Orlovsky: Buffalo never once forced Hurts to make the harder throw

[BuffaloBaumer]

Why is Orlovsky not a coach in the NFL?

[C.Biscuit97]

19 minutes ago, Paup 1995MVP said:

How is McDermott a good leader?  What does he say that is remotely smart witty intelligent or inspiring?

 

As for a team brotherhood.  That's on the players.  Most like each other.  Some are outliers, as in any group in society.  But when they are on the field they should all want to win for themselves, each other and their fans.  

 

Coaches need to put a game plan together given who their opponent is that gives their team the best chance to be successful.  And while the game is being played, they need to scheme and make decisions on the fly that continue to give their team the best chance to come out victorious.  In the biggest games, McDermott has come up short time and again.  He has hit his ceiling, and has been figured out.  Time for a change.  

See, I think we are going too far with the McDermott hate now. I think he clearly has game management issues but this team has a lot of personalities and has had some really tough circumstances (Hamlin, blizzard, Diggs, etc) and has kept us together through it. I would never question him as a leader. 

[C.Biscuit97]

27 minutes ago, BuffaloBaumer said:

Why is Orlovsky not a coach in the NFL?

Because coaching sucks. Awful hours, people want to fire you after one game, losers hassle your kids. nice paycheck if you make it high enough and there’s nothing like winning a game/ championship. But there are a lot of drawbacks compared to a cushy tv gig. 
 

id rather be in the front office if I worked for a nfl team.

[DrDawkinstein]

8 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Because coaching sucks. Awful hours, people want to fire you after one game, losers hassle your kids. nice paycheck if you make it high enough and there’s nothing like winning a game/ championship. But there are a lot of drawbacks compared to a cushy tv gig. 
 

id rather be in the front office if I worked for a nfl team.

 

Same reason Fitz isnt coaching. He made close to $100M and has a cushy, high paying announcing gig. Who would EVER give that up so they can have the privilege of never seeing their family, working 20 hour days, and having everyone hate you?

[buffalostu2]

No one seems to mention that the Bills and Josh Allen WON the turnover differential.   

 

No one mentions the bad calls either.  They point out what we did to hurt ourselves, but not what was done to us as well.  

 

An incomplete analysis by people who did not watch the game, Orlovsky aside.

[BillsFan130]

32 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

See, I think we are going too far with the McDermott hate now. I think he clearly has game management issues but this team has a lot of personalities and has had some really tough circumstances (Hamlin, blizzard, Diggs, etc) and has kept us together through it. I would never question him as a leader. 

He passive aggressively throws his players and coaches under the bus all the time .

 

He never says “it’s my fault “.

 

listen to a Dan Campbell post game press after a loss compared to MCD. 

 

MCD never takes any ownership and that is a sign of a terrible leader 

[GoBills808]

52 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

See, I think we are going too far with the McDermott hate now. I think he clearly has game management issues but this team has a lot of personalities and has had some really tough circumstances (Hamlin, blizzard, Diggs, etc) and has kept us together through it. I would never question him as a leader. 

Lol this team does not have a lot of personalities and that's by design, on the WR diva scale Diggs is probably a 3

 

Credit for tough circumstances? What, for not sitting out the rest of the year? They folded like a tent end of last season

[finn]

3 hours ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

In fairness,  that was like a 1/25 type fg make and even that feels generous.  
 

The defense held on to win a lot last year,  this disappointing season seems to have given people fuzzy memories.  Even in losses they pulled off some impressive holds like the Minnesota game where they had a pretty amazing goal line stand then the offense fumbled it away 

 

it’s kind of funny you mention the ravens game from two years ago because our defense saved the game with a late INT against that very same team the next season and you don’t remember it 😂
 

in total they stopped the opponent with a chance to win on a final drive in all these games:

kc

bal

Min 

Mia x3 (defense had good field position game 1)

partial credit for NYJ game 1 (long drive but held to a fg so we could tie with a fg.  Plenty of time for the offense to at least tie who took over and did nothing)

 

partial credit for NYJ game 2 (we were up 8 so the best they could do was tie)

 

Partial credit for lions….(held to a fg to keep the game tied then the offense won it with 30 seconds left) 

 

so depending on how you look at it the defense held somewhere between 6-9 games.   The rest of the games were pretty much blowout wins.  Defense at least debatably held up in 100% of their opportunities on late drives 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hey, I don't let facts get in the way of my cherished narratives, ok? 😉

[BADOLBILZ]

8 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

2015 Tyrod Taylor with more willingness to take risks IMO

 

 

Yeah the similarities are notable.   Putting big time play making talent around quarterbacks with the traits to throw the deep ball and run for yardage works.    Athletically,  Hurts is a load to bring down but he is less dynamic 2015 Tyrod........who had a higher yards per attempt(8 to 7.5) AND yards per rush(5.5 to 3.6) than Hurts has this season.

 

I'm not going run Hurts down too much because I think he is a very smart, well prepared QB even if he lacks great arm talent.........but it would be interesting to find out what he'd look like if AJ Brown or DeVonta Smith went down for about 8 weeks or so.   As you and I know,  the quality of that second option is hugely important.

[DCofNC]

18 hours ago, Comebackkid said:

It's basically the same thing we had going on before McDermott took over. The defense is great spread out over the average. The problem is when you need a great defense to make a stand you don't have it. Part of that is we don't have a Bruce Smith, we no longer have a healthy Von Miller. The other part of that is the coaching philosophy that falls apart when you need it the most.

The entire problem with a scheme like this, you can hide mediocre talent with it, waiting on the other team to screw up.  However, you sell your soul to stop either the run or the pass in big moments UNLESS you have elite talent, that leaves you susceptible to getting crushed in big moments.  The reason Tony Dungy got fired in Tampa was the same issue, bend, don’t break, only works if you have room to bend.     McD will get fired is just that, it doesn’t work when you can’t bend.

[C.Biscuit97]

13 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yeah the similarities are notable.   Putting big time play making talent around quarterbacks with the traits to throw the deep ball and run for yardage works.    Athletically,  Hurts is a load to bring down but he is less dynamic 2015 Tyrod........who had a higher yards per attempt(8 to 7.5) AND yards per rush(5.5 to 3.6) than Hurts has this season.

 

I'm not going run Hurts down too much because I think he is a very smart, well prepared QB even if he lacks great arm talent.........but it would be interesting to find out what he'd look like if AJ Brown or DeVonta Smith went down for about 8 weeks or so.   As you and I know,  the quality of that second option is hugely important.

Isn’t that the case for almost every qb not named Mahomes? I know people hate him but Gabe Davis would be a big loss. 
 

Quote

Hurts also has won 14 straight games against teams with winning records, the longest such streak in NFL history.

https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/eagles-bills-stats-jalen-hurts-jordan-davis-20231128.html#:~:text=Hurts also has won 14,a number of different ways.
 

that is an amazing stat. Maybe the guy who outplayed Mahomes in the SB is just really good.

Edited November 29, 2023 by C.Biscuit97

[dave mcbride]

13 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yeah the similarities are notable.   Putting big time play making talent around quarterbacks with the traits to throw the deep ball and run for yardage works.    Athletically,  Hurts is a load to bring down but he is less dynamic 2015 Tyrod........who had a higher yards per attempt(8 to 7.5) AND yards per rush(5.5 to 3.6) than Hurts has this season.

 

I'm not going run Hurts down too much because I think he is a very smart, well prepared QB even if he lacks great arm talent.........but it would be interesting to find out what he'd look like if AJ Brown or DeVonta Smith went down for about 8 weeks or so.   As you and I know,  the quality of that second option is hugely important.

I think this is what you'd see - the 2021 version of him, when he only had a rookie Smith: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/phi/2021.htm. His numbers were pretty Tyrod like, which doesn't mean bad (Tyrod was a decent player for the Bills). 

[Solomon Grundy]

On 11/27/2023 at 11:27 PM, SydneyBillsFan said:

In reference to the final drive prior to the 59-yard FG, Orlovsky tears McD a new one.

 

From 6:20:

 

 

He'll NEVER accept responsibility!! 

[dave mcbride]

3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Isn’t that the case for almost every qb not named Mahomes? I know people hate him but Gabe Davis would be a big loss. 
 

https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/eagles-bills-stats-jalen-hurts-jordan-davis-20231128.html#:~:text=Hurts also has won 14,a number of different ways.
 

that is an amazing stat. Maybe the guy who outplayed Mahomes in the SB is just really good.

I'll say this about him - I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone improve year-to-year like him, and this goes back to college. I remember him getting benched for Tua vs Georgia, and I thought, put him out of his misery -- the man can't throw and also has an incredibly slow release. No chance at the next level. Props to him for always improving year to year. I think he's plateaued, but that plateau is pretty elevated.

[Solomon Grundy]

On 11/27/2023 at 11:38 PM, HappyDays said:

I time stamped it to the exact point in the video. It goes until 7:30.

 

 

 

It's mind blowing. The exact same spot on the field over and over and over again, and we never adjusted. Great breakdown by Dan Orlovsky.

 

Kind of off topic, but Dan Orlovsky is the only person on this panel that has a clue. I feel bad for him, putting so much work in while his coworkers make fools of themselves. Take it from me and don't bother watching anything before the time stamp or after 7:30.

I think that entire panel is AWESOME, especially Laura😎

[Ray Stonada]

 

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

I'll say this about him - I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone improve year-to-year like him, and this goes back to college. I remember him getting benched for Tua vs Georgia, and I thought, put him out of his misery -- the man can't throw and also has an incredibly slow release. No chance at the next level. Props to him for always improving year to year. I think he's plateaued, but that plateau is pretty elevated.

He also tends to be his sharpest when the team needs it—like connecting with Smith deep to spark  comebacks the last two weeks. 

[BADOLBILZ]

42 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Isn’t that the case for almost every qb not named Mahomes? I know people hate him but Gabe Davis would be a big loss. 
 

https://www.inquirer.com/eagles/eagles-bills-stats-jalen-hurts-jordan-davis-20231128.html#:~:text=Hurts also has won 14,a number of different ways.
 

that is an amazing stat. Maybe the guy who outplayed Mahomes in the SB is just really good.

 

 

1) The quality of a teams second receiving target has been a remarkable indicator of which teams reach the SB for the past 15 years or so but especially the last 6 SB's.........where the second options on those SB participants all were basically WR1B's or put up WR1 numbers.

 

People express "hate" about Beane stranding Allen with Gabe as his #2 because he's so clearly not in that category.............so you are reading that entirely the wrong way.     The Bills lack depth at WR but Gabe isn't a good second option and it's a lot easier to envision Shakir or Sherfield(even) replacing Gabe's wildly inconsistent play than it would be anyone on the Eagles replacing Brown or Smith.

 

2) The flip side is that Hurts took the better roster........including better blocking, receiving and running game.........and got beat by a QB playing on a high ankle sprain.    When Hurts handed the Chiefs those 7 points by setting the ball on the ground and fumbling it to KC for 7 points that totally changed the momentum of the game so I have never felt that he "outplayed" Mahomes.   

[CincyBillsFan]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

2) The flip side is that Hurts took the better roster........including better blocking, receiving and running game.........and got beat by a QB playing on a high ankle sprain.    When Hurts handed the Chiefs those 7 points by setting the ball on the ground and fumbling it to KC for 7 points that totally changed the momentum of the game so I have never felt that he "outplayed" Mahomes.   

Funny how that TO, much worse then the INT Allen threw on Sunday, is forgotten in the near universal praise of Hurts play in last years SB.  Yet Allen who played better on Sunday is having his spectacular performance negated by ONE INT.  There is something weird going on in the Allen criticisms as they're getting more unhinged as the season progresses.

 

 

 

[C.Biscuit97]

1 hour ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Funny how that TO, much worse then the INT Allen threw on Sunday, is forgotten in the near universal praise of Hurts play in last years SB.  Yet Allen who played better on Sunday is having his spectacular performance negated by ONE INT.  There is something weird going on in the Allen criticisms as they're getting more unhinged as the season progresses.

 

 

 

You’re comparing the SB to a regular season game??? How does that even make sense? A game where Hurts had almost 400 yards and 4 tds??? Because of a fumble? That’s literally an insane comparison. 
 

how many SBs win if Kelly (an awful postseason qb) had close to that game that Hurts had, despite that fumble?

[DCofNC]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

I'll say this about him - I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone improve year-to-year like him, and this goes back to college. I remember him getting benched for Tua vs Georgia, and I thought, put him out of his misery -- the man can't throw and also has an incredibly slow release. No chance at the next level. Props to him for always improving year to year. I think he's plateaued, but that plateau is pretty elevated.

I thought he was undraftable coming out, after his first year playing, I was still sure I was spot on.  Then he broke out like Allen did.  He’s playing great football.