Outlook on McDermott if we turn it around

[UmbrellaMan]

On 11/20/2023 at 12:54 AM, JerseyBills said:

I'm in the minority clearly but I'm a huge McD fan. I'm in my 30s, was too young to enjoy Levy, barely able to enjoy Wade, basically grew up in the drought and McD ends that in year 1, I just don't see an improvement out there, his biggest mistake besides 13 seconds, which can be put on many players/coaches, was letting a 25 year old QB hand pick his oc. 

 

I'm glad he's here

This post is 100% on point. Be careful what you wish for…

[BullBuchanan]

7 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Yes yes, he has that Super Bowl “DNA” which has been clearly expressed with two playoff wins in a decade. Just a born playoff and championship deliverer. 

 

the list of coaches who won 1 Super Bowl and never won again is A LOT higher than coaches who have won multiple.

 

I love this.

 

 

Sean Payton did it three years in a row with one of the greatest QB’s of all time.

 

Tomlin missed the playoffs 4 years with Big Ben. 
 

Pete Carrol missed the playoffs twice with Russell Wilson.

 

Josh Allen isn’t Tom Brady and McDermott isn’t Bill Belichick. 

Just checking, but you'd prefer 1 Super Bowl win to 0 right?

It's quite interesting you're gunning for Harbaugh so hard when he's probably going to get Coach of the Year and his team will probably get the #1 seed.

[DapperCam]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

Sean Payton did it three years in a row with one of the greatest QB’s of all time.

 

Tomlin missed the playoffs 4 years with Big Ben. 
 

Pete Carrol missed the playoffs twice with Russell Wilson.

 

Josh Allen isn’t Tom Brady and McDermott isn’t Bill Belichick. 

Sean Payton missing the playoffs with Drew Brees was a massive failure. Tomlin missing the playoffs in 2018 was a massive failure. 

 

Some of those other years had just “good” QB performances. If you have a QB putting up a top-5 performance in the league for their position in a given year, you should make the playoffs or it is a coaching failure IMO. Maybe that was less true in the past, but with the way the rules are now I think it is true.

 

Allen is on pace for a top 5 finish at his position. Maybe top 1 depending on how you weigh TDs vs turnovers.

 

 

 

[BullBuchanan]

1 hour ago, DapperCam said:

Sean Payton missing the playoffs with Drew Brees was a massive failure. Tomlin missing the playoffs in 2018 was a massive failure. 

 

Some of those other years had just “good” QB performances. If you have a QB putting up a top-5 performance in the league for their position in a given year, you should make the playoffs or it is a coaching failure IMO. Maybe that was less true in the past, but with the way the rules are now I think it is true.

 

Allen is on pace for a top 5 finish at his position. Maybe top 1 depending on how you weigh TDs vs turnovers.

 

 

 

I'm not sure how you're slotting him ahead of Jackson, Tua, Stroud, Prescott, or Wilson based on this year. They are all performing significantly better. You also have Hurts, Mahomes and Goff right there too.

[Since1981]

McDah will be a hero or zero now based on Brady. We really have to give kudos for OC shift. One game. We’ll see. 

[Billsatlastin2018]

Mr. Can’t Count down from 13 or up to 12 McClapper,has FUBARed this season, along with the clown he threw over the side. The Bills should be going into this buzz saw stretch of 4 games with… let me be charitable… 2 Losses! The stiffs and bums they lost to are embarrassing. 
 

But, that is the McD reality! Snatching away Championship runs with idiotic and incompetent decision making. I would be shocked if the Bills were 2-2 here and finishing at 9-8 is OUT OF THE PLAYOFFS! No,they are not going to beat the Fish at Miami in the Season finale.

 

Hit the road Clappy and don’t you come back no more!

EVER!

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

During the Bucs game, for the first time ever I felt like I was done with McDermott. I have always appreciated what he’s done to take us from a joke to a contender. That was the first game where I just couldn’t unsee the stupidity and all the good just slowly stopped mattering. Maybe he’s a guy that is good enough to fix it but not good enough to take us where we need to be. After the inexcusable bronco loss I was actually hoping the guy was fired and just knew the season was over.
 

Knowing where we are and what we have coming, if we somehow get into the playoffs…it would be the best coaching job McDermott has done so far. I think knowing how I felt after the bronco game and knowing what it would take to get in I’d be very happy with McDermott again and be willing to forgive the early season issues. Find a way to get in and I’m going to have a short memory on the rare slow start. If we don’t make the playoffs I won’t be surprised but I will be ready to move on. This team is too good and this league is too average right now to be sitting home.

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

8 hours ago, FireChans said:

Yes yes, he has that Super Bowl “DNA” which has been clearly expressed with two playoff wins in a decade. Just a born playoff and championship deliverer. 

 

the list of coaches who won 1 Super Bowl and never won again is A LOT higher than coaches who have won multiple.

 

 

 

With that being the case, doesn't it make more sense to fire a Super Bowl winning coach if he doesn't deliver another within a few seasons rather than hold onto him? Maybe the Eagles are onto something? Does it revitalize and refocus a team with new energy? Or is it just random luck? Obviously the sample size is small right now. And what is Sirianni's fate? Will he be fired in a couple seasons if they do not win a Super Bowl? Or fired a few seasons after having won a Super Bowl if they don't win another?

 

Is the goal to find the next Andy Reid (KC Reid not Philly Reid) or Bill Belicheck? I think those are the only two active coaches that even have multiple Super Bowl rings. And then hold onto them forever? Or should teams forever be content with the Tomlin's and Harbaugh's?

 

Yet here we are, and folks want to hold onto McDermott who has been here for 7 years now, six with Allen and has yet to even get to a Super Bowl. Based on actual history, an argument could be made that even if all the dominoes fell right and McDermott and the Bills won a Super Bowl in 2020, if the Bills don't get back to the Super Bowl this year he should be fired. 

1 hour ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

During the Bucs game, for the first time ever I felt like I was done with McDermott. I have always appreciated what he’s done to take us from a joke to a contender. That was the first game where I just couldn’t unsee the stupidity and all the good just slowly stopped mattering. Maybe he’s a guy that is good enough to fix it but not good enough to take us where we need to be. After the inexcusable bronco loss I was actually hoping the guy was fired and just knew the season was over.
 

Knowing where we are and what we have coming, if we somehow get into the playoffs…it would be the best coaching job McDermott has done so far. I think knowing how I felt after the bronco game and knowing what it would take to get in I’d be very happy with McDermott again and be willing to forgive the early season issues. Find a way to get in and I’m going to have a short memory on the rare slow start. If we don’t make the playoffs I won’t be surprised but I will be ready to move on. This team is too good and this league is too average right now to be sitting home.

 

Well said. My exact feelings as well. It will be McDermott's greatest coaching job ever if he can get this current squad to the playoffs with the upcoming schedule the Bills have. Assuming a 4-2 finish or better is what is needed to get us there and not 3-3 because some other teams implode. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

8 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:

It's quite interesting you're gunning for Harbaugh so hard when he's probably going to get Coach of the Year and his team will probably get the #1 seed.

 

Really? Over Campbell or Demeco Ryans? Can't see that. This year Harbaugh has significantly benefited from playing in the division that ended up having the absolute worst QB play by a mile besides his own healthy Lamar Jackson. 

 

Not sure if a coach who ever missed the playoffs has won, but if the Texans somehow don't get in I could still see Ryans winning it. That teams wasn't supposed to win more than 4 games. 

[Dopey]

On 11/20/2023 at 12:51 AM, Einstein said:

 

If this happens then I think McD needs to answer some tough questions about why he didn’t make a change sooner.

 

That type of run against the gauntlet of teams upcoming would be a clear and direct indictment on Dorsey.

Ahh, the “never happy crew”. 

[PBF81]

3 hours ago, Since1981 said:

McDah will be a hero or zero now based on Brady. We really have to give kudos for OC shift. One game. We’ll see. 

 

We also have to realize that he only fired Dorsey due to fan & media pressure.  He repeatedly stated his story for Dorsey.  

 

I'm not sure he gets kudos for having his hand forced, any more than he does in supporting Peterman over Allen.  

 

... yet another reason ...

 

 

[Wayne Arnold]

On 11/20/2023 at 12:17 AM, Mikie2times said:

The better we perform in the short term, the more likely we will maintain the status quo in the long term. I don't see any way that isn't the case. It was already a long shot that we would part ways with McDermott after this year. It was going to take an implosion on the trajectory of what we had seen prior to Dorsey being canned. If they turn it around and threaten the playoffs it's not going to happen. 

 

Do some of you feel strongly enough about McDermott to actual want this thing to implode for the greater good? Do some of you feel if we can somehow get back on track to make the playoffs that it would alter your view on him as the coach next year? Curious what the outlook is on this. 

 

After the Broncos loss I was convinced that the season was over and McDermott had lost the team and a replacement was needed.

 

His decision to fire Dorsey surprised me. But it didn't change my mind.

 

But if this season turns around and replacing Dorsey with Brady is a big part of that, then McDermott deserves a hell of a lot of credit.

 

I'd much rather hope that I was wrong about McDermott and that he may be capable of being a Super Bowl winning head coach than hope I was right and root against my team so that it blows up and we get a new coaching staff. If they beat the Eagles on Sunday then the Super Bowl expectations are back and let's f'n go.

[Buffalo03]

I think the only Bills coach I ever actually rooted to lose was Dick Jauron. Mainly because I knew he was an absolute waste as a head coach. When he made it to his 4th year, I was just like "enough of this already". He got fired that season, thankfully. But that was the only time I was ever happy for a Bills coach to lose to get something done

[PBF81]

2 hours ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

During the Bucs game, for the first time ever I felt like I was done with McDermott. I have always appreciated what he’s done to take us from a joke to a contender. That was the first game where I just couldn’t unsee the stupidity and all the good just slowly stopped mattering. Maybe he’s a guy that is good enough to fix it but not good enough to take us where we need to be. After the inexcusable bronco loss I was actually hoping the guy was fired and just knew the season was over.
 

Knowing where we are and what we have coming, if we somehow get into the playoffs…it would be the best coaching job McDermott has done so far. I think knowing how I felt after the bronco game and knowing what it would take to get in I’d be very happy with McDermott again and be willing to forgive the early season issues. Find a way to get in and I’m going to have a short memory on the rare slow start. If we don’t make the playoffs I won’t be surprised but I will be ready to move on. This team is too good and this league is too average right now to be sitting home.

 

30 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

Yet here we are, and folks want to hold onto McDermott who has been here for 7 years now, six with Allen and has yet to even get to a Super Bowl. Based on actual history, an argument could be made that even if all the dominoes fell right and McDermott and the Bills won a Super Bowl in 2020, if the Bills don't get back to the Super Bowl this year he should be fired. 

 

Well said. My exact feelings as well. It will be McDermott's greatest coaching job ever if he can get this current squad to the playoffs with the upcoming schedule the Bills have. Assuming a 4-2 finish or better is what is needed to get us there and not 3-3 because some other teams implode. 

 

If he can take us too the playoffs by us winning, and not with a bunch of other teams imploding, and get us at least to the AFC CG, and not lose that one due to some idiotic coaching blunder, or better yet, win the damn thing and advance is to the Super Bowl, again, playing without blundering it away, win or lose, then this becomes a whole new conversation.  If he can't get us past the Divisional round again for the second time in 7 seasons, if we even make it, them he's made his own bed.  

 

Until then ... 

 

Either way, not sure I see Pegula eating the crow that would be necessary to admit a McDimwit type blunder in extending him rather than waiting too see how the first half of this season played out. 

 

As always, it's not as if it comes down to a forum vote here, so we're all captive to Pegula.  

 

Otherwise, maybe we'll have further insight after Sunday's game.  Every game is a must-win now.  

 

 

8 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

I think the only Bills coach I ever actually rooted to lose was Dick Jauron. Mainly because I knew he was an absolute waste as a head coach. When he made it to his 4th year, I was just like "enough of this already". He got fired that season, thankfully. But that was the only time I was ever happy for a Bills coach to lose to get something done

 

The thought of having a mid-round pick is an appealing one.  

 

 

[FireChans]

7 hours ago, DapperCam said:

Sean Payton missing the playoffs with Drew Brees was a massive failure. Tomlin missing the playoffs in 2018 was a massive failure. 

 

Some of those other years had just “good” QB performances. If you have a QB putting up a top-5 performance in the league for their position in a given year, you should make the playoffs or it is a coaching failure IMO. Maybe that was less true in the past, but with the way the rules are now I think it is true.

 

Allen is on pace for a top 5 finish at his position. Maybe top 1 depending on how you weigh TDs vs turnovers.

 

 

 

Funny fact, Drew Brees threw 19, 17, 11 and 15 INTs when they missed the postseason those four years. He never threw double digit picks again and never missed the postseason again.

 

9 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:

Just checking, but you'd prefer 1 Super Bowl win to 0 right?

It's quite interesting you're gunning for Harbaugh so hard when he's probably going to get Coach of the Year and his team will probably get the #1 seed.

I would, and I am on record that I would rather have the Bills suck for 10 years and win once than make the playoffs 10 years straight and never win.

 

But, to me, a guy like Haurbaugh is just as good of a coach as McD. Maybe a little better or worse but in the same tier of coaching. Yes, he won 1 Super Bowl a decade ago when his QB had the most insane heroic postseason performance of all time. 
 

But, imo, McD has been just as good if not better since he’s been a coach in this league.

 

Put another way, if we fired McD and hired Harbaugh or Tomlin, to me that’s a complete lateral move. Despite their Super Bowl “DNA,” they didn’t win one with us and Harbaugh especially has never even come close repeating.
 

Also, Dan Campbell will win COTY.

Edited November 23, 2023 by FireChans

[RiotAct]

2 hours ago, Billsatlastin2018 said:

 

I would be shocked if the Bills were 2-2 here and finishing at 9-8 is OUT OF THE PLAYOFFS! No,they are not going to beat the Fish at Miami in the Season finale.

That’s the spirit…

[FireChans]

53 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

With that being the case, doesn't it make more sense to fire a Super Bowl winning coach if he doesn't deliver another within a few seasons rather than hold onto him? Maybe the Eagles are onto something? Does it revitalize and refocus a team with new energy? Or is it just random luck? Obviously the sample size is small right now. And what is Sirianni's fate? Will he be fired in a couple seasons if they do not win a Super Bowl? Or fired a few seasons after having won a Super Bowl if they don't win another?

 

Is the goal to find the next Andy Reid (KC Reid not Philly Reid) or Bill Belicheck? I think those are the only two active coaches that even have multiple Super Bowl rings. And then hold onto them forever? Or should teams forever be content with the Tomlin's and Harbaugh's?

 

Yet here we are, and folks want to hold onto McDermott who has been here for 7 years now, six with Allen and has yet to even get to a Super Bowl. Based on actual history, an argument could be made that even if all the dominoes fell right and McDermott and the Bills won a Super Bowl in 2020, if the Bills don't get back to the Super Bowl this year he should be fired. 

 

Well said. My exact feelings as well. It will be McDermott's greatest coaching job ever if he can get this current squad to the playoffs with the upcoming schedule the Bills have. Assuming a 4-2 finish or better is what is needed to get us there and not 3-3 because some other teams implode. 

See I think the one thing that coaches like Tomlin or Harbaugh have proven, and the reason why I think they haven’t been fired yet, is because they have weathered storms and come out the other side.

 

Tomlin almost always pulls .500 seasons  out. Both rosters and teams have seen rises and falls, and they haven’t lost the lockerooms or failed to bring the team back.

 

McD hasn’t done that, yet.

He has taken a team with no business making the playoffs to the WC spot (probably his best coach job).

 

He has overseen a good team get to the second or third round, which is disappointing but not wildly below expectations.

 

He hasn’t taken a team that was on life support from a playoff perspective, rallied them, and went on to win a playoff game or two.

 

To me, this is the last hurdle for McD. I think if he pulls off a 6-1 record down the stretch here, he’s safe. And I’m okay with that tbh. And if we get killed in a couple of these games and the season spirals, I’m okay with firing him.

[FireChans]

31 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

After the Broncos loss I was convinced that the season was over and McDermott had lost the team and a replacement was needed.

 

His decision to fire Dorsey surprised me. But it didn't change my mind.

 

But if this season turns around and replacing Dorsey with Brady is a big part of that, then McDermott deserves a hell of a lot of credit.

 

I'd much rather hope that I was wrong about McDermott and that he may be capable of being a Super Bowl winning head coach than hope I was right and root against my team so that it blows up and we get a new coaching staff. If they beat the Eagles on Sunday then the Super Bowl expectations are back and let's f'n go.

Win or lose, this season is probably the last go-round for guys like Poyer, Hyde, maybe Tre, Von etc.

 

For Poyer and Hyde, guys who deserve massive credit for becoming stars in Buffalo, helping break the drought, etc, I would like to send them out with a bang. Beat the Eagles and we are hopping the train. 
 

I don’t want those dudes last season in Buffalo to be spent on IR at 8-9.

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, Dopey said:

Ahh, the “never happy crew”. 

 

I certainly don’t think I’m in that category.

 

However, I am in the “well paid coaches should be held accountable” category.

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, PBF81 said:

 

We also have to realize that he only fired Dorsey due to fan & media pressure.  He repeatedly stated his story for Dorsey.  

 

I'm not sure he gets kudos for having his hand forced, any more than he does in supporting Peterman over Allen.  

 

... yet another reason ...

 

 

Most coaches don’t talk smack about current coaches. 
 

Tomlin also caped for Canada. Then fired him. Lol