Josh’s off seasons

[90sBills]

1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Josh has trained every offseason.  Then after playing through a hurt elbow and a tragic and emotional season he takes some time to recover and you all lose your minds.  It’s utterly ridiculous 

You usually get what you put in with most things in life. So we’re seeing the results of it this season.

 

[LABILLBACKER]

25 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

In fairness to Josh, this is the type of thing that only becomes an issue, or even a thought, when we are losing and things aren't going well.

 

If we are undefeated right now and Josh looks like the MVP, no one is talking about his summer time golf.

 

It does seem like he isn't as committed as he could be.  Most guys at this level are not.

 

 

I would agree.  If he wants to have the success of guys like Brady, Manning etc. he needs to put down the wedges a little and focus more on his craft. I'm an avid golfer, so I get the therapeutic nature of golf.  But hopefully with a new offensive HC, he'll be inspired to dedicate more time there.

Edited November 14, 2023 by LABILLBACKER

[HappyDays]

26 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I am not going to speculate on exactly what might be going on in a public forum. I don't think that is fair to anyone. None of us know. But his pressers and his body language are really concerning. And I don't mean "he might not be playing at his maximum as a Quarterback" concerning I mean on a human level I am concerned for him. He has said some weird ***** in pressers and he looks so vacant on the field. I think it probably isn't football related. 

 

Josh is more than fine in his personal life. Last I heard he and Hailee Steinfield are engaged. He's mega rich. No personal issues to speak of at all.

 

If anything I think he has just gotten sick of the losing. He doesn't have confidence in the system or the players around him, and it's impossible to play fundamentally sound football when you lack trust in the elements around you. I don't think this is anything close to a Carson Wentz situation where Allen has lost the locker room and completely stopped caring about football.

 

Personally I think it is an easy fix. He just needs a totally fresh support system around him this offseason. A new scheme to learn from an experienced offensive play caller that knows how to build the offense around his players' strengths. A head coach that isn't wound so tight and doesn't put players in the doghouse for occasional mistakes. A real WR2 would also help.

 

Overall I think the entire team, Josh included, has forgotten that football is supposed to be fun. They need to get some new energy in the building ASAP.

[Brand J]

As a young pup, Josh worked relentlessly to improve. Mostly from a physical and fundamental standpoint. In 2020, the pandemic year with empty stadiums, he came in on a tear, surprising us all. I remember being absolutely “wowed” by him in that SF game and thought at the time “this guy is gonna be scary good.” Even after the 13 second debacle, the team rebounded the next season and looked to be a force… then the MNF game against GB happened and nothing has been the same since halftime of that game. 

 

When Josh came into this offseason saying he had never been as focused on football as he is now, I thought it was an interesting comment and didn’t know what to make of it. Some here speculated that when a player makes a comment like that, the inverse is often true - the player is not all in, but is saying so as to convince himself and others.
 

Josh has never been great at reading the field, knowing where to go with the ball immediately after the snap, and getting it out on time, but I haven’t seen him look this lost since his rookie year. Quote all the stats you want to tell me how much I’m wrong, but Josh looks like he’s going through some things on a personal level.
 

This offseason he needs to shut it all down, all the extra-curriculares, and become a film watching junky. Really dive into the complexities of defenses to see how coordinators are defending you, what’s working, what’s not working, where his eyes should be based on a given look, etc. become a real student of the game. Aaron Rodgers said “if you want to have sustained success, you need to know defenses as well as your own offense.” I don’t care if Allen doesn’t want to lift or focus on his body, the improvement needs to be upstairs, between his ears, if he’s going to see his vivid dream of the Bills having a Super Bowl parade come to fruition. 

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

I guess Josh's offseason made Cook fumble the first play from scrimmage. 

 

And for Gabe Davis to turn a 1st down from the DEN 15 into an INT.

 

And for Kincaid to turn a 3rd down conversion into a punt. 

 

Murray had a bad drop too, although that play looked like it was only going to gain a few yards. 

 

The 2nd INT and the botched handoff with Cook were bad, but Josh had a pretty good game overall. 

 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

15 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Josh is more than fine in his personal life. Last I heard he and Hailee Steinfield are engaged. He's mega rich. No personal issues to speak of at all.

 

If anything I think he has just gotten sick of the losing. He doesn't have confidence in the system or the players around him, and it's impossible to play fundamentally sound football when you lack trust in the elements around you. I don't think this is anything close to a Carson Wentz situation where Allen has lost the locker room and completely stopped caring about football.

 

Personally I think it is an easy fix. He just needs a totally fresh support system around him this offseason. A new scheme to learn from an experienced offensive play caller that knows how to build the offense around his players' strengths. A head coach that isn't wound so tight and doesn't put players in the doghouse for occasional mistakes. A real WR2 would also help.

 

Overall I think the entire team, Josh included, has forgotten that football is supposed to be fun. They need to get some new energy in the building ASAP.

 

I hope you are right. I suspect there is more to it. Like I say, he has been odd all year. Off the field as well. 

[CincyBillsFan]

27 minutes ago, JayBaller10 said:

As a young pup, Josh worked relentlessly to improve. Mostly from a physical and fundamental standpoint. In 2020, the pandemic year with empty stadiums, he came in on a tear, surprising us all. I remember being absolutely “wowed” by him in that SF game and thought at the time “this guy is gonna be scary good.” Even after the 13 second debacle, the team rebounded the next season and looked to be a force… then the MNF game against GB happened and nothing has been the same since halftime of that game. 

 

When Josh came into this offseason saying he had never been as focused on football as he is now, I thought it was an interesting comment and didn’t know what to make of it. Some here speculated that when a player makes a comment like that, the inverse is often true - the player is not all in, but is saying so as to convince himself and others.
 

Josh has never been great at reading the field, knowing where to go with the ball immediately after the snap, and getting it out on time, but I haven’t seen him look this lost since his rookie year. Quote all the stats you want to tell me how much I’m wrong, but Josh looks like he’s going through some things on a personal level.
 

This offseason he needs to shut it all down, all the extra-curriculares, and become a film watching junky. Really dive into the complexities of defenses to see how coordinators are defending you, what’s working, what’s not working, where his eyes should be based on a given look, etc. become a real student of the game. Aaron Rodgers said “if you want to have sustained success, you need to know defenses as well as your own offense.” I don’t care if Allen doesn’t want to lift or focus on his body, the improvement needs to be upstairs, between his ears, if he’s going to see his vivid dream of the Bills having a Super Bowl parade come to fruition. 

None of this matters if the Bills don't change their mindset to focusing their resources on the offense and surrounding their franchise QB with the talent to fully exploit his skills.  He can spend every waking moment in the off season working out, studying film and further refining his throwing motions and foot work and it won't fix the Bills offensive problems. 

[DrPJax]

3 hours ago, Riverboat Ritchie said:

I know Josh loves golf and that is fine but it sure seems like he has not focused on training with WRs or development the last couple of seasons  as he has become more Hollywood. I don’t want to believe it and these guys definitely need an off season to reboot but I hope he gets back to training with Palmer and maybe throwing some with WRs. 

Sorry, I’m in the medical profession so my analogies are related to things i know or have experience with. Every day i had to study to keep up.  When younger , after being paid 13k a year for 3 years in residency,  when i started private practice at age 27 and actually started to be more fairly paid,  i got a little loose partying and spending money a little undisciplined as my family had been coal miners in Ohio and i grew up quite poor.     I learned , fortunately very quickly from great older  docs, and a great  accountant, if you dont treat your career like being in training, work just as hard in the off hours , others will pass you by professionally and in business. There is always someone better, more gifted. 

 

I didn’t like hearing it at the moment because of ego,  but 40 years later I have never been  sued in the litigious state of Florida, teach med students, residents, nurses, arnp’s and was a med director for several clinics.  More importantly , i can honestly say i never had a family ever come back and tell me , you missed something on my family member that hurt them.  I made some errors as we all do ,  but was honest and helped fix things. I pass those messages about continuous improvement to those younger who are just starting their careers.  I am eternally thankful an older vet/doc sat me down and was brutally honest as i was prob cocky having good credentials coming out of training. Taught me real life lessons.  Josh looks like he might be experiencing similar life issues, understandable given his young age and early success (hey I never made 250 mil$) and it seems he has admitted  he is not a big film guy. He grew with palmer as a mentor , but something is regressing , which is so unexpected. 

 

    He may have decreased  seeing palmer,  but maybe I’m wrong.  He has regressed noticeably , and some vet/ coach needs the balls to sit down and tell him what he doesn’t want to hear. When leading the league in turnovers , be honest with yourself ,,,is that good or fair to your team?  You need to be more professional ; never call out the fans who worship you; your  arm arrogance works less and less each year in the nfl.  How can a captain, leader not be the guy calling an offense only team meeting ? Terrible optics!  I dont  see Dorsey being that confrontational guy , esp since he partially owes josh for getting the OC position. 

 

Maybe players like playing with you , doesn’t mean crap from yes men on your team, whom you give gifts to each Christmas, and they have no real power.  Look , maybe coaching is bad and ruining you ?   Then take charge of your career and  step up;   bring palmer or orlovsky or agent to meeting with you to talk w mcd/beane about solving this. Because right now it’s not working and you look very unsatisfied, and season is on the brink.  My point is , if you feel treated unfairly/badly josh, only you can fix it!   Careers go so fast; don’t keep wasting years, esp as you are in a position of financial power more so than the coaching staff. 

 

Not excusing mcd or Dorsey who i now strongly feel must go next year. Process talk is stale.  If I’m an owner , this is second year w injuries and i think extension was to show mcd belief after terrible injuries last year w Hamlin as well.  That excuse prob wont cut it this year w terrible offense.  No excuse for the bad turnover issue or 12 man debacle. Josh appears to act like he is now untouchable.  Beane should be drafting a backup or see where Dobbs or better competition is to push josh. 

 

Life experience does matter , been a bills fan since ‘63 , and imo , without a miraculous turnaround there will be no playoffs this year.  if I’m beane or the owner , I’m trying to salvage josh to sell those PSL’S FOR the new stadium. Play the year out but 7 years is a fair trial. Time to chance getting better.  Worsening every year is not a good strategy   Thanks for allowing me to vent. This is looking like a very bad year., and tough to enjoy. .  

[BIGFOOTspaceman]

6 hours ago, Riverboat Ritchie said:

I know Josh loves golf and that is fine but it sure seems like he has not focused on training with WRs or development the last couple of seasons  as he has become more Hollywood. I don’t want to believe it and these guys definitely need an off season to reboot but I hope he gets back to training with Palmer and maybe throwing some with WRs. 

I think he gets plenty of work in season throwing to opposing cornerbacks.  I know we've all seen the graphic of "Most turnovers in the NFL since 2018," but look at the company he shares that list with....Jared Goff, Baker Mayfeild, Derek Carr .  Not exactly "elite" company.

[Another Fan]

He can date or be best friends with Taylor Swift, Bob the Drag Queen, or the biggest adult entertainment star in the world today for all I care.  So be it he still brings it on the football field.

 

 

Im not sure the Hollywood girlfriend is a distraction….  but I think it’s fair to question it 

[4merper4mer]

6 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

I hope this doesn't become another Eichel situation due to an incompetent organization.

 

 

Eichole brought a lot on himself.  Josh is nowhere near the level of Jack in terms of lack of redeeming traits.  Eichole had none.  Josh has them.  

5 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

I would agree.  If he wants to have the success of guys like Brady, Manning etc. he needs to put down the wedges a little and focus more on his craft. I'm an avid golfer, so I get the therapeutic nature of golf.  But hopefully with a new offensive HC, he'll be inspired to dedicate more time there.

What is he a kindergartner?  He needs a new coach to “inspire him” to work?  He needs to grow up.

[Dunkirk Donski]

1 hour ago, DrPJax said:

Sorry, I’m in the medical profession so my analogies are related to things i know or have experience with. Every day i had to study to keep up.  When younger , after being paid 13k a year for 3 years in residency,  when i started private practice at age 27 and actually started to be more fairly paid,  i got a little loose partying and spending money a little undisciplined as my family had been coal miners in Ohio and i grew up quite poor.     I learned , fortunately very quickly from great older  docs, and a great  accountant, if you dont treat your career like being in training, work just as hard in the off hours , others will pass you by professionally and in business. There is always someone better, more gifted. 

 

I didn’t like hearing it at the moment because of ego,  but 40 years later I have never been  sued in the litigious state of Florida, teach med students, residents, nurses, arnp’s and was a med director for several clinics.  More importantly , i can honestly say i never had a family ever come back and tell me , you missed something on my family member that hurt them.  I made some errors as we all do ,  but was honest and helped fix things. I pass those messages about continuous improvement to those younger who are just starting their careers.  I am eternally thankful an older vet/doc sat me down and was brutally honest as i was prob cocky having good credentials coming out of training. Taught me real life lessons.  Josh looks like he might be experiencing similar life issues, understandable given his young age and early success (hey I never made 250 mil$) and it seems he has admitted  he is not a big film guy. He grew with palmer as a mentor , but something is regressing , which is so unexpected. 

 

    He may have decreased  seeing palmer,  but maybe I’m wrong.  He has regressed noticeably , and some vet/ coach needs the balls to sit down and tell him what he doesn’t want to hear. When leading the league in turnovers , be honest with yourself ,,,is that good or fair to your team?  You need to be more professional ; never call out the fans who worship you; your  arm arrogance works less and less each year in the nfl.  How can a captain, leader not be the guy calling an offense only team meeting ? Terrible optics!  I dont  see Dorsey being that confrontational guy , esp since he partially owes josh for getting the OC position. 

 

Maybe players like playing with you , doesn’t mean crap from yes men on your team, whom you give gifts to each Christmas, and they have no real power.  Look , maybe coaching is bad and ruining you ?   Then take charge of your career and  step up;   bring palmer or orlovsky or agent to meeting with you to talk w mcd/beane about solving this. Because right now it’s not working and you look very unsatisfied, and season is on the brink.  My point is , if you feel treated unfairly/badly josh, only you can fix it!   Careers go so fast; don’t keep wasting years, esp as you are in a position of financial power more so than the coaching staff. 

 

Not excusing mcd or Dorsey who i now strongly feel must go next year. Process talk is stale.  If I’m an owner , this is second year w injuries and i think extension was to show mcd belief after terrible injuries last year w Hamlin as well.  That excuse prob wont cut it this year w terrible offense.  No excuse for the bad turnover issue or 12 man debacle. Josh appears to act like he is now untouchable.  Beane should be drafting a backup or see where Dobbs or better competition is to push josh. 

 

Life experience does matter , been a bills fan since ‘63 , and imo , without a miraculous turnaround there will be no playoffs this year.  if I’m beane or the owner , I’m trying to salvage josh to sell those PSL’S FOR the new stadium. Play the year out but 7 years is a fair trial. Time to chance getting better.  Worsening every year is not a good strategy   Thanks for allowing me to vent. This is looking like a very bad year., and tough to enjoy. .  

He's regressed due to the soap opera between Dorsey and the Clapster.  The entire offense has regressed...The "QB competition" crap is beyond dumb.  The head coach is way in over his head and the ship has sunk. 

[JackKemp]

6 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

He needs to be like Mahomes who constantly works on his game. 

 

Careers are short you can have fun after you retire

 

 

Mahomes is in more commercials and plays a lot of golf too. Kelce is playing well and yet is “distracted” by Taylor Swift and doing a lot of commercials.

[mrags]

6 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

I hope this doesn't become another Eichel situation due to an incompetent organization.

 

 

It’s going to be. Thank McClappy for that 

[uticaclub]

What's the point of working hard if Gabe Davis is your #2

[UKBillFan]

8 minutes ago, Dunkirk Donski said:

He's regressed due to the soap opera between Dorsey and the Clapster.  The entire offense has regressed...The "QB competition" crap is beyond dumb.  The head coach is way in over his head and the ship has sunk. 

 

I do think there is something behind tension between McDermott and Dorsey behind the scenes about how the offense can play 'complimentary football'. It's time for Josh to stand up, request uptempo offense, and if the coaches don't like it then head to Pegula.

 

McDermott shouldn't still be at OBD anyway.

[bostonadguy]

Does he still work with Jordan Palmer in the summer? Early in his career he did.

[Fan in Chicago]

17 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

.  Eichole had none.  Josh has them.  

What is he a kindergartner?  He needs a new coach to “inspire him” to work?  He needs to grow up.

Toxic relationships affect a person's overall life. I am totally speculating that his relationship with Dorsey is the root cause. That is spreading to his demeanour , his personal relationship (breaking up with one, immediately jumping into another) and his general lack of interest. This is akin to somebody whose work performance goes down due to a horrible situation with the spouse.... This is in reverse. 

 

All my speculation from the progression of things. A highly motivated and talented individual doesn't suddenly become a disconnected soul. 

[BeastMaster]

McDermott has ruined Josh

 

Hopefully a new staff can put the pieces back together 

[CEN-CAL17]

7 hours ago, Riverboat Ritchie said:

I know Josh loves golf and that is fine but it sure seems like he has not focused on training with WRs or development the last couple of seasons  as he has become more Hollywood. I don’t want to believe it and these guys definitely need an off season to reboot but I hope he gets back to training with Palmer and maybe throwing some with WRs. 

A HC change and new system will make that happen!!!!