Most concerning defensive stat

[SCBills]

4 minutes ago, Beast said:

The defensive ends are probably the biggest disappointment on the team.

 

Not getting to the QB. No big sacks. No knocking the ball loose from the QB. No forcing the QB’s to throw a pick with pressure.

 

With the high picks and salary spent at this position, the return on those investments is a flat out failure.

 

 

We have no Crosby, Bosa, Garrett, Chris Jones type on this DL.  
 

When Daquan was healthy, we had 4 above average DL rushing together, with AJE as a 5th… the sum of their parts was greater than their individual talent. 
 

But.. as we saw last year.. if we take one cog out of the unit and/or guys get dinged up.. the pass rush disappears. 
 

None of these guys seem to regularly be able to affect a game themselves.  They need to healthy as a unit and individually.. which is really disappointing given the draft capital and money spent. 
 

Maybe Linval Joseph and Von, at some point, returning to 80% can elevate them again … but they look like the same group we had last year.  Elite with Von. Completely average without.  

[Paup 1995MVP]

5 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Now that Douglas and Joseph should be up to speed, I have zero appetite to hear about injuries anymore. 
 

Im not talking about us being elite on defense, that’s fair to say we won’t get there due to the losses of Jones, Milano and White.. but they’ve now been replaced by Joseph and Douglas.  
 

We also drafted a LB in RD3 who should be able to learn as he goes given we’ve filled in the other spots. 
 

Figure it out.  McDermott has more than enough to work with .. and this defense better rise up from the dregs of the NFL where they’ve been residing for a month….  It was unacceptable with a defensive HC then, and will certainly be unacceptable now. 
 

 

 

Good points as always SC.  One thing which I believe is hurting the defense is the play of Poyer and Hyde.  They just don’t have the speed and quickness to cover anyone anymore.  Poyer got beat badly on the Bengals 1st TD.  And Hyde has been getting beat all year.  Sure they can still support the run coming downhill and our smart.  But this isn’t 1992 when safety’s could just pummel receivers.  Everyone in the secondary has to be able to cover receivers.  And I believe we are limited w those two back there.  What teams are playing 2 starting safety’s well into their 30’s?  It just doesn’t happen in today’s game.  Combine those 2’s age and how small Taron Johnson is and the back end is becoming a weakness.  
 

I like Douglass and Joseph.   But we need an infusion of young talented athletic players on defense.  

[All_Pro_Bills]

Saying that scoring more points gives the Bills a better chance of winning vs. playing chicken and hoping to squeeze out a 3 point win on the last drive of the game is a no-brainer.  The problem is doing it.  As over the last month this offense disappears for about 1/2 the game every week along with committing a couple turnovers.  And committing a series of errors including turnovers while playing the time of possession game to protect your defense more or less defeats the purpose of playing it that way.  As part of playing it safe is not turning the ball over.  That's shown to be a losing approach.  So don't do it anymore.  That seems obvious to us all.

 

If your offense disappears for over 1/2 the game its hard to win regardless of how good or bad your defense is out there.  If there are specific plays that have led to interceptions that get them out of the play book.  I think the fundamental problem is Dorsey's game plan and play calling.  Everybody has it figured out, whether watching from the stands, on TV, or the opposing defenses coaching staff and players.  They know what's coming.  It all way too predictable, period. 

 

I remember way back when in the early 2000's when the Bills had Bledsoe and a high powered offense tearing up the league for about a season and a half.  Then everybody figured it out and it was all over.  Because the coaches had no answers or wouldn't adjust.  And here we are again.  The message to McDermott and Dorsey is adapt and evolve or die.  Strategy is not some static plan.  It needs to be dynamic always changing and adjusting to changing circumstances and the actions of your opponent.  The best coaches are the ones that do this well.

Edited November 9, 2023 by All_Pro_Bills

[Buffalo_Stampede]

The defensive additions at the deadline hopefully help because they have 5 of the top 10 offenses coming up. 

[SoCal Deek]

Week after week I watch other team’s defensive ends wreaking havoc on their opponents quarterback with seemingly relentless pressure. And it’s NOT a rotation of fresh guys. It’s one or two high performing DEs. Who is coaching our D Line? 

[Bermuda Triangle]

2 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Week after week I watch other team’s defensive ends wreaking havoc on their opponents quarterback with seemingly relentless pressure. And it’s NOT a rotation of fresh guys. It’s one or two high performing DEs. Who is coaching our D Line? 

Eric Washington.  Shockingly, he's yet another Carolina retread.

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, Drew21PA said:

I’ve said this a million times it’s really not the defense

 

rhise offenses we have faced the last 3-4 weeks have been able to do their best plays and limit turnovers becuase our offense applies ZERO PRESSURE - for the other team to have to push the ball and play more “desperate “

It's the reverse. The offense, outside of the one TO vs. NE and the drive start vs TB after the Harty return to the TB 25 yard line, is getting NO short fields to work with. It's hard to sustain long drives, and short-field scoring makes up a LOT of the scoring in the NFL.

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, Bermuda Triangle said:

Eric Washington.  Shockingly, he's yet another Carolina retread.

Figures! Enough is enough already. With the amount of draft capital they’ve expended on the position we should be living in the opponent’s backfield! Fire his arse. 

[JerseyBills]

4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Week after week I watch other team’s defensive ends wreaking havoc on their opponents quarterback with seemingly relentless pressure. And it’s NOT a rotation of fresh guys. It’s one or two high performing DEs. Who is coaching our D Line? 

ya the rotation kills me. If Floyd or whoever get hot, keep em on the freaking field 

Was hoping Groot would excel to elite status but hasn't 

I badly wanted Hendrickson a cpl years back and he has been amazing in Cincy

[SoCal Deek]

Just now, JerseyBills said:

ya the rotation kills me. If Floyd or whoever get hot, keep em on the freaking field 

Was hoping Groot would excel to elite status but hasn't 

I badly wanted Hendrickson a cpl years back and he has been amazing in Cincy

I’m sure we’ll soon learn that every single one of these guys is dealing with a “nagging injury” or some such horse $&it. That’s the go-to front office line in February. 

[JerseyBills]

Just now, SoCal Deek said:

I’m sure we’ll soon learn that every single one of these guys is dealing with a “nagging injury” or some such horse $&it. That’s the go-to front office line in February. 

🤣 sad but so true. 

[PatsFanNH]

58 minutes ago, Drew21PA said:

No you’re right they need turnovers but look even at the patriots game

 

we got down and max played with confidence O’Brien had zero reason to try to force anything and gave his qb plays that were easy and effective.

 

if they were down even 7 - mac would panic and then O’Brien would have to try different things - that leads to more mistakes.

 

same with the giants - we couldn’t get a lead - they were able to limit tyrod and still be effective 

 

forward to cincinatti

joe was playing hurt - we got to him on defense he was clearly rattled.  They were able to go conservative becuase we couldn’t score anyways - they were getting nervous before Kincaid fumbled (no blame there he played lights out) and they were able to easily go down field because our team is soft and kind of lost hope.  
 

blame 

McDermott for not mentally preparing this team like - ever

 

blame 

offensive coordinator for ZERO killer instinct ar all and has never had it over the last two seasons

 

daboll had it - kill this now

 

dorsey clearly does not - you have a killer ar qb

 

not an interrogator 

 

 

go for the kills 

Truly believe if we stay up tempo we would have beaten the bengals with a shoot out

 

i really believe that - I think anyone watching the game saw when we picked it up 

 

first drive of game - first drive of second half before Kincaid fimble

 

punch for punch shootout wr would win

 

dorsey is a wimp and this team will not go anywhere 

 

Dorsey is the big problem

 

underlying problem is McDermott terrible leadership and he’s hit a ceiling I believe 

 

decision making is ridiculous 

The Pats game they gave up 29 points to a O that until then was the WORST scoring O in the NFL, I think they are 2nd worse now. 
 

I agree the O didn’t help but they gave the D the lead with 2 minutes left and all the D had to do was stop Mac Jones from driving down the field. Something he had never done in the 4th quarter his entire career. (Not all his fault the WR kinda stink too) 

 

for the Pats game I’d say that was a team loss for the Bills. As in both sides of the ball were equally responsible.

[stlbills13]

Russel Wilson and Zach Wilson the next 2 weeks. 

 

The over/under for turnovers forced is 2.5. What are you taking?

[Bruffalo]

35 minutes ago, Beast said:

The defensive ends are probably the biggest disappointment on the team.

 

Not getting to the QB. No big sacks. No knocking the ball loose from the QB. No forcing the QB’s to throw a pick with pressure.

 

With the high picks and salary spent at this position, the return on those investments is a flat out failure.

 

 

It's been this way since McD got here. It seems like a scheme/coaching issue.

 

Eric Washington is constantly failing upwards and it is baffling to me.  

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

The Pats game they gave up 29 points to a O that until then was the WORST scoring O in the NFL, I think they are 2nd worse now. 
 

I agree the O didn’t help but they gave the D the lead with 2 minutes left and all the D had to do was stop Mac Jones from driving down the field. Something he had never done in the 4th quarter his entire career. (Not all his fault the WR kinda stink too) 

 

for the Pats game I’d say that was a team loss for the Bills. As in both sides of the ball were equally responsible.

The same thing happened against Cincinnati and against the Giants (they just didn’t score). The defense has failed miserably at crunch time. 

[CincyBillsFan]

1 hour ago, JerseyBills said:

From weeks 1-4 ,4 games, defense caused 11 turnovers, including 8 ints

 

Weeks 5-9, 5 games, defense caused 3 turnovers with zero ints. 

 

Weeks 6-9, 1 turnover..

 

This is a disturbing trend,  especially with our turnover prone QB. Hard to win in the NFL. Much harder when you lose the turnover battle. 

This D has to find ways to turn the ball over, bottom line. Turnovers could be the difference between a playoff birth

 

 

This is a disturbing trend because the Bills put most of their franchises eggs in the defensive basket and this unit's bad play has moved from the playoffs to the regular season.  Sure injuries have played a role but so what, injuries happen no?

 

And while Allen's TO's do put pressure eon the D all those TD's he scores should be going a long way towards relieving that pressure, no?

 

 

 

 

4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

The same thing happened against Cincinnati and against the Giants (they just didn’t score). The defense has failed miserably at crunch time. 

Which has been the pattern during the playoffs over the last few years with the exception of the Ravens game.  Now we see bad D in the regular season.  Sure injuries have played a big role here but if your franchise is defensive focused in resource allocation and coaching expertise there should be enough talent/schemes to at least maintain a decent D.

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Well I'm sure after the season we'll get the usual excuses about the lack of pass rush:

 

1. Rousseau hurt his foot in Week 4 and was never the same again

2. Von needs 2 years to come back from the ACL

3. First year that Epenesa was really counted on

4. Floyd rolled an ankle in Week 3 and was never the same

5. Ed Oliver rolled an ankle and was never the same

6. The emotional loss of DaQuan Jones was too much to bear

[DrDawkinstein]

46 minutes ago, Beast said:

The defensive ends are probably the biggest disappointment on the team.

 

Not getting to the QB. No big sacks. No knocking the ball loose from the QB. No forcing the QB’s to throw a pick with pressure.

 

With the high picks and salary spent at this position, the return on those investments is a flat out failure.

 

 

 

They were generating tons of pressure, sacks, and turnovers until we lost some CBs and lost the ability for coverage to allow the DEs to get home.

 

Lately, QBs can get the ball out in just over 2.0secs because their guys are immediately open. The ball is coming out a second before our DEs even get out of their first move.

 

Hopefully Douglas and Benford can help that a bit.

 

If coverage can hold up just a little longer and allow the DEs to get home, the DEs will force bad throws and turnovers to the DBs. All things circular.

 

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, JerseyBills said:

From weeks 1-4 ,4 games, defense caused 11 turnovers, including 8 ints

 

Weeks 5-9, 5 games, defense caused 3 turnovers with zero ints. 

 

Weeks 6-9, 1 turnover..

 

This is a disturbing trend,  especially with our turnover prone QB. Hard to win in the NFL. Much harder when you lose the turnover battle. 

This D has to find ways to turn the ball over, bottom line. Turnovers could be the difference between a playoff birth

 

 

 

Turnovers are not a sustainable method for winning games.  

 

We beat Miami with assistance from TOs, and got them but didn't need them in wins over the Raiders and Skins.  

 

 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

1 hour ago, Drew21PA said:

I’ve said this a million times it’s really not the defense

 

rhise offenses we have faced the last 3-4 weeks have been able to do their best plays and limit turnovers becuase our offense applies ZERO PRESSURE - for the other team to have to push the ball and play more “desperate “

i’m not sure I entirely agree here.

If this were the case you would’ve thought we would’ve forced in INT against the Buc’s and Baker Mayfield. The one game where we did have a two score lead,  putting pressure on the opposing offense.

 

could be that we are calling a far less aggressive, defensive scheme with the losses of white, Milano and Jones.

 

if the only way we can get consistent turnovers from our defense is by beating teams by 28+ points, that’s a bit of an issue.

1 hour ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

Once the DL died, the rest followed. 

which is ridiculous because we lost what, one player on the D line? And it’s still somehow all crumbled.