‘Bye, Bye Barry’ (Sanders) documentary released on prime video

[BaaadThingsMan]

Will they say he left because he had several women all due to deliver his babies at the same time...allegedly? 

[CookieG]

18 hours ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

In my opinion, the best pure running back to play the game was OJ.  OJ's moves were a little more subtle than Barry's but just as effective.  And OJ was bigger, faster, and stronger.   OJ wasn't the best blocker.  He was underutilized as a receiver.  But as a runner, he was a man playing with boys.  

I don't have the stats but I'll guess Barry had more negative plays than OJ.  The highlights don't show that.

 

If OJ wasn't murderous scum, the NFL and its fans would remember him differently.  I think the top tier of running backs consists of two players: Jim Brown and OJ.  I think Barry is in the next tier with Walter Payton and some others.  

 

But most people don't rank RBs that way - with OJ in the top two - because of the ick factor of OJ's post-career crimes rightfully tainting his reputation.   

 

If OJ had died in a car accident when he was traded to the 49ers, the Jimi Hendrix effect would be working in his favor and he'd be remembered as a legend.  

eh, this is always fun, comparing all time greats.  The greatest boxer, Jordan vs Lebron, Ruth vs whomever, etc.

 

OJ's first few years were wasted, being underutilized and playing on a sub par offense.  But when Lou Saban came back, he made a big effort to change that.  The Bills drafted Reggie Mckenzie in the 2nd round of the 1972 draft.  in 1973 they drafted both Joe D and Paul Seymour in the 1st. Seymour was an offensive tackle in college and Saban made him a TE.  He brought in a 250 lb fullback in JIm Braxton,  who was essentially another OL. They were running jumbo sets as their standard offense.   All of that was for OJ.  And for the most part, it worked.

 

Barry was drafted by Wayne Fontes and ran out of a run and shoot offense.  In those days, the run and shoot was what Buddy Ryan said it was, the "chuck and duck".  No fullback, no TE, not much blocking. When Barry started his career, he did have Lomas Brown at LT, Kevin Glover at center and some players on the interior of the Oline. But guard Mike Utely was paralyzed in 1991 and their other guard was killed in an offseason tragic accident around the same time. I think they ended up getting BIll Fralic fro a year in 1994 or 1995.

 

Its true, Barry had more negative yards than OJ.  In fact, he had more than anyone.  But he also averaged 5 yards per carry. On many of his highlight reel runs, he's having to duck people in the backfield.  The Lions weren't built for running the football.  It was "chuck and duck" in the the running game as much as it was in the passing game.

 

As you say, OJ looked like a man among boys when he ran.  Barry was the little kid in a pee wee game, the running back that no one can tackle. Except he was doing it in the NFL. And he was often doing it against pro bowl players.  

 

In these convos, Barry gets my vote as the GOAT.  He could do things with the football no one else could.  Even Walter Payton admitted that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

12 hours ago, Mr. Wonderful said:

Some of you younger guys may not be aware that  both Thurman Thomas and Barry Sanders were teammates for a time at Oklahoma State.  Tremendous talents!   

Barry Switzer has a famous quote about that.  Before the Oklahoma St. game, he claims to have said "whatever you do, don't let Thurman Thomas hurt. You don't want to face this Sanders guy."

 

 

[BillsPride12]

Just watched it.  Excellent documentary.  I miss that era of NFL football so bad, I remember doing a book report on Barry when I was a little kid.  It's a shame he never got see experience more team success.  I did forget about how many talented players were on those early 90s Lions teams they eventually lost to free agency. 

[Sherlock Holmes]

On 11/21/2023 at 12:49 PM, RobbRiddick said:

Yep, I agree. Best running back I ever saw and, along with Favre, the most entertaining player in my mind. 

 

Josh Allen is wayyyy more entertaining than Favre

[DuckyBoys]

On 11/22/2023 at 6:15 AM, Dablitzkrieg said:

Mitchell had one great season (1995) where Detroit had a high powered pass game  Next season he showed up 30lbs heavier with a beer belly Dad bod and that was the end of that Dude can be bitter but the most success he had was briefly on the Lions   Lions won one playoff game early in Barry's career and that was with mighty Eric Kramer at qb.  I watched Barry whenever possible and he was must watch tv  Lions wasted Barry w Fontes and mediocre qbs running the run and shoot   

 

 

[Mark Long Beach]

Man I loved watching Barry Sanders.   One of those very rare players that made you gasp on a regular basis.   The best part is, that I actually get that feeling with Josh Allen.  Someone who can do something (almost) nobody else can on a regular basis.

[Alphadawg7]

Documentary was great.  He is the GOAT at RB as far as I’m concerned, and it’s a clear choice for me.  

[BuffaloBill]

Sanders had an other worldly combination of power, speed and balance. Maybe the only other player to have anything similar was Bo Jackson.  

[Chaos]

it’s hard to compare eras.  But Jim Brown avg over five per carry when defenses were focused primarily on stopping the run AND allowed to tackle by face masking 

[BuffaloBill]

Factoid:

 

OJ hits 2003 vs. Jets

 

Barry hits 2000 vs the Jets

[machine gun kelly]

On 11/21/2023 at 12:49 PM, RobbRiddick said:

Yep, I agree. Best running back I ever saw and, along with Favre, the most entertaining player in my mind. 

 

You must not be old enough to see OJ.  The crazy part to OJ is every offense to stop him, yet he averaged 143 yards per game in 1973.  That is the greatest avg yardage for a season of all time.  Now I’m not old enough to remember that year, but I’ve watched the games after the fact.  Granted he turned into a piece of human garbage later in life, but he’s up there with Barry.  I used to always go to the Bucs/Lions games in the 90’s because of him.  He was electric!

[The Firebaugh Kid]

My first Bills game ever was the meaningless January game (for Buf) against Barrys Lions in 91. 
We had lower end zone seats and someone hit Barry in the head with a snowball 🤣

PS thanks for a great experience dad 🤣

[Buffalo ill]

Barry Sanders or Bo Jackson would have ran for 300 yards/game if they played for the 90's cowboys.

[RobbRiddick]

1 hour ago, machine gun kelly said:

You must not be old enough to see OJ.  The crazy part to OJ is every offense to stop him, yet he averaged 143 yards per game in 1973.  That is the greatest avg yardage for a season of all time.  Now I’m not old enough to remember that year, but I’ve watched the games after the fact.  Granted he turned into a piece of human garbage later in life, but he’s up there with Barry.  I used to always go to the Bucs/Lions games in the 90’s because of him.  He was electric!

No I never saw OJ or Jim Brown so have to rely on highlights for them. Caught the tail end of Payton but I was really young when he was playing so probably didn't appreciate him as much.

 

Part of the reason I have Barry as number 1 is that I just loved watching him play so much. I think we put a lot of stock in watchability with sportsmen, like Ali in boxing or Pele/Maradona/Messi in soccer. It's not just how good they are but how entertaining they are. That's why Sanders always comes to mind. I remember telling a younger person who had never seen him play that it was like watching a guy run on a carpet of air, he was so smooth and graceful despite having legs as wide as oak trees.

 

And I have to admit, seeing all these showboaters these days celebrating every time they get a first down, it makes me appreciate Sanders even more for the countless times he'd score a highlight real TD only to usually flip the ball back to the ref.

[EasternOHBillsFan]

2 hours ago, BuffaloBill said:

Factoid:

 

OJ hits 2003 vs. Jets

 

Barry hits 2000 vs the Jets

 

Reminded me... Bruce Smith most sacks (17.5) vs. the Jets Ken O'Brien!

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

On 11/21/2023 at 12:35 PM, BuffaloBill said:

https://www.amazon.com/Bye-Barry-Sanders/dp/B0CGP3QJYH?nodl=1&dplnkId=1c2ba690-009a-431f-9f51-b14972e47f1c

 

 

 

I have not watched it yet but Prime has just released a documentary on Barry Sanders. In my book he is the best pure running back to play the game.  I could watch his highlight clips all day. It’s so sad that his career was wasted in a bad to middling Detroit franchise.  

Thanks!

 

in my book, he is the best football player ever.

[hondo in seattle]

3 hours ago, machine gun kelly said:

You must not be old enough to see OJ.  The crazy part to OJ is every offense to stop him, yet he averaged 143 yards per game in 1973.  That is the greatest avg yardage for a season of all time.  Now I’m not old enough to remember that year, but I’ve watched the games after the fact.  Granted he turned into a piece of human garbage later in life, but he’s up there with Barry.  I used to always go to the Bucs/Lions games in the 90’s because of him.  He was electric!

 

Many teams, maybe most, put a spy on OJ.  Fergie became a good QB in later years but when he first got to the NFL his job was to hand off.  Our passing attack in 1973 wasn't anything special.  Neither was our defense.  So the opposing team's game plan was to slow OJ down.  If they did that, they'd win.  With an entire defense focused on him every week, OJ still averaged 143 yards.  

 

People forget the rules were different then.  Hash marks were wider out often squeezing the offense against a sideline.  Linemen couldn't block with their hands.  And so on.  Virtually all the rule changes since the 1970s have favored the offense gaining yards and scoring easier.  

 

Schemes and philosophies were different back then.  More RBs were taken #1 overall in the draft in the 1970s than QBs.  While QBs were important, many teams built their offenses around bell cow running backs.  The best athletes didn't become WRs and CBs, they became RBs.  The coaching mantra was: Establish the run to open the pass.  Then it was all about the run.  

 

So defenses were designed to stop the run.  The Nickel defense we currently run as our base would be considered a pass-prevent defense back then.  LBs weren't coverage guys and blitz specialists.  They were big, violent thumpers like Dick Butkus and Chuck Bednarik whose sole goal in life was to crush running backs.  

 

By 1997, Barry's best year, the league had changed.  Seasons were longer, defenses were more concerned with the pass, and the rule changes made it easier for offenses to move the ball and score.  Barry topped out at 2053 but a couple other guys also took advantage of the changes and finished over 1500 yards.  Still, it was a very good year for Barry as he finished an impressive 17% above the next best guy.

 

In 1973, in a 14 games season where the best athletes played running back and defenses were focused on the run, OJ got 2003 yards - a whopping 75% more yards than the next best guy.   OJ wasn't just a little better than his peers.  He was on a different freaking planet.    His combination of speed, grace, power, elusiveness, and vision were otherworldly.  

 

I am old enough to have watched OJ in his prime.  And I don't think I've ever seen an NFL player - not even Brady - play at a level that was so much ahead of what everyone else was doing.  Brady's career was amazing but how much better in his best years was he than Rodgers, Brees, or Manning.   Not much - if at all.  On the other hand, once Lou Saban came to town, everyone in the NFL knew OJ was the best back in the game and there was little-to-no debate.  

 

[Spiderweb]

8 hours ago, Chaos said:

it’s hard to compare eras.  But Jim Brown avg over five per carry when defenses were focused primarily on stopping the run AND allowed to tackle by face masking 

And he out weighed some defensive linemen..

 

[hondo in seattle]

On 11/21/2023 at 1:19 PM, Bill from NYC said:

Did you ever see Earl Campbell in his prime?

 

I loved Earl Campbell.  And wouldn't he be great on the Bills with all the power and passion?  Put guys in the box to stop Earl, and we'll throw it over the top.  Play in a soft zone, and Earl will ram the ball up your gut.   We'd be so hard to defend.

But OJ was better.  

[PBF81]

On 11/21/2023 at 5:48 PM, BillsPride12 said:

I have been looking forward to this for awhile, can't wait to watch over the Holiday break.  

 

It's excellent!  Very well done.