Tyler Dunne story on McDermott - 3 parts, 25 interviews, one damning conclusion

[davefan66]

3 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

In sorry but that whole thing sounds like a complete lie. 
 

McD wanted his OL to wear work boots instead of Jordan’s during a walk through? What? 

If this is true and Morse drew a Jordan logo on his boots, that’s an issue.  Making fun of the HC shows you don’t respect him.  If players aren’t respecting the HC, it’s time to fire him for sure.

 

I’d really hate for our failure to get to the Super Bowl being McD.  If he’s and issue I would hope Beane would have addressed it.  Unless he has no say in the coach, as has been stated on these boards before.

 

Kinda would like the players to and and get him fired.  If we make the playoffs, it will be McD’s “doing” and save his hide.

[DrDawkinstein]

2 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

This is one of those things you think/hope isn't true on one level but also kind of want to be true for Morse because it's hilarious.

 

Though this and any other story any in there with players on the team right now seem a little odd, I mean they sound ridiculous and he has to know that someone is going to ask them about them right? Like if Morse gets asked about this story and says it never happened or explains the whole thing was just a bunch of jokes that no one cared about he's going to look like a ***** hack.

 

It was a joke, and Morse will likely say no one cared. It certainly wasnt this big, confrontational, watershed moment.

 

But even at it's lightest weight, it shows how out of touch McD is with his players, and how he is a boss that rubs them the wrong way as opposed to a good leader.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

I always hate these stories when the target is having a bad season or something bad just happened.

 

 

[Wayne Arnold]

3 hours ago, Roundybout said:

https://www.golongtd.com/p/the-mcdermott-problem-part-i-blame?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
 

 

A very long read, and the other parts are only for paid subscribers, but his sources paint a picture of McD as a narcissistic control freak who won’t take accountability for anything. 
 

 

Do with this what you will. 

 

I find some of the backlash from this article hilarious.

 

You have Bills fans who support McDermott simply because they think the guy who replaces him might be worse. *gasp*

 

Some people are scared of their own shadow. It's truly pathetic.

 

Once McDermott is finally let go there will be a line past Big Tree Road of the most talented coaches in the country salivating at the chance of coaching an NFL team with Josh Allen as its quarterback. 

 

To think that there are more than a handful of knuckle-dragging Bills fans who think we can't do better than Sean McDermott is mind-boggling.

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, davefan66 said:

 

I’d really hate for our failure to get to the Super Bowl being McD.  If he’s and issue I would hope Beane would have addressed it.  Unless he has no say in the coach, as has been stated on these boards before.

 

 

It's been McD every time so far. But Beane isnt in charge of firing him or addressing it in any way. That can only come from Terry.

[Cheektowaga Chad]

1 hour ago, JackKemp said:

I'm simply not buying what Dunne is selling here. The article seems to want us to think there is a toxic culture in the organization. How does that jive with players wanting to play here? How does that jive with year in year out winning? How does that jive with players that come back to play here? When a free agent signs they always site the culture as one of the reasons why they decided to play for the Bills. I truly believe we are all going to regret the bashing of McDermott. The best organizations find a good coach and stick with them.

Josh Allen, players get players to sign in places that aren't vacation destinations not coaches 

 

For example see new England patriots when Brady was there vs without Brady. Free agents would put up with the belicheck way when Brady is there, once he left they were done 

[NoSaint]

2 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

 

 

Wow, I leave for a couple hours to go to lunch, want to come back to talk about footwear and we're already ramped up to "McD envoking the 9/11 terrorists"!

 

Back to this tho.

 

Yeah, no way did he mandate or even suggest players actually wear work boots. He was obviously busting their chops and calling them out to be tougher.

 

THAT SAID, it is piss poor coaching to even do that.

 

Mike McDaniel sees that and buys the entire OL matching Jordans.

Pete Carroll sees that and shows up in his own Jordans the next week.

Bill Belichick wouldnt even notice what shoes they are wearing because he's busy making sure players know what theyre doing in situational football, and keeping Floyd off a Mayday FG defense.

 

McD, Marrone, Greggggg Williams, and other wannabes are the type to see that and call it out that he wants "work boots and carharts".

yuuup. It’s been a long time since we saw a player say they loved it in his regime and there was that players poll awhile back where his praises were noticeably absent 

 

All season I’ve had the feeling he doesn’t trust his team and they don’t trust him

[Cheektowaga Chad]

Name any head coach in thats consider the worst in history of the league, what would be the worst possible record said coach would have with Josh Allen at QB?

 

Some may say around .500

 

 

Now what's the bills record again? 

[PBF81]

8 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

There is literally no defending Dorsey, his performance last year should have got him fired instead of gambling Allen and Diggs prime on an unproven OC who had way too many growing pains last season.  

 

No, it isn't complicated.  But I'm not defending Dorsey.  I never wanted Dorsey as an OC.  I was always wait and see.  So I have no idea what you're even referring to here.  I'm anything but a Dorsey apologist.  

 

What you're doing is conflating the notion that I don't excuse McD from any of the current state of the team, with me being a Dorsey apologist.  Sadly for you there's zero evidence of that.  Sorry, there just isn't.  

 

 

8 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

And then this year, he was terrible and there is a ton of film that shows the issues with the Dorsey led offense.  

 

Again, here are the facts.  

 

+84 of our current Point-Differential was due to an explosive offense in three of our first four games, after the Jets game that we went into entirely unprepared.  That's for another thread though.   

 

Since then we're +17, -9 without the big game over the hapless Jets.  

 

Those are facts.  

 

Another fact is that McD's phrase, "complimentary football" did not make an appearance, at least not that I'm aware of, until after that point in time.  

 

Obviously something changed in our offense after we got back from England, or maybe even for that Jags game, either way, doesn't matter.   That's also indisputable.  

 

So what was it?  

 

What, Dorsey just said "f-it, we're scoring too much, I need to slow this ship down." ?  

 

I'm not nor have ever defended Dorsey, in fact I don't defend any coach that's currently on this staff.  Not one, not even Brady until he strings a half-season together consistently, which we'll find out here in December.  

 

But something changed, so what was it?  

 

 

[JMM]

3 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

Exactly! This just feels like a guy who had an agenda, and sought out sources and quotes to fit the narrative he was trying to make.

 

A positive McD piece would have got 30 clicks, zero discussion.

 

A negative piece will get hundreds. 

I am now on the record that I feel we should move on from McDermott,  but I tend to agree, this is a hit piece.

[Alphadawg7]

38 minutes ago, HomeskillitMoorman said:

 

Dude you absolutely are a McScapegoat excuse maker. I remember just a couple or so weeks ago debating with you on it and you were making excuses every which way for him. 

 

Sure, Dorsey earned his firing, but McD hired him and kept him in that position for a year and a half. Just like he kept Frazier for years. He scapegoated Frazier and then does the same exact loser soft prevent zone at the end of games that he does. 

 

And the late game coaching blunders and poor game management have been going on for years, literally since year 1. This is nothing new. He's just had #17 here to constantly bail him out until this season. 

 

It's hard for me to understand why people like yourselves can't evaluate this until things go completely off the rails, and even now you're still saying he should go only "IF" we miss the playoffs! It's truly unreal. All of his blunders and gaffes are still blunders and gaffes even if we make the playoffs.

 

We've wasted 6 years of an elite talent at QB because of this trashbag coach who has never put in the slightest bit of work to improve himself or his preparation. That's the hard truth. 

 

Lol, no I am not.  You are either thinking about someone else or misremembering whatever conversation you are alluding to.  In fact, I have remained objective on McD, including being critical of his bad decisions when they happen.  But you see, the anit-McD crowd doesn't see it that way...they only see 2 categories:  McD hate or McD apologists.  There is no room for the anti-McD crowd to allow for anyone to remain objective about McD.  

 

McD is a good football coach, and its not remotely debatable.  His record and turning an inept franchise around speaks for itself and its actually historically good.  However, that also does not mean his job should be safe or he is the right guy to get the Bills to the next level.  So its possible to look at McD and feel like this is a good coach and also feel he isn't untouchable and that his job needs to be evaluated just like anyone else.  

 

I have said for weeks now that if we miss the playoffs with a healthy Josh Allen then he should be fired.  I even started a thread with a poll to examine what outcomes could actually save his job because it was trending so much towards him not being back. 

 

What I have said over and over again all season, last season, this off season is that DORSEY is a PROBLEM.  And he was, clearly.  I mean had this version of the offense under Brady been here all season, we would be 11-1 right now instead of 6-6 with the only loss being Philly.  We wouldn't have lost to the Jets, Jags, Pats, Bengals or Broncos had this version of the offense been here.  

 

So should McD right now be fired...NO.  

Should he be if we miss the playoffs...YES.  

Should he be safe if we just make the playoffs...NO (but probably is).

 

If the Bills run the table after making the change to Dorsey, then it almost assures McD is safe and Dorsey was the problem...and make no mistake about it, this team had multiple problems, but hands down Dorsey was the biggest one of them all and most impactful in our overall record.  But if we run the table and make the playoffs, then how this team performs in the post season should still VERY MUCH be part of the conversation around McD and whether or not his job is safe or if he should go.  Although, according to some reports out there it doesn't sound like his job would be in jeopardy in that case, but that can all change with a bad performance.  

 

That is being objective about McD.  And it is perfectly OK to personally for you to have your own mind made up that you want a change, no problem with that.  But don't lump people in who still have an objective view point as if we are also some McD apologist, because that is just lazy and inaccurate.  

Edited December 7, 2023 by Alphadawg7

[SoonerBillsFan]

7 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

I find some of the backlash from this article hilarious.

 

You have Bills fans who support McDermott simply because they think the guy who replaces him might be worse. *gasp*

 

Some people are scared of their own shadow. It's truly pathetic.

 

Once McDermott is finally let go there will be a line past Big Tree Road of the most talented coaches in the country salivating at the chance of coaching an NFL team with Josh Allen as its quarterback. 

 

To think that there are more than a handful of knuckle-dragging Bills fans who think we can't do better than Sean McDermott is mind-boggling.

Exactly. I have said this a out 100x.

[Goin Breakdown]

There is a thread here about "burn out" and how football used to be a distraction. All this is a microcosm of everything I'm trying to be distracted from. This isn't fun reading all that Dunn had written. It's not fun reading multiply posts by fans taking sides and being divided. 
If we were winning none of this would be an issue. We all be saying "who cares if McD wants them wearing boots" And a bunch of other tough guy crap. Who cares if he has staff come in early and leave late?  If our players go golfing or star in a commercial, we accuse them

of not being focused. All of this sounds like a temper tantrum or a beat, it's just kicking the Bills when they're down. I have to show up to work 20 mins early and leave 29 mins after. Should I quit my job? Hate my boss?  I have to "dress for the position". Tyranny!!!

there's not another coach out there that much of this can't be said about, so no, the grass isn't greener. 
I'm not a Big McD guy. I don't like his coaching style or his philosophy of the game. He is a horrible manager and dodges issues. I'm tired of it all. But I kinda believe that if anyone wanted to they could write a ton about all the garbage each one of us too. Fire him

because of Xs and Os not because of this article. 

[Wayne Arnold]

2 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

There is a thread here about "burn out" and how football used to be a distraction. All this is a microcosm of everything I'm trying to be distracted from. This isn't fun reading all that Dunn had written. It's not fun reading multiply posts by fans taking sides and being divided. 
If we were winning none of this would be an issue. We all be saying "who cares if McD wants them wearing boots" And a bunch of other tough guy crap. Who cares if he has staff come in early and leave late?  If our players go golfing or star in a commercial, we accuse them

of not being focused. All of this sounds like a temper tantrum or a beat, it's just kicking the Bills when they're down. I have to show up to work 20 mins early and leave 29 mins after. Should I quit my job? Hate my boss?  I have to "dress for the position". Tyranny!!!

there's not another coach out there that much of this can't be said about, so no, the grass isn't greener. 
I'm not a Big McD guy. I don't like his coaching style or his philosophy of the game. He is a horrible manager and dodges issues. I'm tired of it all. But I kinda believe that if anyone wanted to they could write a ton about all the garbage each one of us too. Fire him

because of Xs and Os not because of this article. 

 

Pegula isn't going to fire McDermott because of x's and o's. He's not smart enough to do that. He'll only fire McDermott if the public pressure is too much to overcome. Articles like this helps with that.

 

Keep em comin.

[BuffaloRebound]

13 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

we will wait for the flood of folks defending him. 
 

morse unfortunately has an uncomfortable interview coming at some point 
 

Daboll was allegedly pretty unhappy when he chose to leave. Is he scorned as a disgruntled ex too? You can’t pretend there aren’t red flags and warning signs that support this potential narrative. 
 

I said weeks ago that there was some energy around the team as if players lost faith in him

Let’s ask Wyatt Teller, Zack Moss, and Zay Jones to comment on Daboll anonymously and see what that article looks like.  Heavy is the head that wears the crown.  I don’t think McDermott has what it takes to win a Super Bowl but that article is a hit piece.  2 things can be true at once.  

[Alphadawg7]

5 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

No, it isn't complicated.  But I'm not defending Dorsey.  I never wanted Dorsey as an OC.  I was always wait and see.  So I have no idea what you're even referring to here.  I'm anything but a Dorsey apologist.  

 

What you're doing is conflating the notion that I don't excuse McD from any of the current state of the team, with me being a Dorsey apologist.  Sadly for you there's zero evidence of that.  Sorry, there just isn't.  

 

 

 

Again, here are the facts.  

 

+84 of our current Point-Differential was due to an explosive offense in three of our first four games, after the Jets game that we went into entirely unprepared.  That's for another thread though.   

 

Since then we're +17, -9 without the big game over the hapless Jets.  

 

Those are facts.  

 

Nope those are not the facts, those are cherry picked lump totals that completely do NOT tell the TRUE story of the first 4 weeks.  Like how bad the offense was week 1.  What about how bad the offense was for more than half the game against Washington until the D created a bunch of opportunites for us late in the game that inflated the score and masked the larger chunk of the game where the offense was again struggling.  

 

And again, it is Josh Allen, no level of OC can keep Josh and this offense from not scoring forever.  It is about consistency.  And you are literally trying to use about a game and a half of football during the first 4 weeks of when the offense was humming to excuse the 6 weeks that proceeded it as if McD came in and tinkered and fundamentally changed something.  

 

Its actually quite absurd the story you are trying to tell. 

 

5 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

Another fact is that McD's phrase, "complimentary football" did not make an appearance, at least not that I'm aware of, until after that point in time.  

 

Obviously something changed in our offense after we got back from England, or maybe even for that Jags game, either way, doesn't matter.   That's also indisputable.  

 

So what was it?  

 

What, Dorsey just said "f-it, we're scoring too much, I need to slow this ship down." ?  

 

I'm not nor have ever defended Dorsey, in fact I don't defend any coach that's currently on this staff.  Not one, not even Brady until he strings a half-season together consistently, which we'll find out here in December.  

 

But something changed, so what was it?  

 

 

 

NOTHING with the Bills changed.  It was the same Dorsey issues last year and this year.  And what actually changed was that opposing teams, even bad ones, had the blue print to counter Dorsey's unimaginative offense and Dorsey was not a good enough coach to be able to counter back.  

 

So why you keep going with this "what changed" narrative is puzzling to me...its not only obvious, but there is a ton of film out there by professionals literally showing this.  

[PBF81]

15 minutes ago, Yobogoya! said:

Oh I definitely agree that McDermott has underperformed with Allen. Believe me I hold the guy primarily responsible for our collapses this year (and past), I'm not trying to defend him too hard. 

 

More like, just trying to play a little devil's advocate on what mostly amounts to an opinion piece about a man's character. McDermott has made plenty of tangible mistakes from a purely decision-standpoint that warrant discussion and criticism. If the guy's a control freak or a scrooge, frankly that's not the reason I'm firing him for.

 

No doubt.  I'd part from McD because he's not competent enough.  He's clearly never going to outcoach his playoff peers.  That's a huge problem if you want to win a Championship, which is something that Pegula needs to understand and come to grips with, and make a decision regarding.  

 

But the biggest single and incredibly simplistic reason why I'd move on from McD is that there's a complete disconnect between him and the core strength of this team, namely Allen and the Offense.  

 

Watching him plug-n-play varying OCs, to date all having ties to W&M or Carolina, more on that in a moment, hoping to find the right one, because he clearly won't hire from elsewhere and get a better one, with my theory being the logical one that he refuses to hire anyone that won't do what he says despite his ignorance in the matter, and therefore won't hire a competent one for fear that he'll end up getting replaced because his own house, "Defense," is anything but in order come playoff time.  

 

As to W&M/Carolina, what on earth are the odds that the best candidates for that position to get the most from Josh & the O, were people with that background?  

 

Sure, it's possible, but it's also ridiculously unlikely.  

 

 

15 minutes ago, Yobogoya! said:

Was Dorsey a scapegoat? Or did McDermott actually go out on a limb to give the guy way more of an opportunity than he deserved? 

 

Don't know, but it was McD's decision much in the way that he was literally the only one in the world, including of his own coaching staff, that claimed that Peterman gave us the best chances of winning.  Those decisions come with a price if they're wrong.  Or should anyway, for a head coach.  How many times can a head coach be so wrong about so many things and still be regarded as competent.  

His nepotistic ways are not helping him in this regard.  

 

 

15 minutes ago, Yobogoya! said:

In any event, the article does seem to back up what a lot of people think about McDermott not being willing to learn from his mistakes and adapt. If true, it's just a damn shame. McDermott seems like a smarter guy than that. If he's going to stubbornly stick to the same decisions and schemes and concepts that let us down time and time again, there's no doubt in my mind he should be let go.  

 

Yeah, that's pretty much the substantiated narrative now.  Again, we'll find out more once he's gone, whenever that is.  But at some point it's likely that he loses the lockerroom, and I don't see that his decision re: Von Miller has helped him in that way, backed by Pegula.  

 

That's a bad look for the team, Bills' mafia, etc.  Remember, he just fired two people that had a normal yet romantic relationship from his staff.  Now he's letting a player with a past history of domestic abuse and in hot water at the moment for what looks to be more than "nothing," take the field.  

 

This is not decision-making by a rational person that constantly decries character.  

 

 

[Pasaluki]

Diana Russini did a takedown of the Jets and Panthers. The big difference between her reporting and this article was her sources are CURRENT players and coaches/assistants who were with their teams this year and many of whom are still active. 

 

This guys sources are all burnouts and ex players. 🙄 

[Bills69]

13 seconds man, that's when he should have been fired. Every day since has been too late..

[boyst]

25 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

 

 

Wow, I leave for a couple hours to go to lunch, want to come back to talk about footwear and we're already ramped up to "McD envoking the 9/11 terrorists"!

 

Back to this tho.

 

Yeah, no way did he mandate or even suggest players actually wear work boots. He was obviously busting their chops and calling them out to be tougher.

 

THAT SAID, it is piss poor coaching to even do that.

 

Mike McDaniel sees that and buys the entire OL matching Jordans.

Pete Carroll sees that and shows up in his own Jordans the next week.

Bill Belichick wouldnt even notice what shoes they are wearing because he's busy making sure players know what theyre doing in situational football, and keeping Floyd off a Mayday FG defense.

 

McD, Marrone, Greggggg Williams, and other wannabes are the type to see that and call it out that he wants "work boots and carharts".

i am more in the sense that he was making an analogy or something rhetorical about how the players dress and behave. i don't think he was serious.

 

moral of story. lunches are 1 hour sir.