as good a QB as Allen, the eye test and stats prove it, and there isnt a GM in the league who would select Lamar over Josh, that is a fact! Bills played a weak schedule, you might want to recheck that one! Edited January 21 by LarryMadman Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.