Firing Dorsey did not solve Bills' number 1 problem: Sean McDermott (damning Warren Sharp article)

[warrior9]

The funny thing about all of this is Josh is having the lowest percentage of turnover worthy throws in his career with the highest completion percentage.

 

This means that balls are being dropped, interceptions happening aren't on Josh, etc, etc.

[LABILLBACKER]

28 minutes ago, FireChans said:

I did. It's cherry picking and riding the "Fire McD" wave.

 

Criticism has been RAMPANT on the Bills inability to be less "Josh Allen-centric."  That's consistent since 2020. There's only one way to do that, run the ball. We have tried to get better in that regard.

 

Folks wanted Frazier gone after 13 seconds. They thought the Bills defense was too passive. They wanted a more attacking and blitzing style defense.  We did that, we tried to get better in that regard.

 

Half the posts in weeks 1-4 were how fans were SO EXCITED we had a run game that worked. How the defense was much more aggressive. Some key injuries and some regression on offense and now its "Sean McDermott orchestrated the Bills fall" lol.

 

This article could have easily been "Dorsey sucked and was holding this team back despite improved personnel" (because pretty much every stat supports that), but Sharp included a bunch of frustrated quotes after losses from 3 years ago to make it seem far more nefarious.

 

There aren't any quotes about McD's offensive frustration from 2022 or 2023?  Why? Has McD not said a million things about the offensive woes' between 2022 and now?

 

Of course he has.

 

Hack job.

 

0/10. 

 

Would not submit my email to read this garbage again.

Ok Chans then how is McD supposed to run the ball if he's refused to draft olineman for 6 years.  Seriously?

[FireChans]

Just now, LABILLBACKER said:

Ok Chans then how is McD supposed to run the ball if he's refused to draft olineman for 6 years.  Seriously?

They drafted Cody Ford in the second, Dion Dawkins in the second, Torrence in the second, Spencer Brown in the third, signed Mitch Morse to the top 7 center contract in the NFL, Nick Broeker in the 7th, Luke Tenuta in the 6th, Tommy Doyle in the 5th, Jack Anderson in the 7th, Wyatt Teller in the 5th, signed Daryl Williams to a 3 years $24M deal, signed Quinton Spain, signed John Feliciano, signed Roger Saffold.

 

You could argue that's "refusing to draft olinemen," and thus a reflection on not wanting to run the ball, but you'd be wrong.

[boyst]

8 minutes ago, FireChans said:

You can't say that and ALSO SAY that Frazier was a nefarious scapegoat to the McD agenda.

Sharp is purposely avoiding the current year and the comments surrounding Dorsey his entire tenure as an OC, and linking quotes from 3 years ago instead.  Like Sean hasn't been basically telling Dorsey to figure it out all season? 

 

His premise is that this is the offense McD wants.  Well if Dorsey was doing a great job doing what McD wanted, WHY DID HE FIRE HIM!

 

I don't care if you hate McD and think he sucks. That's fine. I don't even disagree that we should fire him.  But this article is still garbage.

we don't know the full story about frazier and i haven't heard from a reliable source one way to believe or not but i generally get the feel that there was mutual frustration for both of them against each other.

 

and mcdermott fired him because of the losses. if 11 men were on the field, dorsey would still be here.

[Logic]

I'm just glad I could give everyone a new reason to get angry with each other.

[FireChans]

Just now, boyst said:

we don't know the full story about frazier and i haven't heard from a reliable source one way to believe or not but i generally get the feel that there was mutual frustration for both of them against each other.

 

and mcdermott fired him because of the losses. if 11 men were on the field, dorsey would still be here.

If the Bills won the Superbowl in 2021, we wouldn't be talking about how McD ruined the Bills lol.

 

We can both play that game.

[mjt328]

Not sure if I agree with this article.

 

The Bills struggled on offense in the playoffs, in what he calls the "magical" 2020 season.  

Most fans feel the team actually had it's best chance in 2021, due to the team clicking on offense in playoffs.  But then 13 seconds happened.

And even last year, the Bills were still leaning very heavily towards the pass and still allowing Josh Allen to run the ball a ton.

 

And here in 2023, all the metrics are showing the Bills offense works better when they are running the ball.  James Cook was pretty much the only thing working on Monday night.

 

It's very probably that Sean McDermott is trying to limit Allen's running, and I agree that it's a problem.  But part of the problem with the Bills is being too one-dimensional and predictable.  Teams have caught-up to the heavy passing offenses, and it's vital to keep teams off balance.  If McDermott was preaching that, he's not wrong.

[boyst]

9 minutes ago, FireChans said:

If the Bills won the Superbowl in 2021, we wouldn't be talking about how McD ruined the Bills lol.

 

We can both play that game.

perhaps but that team was full of talent and he had little to do with them.

[FLFan]

I have not been on the McDermott is the problem train like many posters here have been, and in fact I have always argued back at this, but that train is beginning to leave the station in my mind.  This article by Sharp is outstanding, well reasoned and backed up with facts.  It is the best written explanation of what may be the crux of the problem I have read certainly.  Definitely food for thought as the mistakes and failures by players and coaches pile up week after week.   
 

That said, I definitely think Dorsey was part of the problem.  Whether it is partly or mostly due to McDermott’s direction is a valid question, as is the role of McDermott in Josh’s erratic performance.  I know if I do not see some evidence that this team has not quit on the season and by extension the HC by the end of the year (hopefully very soon) the train will be all the way out of the station for me.  

11 minutes ago, Logic said:

I'm just glad I could give everyone a new reason to get angry with each other.

Thanks for posting, really.  I had already read it and  would have posted if you had not already done so.  

[34-78-83]

14 minutes ago, FireChans said:

They drafted Cody Ford in the second, Dion Dawkins in the second, Torrence in the second, Spencer Brown in the third, signed Mitch Morse to the top 7 center contract in the NFL, Nick Broeker in the 7th, Luke Tenuta in the 6th, Tommy Doyle in the 5th, Jack Anderson in the 7th, Wyatt Teller in the 5th, signed Daryl Williams to a 3 years $24M deal, signed Quinton Spain, signed John Feliciano, signed Roger Saffold.

 

You could argue that's "refusing to draft olinemen," and thus a reflection on not wanting to run the ball, but you'd be wrong.

They also have a pretty decent "top half" kinda O-line this year, that is going largely unnoticed through the tornado around it.

[HoofHearted]

1 hour ago, boyst said:

@HoofHearted argue this article. even here he calls out all of our defense and the blitz on 3rd down.

Sure. That dudes a clown. End of discussion.

[FireChans]

26 minutes ago, warrior9 said:

The funny thing about all of this is Josh is having the lowest percentage of turnover worthy throws in his career with the highest completion percentage.

 

This means that balls are being dropped, interceptions happening aren't on Josh, etc, etc.

Aka all good reasons to fire the guy whose job it is to get the offense to execute and play well.

 

Jk, it must be another nefarious scapegoating! 

[Logic]

1 minute ago, HoofHearted said:

Sure. That dudes a clown. End of discussion.

Cheap response.

There are lots of "clowns" in football analysis and on Twitter, specifically.

Warren sharp is a reasonably bright guy, and his piece at least provided lots of numbers and reasoning for his conclusion.

Totally reasonable to disagree with him -- there were some sections of the article that I had issues with, too -- but if you disagree with him SO strongly that you're willing to dismiss his article out of hand and call him a "clown", you'd think it shouldn't be too difficult to list at least a few of the reasons why you disagree so strongly. 

 

[Cubanmist 1]

I’m not on the “Fire Sean” train as the real reasons are being recklessly neglected. The glaring issues on why the offense has been out of whack is obvious to me. Here are my observations.

1) Daboll knew how to unlock Allen, Dorsey didn’t.

2) Dorsey is not Daboll nor was he creative

3) Beane, needed to give Allen a #2 WR. The year that the Bills almost won it all they had a very talented WR in Sanders opposite of Diggs and next to Davis. He could have easily been a #2. A body like that was useful, but was never replaced after Sanders retired.

4)  Last but not least, Josh Allen just has not been himself. He needs to learn to stop trying to throw those tight throws, if they aren’t necessary. Take Tom Brady’s advice and go to the alternative target….even if it yields you 3-5 yards.

Sean does have a little blame in this, but not entirely. My only issue is that he takes too long to fire staff members when needed. Still waiting for him to fire Smiley.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Cubanmist 1

[34-78-83]

8 minutes ago, HoofHearted said:

Sure. That dudes a clown. End of discussion.

you sure though man? I mean don't gambling advice and stat web guys always know more that actual film analysts and scouts? (sorry this is more of a response to an argument that's following you around than to this post)

Edited November 15, 2023 by 34-78-83

[Rico]

Tough to admit  but I’ve seen enough.

 

Sorry McD, next…

[HoofHearted]

8 minutes ago, Logic said:

Cheap response.

There are lots of "clowns" in football analysis and on Twitter, specifically.

Warren sharp is a reasonably bright guy, and his piece at least provided lots of numbers and reasoning for his conclusion.

Totally reasonable to disagree with him -- there were some sections of the article that I had issues with, too -- but if you disagree with him SO strongly that you're willing to dismiss his article out of hand and call him a "clown", you'd think it shouldn't be too difficult to list at least a few of the reasons why you disagree so strongly. 

 

I didn’t read the article. I’m sure the analytics stuff is fine. He’s just a hack. Sold himself as this big time NFL Consultant and it’s all false. He doesn’t know a dang thing about football. Just numbers.

9 minutes ago, 34-78-83 said:

you sure though man? I mean don't gambling advice and stat web guys always know more that actual film analysts and scouts? (sorry this is more of a response to an argument that's following you around than to this post)

I need to just stop responding 🤣

[LABILLBACKER]

34 minutes ago, FireChans said:

They drafted Cody Ford in the second, Dion Dawkins in the second, Torrence in the second, Spencer Brown in the third, signed Mitch Morse to the top 7 center contract in the NFL, Nick Broeker in the 7th, Luke Tenuta in the 6th, Tommy Doyle in the 5th, Jack Anderson in the 7th, Wyatt Teller in the 5th, signed Daryl Williams to a 3 years $24M deal, signed Quinton Spain, signed John Feliciano, signed Roger Saffold.

 

You could argue that's "refusing to draft olinemen," and thus a reflection on not wanting to run the ball, but you'd be wrong.

Yes and everybody with the exception of Dawkins & Torrence are terrible.  Morse is no where near the center he was in KC.  You've basically just listed a bunch of garbage olineman that validate our poor OL ranking since 2018.  Come on Chan....it's about quality,  not quanity.

[juno999]

20 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

Not sure if I agree with this article.

 

The Bills struggled on offense in the playoffs, in what he calls the "magical" 2020 season.  

Most fans feel the team actually had it's best chance in 2021, due to the team clicking on offense in playoffs.  But then 13 seconds happened.

And even last year, the Bills were still leaning very heavily towards the pass and still allowing Josh Allen to run the ball a ton.

 

And here in 2023, all the metrics are showing the Bills offense works better when they are running the ball.  James Cook was pretty much the only thing working on Monday night.

 

It's very probably that Sean McDermott is trying to limit Allen's running, and I agree that it's a problem.  But part of the problem with the Bills is being too one-dimensional and predictable.  Teams have caught-up to the heavy passing offenses, and it's vital to keep teams off balance.  If McDermott was preaching that, he's not wrong.

The Bills in general have not run the ball effectively in quite some time.  They don't want Allen to run the ball.  I get that concern but they didn't replace that aspect of the offense at all.  So they signed a 33 yr old back and Harris who has an injury history and is on IR now.  They removed a large part of Allen's game and he's struggling to adjust to it.

[JerseyBills]

Pressure bust pipes but also makes diamonds. 

That pressure is at an all time high for McD, job likely on the line, lets see how the man reacts.

Edited November 15, 2023 by JerseyBills