Solving the Coach Poaching Problem

[Heavy Kevi]

8 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

No one cares so this won't happen.  Daboll having an interview had nothing to do with the Bills bad exit from the playoffs. It doesn't stand to reason that it did. 

 

It COMPLETELY stands to reason that a coach would be distracted while interviewing for other jobs.

 

You ever interviewed for another job while working for another company? My guess is probably yes. Now how did you feel about your current job when looking for another? You aren't committed the same way. You are looking to the future.

 

It's just like a WR looking at all the yards he's gonna eat up after the catch before securing the catch. Alot of times they drop the ball

14 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

OP:  Give me $6 to get Peacock, and you've got my vote.

*
😇😁

 Screw that lol.

 

Didn't pay the 6 bucks then (funny enough my bar manager had peacock and signed in on our TV's for the game to show at the bar), and I sure as heck ain't paying 6 bucks for ridgeway!

 

Now, maybe $5.92 and we're at least in negotiations.

[Rochesterfan]

45 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Because Superbowl is 4 weeks before free agency opens. That isn't enough time to interview, shortlist and hire a coach. Then hire a staff. Then assess the entire roster. Then try and extend our own FAs. Then try and assess the FA market and work out who you want to target. You would have to put FA back at LEAST two weeks. Then you probably need to move the draft back into mid-May. The one year we went to early May the feeling was it squeezed rookie mini-camps and ate into the one month of true break that coaches and personnel guys get mid-June to mid-July. 

 

The schedule doesn't work unless the league is willing to lose something totally. If it agreed to totally lose pre-season you could fit it all in and move camp back to start of August. But they are not going to do that. 

 

In addition, you have the college schedule to consider.  If teams want to interview and hire a college coach as a HC or coordinator and you push the NFL hire window until mid February - you screw your college recruiting windows and transfer portal windows and then national signing day.
 

All for a stupid request to keep a coach from doing a couple of hour interview during the playoffs that has never shown to be a huge deal and they already have rules around the process.

 

Could they do it - sure with lots of other manipulation and issues and for almost no reward or reason.

 

 

[GunnerBill]

49 minutes ago, Heavy Kevi said:

I have alot of respect for your opinions, Bill...

 

But I'm not buying that's it's not possible and messes everything up.

 

These are highly paid professionals, they should have no problem dealing with slight changes in their work schedules for the betterment of the league, fairness, and a higher quality product on the field in the playoffs.

 

So find me the time then. Where does it come? If you move the hiring season back to the second half of Feb what are you losing to made the calendar work? Or are you just truncating the four weeks that these guys get off a year? These guys who work every holiday away from their families? 

 

I see two options:

 

1) you scrap rookie camps altogether and the first time the rookies ever meet their teammates or get taught the playbook is camp. That is the way it used to work years ago when FA wasn't a thing and so you almost never needed your rookies to start. In the modern NFL I see no way that improves the product. 

 

2) you scrap pre-season, thereby you can move camps back to start the first week or so of August and give teams 4 weeks to assess their roster and cut down to 53 and then a week to prep for game 1. I'm not necessarily against this but it hurts the guys who are UDFAs or late round picks (without pre-season the covid year about 20 fewer UDFAs than normal made rosters). And the reality is the NFL isn't going to do this. 

3 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

In addition, you have the college schedule to consider.  If teams want to interview and hire a college coach as a HC or coordinator and you push the NFL hire window until mid February - you screw your college recruiting windows and transfer portal windows and then national signing day.
 

All for a stupid request to keep a coach from doing a couple of hour interview during the playoffs that has never shown to be a huge deal and they already have rules around the process.

 

Could they do it - sure with lots of other manipulation and issues and for almost no reward or reason.

 

 

To the bolded - excellent point. Hadn't considered that. 

 

On your final line conclusion - totally agree. It would mean losing something else and I don't see any evidence that it would deliver significant benefit. 

[Low Positive]

5 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

In addition, you have the college schedule to consider.  If teams want to interview and hire a college coach as a HC or coordinator and you push the NFL hire window until mid February - you screw your college recruiting windows and transfer portal windows and then national signing day.
 

All for a stupid request to keep a coach from doing a couple of hour interview during the playoffs that has never shown to be a huge deal and they already have rules around the process.

 

Could they do it - sure with lots of other manipulation and issues and for almost no reward or reason.

 

 

Now that Zoom is a thing, this is really not as big a deal as it used to be.

[Xwnyer]

As long as any team is in playoffs their coaches should be off limits.   No issues with directors of personnel or others on executive side interviewing

[Einstein]

2 hours ago, Heavy Kevi said:

Idk if Dabolls interviews had any correlation to us being knocked out, but it stands to reason that it may have

 

Daboll’s last two games in Buffalo is one of the best offensive playoff performances in franchise history.

 

If it had any impact, it was for the good.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Heavy Kevi said:

 

It COMPLETELY stands to reason that a coach would be distracted while interviewing for other jobs.

 

You ever interviewed for another job while working for another company? My guess is probably yes. Now how did you feel about your current job when looking for another? You aren't committed the same way. You are looking to the future.

 

It's just like a WR looking at all the yards he's gonna eat up after the catch before securing the catch. Alot of times they drop the ball

 Screw that lol.

 

Didn't pay the 6 bucks then (funny enough my bar manager had peacock and signed in on our TV's for the game to show at the bar), and I sure as heck ain't paying 6 bucks for ridgeway!

 

Now, maybe $5.92 and we're at least in negotiations.

 

13 seconds....

[Warcodered]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Because Superbowl is 4 weeks before free agency opens. That isn't enough time to interview, shortlist and hire a coach. Then hire a staff. Then assess the entire roster. Then try and extend our own FAs. Then try and assess the FA market and work out who you want to target. You would have to put FA back at LEAST two weeks. Then you probably need to move the draft back into mid-May. The one year we went to early May the feeling was it squeezed rookie mini-camps and ate into the one month of true break that coaches and personnel guys get mid-June to mid-July. 

 

The schedule doesn't work unless the league is willing to lose something totally. If it agreed to totally lose pre-season you could fit it all in and move camp back to start of August. But they are not going to do that. 

If this is for HC and Coordinators then I'm pretty sure the GM roles can be interviewed and hired during the Playoffs and that's supposed to be their role. Either way when you fire your HC yeah your in a hole, but we're going to punish the good teams still playing in the Playoffs to make it easier for you? Why?

Edited January 9 by Warcodered

[MJS]

I believe the Bills suggested this rule to the league a couple of years ago.

[stuvian]

These owners will always go through third parties to plant a bug in the ear of their preferred candidates.

 

Do you think Steve Ross will sit back and follow the rules? Remember the prohibitions on owning any gambling related businesses?

 

The 1% have lost all sense of fair play and civility when they made the almighty buck their one true God.

[WhoTom]

1 hour ago, Heavy Kevi said:

It COMPLETELY stands to reason that a coach would be distracted while interviewing for other jobs.

 

You ever interviewed for another job while working for another company? My guess is probably yes. Now how did you feel about your current job when looking for another? You aren't committed the same way. You are looking to the future.

 

That depends a lot on the reason I'm interviewing for another job. If I hate my current job and will do just about anything to get out, then I agree with your premise. But if I'm reasonably happy where I am and I'm just looking for advancement or a career change, then I'm still dedicated to my current job - certainly through the interview process. I'd say most coordinators who interview for HC jobs are in the latter category.

 

 

[djp14150]

2 hours ago, Heavy Kevi said:

Sitting here watching gmfb.... And they are talking about Commanders, Chargers, and Panthers having requested permission to interview Detroit OC Ben Johnson as well as their DC.

 

This happens every year. Playoff teams are in the middle of trying to win a championship, and other eliminated teams are distracting their coordinators with interviews, sometimes even flying them in. It's disgusting and it's a problem.

 

Obviously this happened with Daboll too in the midst of what probably should have been our SB run. Idk if Dabolls interviews had any correlation to us being knocked out, but it stands to reason that it may have, and SURELY there have been coordinators who didn't do as well of a job because they were distracted interviewing with other teams.

 

The argument for allowing this is clear. It would be unfair to coordinators in the playoffs if they were locked out of the interview process in favor of coaching candidates that were at home (or from college).

 

So here's my solution:

 

Make a head coach hiring window, similar to how FA works. After the trade deadline, teams may fire their coaches and promote from within, but NO TEAM is allowed to interview or hire a HC until after the Super Bowl.

 

DONE! Problem solved. Would the NFL ever adopt this or do they just not care?

 

I agree with the premise of holding coach hiring till after conference championship game with thst off week for interviews and hiring.

 

the issue is setting up a staff in time for the combine and free agency.

 

they could move UFA opening date to April 1 and draft to weekend before Memorial Day ( but this would interfere with college graduation ceremonies) and draft combine move to third weekrnd in March , same weekend as March madness begins). NFL ratings would loose to this.

 

 

[GunnerBill]

14 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

If this is for HC and Coordinators then I'm pretty sure the GM roles can be interviewed and hired during the Playoffs and that's supposed to be their role. Either way when you fire your HC yeah your in a hole, but we're going to punish the good teams still playing in the Playoffs to make it easier for you? Why?

 

Hiring a staff? Reviewing your current roster? The coaches are heavily responsible for that. Once you get into the outside evaluation yes, it is the GM often who leads that but in most places the coaching staff is involved in the process too. 

 

I don't think you are punishing the good teams first off, there is no evidence to me that is the case. The Eagles had both coordinators in hiring cycles last year and made the Superbowl. The Patriots won a Superbowl with Patricia and McDaniels being hired away (in the end McDaniels reneged on Indy but still). I don't think the evidence supports your supposition. 

 

But even if it does.... the NFL is trying to establish parity. So delaying it to further disadvantage the bad teams doesn't seem to achieve that objective 

 

[Malazan]

2 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

OP:  Give me $6 to get Peacock, and you've got my vote.

*
😇😁

 

Damn, cheap vote. What else will you do for $6?

[Southern_Bills]

2 hours ago, Heavy Kevi said:

 

It COMPLETELY stands to reason that a coach would be distracted while interviewing for other jobs.

 

You ever interviewed for another job while working for another company? My guess is probably yes. Now how did you feel about your current job when looking for another? You aren't committed the same way. You are looking to the future.

 

It's just like a WR looking at all the yards he's gonna eat up after the catch before securing the catch. Alot of times they drop the ball

 Screw that lol.

 

Didn't pay the 6 bucks then (funny enough my bar manager had peacock and signed in on our TV's for the game to show at the bar), and I sure as heck ain't paying 6 bucks for ridgeway!

 

Now, maybe $5.92 and we're at least in negotiations.

 

On black friday you can get a year of peacock for 20 bucks, I like some of the shows on there so I had thankfully already did that. 

[djp14150]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Because Superbowl is 4 weeks before free agency opens. That isn't enough time to interview, shortlist and hire a coach. Then hire a staff. Then assess the entire roster. Then try and extend our own FAs. Then try and assess the FA market and work out who you want to target. You would have to put FA back at LEAST two weeks. Then you probably need to move the draft back into mid-May. The one year we went to early May the feeling was it squeezed rookie mini-camps and ate into the one month of true break that coaches and personnel guys get mid-June to mid-July. 

 

The schedule doesn't work unless the league is willing to lose something totally. If it agreed to totally lose pre-season you could fit it all in and move camp back to start of August. But they are not going to do that. 

 

Yep you run into schedule problems with…

 

Combine— push it later you get into March madness and nfl loses tv ratings on event. Indy is a regular host of something.

 

UFA open date— this would need to move because of time to e v a l.  If you moved drsft to before free sgrncy would totally change drsft strategy. Now free agency affects who you turn focus on drafting.

 

NFL draft needs to move to later— then you run into college graduation ceremony conflicts.

 

 

if they altered the playoffs where say 1-7 got in playoffs and 8-9 had a play in/WC round they could structure controlled interviewing where 28 teams are open for interviewing. The two games on Thursday and Friday. Weekend is open for interviewing those 4 teams. Playoff planning starts on Tuesday.  For most teams it’s a week off before playoffs start. The 2 more games on Wednesday, Thursday and Friday night and Monday night moves their too.

 

if it happened this season

 

sunday night last regular season game

mon-Friday coach interviews for 28 teams

Thursday and Friday JAX vs CIN, SEA vs NO.

friday-sun coach interview continue for thurs snd fri game staffs.

Monday decisions are due.

Wednesday-Sunday quarterfinal round games

 

 

 

[Warcodered]

31 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Hiring a staff? Reviewing your current roster? The coaches are heavily responsible for that. Once you get into the outside evaluation yes, it is the GM often who leads that but in most places the coaching staff is involved in the process too. 

 

I don't think you are punishing the good teams first off, there is no evidence to me that is the case. The Eagles had both coordinators in hiring cycles last year and made the Superbowl. The Patriots won a Superbowl with Patricia and McDaniels being hired away (in the end McDaniels reneged on Indy but still). I don't think the evidence supports your supposition. 

 

But even if it does.... the NFL is trying to establish parity. So delaying it to further disadvantage the bad teams doesn't seem to achieve that objective 

 

If the HC a team hires is one of the coordinators on one of the Super Bowl teams how is he going to do any of that until after the Super Bowl anyway?

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

If the HC a team hires is one of the coordinators on one of the Super Bowl teams how is he going to do any of that until after the Super Bowl anyway?

 

He doesn't. And that team starts behind. But he takes over the Monday after the Superbowl and he starts right away. Not allowing any interviews until after the Superbowl means you are at best 10 days or so behind even that timetable. 

[Warcodered]

13 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He doesn't. And that team starts behind. But he takes over the Monday after the Superbowl and he starts right away. Not allowing any interviews until after the Superbowl means you are at best 10 days or so behind even that timetable. 

It seems a little ridiculous that these Billion dollar teams, who would still be evaluating and narrowing their lists the entire Playoffs, couldn't expediate the process knowing they're behind the 8 ball with a short window.

 

Either way it's not like any of this matters, it's never going to change it would require the Owners to all vote for it and that's never going to happen.

[ControllerOfPlanetX]

The league has a “search list” of coaches and resumes, these are reviewed before interviews.

Most interviews are for show or forced by the league.

Most owners know who they want before even talking to the guy, the interview is just confirmation.