BuffaloBill Posted January 10 Posted January 10 The Bills faced a combination of Josh being a bit too fast on reads in some cases, in others he was not presented with good options. Thought this was an excellent explanation and balanced by Warner. The Bills were beating themselves. Then they adjusted. 11 6 Quote
Andrew Son Posted January 10 Posted January 10 I always been pretty aligned with Warner in that Josh needs to take more layups. 3 2 Quote
BuffaloBill Posted January 10 Author Posted January 10 Just now, Taro Nimbus said: Who’s Jason Allen? Damn spell checker and I was an idiot for not noticing 2 Quote
SoMAn Posted January 10 Posted January 10 He's kind of right, but not entirely. One of the issues with the up and down win-loss roller coaster during Dorsey's final games was putting handcuffs and leg shackles on Josh. Josh has got to be Josh. He's not Kurt Warner. Yes, he has to be conventional and trust his receivers, but he's not a classic pocket passer and I doubt he ever will be. 2 1 Quote
Drew21PA Posted January 10 Posted January 10 I think the BEST SIGN buffalo could make a run over anything else is that our coaching has improved !!! making adjustments on offense and defense - I’ll hand it to them I didn’t think they had it in themselves 3 2 Quote
ToGoGo Posted January 10 Posted January 10 Didn't watch this one, but watched Kurt Warner videos on Josh Allen in the past and it always felt like Warner would judge Allen harshly for not being more of a strict pocket passer like Warner. 1 1 Quote
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted January 10 Posted January 10 16 minutes ago, SoMAn said: He's kind of right, but not entirely. One of the issues with the up and down win-loss roller coaster during Dorsey's final games was putting handcuffs and leg shackles on Josh. Josh has got to be Josh. He's not Kurt Warner. Yes, he has to be conventional and trust his receivers, but he's not a classic pocket passer and I doubt he ever will be. The weird thing is he played exactly one game, Week 1 vs the Rams last season, as a timing route pocket passer and then it just never happened again. 4 3 Quote
SoonerBillsFan Posted January 10 Posted January 10 28 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said: The Bills faced a combination of Josh being a bit too fast on reads in some cases, in others he was not presented with good options. Thought this was an excellent explanation and balanced by Warner. The Bills were beating themselves. Then they adjusted. This verifies what I am saying, bring. In the WCO or hybrid version of it. Look at what has done for Purdy. Then you got the years of Elway running it and winning 2 superbowls. Montana, Young, Rogers and Favre ( who we compare Allen to) in Green Bay let alone Mahomes in KC. It still works. 3 minutes ago, ToGoGo said: Didn't watch this one, but watched Kurt Warner videos on Josh Allen in the past and it always felt like Warner would judge Allen harshly for not being more of a strict pocket passer like Warner. Warner is 100% spot on in this one, and Allen needs to be more of a pocket passer than he is. Warner show clear missed decisions by Allen he has to make. And he points out a flaw of too slow hot routes in our system 1 2 Quote
SoMAn Posted January 10 Posted January 10 6 minutes ago, SageAgainstTheMachine said: The weird thing is he played exactly one game, Week 1 vs the Rams last season, as a timing route pocket passer and then it just never happened again. Yes. There were a couple of other games in which it looked more like quick throw, dink & dunk stuff. And it worked. But then it was abandoned. My belief is that Josh is always in 4th gear. A hurry-up, 2 minute style suits him. I’d like to see them use it more often. Obviously, it couldn’t be used throughout as it would wear down the rest of the offense, but it could be used more often to get opposing defenses on their heals Quote
davefan66 Posted January 10 Posted January 10 It’s easy to break down tape where microseconds can be frozen to prove a point. Yes, Josh may need to keep on a read a little longer, especially when he is “sugar high” Josh. A few of those examples looked too fast even though they were slowed down/frozen. I do agree Josh needs more quick options. When the pass rush is killing you either have a quick slant or run a screen. Seems it took too long for them to adjust to the pass rush last game. 1 2 Quote
corta765 Posted January 10 Posted January 10 50 minutes ago, SWATeam said: I always been pretty aligned with Warner in that Josh needs to take more layups. Agreed. Brady I think is trying his best to not fully overhaul the offense as you really can't at this point while adding easier throws, motion, play action... basically all the sh*t Dorsey didn't do that limited the offense. I expect whoever is the OC next year blends more of this regularly in and makes Kincaid/Shakir a larger focus the way Beasley was to have an easy option. Daboll really got the offense excelling once he got Josh on that page and presented it. I think Warner has actually had some of the best analysis of Josh. 3 Quote
Ralonzo Posted January 10 Posted January 10 50 minutes ago, SWATeam said: I always been pretty aligned with Warner in that Josh needs to take more layups. Did we watch the video? The main point of it was, in the Bills disaster plays (sacks, ints, fumbles) it was the play design that left Josh no answers to the blitz-0 calls by the defense. The secondary point was, he's getting through his reads too fast when he's feeling that pressure and looking for a place to go with the ball before it arrives. To me Warner called out Brady without ever mentioning his name. 2 3 1 Quote
dave mcbride Posted January 10 Posted January 10 Just now, Ralonzo said: Did we watch the video? The main point of it was, in the Bills disaster plays (sacks, ints, fumbles) it was the play design that left Josh no answers to the blitz-0 calls by the defense. The secondary point was, he's getting through his reads too fast when he's feeling that pressure and looking for a place to go with the ball before it arrives. To me Warner called out Brady without ever mentioning his name. Exactly. Receivers running too deep on all-out blitz plays is a real problem. What I’d like to see is if the Bills cleaned that up in the second half. 5 3 Quote
Andrew Son Posted January 10 Posted January 10 Just now, Ralonzo said: Did we watch the video? The main point of it was, in the Bills disaster plays (sacks, ints, fumbles) it was the play design that left Josh no answers to the blitz-0 calls by the defense. The secondary point was, he's getting through his reads too fast when he's feeling that pressure and looking for a place to go with the ball before it arrives. To me Warner called out Brady without ever mentioning his name. I didn't watch this particular video, no. I'm just commenting on what I've heard from Warner about Josh on multiple occasions, including on One Bills Live this week. Quote
JohnnyBuffalo Posted January 10 Posted January 10 What I heard was - Josh bails on certain plays too early for what reason? Sounds like 2 reasons. 1. The plays take too long to develop and there is no FAST or QUICK Hot option when over load pressure comes and Oline can’t hold up. 2. Josh’s mind goes too fast through reads anticipating reason one and misses easier (notice EASIER not EASY) options. Sounds very reasonable that you can always build in a hot option OR they get better scheme upfront? I don’t know because they don’t pay me millions of dollars like these guys to figure it out. But considering INTs are going to be more costly moving forward in the playoffs I suggest they figure it out. But hey what do I know. Go Bills! Quote
finn Posted January 10 Posted January 10 Warner's evidence is persuasive. He's saying Allen needs more patience, but many of the negative plays are the result of the receivers not reading blitz and running long-developing routes. He doesn't say if that's on Brady, the receivers, or both. Looks like that first interception is on Davis (again) for not breaking off his route to help Allen. The second one might just be on him, too, since who knows if he could have made the catch if he didn't trip over his own feet. In Warner's examples, Davis always seems to be in la-la land running his routes while Diggs seem to be either adjusting or just being open. Can't say I'm impressed by Brady. His excellent W/L record might be more the result of unshackled, revitalized Allen than better play designs. In fact, Dorsey might have been the superior coordinator; evidently the numbers back that up. That would be ironic. McDermott shackles Allen, it all goes south, so he fires the blameless coordinator and hires an inferior one, but also agrees to unleash Allen, who comes alive, making the inferior coordinator and foolish coach look like geniuses. Meanwhile, Dorsey, not McDermott, is painted as the bad guy who almost doomed a Super Bowl team. How's that for a counter-narrative? 2 1 2 1 Quote
Ralonzo Posted January 10 Posted January 10 (edited) 14 hours ago, dave mcbride said: Exactly. Receivers running too deep on all-out blitz plays is a real problem. What I’d like to see is if the Bills cleaned that up in the second half. I really thought they had an answer in the second half on a play where Allen saw the blitz coming, called an alert and motioned Shakir in tight from the stack left in to a tight formation to make him the hot, where he'd be able to break immediately on a shallow crosser into the voided zone if the backers fired on the blitz which they were showing. Friggin brilliant QB'ing. Then Shakir makes no adjustment and runs his normal route to the regular depth with his back to Allen for 10 yards and the blitz gets home and it's a negative play. And I'm wondering if the Bills even have a sight adjust for a 0 blitz in the damn playbook... which is why the Dolphins went back to it over and over. Honestly suprised Warner didn't spin that play, I was freaking the hell out watching it happen live (while 3/4 of the GDT is talking about benching Allen and/or drafting Penix) Edit: @HappyDays zeroed in on this play too, it was Shakir not Sherfield, and at 10:45 of the 3rd quarter as he pointed out. Edited January 11 by Ralonzo 5 2 1 Quote
streetkings01 Posted January 10 Posted January 10 1 hour ago, Taro Nimbus said: Who’s Jason Allen? Isn’t he that bum CB the Dolphins drafted the year we drafted McKelvin? Quote
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