Tyler Dunne story on McDermott - 3 parts, 25 interviews, one damning conclusion

[RichRiderBills]

36 minutes ago, Cray51 said:

I don’t think Dunne has an ax to grind, I think he has bills to pay.  He knows these types of “hit piece” articles draw interest and pull in subscribers.  No one reads an article about how many former players like Sean.  Even if he acknowledges there may be some, he can find a few that don’t and make that the large part of the thesis of his writing.

 

its not personal against Sean, it’s using him as a way to pay bills and build his career.

 

which is why I agree with Micah, it’s a low blow.  But I see why he did it. 

 

Idk he was on McD right from word go. He thought Beane was a weak sauce crony hire as well. 

[mannc]

2 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

So subordinates buying a new truck for a supervisor that has massive decision making power and control over future earnings is at best a massive perceived conflict of interest.

 

The source saying he "thought it was the coolest thing ever, but McD was jealous of the relationship the coach had with his players because McD did not have that type of relationship..."

 

So that really makes me question the lens through which the sources are seeing things through... I'm not saying the source is being at all dishonest, but I would be livid if I was a CEO of a company and found out that an employee bought their manager say a $5k vacation as a thank you for helping them do so well and get promoted.

 

It doesn't raise into question the honesty of the source at all, but it makes it very clear that that source does not have an understanding of what might have caused McD to behave how he behaved and attributed something to jealously, when I think it would be more McD felt subordinates giving gifts of value to supervisors is a huge at best perceived conflict of interest and there are potentially huge civil liabilities for that type of stuff/even if not the case, would absolutely be something I personally would not want as a part of my organizational culture...gifts should not flow up stream in an organization for a wide range of reasons

That's a fair point, but if all of the receivers pitched in and paid for the truck, then the conflict of interest risk is minimized.  I'm also not sure how much say Hall would have had regarding playing time or who was making the roster.   

[Beck Water]

7 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Ehh, maybe. But most of what I see about Belichick from former players is how funny he actually is. Almost the opposite of McD who has a nice, friendly public demeanor but can't relate to his players.

 

Serious question: How do we know McDermott can't relate to his players?

[RichRiderBills]

16 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

When did Dunne write a "hit piece" (oh the drama, Good Lord) on Beane?

 

He's regularly critical of the drafting. 

[Mikie2times]

5 minutes ago, mannc said:

That's a fair point, but if all of the receivers pitched in and paid for the truck, then the conflict of interest risk is minimized.  I'm also not sure how much say Hall would have had regarding playing time or who was making the roster.   

This isn’t exactly corporate America either. That gift was the equivalent of a normal supervisor getting a Christmas gift. 

4 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Serious question: How do we know McDermott can't relate to his players?

He has Michael Jackson as his favorite singer. Where would you put your money? 

[QCity]

9 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

but I would be livid if I was a CEO of a company and found out that an employee bought their manager say a $5k vacation as a thank you for helping them do so well and get promoted.

 

What if it was every employee working under that manager? And what if every employee was making more money than the manager, some up to 25X more? And what if some of those employees had more job security than the manager? That analogy doesn't work.

[GoBills808]

10 minutes ago, mannc said:

That's a fair point, but if all of the receivers pitched in and paid for the truck, then the conflict of interest risk is minimized.  I'm also not sure how much say Hall would have had regarding playing time or who was making the roster.   

It's not really a good comparison

 

In this case some of the subordinates make like 20x what the supervisor does

3 minutes ago, QCity said:

 

What if it was every employee working under that manager? And what if every employee was making more money than the manager, some up to 25X more? And what if some of those employees had more job security than the manager? That analogy doesn't work.

Lol exactly

[HardyBoy]

12 minutes ago, mannc said:

That's a fair point, but if all of the receivers pitched in and paid for the truck, then the conflict of interest risk is minimized.  I'm also not sure how much say Hall would have had regarding playing time or who was making the roster.   

 

No, the perceived conflict of interest is equally there...it's gotta be a near $100k gift

 

He has a ton of say over gameplans and playing time and who is being featured in the passing game though and if he says he doesn't think someone is a good culture fit they're absolutely gone.

[Beck Water]

17 minutes ago, mannc said:

That's a fair point, but if all of the receivers pitched in and paid for the truck, then the conflict of interest risk is minimized.  I'm also not sure how much say Hall would have had regarding playing time or who was making the roster.   

 

It's my understanding the position coaches grade their players weekly on practice prep and game performance if they play.

They aren't the determining voice as to whether or not a player is active - that would be the OC, DC, ST, HC, and Beane and ultimately HC

But, they do have input.  SIGNIFICANT input.

 

I agree that if ALL the players were involved equally, it does minimize conflict of interest to some degree. 

 

But I can still see why it would be considered problematic:

1) Did the players contribute equally?  If so, younger players on PS and cheap rookie deals might potentially feel a bit coerced vs guys on multi-million deals.  IF not ad it becomes known, there's that Conflict of Interest risk.

 

2) Does it change the coaching picture?  I could see where the coach might find it harder to "get in the Grill" of a player who, after all, participated in GIVING ME A BRAND NEW TRUCK

 

3) Then what about next year and the following year?  That rookie and the newly-signed vet didn't GIVE YOU A TRUCK, so the conflict of interest is there.  Why is Player M seeing the field so much more than Player S, who seems to have higher potential?  Is he really grading out better in practice?  Or does the truck gift weight the grading?

 

Anyway, other assistant coaches are 100% entitled to feel that the truck was a super-cool super-moving story and McDermott Shat on the parade, but I'm kind of leaning towards the whole picture of what's reasonable, might be a bit more nuanced.

Edited December 9, 2023 by Beck Water

[FireChans]

40 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

what's on his agenda?

 

 

You can answer my question now.  Where, when reading this long form article, did you discover his hackery and sharpening axe?  what should he not have written about?

I thought the “Dorsey is next on the block” was a bit hackery.

 

I think anyone with a brain had higher odds on Dorsey getting fired this year more than anyone else on the staff. And rightfully so with a bipolar offense that didn’t have a counter punch last year. 
 

That quote sounded really axe to grind like imo 

 

 

[Beck Water]

14 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

He has Michael Jackson as his favorite singer. Where would you put your money? 

 

I mean, Josh Allen has Justin Bieber and Frank Sinatra, so not sure of your point?

 

Guys have to have the same musical taste before they can relate to people now?

Edited December 9, 2023 by Beck Water

[wettlaufer]

28 minutes ago, Cray51 said:

i guess I just don’t have a lot of care for this type of journalism.  I don’t care if Sean is an ass, as long as the results show. 

They do not, however. I think Dunne's article illuminates why that may be the case. Few things can be boiled down to one variable, but we can all see McD freezing up and blowing a lot of games. I think our fan base is really wrapped up in the details of this 20,000 word piece and dodging the bottom line: McD is a very shaky leader and shrinks in the big moments. Dunne didn't say that. The majority of his 25 sources did.

[Wayne Arnold]

14 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

 

He's regularly critical of the drafting. 

 

That's what you consider a "hit piece"?

[mannc]

4 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

It's my understanding the position coaches grade their players weekly on practice prep and game performance if they play.

They aren't the determining voice as to whether or not a player is active - that would be the OC, DC, ST, HC, and Beane and ultimately HC

But, they do have input.  SIGNIFICANT input.

 

I agree that if ALL the players were involved equally, it does minimize conflict of interest to some degree. 

 

But I can still see why it would be considered problematic:

1) Did the players contribute equally?  If so, younger players on PS and cheap rookie deals might potentially feel a bit coerced vs guys on multi-million deals.  IF not ad it becomes known, there's that Conflict of Interest risk.

 

2) Does it change the coaching picture?  I could see where the coach might find it harder to "get in the Grill" of a player who, after all, participated in GIVING ME A BRAND NEW TRUCK

 

3) Then what about next year and the following year?  That rookie and the newly-signed vet didn't GIVE YOU A TRUCK, so the conflict of interest is there.  Why is Player M seeing the field so much more than Player S, who seems to have higher potential?  Is he really grading out better in practice?  Or does the truck gift weight the grading?

 

Anyway, other assistant coaches are 100% entitled to feel that the truck was a super-cool super-moving story and McDermott Shat on the parade, but I'm kind of leaning towards the whole picture of what's reasonable, might be a bit more nuanced.

Ok, fair enough.  But did the Bills have a policy regarding such gifts?  Given the amount of money the players have, if the organization was concerned about the real or perceived conflict of interest created by gifts like this, then you would expect there to be a "no gift" policy, or a limit on such gifts.  Policies like that are common in corporate America... 

[Beck Water]

19 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

Idk he was on McD right from word go. He thought Beane was a weak sauce crony hire as well. 

 

I don't know if it's true, but someone upthread said Dunne is close to disgruntled ex-employees Doug Whaley and Russ Brandon.  He's also had ex-employee Jim Monos on his show a fair bit.

 

I agree that it's probably looking out for Dunne's bottom line in drawing in subscribers rather than motivated as a hit piece but if two align, well....

 

....and the Conspiracy Theorist at the back of my skull keeps poking me and saying "what if someone on the Chiefs paid Dunne off?"

[Mikie2times]

4 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I mean, Josh Allen has Justin Bieber and Frank Sinatra, so not sure of your point?

 

Guys have to have the same musical taste before they can relate to people now?

Michael Jackson is the answer you give if you don't have an answer. Frank Sinatra is the answer you give if you want to be trendy and cool in your 20's.  

[HardyBoy]

4 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

It's my understanding the position coaches grade their players weekly on practice prep and game performance if they play.

They aren't the determining voice as to whether or not a player is active - that would be the OC, DC, ST, HC, and Beane and ultimately HC

But, they do have input.  SIGNIFICANT input.

 

I agree that if ALL the players were involved equally, it does minimize conflict of interest to some degree. 

 

But I can still see why it would be considered problematic:

1) Did the players contribute equally?  If so, younger players on PS and cheap rookie deals might potentially feel a bit coerced vs guys on multi-million deals.  IF not ad it becomes known, there's that Conflict of Interest risk.

 

2) Does it change the coaching picture?  I could see where the coach might find it harder to "get in the Grill" of a player who, after all, participated in GIVING ME A BRAND NEW TRUCK

 

3) Then what about next year and the following year?  That rookie and the newly-signed vet didn't GIVE YOU A TRUCK, so the conflict of interest is there.  Why is Player M seeing the field so much more than Player S, who seems to have higher potential?  Is he really grading out better in practice?  Or does the truck gift weight the grading?

 

Anyway, other assistant coaches are 100% entitled to feel that the truck was a super-cool super-moving story and McDermott Shat on the parade, but I'm kind of leaning towards the whole picture of what's reasonable, might be a bit more nuanced.

 

Exactly, I would be really upset as a CEO if that happened.

 

It doesn't make what the source said untrue, but it makes it very obvious the source does not understand the big picture or what might be going through McDs head when he's acting the way he's acting...the source said it was because McD was jealous, when it likely has nothing at all to do with that.

 

It raises a lot of questions on if the sources have the proper big picture view to understand the motivations behind McDs behavior and maybe them not understanding the true reason for it...it's concerning in terms of trusting the article

[Beck Water]

Just now, mannc said:

Ok, fair enough.  But did the Bills have a policy regarding such gifts?  Given the amount of money the players have, if the organization was concerned about the real or perceived conflict of interest created by gifts like this, then you would expect there to be a "no gift" policy, or a limit on such gifts.  Policies like that are common in corporate America... 

 

Don't Know. 

[EasternOHBillsFan]

19 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Serious question: How do we know McDermott can't relate to his players?

 

Well, the large number of sources that Dunne found didn't come from the ether... the piece clearly was to put pressure on McDermott and if the piece is accurate then he will probably crack and it will cause a further rift. It's a mere waiting game now...

[BillsSbSoon]

If you think over the years we’ve been getting screwed by bad officiating before, wait till you see what probably happens now. Dunne is a punk for putting out this hit piece, but Sean said what he said and admitted it. And just embarassed the organization in a really bad way. He needs to go it doesn’t seem likes it’s recoverable.