My theory: McDermott never liked Daboll's high flying offense, but had to go along with it

[SoonerBillsFan]

3 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

I'm no fan of Dorsey, but I think what we're seeing is the type of offensive approach that McDermott has ALWAYS wanted. Not that he doesn't want points, but he wants "balance." 

 

McD is a smart guy, a great defensive mind, but also an Alpha. This is HIS team. He has an idea of how to win. 

 

The difference with Daboll was that he did it his way, throwing 10-15 times in a row to start games and having guys flying all over the place. Allen was a bulldozer. The offense was cranking.

 

I think McDermott was uncomfortable with that approach and probably tried to get Daboll to change and that's the cause of the obvious tension between the 2 that got worse and worse until the end. At the end of the day, McDermott couldn't say too much because it was working and the team was winning and the players would have probably sided with Daboll if things blew up about it, so McDermott had to just go along with it.

 

Why else would McD have such hard feelings about Daboll? And he does, we don't need to argue the blatantly obvious. 

 

Obviously McD wants wins. Ultimately the HC gets the most credit, along with the QB. So it's a tense standoff. 

 

If it came down to a "him or me" argument McD might not have been the owner's (or superstar QBs) choice when the offense is scoring at will and Allen is becoming a superstar and the team is winning "because of offense" (which also must have driven him crazy on some level). 

 

It was also the defense that let the team down in 13 seconds. 

 

As a HC, I can see how he might see it as Daboll trying to one up him. I could see him feeling disrespected, regardless of the outcome of it. He's the HC and it's supposed to be his program, but the OC was a big personality who was getting all sorts of credit for doing the opposite of what McD wanted. 

 

What was McD going to do? Fire him? There would have been a mutiny. McD would have lost the locker room. 

 

But now, Dorsey is just a guy and McDermott can put his stamp on the offense. Now offensive guys are frustrated, unhappy, and want their offense back, regardless of who is calling the plays. 

 

That's the reason for the Diggs outbursts, Allen's malaise, and Florio's obnoxious "Jenga tower" articles after every Bills loss. 

 

My theory anyway as to what is going on with the offense. I'm not sure how much it matters who the 

I think we are very close to a breaking point with McDermott and Josh.  I feel one of the 2 is going to tell Terry "if he is still here, I won't be"

 

They are oil and water in what they want in an offense and it's causing more harm than good.  

[TheFunPolice]

2 hours ago, Heitz said:

Bills fans on TBD after a loss (ESPECIALLY this season)

 

 

That definitely fits me this season! 

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

lots of text---none of it made sense in support of your contention that McD disliked the Offense Daboll was running.   Why on earth would he have an issue with a very successful offense that scored a lot of points?  McD has no Offensive acumen, why would he care?  How could be "uncomfortable with that"?

 

your premise is flawed. 

 

because he didn't feel comfortable that it was sustainable and he's the HC and wants a more balanced approach that he thinks is more sustainable

[TheFunPolice]

6 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I think we are very close to a breaking point with McDermott and Josh.  I feel one of the 2 is going to tell Terry "if he is still here, I won't be"

 

They are oil and water in what they want in an offense and it's causing more harm than good.  

 

That's the easiest decision in the history of decisions!

[SoonerBillsFan]

Just now, TheFunPolice said:

 

That's the easiest decision in the history of decisions!

Yep, I just wish Josh would push the point 

[BillsFan692]

18 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

That definitely fits me this season! 

 

because he didn't feel comfortable that it was sustainable and he's the HC and wants a more balanced approach that he thinks is more sustainable

Sounds like a terrible terrible coach. Forcing his wants down his players throats even when they dont match the players skillsets.

 

What a treat. So lucky to be a Buffalo Bills fan.

10 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Yep, I just wish Josh would push the point 

Oh please God with a cherry on top.

 

Its almost the only way. We need Josh to say it.

[\GoBillsInDallas/]

3 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

My theory: McDermott never liked Daboll's high flying offense, but had to go along with it

 

[starrymessenger]

Have to wonder whether the kind of offence McD wants is the one most suitable to the personality and precise skill set of his star QB. Maybe Josh is not being put in a position for him to best succeed. If that's accurate McD will eventually have to go. And if that too is true, the sooner the better. 

[DanInUticaTampa]

one criticism I had on daboll's offense was lack of balance. 

 

Balance is still a problem as in we are 1 dimensional and cant run the balll consistently. 

 

However, this offense has a lot more problems than just balance. 

 

These draw plays on 3rd and 1, or just draw plays in general. WTF. Lack of screen game, deep throws to Harty, Davis being useless, not having a receiver that can get good YAC, playcalling putting us in 3rd and longs...  This is all stuff that is probably worse since Daboll left. Offense is fundimentally flawed. 

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

 

"However, McDermott and Dorsey have both admitted that the head coach is getting his fingers on the game plan on offense.

“I’m doing everything that I can as a head coach to make sure that things are the way that I want them and expect them to be across all three phases,” McDermott said via video conference.

Dorsey confirmed McDermott’s input, too. He even said he thinks McDermott’s vantage point as a defensive coordinator can be useful to him.

“He’s got a great mind for the game,” Dorsey said."

 

It's likely they didn't like each other because they didn't like each others philosophy.  I am not going to pretend to know exactly why, but I am pretty sure they both shower so I doubt it's that.  I am also pretty sure they don't care what each other eats for lunch so I doubt it's that. Pretty sure it's probably football related.

 

 

He's a moron then.

 

2 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

That definitely fits me this season! 

 

because he didn't feel comfortable that it was sustainable and he's the HC and wants a more balanced approach that he thinks is more sustainable

 

Including this season, Bills Offense has ranked (in scoring): 5th, 2nd, 3rd, 2nd.

 

not sustainable...lol.  this is why McD has to go. 

 

[bklnpete]

Everyone has a theory when Bills are losing. 

[nedboy7]

6 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

He's a moron then.

 

 

Including this season, Bills Offense has ranked (in scoring): 5th, 2nd, 3rd, 2nd.

 

not sustainable...lol.  this is why McD has to go. 

 

Its tantrum Tuesday. 

[LABILLBACKER]

2 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I think we are very close to a breaking point with McDermott and Josh.  I feel one of the 2 is going to tell Terry "if he is still here, I won't be"

 

They are oil and water in what they want in an offense and it's causing more harm than good.  

So very, very true.  Josh will eventually say enough.  McDermott is the last person who should be dictating offensive procedures.  He locked horns with Daboll and now he shuts down 2 successful up tempo drives that resulted in tds.  Sean is beyond stupid.

[Thurman#1]

5 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

5 hours ago, BillsFan692 said:

I mean he didnt get fired, he decided to leave for greener pastures. He quit. In previous seasons although he could have left he opted to stay.

 

He got a better job. He'd made no secret of wanting a head coaching job his whole life. 

 

In previous seasons he didn't get offered a head coaching job.

 

 

 

 

28 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

So very, very true.  Josh will eventually say enough.  McDermott is the last person who should be dictating offensive procedures.  He locked horns with Daboll and now he shuts down 2 successful up tempo drives that resulted in tds.  Sean is beyond stupid.

 

 

And you know this is on McDermott because of all of your connections in the Bills locker room?

 

Or does it just conveniently fit your narrative so you find it easy to believe?

[CincyBillsFan]

4 hours ago, Since1981 said:

McClappy didn't like Daboll and Josh relationship.

Remember, Josh and Daboll talked about each other consistently in the media. That is not happening today with Dorksey. Consider that the OC is in his ear on EVERY PLAY. I still think that is what Diggs was saying CIN playoff game "Yo! what are you TWO doing!!"

I also think that all this talk of Allen "hiring" Dorsey is BS.  McD hired Dorsey because he felt he could control him better then bringing in a high end experienced OC who would demand some level of autonomy as a condition for taking the job.  My guess is that Allen wasn't opposed to the promotion because he was promised that the offense wouldn't change that much from Daboll's and for the first half of the 2022 season it didn't.  Then the McD effect started creeping in and accelerated during this off season.

 

 

[CincyBillsFan]

3 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I think we are very close to a breaking point with McDermott and Josh.  I feel one of the 2 is going to tell Terry "if he is still here, I won't be"

 

They are oil and water in what they want in an offense and it's causing more harm than good.  

At the risk of sounding like a loon is there a possibility that McD benches Allen?  Hear me out here:  McD could approach Bean and argue that Allen's shoulder needs to heal fully so why not sit him for a couple of weeks. 

 

Remember McD is the man who benched Tyrod to go with the worst QB who has ever started a game in the NFL.  Peterman threw FIVE INT's in the first half, an NFL record.  McD then double downed on that decision and declared Peterman the starter over Allen the next year only to see Peterman set another NFL record for bad QB play - 9 straight possessions without getting a 1st down.  Then McD was forced to throw Allen to the wolves the next week and start him against a very good Charger D.  And don't forget that because of McD's infatuation with the worst QB to ever start an NFL game Allen missed taking most of the 1st team reps in Training Camp & the preseason games.

 

McD doesn't have a clue about QB's and I wouldn't put it past him to try to pull off a stunt like this.

 

 

[Buffalo716]

3 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I think we are very close to a breaking point with McDermott and Josh.  I feel one of the 2 is going to tell Terry "if he is still here, I won't be"

 

They are oil and water in what they want in an offense and it's causing more harm than good.  

Umm McDermott would never go to Terry and say it's him or me lol

 

Because contract wise and talent wise nobody siding with McDermott... Why would he pull an ultimatum with Terry pegula over a Hall of Fame caliber quarterback?

 

McDermott certainly doesn't want to go back to the Nathan peterman's and tyrod Taylor's... He has a seven year career in Buffalo because Josh Allen blossomed

21 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

At the risk of sounding like a loon is there a possibility that McD benches Allen?  Hear me out here:  McD could approach Bean and argue that Allen's shoulder needs to heal fully so why not sit him for a couple of weeks. 

 

Remember McD is the man who benched Tyrod to go with the worst QB who has ever started a game in the NFL.  Peterman threw FIVE INT's in the first half, an NFL record.  McD then double downed on that decision and declared Peterman the starter over Allen the next year only to see Peterman set another NFL record for bad QB play - 9 straight possessions without getting a 1st down.  Then McD was forced to throw Allen to the wolves the next week and start him against a very good Charger D.  And don't forget that because of McD's infatuation with the worst QB to ever start an NFL game Allen missed taking most of the 1st team reps in Training Camp & the preseason games.

 

McD doesn't have a clue about QB's and I wouldn't put it past him to try to pull off a stunt like this.

 

 

McDermott bench Taylor because we were having trouble moving past midfield

 

We're still 6th in the NFL in scoring... Yeah McDermott should get fired on the spot if he went to Kyle Allen

Edited November 8, 2023 by Buffalo716

[CincyBillsFan]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

McDermott certainly doesn't want to go back to the Nathan peterman's and tyrod Taylor's... He has a seven year career in Buffalo because Josh Allen blossomed

McDermott bench Taylor because we were having trouble moving past midfield

 

We're still 6th in the NFL in scoring... Yeah McDermott should get fired on the spot if he went to Kyle Allen

I give McD a pass for trying Peterman out.  But I can't give hm a pass for naming Peterman the starter over Allen only to see his QB set a SECOND NFL record for offensive futility.  I've said this before but McD did everything possible to screw up Allen's rookie year.  Name one thing he got right?  Allen succeeded in spite of McD whch is a credit to Allen and DaBoll.

 

 

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

I give McD a pass for trying Peterman out.  But I can't give hm a pass for naming Peterman the starter over Allen only to see his QB set a SECOND NFL record for offensive futility.  I've said this before but McD did everything possible to screw up Allen's rookie year.  Name one thing he got right?  Allen succeeded in spite of McD whch is a credit to Allen and DaBoll.

 

 

People don't realize that as much as you can make a quarterback.. you can ruin a quarterback

 

Josh in my opinion coming from the mountain West needed a full year on the bench and seasoning... That year on the bench can coach out flaws that you have

 

Getting thrown in the fire is sink or swim... Yes Josh swam.. but he also didn't get to work on the flaws he had as a quarterback

 

Some of those flaws still come around today... Literally 20 plus weeks on the bench could correct that

 

So yeah I would have seen a two and fourteen season with Josh on the bench because he probably would even be better... Every quarterback should sit it's that tough

 

Quarterbacks getting thrown to the fire is why they don't succeed

 

First round picks used to sit back in the day and learn ... Nothing bad can come from a talented player learning the NFL game from the sidelines...

 

But plenty can happen when you throw a young kid into the league and there's not enough pieces around him... Sitting a talented quarterback to learn the game is never bad

Edited November 8, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Billever76]

4 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I think we are very close to a breaking point with McDermott and Josh.  I feel one of the 2 is going to tell Terry "if he is still here, I won't be"

 

They are oil and water in what they want in an offense and it's causing more harm than good.  

Under no circumstances do you choose McDermott in that case...I don't think any owner would pick an average HC over a potential HOF talent franchise QB..McDermott doesn't fill the stadium and sell merchandise lol

4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

People don't realize that as much as you can make a quarterback.. you can ruin a quarterback

 

Josh in my opinion coming from the mountain West needed a full year on the bench and seasoning... That year on the bench can coach out flaws that you have

 

Getting thrown in the fire is sink or swim... Yes Josh swam.. but he also didn't get to work on the flaws he had as a quarterback

 

Some of those flaws still come around today... Literally 20 plus weeks on the bench could correct that

 

So yeah I would have seen a two and fourteen season with Josh on the bench because he probably would even be better... Every quarterback should sit it's that tough

 

Quarterbacks getting thrown to the fire is why they don't succeed

 

First round picks used to sit 20 back in the day 

This isn't Allen's fault.....take Tom Brady and put him in an rpo system and you could pick apart his game also...Allen is being forced to play in an offense that is in direct conflict to his strengths as a qb

35 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

At the risk of sounding like a loon is there a possibility that McD benches Allen?  Hear me out here:  McD could approach Bean and argue that Allen's shoulder needs to heal fully so why not sit him for a couple of weeks. 

 

Remember McD is the man who benched Tyrod to go with the worst QB who has ever started a game in the NFL.  Peterman threw FIVE INT's in the first half, an NFL record.  McD then double downed on that decision and declared Peterman the starter over Allen the next year only to see Peterman set another NFL record for bad QB play - 9 straight possessions without getting a 1st down.  Then McD was forced to throw Allen to the wolves the next week and start him against a very good Charger D.  And don't forget that because of McD's infatuation with the worst QB to ever start an NFL game Allen missed taking most of the 1st team reps in Training Camp & the preseason games.

 

McD doesn't have a clue about QB's and I wouldn't put it past him to try to pull off a stunt like this.

 

 

I'm more concerned about finding a possibility to Bench McDermott or atleast put him on a leash (handcuff him not allen)

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, Billever76 said:

Under no circumstances do you choose McDermott in that case...I don't think any owner would pick an average HC over a potential HOF talent franchise QB..McDermott doesn't fill the stadium and sell merchandise lol

This isn't Allen's fault.....take Tom Brady and put him in an rpo system and you could pick apart his game also...Allen is being forced to play in an offense that is in direct conflict to his strengths as a qb

I don't think I ever said it was Allens fault... He's literally one of the three best players in the world.. not even counting position

 

He's a superstar

 

But he could and probably would be better if he even sat his rookie year... It did nothing but good for Patrick mahomes Aaron Rodgers and every single other talented quarterback that learns from the sideline